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V12 in Hong Kong 4 June - Test/Review


OneLeg

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I'm curious how good is the headlight in the production version. Most reviews say the supplier gave InMotion the wrong LEDs, which is not very bright, and will improve in the production version.

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Good to hear those first impressions. Certainly sounds like a capable wheel.

It must be cool blatting around HK on an EUC. Something that struck me when I passed through HK (many years ago) was how relatively deserted the streets were of pedestrians in some sections of the city - everyone sticking to the "sky bridges" between buildings instead.

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On 6/6/2021 at 2:08 AM, madbikes said:

I'm curious how good is the headlight in the production version. Most reviews say the supplier gave InMotion the wrong LEDs, which is not very bright, and will improve in the production version.

I tend not to have the headlight on among pedestrians unless it is so dark I may hit one... as having a headlight on is nuisance, may scare them or make them behave unpredictablity and I hit them. On the V12 however the light was on auto and it is pretty bright, similar to a quad LED torch which I use. I turned it off.

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On 6/6/2021 at 2:37 PM, Sidewalk Enforcer said:

Good to hear those first impressions. Certainly sounds like a capable wheel.

It must be cool blatting around HK on an EUC. Something that struck me when I passed through HK (many years ago) was how relatively deserted the streets were of pedestrians in some sections of the city - everyone sticking to the "sky bridges" between buildings instead.

Most large wheels I generally don't want to try again.... but to be honest I woudln't mind another go on the V12.

Yes, HK has many areas which are empty right next to really highy  congested areas. They may be less optimal paths but on unicycles do we care if we have to add a few hundred meters to be able to increase our speed form say 5-7km to 25km/hr and attain much higher average speeds.

Whilst everyone is in total awe of HK's town planing the reality is when you get on a wheel you start noticing the flaws it has. It isn't that great. With HK's car first policy many people are force in say radius of 500-800meters to concentrate on a cross road or a pavement... They put bridges here and there but there isn't enough crossing on large roads or subway tunnels under...

HK is adding like 10% net gain of cars per month right now. LOL so dumb.

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I have now read that several reviewers mention the wobbles at speeds over 40kmh. This really doesn’t seem very clever to me, it’s supposed to be a fast wheel and a fast wheel shouldn’t have any wobbles at speed. Is this a design problem?

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33 minutes ago, Nostris said:

I have now read that several reviewers mention the wobbles at speeds over 40kmh. This really doesn’t seem very clever to me, it’s supposed to be a fast wheel and a fast wheel shouldn’t have any wobbles at speed. Is this a design problem?

this might just be a case of lowering tire pressure somewhat...

i had a slight wobble at +-35kph with my V11, with lower pressure it was solved.

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Don't have high expectations of the speaker/sound.

The speaker is pretty mediocre, neitherhas  fidelity nor base... It sounds encased... My little JBL Clip 3 provides much better quality. I don't understand given the size of the wheel why can't they get this right. A speaker doesn't have to draw much power and having nice sound chamber is easy to do in such a big wheel.

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5 hours ago, OneLeg said:

Don't have high expectations of the speaker/sound.

The speaker is pretty mediocre, neitherhas  fidelity nor base... It sounds encased... My little JBL Clip 3 provides much better quality. I don't understand given the size of the wheel why can't they get this right. A speaker doesn't have to draw much power and having nice sound chamber is easy to do in such a big wheel.

They did the same with the V11’s speaker.

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21 hours ago, EUC_user said:

They did the same with the V11’s speaker.

I think they should just provide a like a hole across the body, where you put your JBL Extreme or something across it and can plug it into a USB.

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On 6/8/2021 at 7:21 PM, mrelwood said:

a beefier  battery doesn’t increase the braking power with the same input unless you were already overleaning the wheel.

 

Someone said the same to me until they tried my MCM5 67V, that until he decided to break and heard the wheel screech, and stopped abruptly/safely...  So sorry I not only disagree, I keep avoiding hiting people thanks to having 64 x 20A batteries... I've yet to see try wheel on which I can break faster....

Also I have a V5F with VTC6 and one without, the difference on them is massive, anyone that tries them is loves the acceleration and breaking of the one with VTC6 cells.

