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Hello fellow EUCers.

Let's start with a little story, about me and my needs.. :)

I tried KingSong 16s and in about 40mins i was riding already and LOVED it, was so much fun! So here i am.

I'm thinking about getting 18L or 18XL for my first ride.

The thing is, i will be ussing it to drive to work and using for errands.. Most time around 10km(6miles) in one trip.

For fun ridding and goofing around, where i life size area is around ~30km(19miles) So most of times i won't go over 40km(25miles) in one ride. Ground here is flat, no hills at all.

Most time i won't go faster than 30-35kph(18-22mph) to feel kinda safe. (ofc i will be getting as well safty gear)

But the thing is i'm kinda HEAVY:( around 128kg (280lbs) And i don't know witch unicycle would be better for me.

I know weight difference is small 3kg(7lbs) and money wise difference is 300euro (don't care about those 300$ more about weight..)

As i will be carying it to second floor and in train each day.

So here i am, witch one would be better? Can i get by with 18L or 30-40km (19-25miles) will be pushing battery?

Thanks for reading & helping <3 :clap3:

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KS18L has 1036Wh battery.

KS18XL has 1554Wh battery, exactly 50% more.

The extra carrying weight of 3kg is insignificant.

The benefit of much greater range vastly outweighs the additional cost and weight.

Running out of power and having to walk is terrible.

 

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1 hour ago, Paul A said:

KS18L has 1036Wh battery.

KS18XL has 1554Wh battery, exactly 50% more.

The extra carrying weight of 3kg is insignificant.

The benefit of much greater range vastly outweighs the additional cost and weight.

Running out of power and having to walk is terrible.

 

The newer xl also have a supposedly 2200w motor vs the 2000w of the L. If a person was never going to need the range or headroom of the XL, the cost and weight increase of the xl, would be a total waste. 6lbs isnt exactly insignificant, but it aint much more. Lets not forget that the 18L has superior build quality than the xl, as far as durability. I do think that at near same price point, the XL is a better buy. However, if an 18L can be found for cheaper and one doesnt need the range, its a no brainer. Either way, both are damn fine wheels and much worse can be found and there are much worse ways to blow a chunk of casholla..

Walking home toting a $1-2k suitcase designed to carry you, totally sucks, I agree! Kinda a kick to the berries, really.

Edited by ShanesPlanet
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6 hours ago, ShanesPlanet said:

The 18xl will give you more headroom. Both are great, but at your weight, I'd err on the side of bigger. The carry weight between the two isnt much. The 18L is more refined in how its battery box is and cable routing. However, if you dont smash the hell out of it, its somewhat moot. At 130lbs in the mountains, I was able to get an 18L to start thorttling me around 25miles. I'd go bigger, unless you can find a smokin' hot deal on the 18L. Either would more than likely carry you, as the they are mostly the same. 50% more battery doesnt hurt tho.

Youtube range test and all it's more like 30% increase in battery no? Also dosen't XL use better battery "Samsung" something?

2 hours ago, ShanesPlanet said:

The newer xl also have a supposedly 2200w motor vs the 2000w of the L. If a person was never going to need the range or headroom of the XL, the cost and weight increase of the xl, would be a total waste. 6lbs isnt exactly insignificant, but it aint much more. Lets not forget that the 18L has superior build quality than the xl, as far as durability. I do think that at near same price point, the XL is a better buy. However, if an 18L can be found for cheaper and one doesnt need the range, its a no brainer. Either way, both are damn fine wheels and much worse can be found and there are much worse ways to blow a chunk of casholla..

Walking home toting a $1-2k suitcase designed to carry you, totally sucks, I agree! Kinda a kick to the berries, really.

Both now have 2200 motor i think. Build aren't the same? Only difference is in battery no? XL has that blue plastic wrapping, L has that nice plastic case around battery?

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28 minutes ago, Funky said:

Youtube range test and all it's more like 30% increase in battery no? Also dosen't XL use better battery "Samsung" something?

