New to EUCs no experience at all

[CNR]

Hi all,

I need some help

I bought a year ago a Xiaomi M365 for practical reasons and before I knew it i was looking for a way more fun scooter (I was dreaming a Dualtron Ultra 2) but since the Ultra is over my budget, somehow I started considering getting a EUC.

I am between the Kingsong 16S and the 18XL but i'm very indecisive even if it would be a good idea in the first place.

I want something practical and i NEED it to be fun (i.e. something I can use for the daily runs and also being able to ride it like a hooligan when I want to)

The 16S is 700€ cheaper and much easier for me to buy but doesn't seem promising in the fun factor while the 18XL is surely a much better specd wheel, but again i've never ridden an EUC before, I don't even know how easy would be to learn to ride comfortably and if I will actually find any fun in it.

Any opinions please ? Maybe someone that has been in my place ?

I'm 50+, ex-biker, present family man

I know the above is the definition of a boring noob question and I apologize, but if i could find some opinions here it might help me make up my mind, there are no EUCs where I live nor a chance to try one and I really can't spend 1100-1800€ on something that doesn't suit me.

 

Thanks :-)

[null]

Welcome.

EUCs are the most exhilarating thing that happened to vehicles since forever, so you probably won't regret.
The 16S will be more reactive and fun, but the 18XL wins at speed and long distance.

Having both I'd go for the 18XL if I could only have one. It is way fun enough, and you can go on faraway expeditions without worry. Speed makes it easier to keep up with traffic should you need. It also has the benefit of being more stable on potholes and such.

The 16S is also a good classic, if you could get one second hand you could start with that and sell it if you wanted to upgrade.

Just my two cent, cheers.

Edited April 20, 2021 by null

[.....]

The 18Xl/L is a win..win. It does pleasant, it does reliable, it does finesse. I find it a very fun wheel, as I do with all mine. However, the 18 series just has the smoothest freaking power curve. I enjoy the speakers, the easy trolley, the available RollNZ cover and its simple ergos and reliablility. If I could have only one, it would easily be my 18L. I'm betting an 18XL is the same with more icing on top... Fwiw, its not a very wide wheel and it makes it pretty easy to stay comfy and load into a vehicle. At $1500 for a great used wheel, the 18XL is a very solid choice. If you can learn it, it WILL be fun, regardless of wheel.

Edited April 20, 2021 by ShanesPlanet

[Tawpie]

in your price range there won't be a ton of hooliganing going on, but that might be a good thing for a person that has obligations beyond self satisfaction. Wheels are absolutely a different kind of fun than a scooter though, even the entry level EUCs have the ability to do so many more things than a scooter (road, dirt, stairs, tricks etc.). Def the 18X/XL is more suitable if you quickly outgrew your scooter, the 16S is a great learner but is easily outgrown because it's... a learner.

[meepmeepmayer]

Get a used wheel for massive savings. Used wheels are great because there is not much that can be wrong with them. See here for some more on this.

If it's only between the 16S and 18XL, of course the 18XL has more range and is the more "serious" wheel than will be enough for you for a long time. 16S is nice, too, but will likely prove to have not enough range and speed in the longer run. So I'd take the 18XL. Not sure if I wouldn't buy any of those two new (used is completely different) though, simply because they're older wheels and a few € more could get you a V11 for example instead of an 18XL, or you buy used and save a ton in comparison.

[CNR]

Wow! So many responses in so little time !! This is better than I could hope for !

Thanks a lot guys :-)

So, what I get is, everyone agrees that 18XL = long term relationship while 16S = great but more of a learner, so I guess 18XL is the way to go.

Btw, is it possible to ride comfortably for like a mile with your hands occupied holding stuff (bags and such) ?

 

Null: “potholes and such” is my greatest fear, but I've seen ppl in youtube going over monstrous obstacles and branches so it's probably because I haven't ridden one.

