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61 year old guy...from Portugal - day #1


Paulo Mesquita

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On 2/3/2021 at 5:28 AM, ShanesPlanet said:

The idea of leaning/turning/accel/decell, is so that you create a new balance that is not centered. The new 'balance' offcentered, has the benefit of g forces and also the benefit of preventing an abrupt side loading changeup. Maintaining perfect balance is much harder than maintaining offset-balance with the help of g-forces. I have wobbled in turns of course, but being leaned over means that the wobble will NOT reach the point that the tire is changing sides in loading, it is merely loading a little less and a little more, but not opposite. Again, perfect symmetry and balance is MUCH harder to maintain, than an offset balance. Slowing while controlling a side lean is effective, as you are forcing the wheel to stay leaned and off center, less likely allowing it to choose for you. Try riding big even circles at a decent speed and note how evenly and smoothly you can do it. Now try and ride perfectly straight with minimal accel/deccel and tell me if its as smooth and easily maintained as the big circle....

@ShanesPlanet I think you're spot on! I had a few more wobbles yesterday and today (next I'll post about session #6 & #7) and was able to figure out it was due to two things:

1) muscle tiredness or too relaxed

2) not pressuring the wheel enough with the inner sides of my legs. I assume that more experienced riders don't need this du to their evolved micro balance on the EUC, but for a newbie it is crucial. At least in my case. In most cases, once the wobble started I tightened my legs on the wheel and the wobble went. In other situations it had to do with my vertical posture being off the proper "unbalance". I adjusted my position and the wobbles went away.

 I notice no difference in wobbles in relationship to my actual position on the wheel.

That too seemed to affect my wobbles. 

 

 

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On 2/3/2021 at 5:45 AM, UniMe said:

....eventually adapt the micro movements necessary to compensate for or overcome wobbles in these positions, as a new rider it is hard to do.

.Exactly my experience in the past two days

... my love for warm beaches in Europe and frustration at needing to cancel a trip to Portugal last year :facepalm:

If it any consolation, the beautiful warm beaches are all closed right now. I just passed a few this morning. Not a single soul on the sand...

 

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On 2/3/2021 at 2:39 AM, null said:

... It mostly happen when you learn riding, but can also kick in for a seasoned rider, due to fatigue, high speed or particularly strong tramline effect.

One reason for me...

....If you get it from standing far front of the pedals it is probably because you're not used to standing on that place and the body isn't dosing the balance correctly. 

Also another reason with me.

 

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On 2/3/2021 at 5:57 AM, UniMe said:

...With the EUC you not only need to balance but to also develop millisecond type responses that prevent the wheel from wobbling, many of these responses are generated in the core musculature we use for balance.

Exactly my experience in the past2 days!!! The millisecond type responses and micro muscle adjustments in a combination of focus but also relaxation allowed me to do some interesting small but very important improvements

 

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On 2/3/2021 at 8:07 AM, Seba said:

Consider getting one of Aftershokz headphones. They are different from typical headphones in that they are using bone conduction technology. As this technology is used in hearing aids, you could benefit from Aftershokz. Another great advantage of Aftershokz is that they don't block your ears. Recently Aftershokz released relatively cheap model - Aftershokz Openmove, with price tag below 100 EUR in Portugal:

https://www.probikeshop.pt/auriculares-bluetooth-aftershokz-open-move-cinzento/213583.html

With Aftershokz and EUC World, you can set many different and customized alarms and voice messages that you won't miss even in the strongest wind noise. And having ears open for ambient sound will keep you aware of surroundings, nearby traffic etc. You can also listen to your favourite tunes while riding, still hearing all the sounds from outside world. Of course, music volume can't be too high :)

@Seba, great tip! I'm definitely going to look into them. Thanks, mate!

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9 hours ago, Yellowjacket said:

Took it up last year, when I was 70. Now I need to learn how to pendulum, cuz you know, it's hard lifting feet high enough to get them up on the pedals more than a few times a day. I think the new S18 will be easier on my bones.
 1308605692_onwheel.thumb.jpg.4091d89c26fba16b881cae2d9daeb8e6.jpg

Figure eights were helpful, but spend as much time learning to stop safely as learning to go.
Please also remember, we usually go where we're looking. I really didn't want to rear end that truck, but kept looking at it until … 

(I wear a helmet on the street).

@Yellowjacket I've been extremely motivated in the past months about EUC riding and particularly now that I've started a week ago. Let me say that this photo of you, being older than over a decade or so, and riding in such a cool, relaxed fashion... is one of the most inspiring things I've seen and felt since I joined this crazy and mind-blowing hobby/sport. Thank you so much for sharing!!! ...Kudos to you!!!!