Both now have 2200 motor i think. Build aren't the same? Only difference is in battery no? XL has that blue plastic wrapping, L has that nice plastic case around battery?

The XL may use a 'better' battery, i really dont know for certain. Of course, 'better' is subjective.

I do think you are spot on with ALL the rest of your observations.  With the plastic battery box inside and ribbing on the external case for protection, the 18L vs 18XL I saw, showed the 18l case was premade for battery cable routing. The 18xl has near same case, so the wiring included some foam, cardboard and not so perfect workaround on wiring. They MAY have changed that by now.   All in all, the differences are minor. My 18L felt a little more nimble to me, but it was so close it didnt matter. Im not extremely fond of how the 18xl batteries are simply pushed up against the plastic cover with NO additional protection. But space is limited, so what ya gna do? Fwiw, Im on an XL now, simply because I was pushing into the headroom of my 18L a bit. I'm not the slowest rider perhaps... I rarely needed more range and speeds are the same. I just 'upgraded' as Im now a wheel snob and dont drop them as much as I used to.:efef8189d7:

Edited by ShanesPlanet
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As for dropping i ofc will be DIY(two sided taping rubber mats almost all round the new wheel) :D 

Question - are hextech pedals worth getting for around 100$ As i hate sand papper.

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I'd give the stock pedals a try, so long as they are the big black ones. THey are comfy as can be. The 18XL isnt a high perfomance wheel, so I dont find them to need spikes. A local skate shop could get you some UBER sticky grip tape if you needed. Give the stock a try first is my suggest. You may find you still want spikes, maybe not. I do know that my nylonove are nice on the sherm, but comfort of the flat 18xl pedals is better. Stock big pedals are covered in a mild grip tape, so maybe you wont hate it. My 18xl is stock aside from the RollNZ cover and a lemfo watch attached to the handle. I'd love to toss more money at her, but she's just perfect the way she sits now. Even the stock tire seems just fine by me. I am using the older Nike style tire tho, but i rode one with the newer and it was also fine. I spent 4 hrs riding around one day and my feet/knees/hips felt just fine. Not too shabby for how bad a shape I'm in.

Edited by ShanesPlanet
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5 hours ago, Funky said:

Question - are hextech pedals worth getting for around 100$ As i hate sand papper.

If you can get the Hextechs for $100, I would not consider them. I would immediately drop everything I was holding at the time, and fly screaming to violently grab them, no matter how many kids I would almost Alleycat over while doing so!

 But that’s just me… :lol:

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Started with a KS16s and thought the range would be more than adequate.

Run out of power a few times and walking for over an hour is not great.

With the KS18XL, can easily go for five hour rides now and not even bother to have app on to monitor battery levels.

The range of the 18XL actually seems to be double the 18L, which is a bit strange.

 

The range claims are based on 70kg riding weight.

Erring on over capacity and possible future riding range needs may be a good idea.

Higher speeds, rougher surfaces like unsealed gravel, also makes a difference to range.

 

The benefit of 50% more battery for the life of the wheel, at the cost of $300 seems great value for money.

EUCO sells one single battery pack for KS18L for $480.

https://www.euco.us/collections/king-song-18xl-parts

 

Didn't know about new models having a 2200W motor, thanks.

 

 

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as an owner of 18XL I can tell you that one is one of the kind wheel, very comfortable for long rides and with plenty of headroom for fast acceleration.
however, I can tell you some weak points in my opinion. Battery it's really impressive for 18XL.

