Kingsong S20/S22 (Confirmed)

[Seba]

27 minutes ago, UniVehje said:

Plus KS is the only brand that allows you to ride down to 3V per cell and that gives maybe 20 extra kilometres(?).

With 18XL it's even possible to ride below 3V per cell. Of course wheel will tilt back, but as long as you don't stop, tiltback angle is moderate so you can continue riding with this unnatural riding stance for some time. At least I was able to ride with battery voltage dropping below 59 V.

[yoos]

Indeed, the range estimate seems adequate under the 20kph, 60kg constraints. I commute at 20kph average speed (but my speed is not constant) on the 16S at around 95kg geared weight and I have a consistent average consumption of 13Wh/km (thanks EUCw for the data). Speed is the most important range factor due to immense wind resistance at high speeds. 

[Heyzeus]

20 hours ago, gon2fast said:

Hard no from the wife so looking for alternate funding..

 

maybe you should start an OnlyFans account and start turning tricks like Hirsute/Damien on your EUC to get some funding

Edited August 27, 2021 by Heyzeus

[I_Must_Bust]

14 hours ago, mrelwood said:

the wheel hasn’t yet been built.

I didn't realize that. I'll need to temper my expectations in that case.

1 hour ago, Heyzeus said:

maybe you should start an OnlyFans account and start turning tricks like Hirsute/Damien on your EUC to get some funding

Sub to my OnlyWheels

[WildHuman]

Wondering about the coil Shock, most of the time those are tuned for a piacular weight and you have to change the spring to go to a different. There are some adjustment with the side can, but not as much as a true air shock (spring in a smoother ride) 

[itsmark]

2 minutes ago, WildHuman said:

Wondering about the coil Shock, most of the time those are tuned for a piacular weight and you have to change the spring to go to a different. There are some adjustment with the side can, but not as much as a true air shock (spring in a smoother ride) 

I was thinking the same. In the live interview on evX, Jack said (as I remember it) the coil shock on the S20 is actually less supple in the top part of the travel when compared to the air shock on the S18. I don't know how much of a difference changing the spring will make or if you need to go to an air shock to get a similar response. The shock size is listed as 240-75 or 240-76 which seems to be the same as 9.5"x3" and replacement springs in different weights are about $30.

[mike_bike_kite]

2 hours ago, UniVehje said:

KS 18XL is pretty much still the gold standard on weight/range ratio.

Actually, I'm not so sure it is. One of the reports in my EUC database shows weight/range. Believe it or not, the Mten3 512Wh, the Monster 2400Wh and the Tesla 1480Wh are all better (for that one ratio). 

[Paradox]

So I pre-ordered the S20 yesterday.  Why hasn't it shipped yet?   This waiting is killing me!    /s

[AtlasP]

I'm firmly in the camp of still lauding the 18XL and even 16S as having been truly great wheels (not only for their time but which hold up even to this day within their price brackets/use cases), and the King Song that made them was a great company that had a solid track record.

Conversely, everyone should remember King Song's most recent two rushed and botched (more-than-normal-even-for-EUCs) launches in a row with the 16X and 18S, and specifically because they were rushing to keep up with a competitor's launch (the Nikola and V11, respectively). Even down to King Song disingenuously scrambling to hold their S18 announcement and launch immediately before the V11's when they clearly weren't yet ready (and ultimately the V11 still launched/shipped before the S18).

I had high hopes that this latest wheel might be a return to form, but it's really, really difficult to ignore what appears to be a glaring repeat to the pattern--specifically with this announcement 1) which is only renders before they even have any working prototypes (!?) and 2) suspiciously right around the same time as info on the Hero and others publicly comes to light? C'mon now..

(To be clear, this isn't defending/arguing in favor of the Hero. I agree the S20 looks much more promising than the Hero in almost every way. I'm simply leery of any company with a now-established pattern of rushing/basing their launch schedules around competitors instead of when they are actually ready.)

Edit: to those proposing that Begode may have pulled a King Song instead of the other way around, let us not forget that one of these wheels exists in the wild with people like Kuji testing it, while the other is only renders with no working prototypes to show. It really doesn't make sense the other way around. (Just because we may have heard about the S20 teaser before the latest Hero leaks, doesn't mean that KS didn't choose to make their announcement now because they may have learned about the Hero prototypes out in the wild and wanted to get their announcement out first. Why else would they make a big announcement using only renders before they have a single prototype to show?)

Edited October 13, 2021 by AtlasP

[Rawnei]

19 minutes ago, AtlasP said:

I had high hopes that this latest wheel might be a return to form, but it's really, really difficult to ignore what appears to be a glaring repeat to the pattern--specifically with this announcement 1) which is only renders before they even have any working prototypes (!?) and 2) suspiciously right around the same time as info on the Hero publicly comes to light? C'mon now..

 

(To be clear, this isn't defending/arguing in favor of the Hero. I agree the S20 looks much more promising than the Hero in almost every way. I'm simply leery of any company with a now-established pattern of rushing/basing their launch schedules around competitors instead of when they are actually ready.)

It's the other way around, actually. S20 had a 2 week countdown timer for the reveal then Hero just dropped a few days before out of nowhere, so in this case it looks like Begode pulled a King Song.

[Unbihexium]

3 minutes ago, Rawnei said:

It's the other way around, actually. S20 had a 2 week countdown timer for the reveal then Hero just dropped a few days before out of nowhere, so in this case it looks like Begode pulled a King Song.