 

ShanesPlanet: I loved your post but man! that “if you can learn it” killed me! Is there a reason why I couldn't learn ? Are there ppl who really tried and didn't succeed ?

What's the “RollNZ cover” ?

I find the 18XL 1790€ on sales here, so I believe it is a great price.

 

Tawpie: “in your price range there won't be a ton of hooliganing going on” yeah, i'm sure you're right but hooliganing for me is just going fast(ish) in an empty place, cornering decently, getting up and down pavements in speed (maybe a few stairs in the future) and such, for which I think the 18XL is ok.

“but that might be a good thing for a person that has obligations beyond self satisfaction” Man! Don't say ppl things like that, it's like an old man complaining to you he doesn't see well and you tell him “that might not be so bad, it won't be for long” trust me, he knows! :-)

 

meepmeepmayer: I thought about the V11, I think it has the nicer looks and I love the idea of the gas suspension (I'd play with the pressures and rebound settings every day) but I thought to keep it simple and (hence) more reliable for my first EUC, besides, the 18XL is marginally in my budget right now.

 

 

Edited April 21, 2021 by CNR

[Daley1]

Seriously guys???

This is a newbie and u want to hitch him to a 50kmh wheel without any skills???

The 16s is the perfect commuter/starter wheel.Ur not going to be riding 60/70 ks  straight up.U dont need to be riding in traffic early on.U will find the 16 inch wheel easier to maneuver, more portable,strong and reliable and a good wheel to develop skills on.Get the Roll.nz cover and a set of XL pedals and ur set to go.

Learn slowly and safely and gear up(get Safety gear).

[winterwheel]

 Go with the XL.

[winterwheel]

1 hour ago, CNR said:

Btw, is it possible to ride comfortably for like a mile with your hands occupied holding stuff (bags and such) ?

I (and probably many of us) do this all the time -- it's one of the great reasons to have a wheel. Nipping out to the grocery store, for example, to pick up a few things is a whole lot faster on wheel than a car even.

[Tawpie]

You’ll have a lot of fun with the 18XL and for quite a long time. Yeah, I sound like an old guy, but I am an old guy so I have an excuse. Don’t be like me, but do be safe. Rehab cuts into your riding time and nobody likes that.

Edited April 21, 2021 by Tawpie

[winterwheel]

My core group is almost all power wheels now, several V11, my EX, and some Shermies. And one guy with a two year old XL. The XL keeps up with us on our group rides just fine, off-road and on both. 

[CNR]

6 minutes ago, Tawpie said:

You’ll have a lot of fun with the 18XL and for quite a long time. Yeah, I sound like an old guy, but I am an old guy so I have an excuse. Don’t be like me, but do be safe. Rehab prevents you from riding.

You don't sound old, i was kidding and i tend to think that all ppl here are way younger than i am.  :-) 

[CNR]

47 minutes ago, Daley1 said:

Seriously guys???

This is a newbie and u want to hitch him to a 50kmh wheel without any skills???

The 16s is the perfect commuter/starter wheel.Ur not going to be riding 60/70 ks  straight up.U dont need to be riding in traffic early on.U will find the 16 inch wheel easier to maneuver, more portable,strong and reliable and a good wheel to develop skills on.Get the Roll.nz cover and a set of XL pedals and ur set to go.

Learn slowly and safely and gear up(get Safety gear).

Hey, i feel you. You are right but i really know these, it's not like i will jump on the wheel and do 50kph. The thing is that it doesn't make sense to me to buy something i will be looking to replace in a few months. 

"Learn slowly and safely and gear up" : You bet i will !  :-)

[CNR]

All right, after i've read and seen videos about the inherent wobble issue of EUCs and various tutorials of how to learn, i admit i'm kinda intimidated. Hell, some of those vids made me think it would be easier and faster to become a kung fu master than learning to ride as comfortably as i do on my scooter.

How long did it take you to feel ready to ride on the road/sidewalk with ppl ?