1) tire it's only 2.5 inch and for your weight you will need to keep high tire pressure giving you not very comfortable sensation even over small imperfections on the road
2) inner-shell, it's likely to crack if it's made from black-plastic >> you should buy only version two or greater with white inner shell
         ho do you check: you can easily check this by looking underneath pedal hangers
3) you should buy only version 18XL with larger pedals and not older version 18L
4) you will need a smart-charger (like this one or similar) - not fast !! - for it .... stock one it's very slow :(

my recommendation is to look for something with 3-inch tire !
at your weight I would be looking for GW Monster V3, or V11, VS, MSP HT
(but this is me after having many many miles inside and outside the city)

Edited by Meserias
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I just noticed you are from Latvia. So you have local resellers in your country. Or @EUniCycles.eu as your option to buy from. I can recommend eunicycles.eu as reseller. He is a nice and great guy. He knows his stuff. The reseller in your country I know not much about.

Now some have suggested other wheels here. I didn't do that because as a new rider getting suspension takes away some of must know when riding skills. It is about long term safety. Also from your post I think reliable is key to how you get by with a EUC as a new rider.

 

Edited by Unventor
I forgot to mention this: warm welcome to the forum.
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There are two charging ports on the KS18XL.

Use two chargers when charging.

Think the moulds for the larger pedals were apparently paid for by ewheels, for the bigger Western feet.

 

The KS18XL is very reliable.  Over 13500km and no problems at all.

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, mrelwood said:

 

If you can get the Hextechs for $100, I would not consider them. I would immediately drop everything I was holding at the time, and fly screaming to violently grab them, no matter how many kids I would almost Alleycat over while doing so!

 But that’s just me… :lol:

Yeah+ they got also that elbo where they attaches to motor axels. I comapred them in store to orginal pedal elbo, they are thicker - stronger i think.

IDK why they are so cheap normaly they go for 200+ with elbo no?

 

OFC i will be cheking and buying only white updated shell, I think all the new ones with 2200 motor comes updated no? There where 2 white shells also no? One was weaker, second stronger.. Original white one din't have those (red ring) 6 "legs" around the hole.

1-kingsong-spare-parts-jan2020-6-2048x.j

I'm also starting to lean on 18XL.. More battery meaning i will not have to change the battery so fast, as we all know it will start to lose it capacity in some time (2-4) years..?

I wanted 18L&18XL because they where the lightest 18inch wheel. Most time 80% of times i will be riding flat asphalt pavements or those small bricks.

I'm thinking about buying it in local store.

As for charging if i use most 30-40% of the 100% battery. Over night charging will be fine. Even after ride i have about 5-10hrs free time to charge. Each day so i think plenty time to charge. (Can charge even at work) xD +Slower charging isn't better?

Isn't charding battery all time to 100% BAD?? I read if you want to keep battery in good conditions (exstand it's life) it's better to charge around 75-80% and stop.. Once in month you charge the battery to 100% to refill (stabilize) all the "small" batteries?

Example: if i charge after each ride the battery to around 80% and once in month to 100% I can have the battery for around 6-8years <VS> if i charge every second day or so all the time to 100% the battery will start to lose capacity and may die in aboth 3-4 years (It's a example, you can get more/less years.. How hard you ride)

Edited by Funky
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14 minutes ago, Funky said:

Isn't charging battery all time to 100% BAD?? I read if you want to keep battery in good conditions (extend it's life) it's better to charge around 75-80% and stop.. Once in month you charge the battery to 100% to refill (stabilize) all the "small" batteries?

I think the consensus here is that you should charge to 100% quite regularly to indeed balance the "small" batteries aka individual cells [can't say how often is enough. I charge to 100% daily, sometimes even twice a day, since my battery is a meager 420wh]. To me the low-probability risk of catastrophic damage from damaged cells and the inconvenience of slightly lower performance at lower voltage easily outweighs the benefits of extended battery lifetime from charging not fully. I also expect the typical lifetime of an EUC is currently some 3-5 years so I would not worry too much about the battery living 8 years vs 4. I expect by the time the battery has degraded considerably you would have worn out a few tyres, a few shells, some LEDs, a motherboard perhaps. And you might want a different wheel by that time anyway (still, KS18XL seems like a great wheel that should stay relevant for a long time, unless some breakthrough tech arrives to EUCs). Even if you want to keep your wheel for 10 years and 30000km, you can replace the batteries when the time comes.