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1 hour ago, OneLeg said:

I keep avoiding hiting people thanks to having 64 x 20A batteries…

That would say something about your riding attitude that I don’t think you intend to or wish to do.

 How would you explain the physics  dilemma where a self-balancing vehicle brakes faster than another similar vehicle with the same input, yet the pedals stay level on both wheels?

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11 minutes ago, mrelwood said:

How would you explain the physics  dilemma where a self-balancing vehicle brakes faster than another similar vehicle with the same input, yet the pedals stay level on both wheels?

Disclaimer: I probably don't know well what I'm talking about here, and that might be completely wrong:

When braking, the high current energy from the motor is absorbed immediately by the capacitors, which act as a buffer until it is transferred in the cells by charging them.
The faster the cells can be charged, emptying the excess voltage/energy from the capacitor, the more the wheel can handle regen from the motor before reaching over-voltage levels.

This is given the high drain cells's chemistry, suffering from less voltage sag has also the same reverse capability when being charged.

It's just a theory, I'm not sure it's valid or if it's what happens in that case.

Edited by supercurio
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2 minutes ago, mrelwood said:

That would say something about your riding attitude that I don’t think you intend to or wish to do.

 How would you explain the physics  dilemma where a self-balancing vehicle brakes faster than another similar vehicle with the same input, yet the pedals stay level on both wheels?

Oh nice put down there about "attitude".... Accidents can happen, you may not be going fast but some kid pops out of nowhere, because he was hiding being a large flower pot. When that happens, the only thing that matters is how fast you pump Watts into that motor... whether it is fully charged or you are 50% down...

I've yet never hit anyone, for one simple reason, because I use unicycles with high capacity discharge batteries. My MCM had 10A batteries before and it was a joke.... actually one guy I know really hurt himself on it, accelerated hard, broke hard, could not output enough, it could not maintain himself fell backwards,  he smashed both sides of his phone tore his pants... 

I've even tried the 84V version of the MCM and it just doesn't break like my 67V... 

I only know that the less discharge a unicycle has even on responsive, say the V8, the more likely I am not to be able to stop in emergency to injure someone... so the more conservative I am on my riding.

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3 hours ago, supercurio said:

The faster the cells can be charged, emptying the excess voltage/energy from the capacitor, the more the wheel can handle regen from the motor before reaching over-voltage levels.

I’m pretty sure the regenerative braking doesn’t play a role here. In a fast braking situation the motor is used to accelerate backwards, and the wheel uses power from the batteries to do so.

 What I was getting at was the dilemma in the geometry. But the answer was actually in your next part:

3 hours ago, OneLeg said:

actually one guy I know really hurt himself on it, accelerated hard, broke hard, could not output enough, it could not maintain himself fell backwards

That was a clear overlean situation, and the wheel was not able to put out enough power to keep the pedals level. It’s pretty self-explanatory that batteries with a higher output help in such situation.

What I tried to point out was that unless the wheel is being overleaned, there should not be a difference in braking distance. Meaning, if you brake more gently, the wheel with beefier batteries will brake just the same as the regular one.

Back to the V12. In your first post (the review) you said that:

On 6/5/2021 at 12:40 AM, OneLeg said:

the breaking power is not up to my liking

If the V12 has sufficient acceleration, it doesn’t make sense that the braking power would not be just as satisfactory. Unless you as well overleaned the wheel by trying to brake fast. That’s why asked about clarification on the braking: Did the pedals go soft while you were braking, preventing you from braking faster?

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4 hours ago, supercurio said:

When braking, the high current energy from the motor is absorbed immediately by the capacitors, which act as a buffer until it is transferred in the cells by charging them.

Unfortionately not. Voltage at a capacitor rises proportional to current over time (dU= I / C * dt).

As the capacitance of the capacitor is "negligible" compared to the capacitance of the battery the voltage at the capacitor "rises very fast" and by the difference to the battery voltage the charge drains off "quite immedeately".

It is just by the paraditic wires inductances that the capacitors are "needed" - to prevent voltage spikes/sag at current changes.

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