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New Veteran "Abrams" 22-inch Wheel


xiiijojjo

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I guess I am first in line for this one, good thing my wife bought me a new helmet! Seriously though, some see this stance as silly or foolish. I can respect that as most of my antics are foolish and silly. My thought process here is very simple. I have a Sherman and it made me take a different stance on what a wheel should offer. Performance, range and the simplest, but most useful option with the roll cage (IMHO). 

I had a Monster V2... the red one. Some guy in SF ended up with it after I sold it to a new rider (who promptly broke it after taking possession). I really liked that wheel, but it felt too hollow if you know what I mean. The cover was very thin, no off the line torque and it did the GW bounce (have a scar to prove it). All of that aside, it was a really fun wheel to ride. It was like driving a big ole Cadillac. 

I am very interested in LK/Veteran's take on a 22" Monster since they nailed it with the "Mini-Monster/Sherman".  

Edited by gon2fast
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20 hours ago, xiiijojjo said:

I have a suspicion that we will never see a 120km/h+ wheel and i think the industry is a about to figure out where to settle when it comes to max performance. Once that happens (90-120km/h topspeed) i believe models overall will increase in price like we are seeing with Veteran... Only thing i can hope is that along with the price hike comes quality improvements as well.

Because think about it from the industry's perspective.

If most their lineups for the next 2-3 years have the same top performance (more or less), what would incentivize costumers to buy their newest product? Nothing beyond quality improvements and increased safety and maybe range.
Once the manufacturers realize how few years/lineups they have left before hitting the performance wall they should start releasing more and more expensive wheels realizing it is the only way to offset the reduced number of returning customers.

If you have issues imagining what i am talking about then think about yourself in 2026. The fastest wheel goes 120km/h and was released in 2024, and you have owned it since then. 
The 2026 Gotmotion lineup is announced as a response to the now arguably inferior Iron Song lineup of the same year. The lineup looks good but the top speed is the same as 2 years prior of 120km/h which you are already able of going. Modularity in battery packs has been a thing since 2022 so even if you need more range, you could just buy bigger battery packs replace the, smaller, old ones.

There would be little reason to buy the 2026 model if there aren't any other notable improvement to either performance or safety or features in general.

I already think these companies are seeing their costumers return at a slower and slower rate. Because back when i had the Msuper v3 in 2017 i knew i wanted more speed and battery and everything really so 1 year later got the tesla, 2 years later got the RS and what in 3 years i get something new? That's more or less what i'm thinking.

Now honestly the only improvement i could ask for my RS is the ability to safely 18A charge it and i don't know what more to ask for other than 120km/h (for safety margin not suicide) But even with the current topspeed i don't see myself upgrading for years to come. 

 

Tl;DR
Prepare for more expensive EUCs becoming the norm as diminishing returns in improving performance starts affecting how often customers want to buy. Having them buying less frequently "forces" the hand of the companies to increase prices.

If EUC's become more mainstream, there should not be any issues selling product (even without real performance gains). There are so many other industries to learn from. For example look at the high end mountain bike/road bike industry - they sell huge quantities every year and all they do is change the colour ;), it's mostly about marketing and feeding the customer's never-ending thirst for wanting "the newest thing". Actual innovation comes every 4-5 years though, just to keep everyone interested, and its more quality of life improvements that general customers want rather than small performance gains that only the pro's will notice.

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1 hour ago, mrelwood said:

Absolutely! It’s because they do not accelerate and brake by leaning… ;)

If the Sherman could climb half as good as the V3 it’d be ok

 

but it doesn’t 

 

I have a clip of the V3 climbing a super steep concrete slope in a drain

 

my Sherman can’t do it 

 

also the brakes where better and I could launch if further off drops and hop it way higher, but thats cos the Sherman is much heavier 

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On 8/14/2021 at 2:13 PM, mrelwood said:

Absolutely! It’s because they do not accelerate and brake by leaning… ;)

nahh ...no need to lean the body when using frontwedge on the pedals ...you control the machine with the toes and keep bodypostion just like a mogul skier!

1. https://eucmods.blogspot.com/2016/07/msuper-mod7the-wedge.html
2. https://eucmods.blogspot.com/2020/04/off-road-pedals-with-spikes-side-wedge.html
3. https://eucmods.blogspot.com/2021/05/updated-sherman-pedals.html

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eWheels preorder page is reporting 50MPH top speed which is consistent with what I heard about the Abrams having more torque than the Sherman, but the same top speed. Interesting since additional torque (low end) in wheels usually equals lower top speed.

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3 hours ago, gon2fast said:

eWheels preorder page is reporting 50MPH top speed which is consistent with what I heard about the Abrams having more torque than the Sherman, but the same top speed. Interesting since additional torque (low end) in wheels usually equals lower top speed.

this is basically a lie, a 22 inch will never compete with a 19' in the low end, it's just a real world fact ;) 

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1 hour ago, EMA said:

this is basically a lie, a 22 inch will never compete with a 19' in the low end, it's just a real world fact ;) 

If you’re talking about accelerating, then sure, a 22” wheel requires more lean to tap into the torque reserve. But while smaller wheels get “free” “torque” from the smaller tire diameter, they also require more “torque” to compensate for the rider’s lean. Which of these two aspects wins or if they are identical, I don’t know. What I do know though is that riders do not tend to overlean 22+ inch wheels at lower speeds.

Edit: I shouldn’t have used the word “torque“ above, as “thrust” is a more correct word. Thanks @Eucner!

Edited by mrelwood
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55 minutes ago, EMA said:

this is basically a lie, a 22 inch will never compete with a 19' in the low end, it's just a real world fact ;) 

Torque and thrust are different things. They are way too often mixed here. If 19 and 22 inch wheels have same torque, will smaller wheel have more thrust.

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13 minutes ago, mrelwood said:

If you’re talking about accelerating, then sure, a 22” wheel requires more lean to tap into the torque reserve. But while smaller wheels get “free” “torque” from the smaller tire diameter, they also require more “torque” to compensate for the rider’s lean. Which of these two aspects wins or if they are identical, I don’t know. What I do know though is that riders do not tend to overlean 22+ inch wheels at lower speeds.

Edit: I shouldn’t have used the word “torque“ above, as “thrust” is a more correct word. Thanks @Eucner!

 

13 minutes ago, Eucner said:

Torque and thrust are different things. They are way too often mixed here. If 19 and 22 inch wheels have same torque, will smaller wheel have more thrust.

thanks both for extended explaination ;)

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7 hours ago, gon2fast said:

eWheels preorder page is reporting 50MPH top speed which is consistent with what I heard about the Abrams having more torque than the Sherman, but the same top speed. Interesting since additional torque (low end) in wheels usually equals lower top speed.

I wouldn’t take anything at face value. The Sherman has proven time and time again it could hit 50 mph. I’d look at the board configuration, motor and battery config before estimating its real world top speed. also the speed-corrected no load speed should clue you in. 

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Abrams looks very, very promissing, it may be best wheel of 2021. 

Reasonably priced 22" wheel with big battery = nice upgrade for Monster lovers. 

As a Monster v3 user I DON'T need super high power, 2500-2800w is absolutelly enough. It is cruiser wheel, not racer. Range is much more needed here, than sporty torque. 

 

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