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Posted (edited)

True, but if i ride lite (not long ranges) Why not to try save the battery :) 

As for damage on wheel it self, I'm not one of those who like extreme riding.. Relax, enjoy the ride, don't risk breaking something: wheel or bone (thats me) :D 

I got 7years old Phone not broken once, that tells something about me.

Also question can i fit 18x3inch tire on 18XL? Or will there be some rubbing?

Edited by Funky
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Of course, It's best to save and conserve battery wherever possible. I also keep things long enough to warrant battery replacement. Still, I do not know how important balancing is for those large serial packs in EUCs and the statistics of it all (chances of failed cells etc. If a single cell becomes defective due to overcharging or overdischarging, the whole pack becomes dangerous to use).

Anyway, 18XL uses LG MJ1 18650 cells, which are rated at 400 cycles (they should retain >80% capacity after this number of cycles). At 15Wh/km that would give you a total mileage of 40 000km! [to give some energy efficiency stats for reference, my avg riding speed is 15.2kph and avg consumption is 12.3wh/km. The average EUC.world user has avg riding speed 15.7kph and consumption of 17.3wh/km]! And you can still use the battery after the specified 400 cycles, 20% range loss is not critical.

Edited by yoos
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3 hours ago, Funky said:

Yeah+ they got also that elbo where they attaches to motor axels. I comapred them in store to orginal pedal elbo, they are thicker - stronger i think.

IDK why they are so cheap normaly they go for 200+ with elbo no?

 

OFC i will be cheking and buying only white updated shell, I think all the new ones with 2200 motor comes updated no? There where 2 white shells also no? One was weaker, second stronger.. Original white one din't have those (red ring) 6 "legs" around the hole.

1-kingsong-spare-parts-jan2020-6-2048x.j

I'm also starting to lean on 18XL.. More battery meaning i will not have to change the battery so fast, as we all know it will start to lose it capacity in some time (2-4) years..?

I wanted 18L&18XL because they where the lightest 18inch wheel. Most time 80% of times i will be riding flat asphalt pavements or those small bricks.

I'm thinking about buying it in local store.

As for charging if i use most 30-40% of the 100% battery. Over night charging will be fine. Even after ride i have about 5-10hrs free time to charge. Each day so i think plenty time to charge. (Can charge even at work) xD +Slower charging isn't better?

Isn't charding battery all time to 100% BAD?? I read if you want to keep battery in good conditions (exstand it's life) it's better to charge around 75-80% and stop.. Once in month you charge the battery to 100% to refill (stabilize) all the "small" batteries?

Example: if i charge after each ride the battery to around 80% and once in month to 100% I can have the battery for around 6-8years <VS> if i charge every second day or so all the time to 100% the battery will start to lose capacity and may die in aboth 3-4 years (It's a example, you can get more/less years.. How hard you ride)

Ironically, I sold an 18L that had the older style shell with standoffs that didnt have this added plastic. Zero standoff were broken on the older 18L and it was my learner with about 700+ miles. Now my newer 18XL has the newer cover as in your picture. About HALF the standoffs were showing cracks. I ended up putting superglue over them to help keep them from getting worse and letting go of the brass inserts. 

I charge mine to 100% after each ride. Maybe I'm losing a little longevity, but I gain the knwledge shes' fully ready everytime. FOr me, Im assuming something else will break, LONG before my batteries become an issue. If my batteries DO eventually wear out, Im thinking that It will be past time for me to buy then next wheel that fits the bill. New wheels released each year, perhaps in 5, there will be another option. OR, in 5 yrs they will be illegal and I'lll be riding a jet pack instead.