If you don't push it, can you expect to avoid major falls (i.e: landing on more than your hands and knees) ? 

I've heard ppl claiming they feel more safe and in control on a wheel than on an electric scooter, do you feel the same ?    

  

[null]

Overanalysing a learning that is mostly muscle memory based isn't helpful for learning at least (for science later on maybe). Wobbles aren't an issue, they will pass naturally. Just dont go faster that your skills allow. If anything overthinking it is maybe the biggest handicap of beginners. You can check out this learning thread by @Albatross for whom it didn't come naturally. After much back and forth the conclusion was "relax".

There is a whole school of people who are (IMO) making it more complicated that it needs to be.
They are creating most of the problems they are trying to solve (once again, IMO)

(else: I am infinitely more table and in control on a EUC than on a e-kick scooter.)

Edited April 22, 2021 by null

[litewave]

1 hour ago, CNR said:

All right, after i've read and seen videos about the inherent wobble issue of EUCs and various tutorials of how to learn, i admit i'm kinda intimidated. Hell, some of those vids made me think it would be easier and faster to become a kung fu master than learning to ride as comfortably as i do on my scooter.

How long did it take you to feel ready to ride on the road/sidewalk with ppl ?

If you don't push it, can you expect to avoid major falls (i.e: landing on more than your hands and knees) ? 

I've heard ppl claiming they feel more safe and in control on a wheel than on an electric scooter, do you feel the same ?    

  

If you need to learn to ride quickly and will be riding among pedestrians often, I would recommend a 16" wheel. For occasional adult pedestrians and small groups, I would say it was two months before I was confident I could ride safely around them. For elderly and children, I would add another 1-2 months. For crowded areas such as plazas or outdoor malls, I would say six months. These are conservative estimates and depend on whether and how quickly you learn to fully control the wheel. I have never driven a Sherman but imagine that would take much longer. Allow yourself at least a month or two before you give up. Very few people can't learn to ride safely by then, at which point you will discover the exhilaration that makes it all worthwhile. If you ride very cautiously, especially at first, that will reduce the chance of reckless behavior that will lead to an accident that could ruin everything.

You will faceplant eventually. I experienced my first one during my first two weeks of learning to ride in grass, so it was easier to walk away from. My second and third did not occur until two years later due to battery cut-outs (faulty replacement battery packs). If you invest in full riding gear including (in order of importance) a full-face helmet, high-quality wrist guards, elbow guards (very snug with 3D0 recommended), and quality knee pads, you should be able to survive normal scenarios at lower speeds  where there is little to no risk of being run over by a vehicle.

Edited April 22, 2021 by litewave

[winterwheel]

Balderdash. Complete and utter nonsense. I teach people all the time who are ready to go on rides out in public after a couple of hours of practice. Nobody in our group has had a faceplant in normal riding conditions.

Edited April 22, 2021 by winterwheel

[null]

I thought several friends and family who where up and riding through the city on day 2 (bike lane, carefully).
The slower cases took maybe 4-6 « sessions » to be functional.

This reflects most the cases I read online.

Edited April 22, 2021 by null

[CNR]

Winterwheel: Is that so ? Oh man, i can live with that, i believe i can live with like a week of frustrating practice before i can have some kind of fun, but more than that, i'm afraid i'll just give up.  I live in a suburb with wide mostly quiet streets/pavements, so being able to practice out of the garage in days, rather than months, really gives me hope.  Thanks! 

[winterwheel]

I actually have a little side business teaching people to ride. The process comprises a two hour session where I give an orientation (me blathering on for half an hour or so) followed by up to 90 minutes riding around a rink. Then the student takes a wheel home and practices for a couple of days on their own. This works for everybody.

The process is probably a bit streamlined because I have equipment, location, and tons of practice as a teacher at this point. But if it its taking longer than a few days to get the hang of it then hit us up for some tips, because there'll be something you can change in your process or approach or technique.