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Days # 6 & #7 of EUC learning.

After a birthday of cake, cake and cake... I got back on the beast yesterday with one single idea in mind: follow all the recent and wise advice from all you Yodas! And so I did.

I went into the garage, lowered the max speed alert to 15km/h and started riding much slower:

The goals:

1) do micro movements both in muscle and balance at the lowest speeds possible. Improved a lot thanks to all your precious advice.

2) understand and wobble that might come up and find ways to learn the causes and work on solutions. It was actually quaite fun. The wobbles came and I fixed them: 

- Tighten legs hard against the wheel....like a 16 year old virgin...

- Straighten the body up and relax the upper body a little. It worked. Bottom half hard, upper half loose...

- Correct feet position on the pedals. maybe I was having them too far up front. A slight adjustment in foot positioning (half an inch back) and the ride seemed a lot more solid.

3) Working on curving a bit more at the lowest possible speed inside the garage. I got it  5 or 6 times,

4) The best one...the hated skateboard push with no wall to hold onto!!! Man, I always hated skateboards, precisely because being the idiot I am I was never able to ride them. But you guys said it was the best way to ride (and I was already quite more confident in braking) so I had that on my agenda.

Well, it was the best!!! Yesterday I was able to do 2 full 140mt rides inside the garage, with no wall holding to get on, and then I went outside onto the gravel road and did another 2!!! Wow, it  made my day.

TODAY I REPEATED THE DOSE!!! And it was even better. I started away from the wall on purpose and got on and rode every time, once in about 3 to 5 attempts (yesterday it was a ride in about 15 to 20 attempts). This particular skateboard launch was by far the hardest thing I ever learnt both with EUC learning at 61 as with rollerblade learning at 35. WHAT A TOUGH EXERCISE! Up, lose balance fall. Up, lose balance fall, Up, adjust, wobble, correct and go!!!

Again I went outside and this time I did 3 full runs of 140mt on the rough gravel road. But the most interesting thing happened: I literally only failed 2 or 3 skateboard launches!!!...in three full runs. I was very tired (43 minutes practice) but it just felt easier??? safer???...i don't know but it was a most gratifying way to end the 2nd session following the new directions given by the wise ones :clap3:

 

 

 

Edited by Paulo Mesquita
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On 2/3/2021 at 7:55 AM, ShanesPlanet said:

in a forward lean with a wheel pushing against us, we are in effect in an 'upright' posture. This is not shared by your other examples, tho your point is well taken and great info. Standing upright while moving forwards is actually a little behind the center of gravity. Same basic principal, but we have to bend more at the ankles  and compensate at the knees and waist. Maybe Im wording that wrong, but you get the gist. @Paulo Mesquita seems like he totally digs reading this stuff, gives me excuse to blah blah blah blah.

I totally dig reading and learning a lot with this stuff. Better than any YT video. I get all your insights and brainstorming for free,,,,

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wheee! It's starting to click. The muscles are learning, progress will come more quickly now that you're getting going. Gravel can be a challenge but if it's working it's a great place to train—the not-perfect surface will train your balance.

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On 2/4/2021 at 8:44 AM, Paulo Mesquita said:

 

Nice, happy to see you are progressing! The EUC is great for core strength and stability, it might even firm up your flanks and belly a bit over time. Without power pads it will also build your calves a bit, now that I have power pads I just flex my knees forward a bit though and it takes a LOT of strain off my feet and calves. This makes longer rides a lot more enjoyable and less fatiguing. Also, on my RS I just rip out of the corners doing this :) I think it's probably best to build your basic skills without power pads though... they can make a person a bit lazy.

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Day #8 learning

45 minute workout with one single goal: NEVER TAKE OF WITH WALL HELP... just skateboard push. 

Went into the garage ( did three 120mt runs outside on the gravel but the weather was bad with plenty of gushes of strong wind... Which never help a newbie!!! 😁).

So I went into the garage again to do the 140mt runs.

The 1st 20 minutes were hard, with a ratio if about 5 fails to 1 success. 

But then... it clicked! Out of 30 attempts I did 25 runs and only 5 fails! No wall help, only skateboard takeoffs. 

I even did a full run wobbling the entire time and controlled it with minor speed adjustments and balance micro movements. 

I figured out something simple when I got the skate takeoffs right: don't kill for too the pedals... LOOK FORWARD! Some of the takeoffs were turning too much to the left (guide leg) but with strong torso movements I got it running. 