@Funky Im pretty sure a 3" will not fit. In all honesty, you shouldnt be worried about upgrades (unless has small pedals). The reason the 18 series is so good is that it DOESNT need you to change anything on it. I like the narrow tire, it makes the wheel pretty easy to flick around for an 18". I've ridden mine up rocky mountain roads, thru grasses and down the street. Its not an offroader, but its a comfort class. If you really MUST farkle on things, perhaps find another target for the attention and assume your 18 is just fine as is?

Edited by ShanesPlanet
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7 hours ago, Funky said:

IDK why they are so cheap normaly they go for 200+ with elbo no?

Last I heard the Hextechs sold for around $250 without any brackets…

7 hours ago, Funky said:

OFC i will be cheking and buying only white updated shell, I think all the new ones with 2200 motor comes updated no?

Yes, they changed to the 2200W motor something like two years ago. They did make the white inner shell with the old 2000W motor for a short while, but I don’t know when the 2nd white inner shell came to be.

 

7 hours ago, Funky said:

Slower charging isn't better?

Even the “quick” chargers for EUCs are still “slow” chargers for the individual cells. Charging the 18XL at 1.8A is no better for the batteries than charging at 5A.

7 hours ago, Funky said:

Isn't charding battery all time to 100% BAD?? I read if you want to keep battery in good conditions (exstand it's life) it's better to charge around 75-80% and stop.. Once in month you charge the battery to 100% to refill (stabilize) all the "small" batteries?

First, I must applaud for the homework you have done, and the amount of information you’ve been able to gather! You already know more about EUCs than many long time riders!

The problem with the 80% charging recommendation is in perspective. @yoos already laid out the math: Yes, in theory you could have 10% more riding range after 40 000km. But if you only charge to 80% and don’t balance charge at all, your battery packs could be unrideable and non-repairable already at 2000km, like one rider had on his 18XL.

 I’ve been lurking around the forum “quite” ;) actively for the past 3 years. I’ve heard of only one single EUC that has ever reached 30 000 km. On the other hand, there are DOZENS and DOZENS of threads titled “…won’t charge above xx%”, most of them having many other riders as well saying “me too”. Almost all of those issues are because of insufficient balancing. 

I balance charged my 16S once a week, about every 7th charge. The first pack was unusable due to insufficient balancing after 4000km, the second pack at 8000km.

 Due to this, I balance charged my MSX every single time (4A charging). I sold the wheel after 14000km with no issues or noticeable degradation in the batteries.

However, if you won’t be riding for more than a week or so, it’s best to store the packs at 40-60%.

Of course, if you only ride for less than 20km every day, you don’t necessarily need to charge every day. But when you do charge, I would absolutely recommend to leave the charger connected for at least 30 minutes after the charger turns green, every single time you charge. Balance charging every day would balance the cells more effectively though, as the balancing current is very small, and it can’t save a pack that is badly out of balance.

 

6 hours ago, Funky said:

Also question can i fit 18x3inch tire on 18XL?

Won’t fit, wouldn’t even rotate. But the 2.5” tire on the 18XL is just fine for practically all riding situations. There’s nothing the wheel wouldn’t be able to do because of the narrower tire.

 

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Just out of curiosity, who was the person(s)/organization/business that created and started the Electric Unicycle Forum that everyone gets to benefit from for free?

There must be costs to maintain a website, who is paying for those? 

The manufacturers and/or distributors?

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13 minutes ago, Paul A said:

John Eucist, May 12, 2016?

Sounds about right. I know its John, not sure exact date. He is VERY generous for doing this, as I hear he's not active or riding euc's much anymore. Please dont quote that tho, he could be on tour, blazing down the street on a sherman right now!:eff02be2d7:

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53 minutes ago, Paul A said:

Just out of curiosity, who was the person(s)/organization/business that created and started the Electric Unicycle Forum that everyone gets to benefit from for free?

There must be costs to maintain a website, who is paying for those? 

The manufacturers and/or distributors?

I think this is a bit of topic or?

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