 

Edited April 22, 2021 by winterwheel

[CNR]

Cheers guys ! You're wonderful !

[RockyTop]

@winterwheel has me beat in all categories.  I have tough 10 people now. Some take to it quicker than others. My daughter learned to ride in less than an hour. My wife, ... 50 year old grandmother of two with poor balance, took longer but she would not give up. Most can ride in a few hours. Feeling confident while riding takes longer. Most people enjoy learning. So while you get sore it is still fun. After a few months most are more agile and comfortable on an EUC than a bicycle. 

[mike_bike_kite]

Learning: it helps to have someone show you the ropes and also prove that it is possible. If you don't have someone then it will take you a week of solid practise. After about a month of riding you'll feel safe in traffic. After 2 months you might actually be safe in traffic. I'd get some protection for whatever wheel you get.

Fun : it will be fairly terrifying for the first few weeks. There's always a new challenge. Just remember that you will fall particularly when learning. 

I am between the Kingsong 16S and the 18XL: The 16S is far more manoeuvrable and accelerates quicker but it sounds like you'll outgrow it in a year. The 18XL is faster and has much better range. The 16X is another wheel to look at that has good acceleration, is manoeuvrable and good range but isn't quite so fast as the 18XL. I wouldn't go with the V11 as a first wheel as it's more fragile than most wheels and you'll be dropping the wheel a lot.

I want something practical: if you ever have to walk up stairs at home or work then you'll want a lighter wheel. Otherwise all the benefits of stability, speed and range are with the heavier wheels. Unfortunately they usually cost more as well.

Personally I'd go with the 18XL and just protect it as much as you can. I'd also try and find someone local to show you the ropes as it will make learning so much faster (and less painful).

[.....]

On 4/20/2021 at 8:53 PM, CNR said:

So, what I get is, everyone agrees that 18XL = long term relationship while 16S = great but more of a learner, so I guess 18XL is the way to go.

My learner was the 18L. Its still my favorite goto and it has taken a decent beating. Looks farily new under the cover and works flawlessly.

Btw, is it possible to ride comfortably for like a mile with your hands occupied holding stuff (bags and such) ?

yes of course. I have carried huge things for fun. Throwing heavy objects while in motion is a challenge. You are assuming more risk with things in your hands. Howevr, if you are comfy on a wheel and ride responsibly, theres no reason one couldnt assume they could carry things. Backpacks make it even easier.

ShanesPlanet: I loved your post but man! that “if you can learn it” killed me! Is there a reason why I couldn't learn ? Are there ppl who really tried and didn't succeed ?

Of course there are. I purchased my first wheel (ks18L) from a  person who gave up after 2 miles. Just as its wrong to assume EVERYONE can learn to roller skate. Your level of physical ability and mental conviction will be the biggest factors in success or fail. I personally refused to think I couldnt learn it, as i'd seen too many old people and tiny kids learn it. 

What's the “RollNZ cover” ?

The rollNZ cover is a neoprene cover that protects the wheel a bit and protects you from the wheel a bit as well.

 

 

Fwiw, It was a few months of riding for me to become comfortable enough I would brave crowded traffic or sidewalk areas. Perhaps Im just a slow learner, but even now: I dont prefer riding in close proximity to random bystanders. How long it takes you to learn to ride, is dependant on too many variables.

If you put the @ symbol before a name, it will tag them for you.

 

Edited April 23, 2021 by ShanesPlanet

[winterwheel]

16 minutes ago, ShanesPlanet said:

Btw, is it possible to ride comfortably for like a mile with your hands occupied holding stuff (bags and such) ?

I often carry one wheel while riding another, in order to deliver wheels to people who have rented them or when getting them returned. Distance travelled is about 1km each way. Most often these are tesla v2 wheels, which at 42 pounds puts my total riding weight at close to 300 lbs on these occasions.