I now also end each run in the garage with a 90º turn and full stop,, having the EUC calmily almost every time. 

Had one hard fall, and for the second time this week... I fell on the wheel. Hurt like a bitch! 

I was naughty and once again went over the 20km/hour mark. But only one time! 😁😁😁

 

Edited by Paulo Mesquita
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Hehe so you are now soon off the albatros take off and landing. 

Once you get more confident you gain more grace. 

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Sometimes skateboard start and place my second foot in front of the pedal in anticipation of accel that isnt there. Makes the nutz shirvel when traffic is coming and you miss that step. lol

 

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4 hours ago, UniMe said:

 Without power pads it will also build your calves a bit, now that I have power pads I just flex my knees forward a bit though and it takes a LOT of strain off my feet and calves.

I did buy the power pads but for 2 reasons I haven't put them on the EUC:

1) I have the Roll. nz bodyguard on. 

2) I'm not sure they'll help While I'm learning

 

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Some say "even with the pedal", others say "ahead of the pedal" but with a skateboard start, it seems like the foot on the ground is going to be behind the pedal when you pick it up off the ground.

Do whatever helps you get the ground foot 'close' to where you want it when you put it on the pedal. I have to think (every time still) "put the second foot a little more forward than you think", or if it was a particularly good take off and I can stay on one leg a little longer I'll tap the front of the pedal with my ground foot to locate the edge.

For me, I'm wondering if I should add something to help me know where my foot landed... or just keep mounting over and over until after a while it's in the right place more often than not. Probably best to just keep practicing and trust that it will come.

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22 minutes ago, Tawpie said:

Some say "even with the pedal", others say "ahead of the pedal" but with a skateboard start, it seems like the foot on the ground is going to be behind the pedal when you pick it up off the ground.

I was doing "even with the pedal" but it didn't help with take off momentum. So it made sense to me that with the skateboard takeoff I'd place the 2nd foot behind. Maybe in front, like @ShanesPlanet mentioned, it can also grab some kind of momentum... 

I don't know and would like to hear more opinions on this... 

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2 hours ago, Paulo Mesquita said:

I was doing "even with the pedal" but it didn't help with take off momentum. So it made sense to me that with the skateboard takeoff I'd place the 2nd foot behind. Maybe in front, like @ShanesPlanet mentioned, it can also grab some kind of momentum... 

I don't know and would like to hear more opinions on this... 

I really havent given much thought about how I do it. I JUST tried and notice that I start with my 'off' foot, just a little bit in front of my 'on' foot. You cant push much on a skateboard, if you start pushing from too far behind the lead foot. Hell, I guess it technically starts as a pull? My comment about stepping in front in anticipation of accel that isnt there: Thats just what happens when I anticipated the wheel to move faster than it did a few times. I wasnt looking down and in a hurry and tried to plant my 'off' foot, in front of the actual pedal location, upon mounting. I recall it quite clearly, as I was crossing a busy highway and it could have ended badly. When you step up on a skateboard start, you are kind of stepping on a moving target. If you accel too quickly(or slowly), your second foot won't land properly(or at all!). As a newbie, its pretty tough to rearrange the feet by much and quickly. Try a skateboard start and accidently forget a pedal is up! Honestly, I am still much better at the standing start. Sometimes you need a rolling start because of inclines or settled in soft dirt, or in a hurry. For now, I'd just focus on getting started in whatever manner you find easiest. I think that you are VERY close to the first plateau of learning and you can begin to stop thinking so damn much. Once you get comfy in general, THEN these specific techniques will be more easily learned. Hell, you may find you learn a lot of them and didnt even intend to. I can tell you that learning to ride uber slowly, prepares you for better and safer riding in congestion. Riding uber slowly is also one step closer to riding backwards. Riding backwards is a part of being able to teeter. See, no matter what you do and how you learn, these things just simply stack on each other. Even during your too slow arms flapping phases, you are prepping for the ability to be safer AND ride backwards/teeter when need be. Enjoy ALL of it, focus on NONE of it :D. Have you taken a pause and tried to look from outside the box? You know, sit back, watch your most recent video, and marvel at what your old ass has already accomplished? Yeah, tell the wifey you f**n told her you could do it, now fetch some mead ye bloody wench!..... wait.. dont say that. You better get a faster wheel and be damn ready first. Im not sure I even own enough gear to protect me from the wrath of a woman scorn.