I still can't stop laughing internally at this. It's clear that Gotway dropped the Hero to try and take the wind out of KingSong's sails being like "you know that suspension wheel KS is updating? Well now you can get that with GoTwAy SpEeD!!1!™" but in reality just making themselves look like a joke re-releasing the RS19HT but this time with an 80lbs aluminum case and a suspension instead of an extra battery pack at $4k while KS announces an actual next generation wheel. 

[RedpaX]

colorful kingsong s20

[itsmark]

41 minutes ago, RedpaX said:

colorful kingsong s20

I was actually thinking of paining mine (assuming I get one) like the bottom left. I'm not a big fan of how bright the S20 looks and I especially don't like their current color scheme of red and purple (your images show red metal pieces instead of the purple, is there a reason?)

[Heyzeus]

4 hours ago, itsmark said:

I was thinking the same. In the live interview on evX, Jack said (as I remember it) the coil shock on the S20 is actually less supple in the top part of the travel when compared to the air shock on the S18. I don't know how much of a difference changing the spring will make or if you need to go to an air shock to get a similar response. The shock size is listed as 240-75 or 240-76 which seems to be the same as 9.5"x3" and replacement springs in different weights are about $30.

maybe in the 3rd batch or later ewheels can get some springless/shockless units and either sell the right spring for your weight or sell a select few compatible aftermarket fox shocks alongside it and install them.

 

[gon2fast]

9 hours ago, Heyzeus said:

maybe you should start an OnlyFans account and start turning tricks like Hirsute/Damien on your EUC to get some funding

I thought that they recently banned that LOL.

Conversation continued today - get rid of two or three wheels and get a new one... HARD NO.

[RedpaX]

6 hours ago, itsmark said:

I was actually thinking of paining mine (assuming I get one) like the bottom left. I'm not a big fan of how bright the S20 looks and I especially don't like their current color scheme of red and purple (your images show red metal pieces instead of the purple, is there a reason?)

My too. Grey looks like 👍🏻. I think red metal better than purple. purple is a strange choice.

[Rawnei]

7 hours ago, RedpaX said:

colorful kingsong s20

Same image but a bit more muted and black version. 😎

[AtlasP]

20 hours ago, Rawnei said:

It's the other way around, actually. S20 had a 2 week countdown timer for the reveal then Hero just dropped a few days before out of nowhere, so in this case it looks like Begode pulled a King Song.

Except the Hero has hardware in the wild that people like Kuji have been testing, while the S20 is only a render. For all intents and purposes one of these wheels exists and the other doesn't (at least not yet).

Just because you may have heard about the S20 teaser before the Hero, doesn't mean that KS didn't choose to make their announcement because they may have learned about the Hero prototypes out in the wild and wanted to get their announcement out first. Why else would they make a big announcement using only renders without a single prototype to show?

If your argument is that supposedly King Song decided on their own to announce their new wheel based solely on a render before they had a working prototype, then 1) that doesn't make any sense and 2) if true, it makes them look even worse than my original argument.

Edited August 28, 2021 by AtlasP

[Rawnei]

45 minutes ago, AtlasP said:

Except the Hero has hardware in the wild that people like Kuji have been testing, while the S20 is only a render. For all intents and purposes one of these wheels exists and the other doesn't (at least not yet).

Just because you may have heard about the S20 teaser before the Hero, doesn't mean that KS didn't choose to make their announcement because they may have learned about the Hero and wanted to get their announcement out first. Why else would they make a big announcement using only renders without a single prototype to show?

If your argument is that supposedly King Song decided on their own to announce their new wheel based solely on a render before they had a working prototype, then 1) that doesn't make any sense and 2) if true, it makes them look even worse than my original argument.

If you read my post couple a bit further up about red flags you would see that I agree with you that I worry about the prototypes and only existing as a paper product, but I can't honestly say that I believe they tried to pull one over the Hero it really seems the other way around.

[SanDiegoGuy]

I have a question.  I weigh only 130 lbs.  Would it be beneficial for me to get a suspension wheel such as an S20?  Would the suspension provide me with a comfortable ride as a heavier rider or would my light weight not benefit from the suspension?

[PourUC]

11 minutes ago, SanDiegoGuy said:

I have a question.  I weigh only 130 lbs.  Would it be beneficial for me to get a suspension wheel such as an S20?  Would the suspension provide me with a comfortable ride as a heavier rider or would my light weight not benefit from the suspension?

On the S18 your weight wouldn't be an issue. However, the spring on the S20 changes things, until we know the specific setup they use it's too early to tell how much your weight will be effected. However, their frame of reference is chinese people who weigh nothing so I imagine it would be okay.

 

[mrelwood]

The spring on the S20 is something like a $30 item to replace with one that works optionally with your weight. Just like in fully suspended mountain bikes, they are very much beneficial for lighter riders as well. It is possible that you wouldn’t get the most optimal small bump comfort on the stock spring, but still, even the crappiest suspension that cars have been sold with since something like the 1930’s was better than no suspension at all.

Edited August 28, 2021 by mrelwood

[Beachboy]

Hey, excused me if this had been asked before.. but how do we lift this wheel anyway?

[Tawpie]

48 minutes ago, Beachboy said:

Hey, excused me if this had been asked before.. but how do we lift this wheel anyway?

So far it's still a render so it's really not possible to lift it at all.

But I also don't see any obvious two handed lift points in the render... trolley handle and the pedals maybe?

[mrelwood]

Reusing the S18 limp mode, lifting could be designed so (clumsily) that you first need to lift the trolley handle to the first indent which disengages balancing, and then lift the wheel from below the replaceable front bumper. Since there’s no obvious way for lifting the wheel in the 3D design, the guesswork is free to run wild here (as well).