Edited by ShanesPlanet
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7 hours ago, ShanesPlanet said:

I really havent given much thought about how I do it. I JUST tried and notice that I start with my 'off' foot, just a little bit in front of my 'on' foot. You cant push much on a skateboard, if you start pushing from too far behind the lead foot. Hell, I guess it technically starts as a pull? My comment about stepping in front in anticipation of accel that isnt there: Thats just what happens when I anticipated the wheel to move faster than it did a few times. I wasnt looking down and in a hurry and tried to plant my 'off' foot, in front of the actual pedal location, upon mounting. I recall it quite clearly, as I was crossing a busy highway and it could have ended badly. When you step up on a skateboard start, you are kind of stepping on a moving target. If you accel too quickly(or slowly), your second foot won't land properly(or at all!). As a newbie, its pretty tough to rearrange the feet by much and quickly. Try a skateboard start and accidently forget a pedal is up! Honestly, I am still much better at the standing start. Sometimes you need a rolling start because of inclines or settled in soft dirt, or in a hurry. For now, I'd just focus on getting started in whatever manner you find easiest. I think that you are VERY close to the first plateau of learning and you can begin to stop thinking so damn much. Once you get comfy in general, THEN these specific techniques will be more easily learned. Hell, you may find you learn a lot of them and didnt even intend to. I can tell you that learning to ride uber slowly, prepares you for better and safer riding in congestion. Riding uber slowly is also one step closer to riding backwards. Riding backwards is a part of being able to teeter. See, no matter what you do and how you learn, these things just simply stack on each other. Even during your too slow arms flapping phases, you are prepping for the ability to be safer AND ride backwards/teeter when need be. Enjoy ALL of it, focus on NONE of it :D. Have you taken a pause and tried to look from outside the box? You know, sit back, watch your most recent video, and marvel at what your old ass has already accomplished? Yeah, tell the wifey you f**n told her you could do it, now fetch some mead ye bloody wench!..... wait.. dont say that. You better get a faster wheel and be damn ready first. Im not sure I even own enough gear to protect me from the wrath of a woman scorn.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

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Days 9 &10

 

Same routine, just a bit more time of exercise. A couple of falls in the garage, but trying to ride as slow as possible to gain a better tunned control of the EUC, balance and body muscles.

Conclusions:

1) my upped body is clearly more relaxed, with the exception of the first couple of meteres where I flap like a duck!

2) My second foot on (right one) is my 1st foot off. I'm breaking dismounting quite well. as I'm stopping I tend to curve imperceptably to the right and the right foot comes off quite naturally, Simultaneously I grab the handle and step off with the left foot.

3) I'm sliding left and right at slow speed, by pressing either foot palms. Works slightly better when goin left since it my strongest leg.

4) When my muscles alre less tired I do the skateboard launch better. When they are worn down, I do better with a still launch. 

5) sometimes my second foot on lands on the pedal too far or too back. when I can't adjust it, I take the opportunity to do the entire ride with a wrong positioning and learn with this mistake on how to compensate the change in balance, so that I get safely to the end of the ride.

6) I did a couple of videos just to see how my upped body relaxation was different. Of course being camera conscious I fell flat and forward...stupid me!!! Won't do too many videos...it hurts like a b*tch!!!

7) My left inner and upper shin is hurting quite a bit and I need to find a way of protecting it more.

And I guess that's all for now...

Day 9 Video:

 

 

 

Edited by Paulo Mesquita
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Left shin is hurting because you are favoring that side being used a LOT on mount/dismount. Perhaps its time to bite the bullet and force yourslef practice the other way around? The shin pain will go away for the most part. You're just still conditioning those baby soft old legs. Ive stick legs and same thing happens to me if i ride a lot after a break. Totally worth it! As you get better, youll also quit grabbing the wheel with your legs so much. Youll also become a little more delicate and fast at mounting. All these will add up to your legs not taking so much abuse... now your knees are another story :) Instead of locking your sore leg in for leverage to be able adjust foot position on other side, you can do a light hop as your feet will more easily shuffle when you arent standing full weight on them.

Edited by ShanesPlanet
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I’d say “break time”. Take a day or two off, you’re sounding exhausted. Give the shin a little time off (and yes, this is a great opportunity to start working the other side!)

You’re looking really solid in the video! Congratulations!

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12 minutes ago, Tawpie said:

I’d say “break time”. Take a day or two off, you’re sounding exhausted. Give the shin a little time off (and yes, this is a great opportunity to start working the other side!)

You’re looking really solid in the video! Congratulations!

Thanks for the same idea @ShanesPlanethad. I confess I'm not too confident on my right leg doing the same job. But I'll give it a try. 

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