F.J. Abaya Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 (edited) Last Saturday I had a flat tire with my Sherman and I had to change the inner Tube. I looked at the tire for puncture marks and I didn’t see any. This is the reason. Luckily I was only going 10-13mph on the sidewalk. I can just imagine what could have happen if I were on the street going 35mph. I reported the incident with Jason and he sent me a couple of inner tubes for free. What a stand up guy. Edited January 12, 2021 by F.J. Abaya 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 (edited) I'm guessing it was merely a shit tube and led to failure? Doesnt appear that it was caused by the rim hole? Surely it wasnt from tire spin, or you've got some serious yank going on and that tire would show evidence. Good to hear that Jason has your back, even on something like a tube that was made by yet another party. See what happens when you patron a reputable dealer! Its MY business and YOURS that enables him to help others. If we get lucky and never find an issue, we can still feel proud that our purchase probably enabled the helping of someone else's.Woohoo, its all relative! Edited January 12, 2021 by ShanesPlanet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanghamP Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 You need to always have the valve cap removed. Always. EUC's shouldn't be sold with valve caps, ever. It's the valve cap that caused that flat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 That’s a lot of assertions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, LanghamP said: You need to always have the valve cap removed. Always. EUC's shouldn't be sold with valve caps, ever. It's the valve cap that caused that flat. care to explain? I wouldnt think anyone should be riding an euc so flat as too worry about tube shift and cut of valve. Having no cap allows water and dirt in. Water that freezes has caused many a leak. Most my knowledge is with auto and motorcycle tho. I am honestly curious as to your reasoning. Edited January 12, 2021 by ShanesPlanet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RagingGrandpa Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 9 minutes ago, LanghamP said: It's the valve cap that caused that flat. Why? The tube manufacturer specifies use of a plastic cap. Properly-installed caps provide an additional pressure seal, and prevent contamination of the valve core. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 22 minutes ago, LanghamP said: You need to always have the valve cap removed. Always. EUC's shouldn't be sold with valve caps, ever. It's the valve cap that caused that flat. I really doubt that is the cause. As long the valve is pointed in the right direction to avoid hitting any thing it should be fine. There is a reason why the valves are bend on tubes used in EUCs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 22 minutes ago, RagingGrandpa said: Why? The tube manufacturer specifies use of a plastic cap. Properly-installed caps provide an additional pressure seal, and prevent contamination of the valve core. I agree with most, but cheapo caps don't really increase sealing nor will they prevent it, should a core leak/fail. Some caps may, but definitely not these cheapos with no inner seal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alcatraz Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 Just be careful when installing the new tube. You can use some talcum powder on the tube to help it seat properly. Also it helps if the valve is loose in the valve hole. That means that there isn't constant pressure on it in any direction. A slight misalignment deflated can become a lot of stress when the tire is inflated and in use. When mounting a tire don't insert it going around in a circle. You take the chance of getting an excess on on side of the valve. First insert the valve and then insert the opposite side of the tube second. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanghamP Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 14 hours ago, ShanesPlanet said: care to explain? I wouldnt think anyone should be riding an euc so flat as too worry about tube shift and cut of valve. Having no cap allows water and dirt in. Water that freezes has caused many a leak. Most my knowledge is with auto and motorcycle tho. I am honestly curious as to your reasoning. The fully inflated inner tube will have the valve extremely close to being fouled by the shell of the wheel. Add the valve cap, and then there is no clearance. These aren't EUC inner tubes but repurposed scooter tubes, and a hard turn will shove that valve right into the shell. My observation is an uncapped valve with the valve head/face pointing opposite of the direction of wheel travel is least likely to foul. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 (edited) 9 hours ago, LanghamP said: The fully inflated inner tube will have the valve extremely close to being fouled by the shell of the wheel. Add the valve cap, and then there is no clearance. These aren't EUC inner tubes but repurposed scooter tubes, and a hard turn will shove that valve right into the shell. My observation is an uncapped valve with the valve head/face pointing opposite of the direction of wheel travel is least likely to foul. Gotcha. Makes perfect sense if theres so little clearance due to valve angle. Silly to think that an euc would fit a tube without having worry about tolerances so close as to endanger a typical bent valve. I shouldnt be surprised however. An easy solution to the valve clearance would be to put a spacer (teflon perhaps?) behind the rim on the valve itself, effectively making it protrude less. Too bad these dont come threaded for nuts, like motorcycle tube commonly do. Edited January 13, 2021 by ShanesPlanet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanghamP Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 1 hour ago, ShanesPlanet said: Gotcha. Makes perfect sense if theres so little clearance due to valve angle. Silly to think that an euc would fit a tube without having worry about tolerances so close as to endanger a typical bent valve. I shouldnt be surprised however. An easy solution to the valve clearance would be to put a spacer (teflon perhaps?) behind the rim on the valve itself, effectively making it protrude less. Too bad these dont come threaded for nuts, like motorcycle tube commonly do. Bent EUC valve stems with caps are a particular pet peeve of mine. They are designed to fail regardless of the direction of wheel travel. That is, if you point the valve opposite of the wheel's travel then there's a good chance it could foul, but then leaving the cap on makes it foul in the opposite direction. Argh! Stupid design. Yeah, ask me how I know. Hint: it wasn't through genius imagination. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yuweng Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 On 1/12/2021 at 8:22 AM, F.J. Abaya said: Last Saturday I had a flat tire with my Sherman and I had to change the inner Tube. I looked at the tire for puncture marks and I didn’t see any. This is the reason. Luckily I was only going 10-13mph on the sidewalk. I can just imagine what could have happen if I were on the street going 35mph. I reported the incident with Jason and he sent me a couple of inner tubes for free. What a stand up guy. Spoiler i have exactly the same problem with two of my wheels, MTB forums call it 'tyre slipping on rim', i've loss count of the numbers of puncture i had Funny thing is non of my fellow riders have this problem. Tried all sort of remedies recommended, duct tape on the side of rim, talcum powder, change different brand tyre & inner tubes, you will gonna continue to have this problem, MTB forums concluded its the rim problem. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 1 minute ago, yuweng said: i have exactly the same problem with two of my wheels, MTB forums call it 'tyre slipping on rim', i've loss count of the numbers of puncture i had Funny thing is non of my fellow riders have this problem. Tried all sort of remedies recommended, duct tape on the side of rim, talcum powder, change different brand tyre & inner tubes, you will gonna continue to have this problem, MTB forums concluded its the rim problem. simple enough to check. Mark the sidewall and rim with grease pen or sharpie. If its tire slip, they wont line up. Typically a little air pressure holds it. My motorcross bike had locks, but its a WHOLE lotta power on a whole lotta tread with zilcho air. We never tightened valve stem nuts to kinda help from tearing. Im merely speculating, but Its possible you could get a tire to slip on an euc rim, but you'd have to run low pressures and REALLY fling that beast with good tread. If it is happening, its probably only happening to the SERIOUS riders. Just a guess. Please mark your tire and let us know if its happening. MTB run low pressure and have serious brakes, but maybe an euc is more similar than assumed. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RagingGrandpa Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 On 1/11/2021 at 8:25 PM, ShanesPlanet said: cheapo caps don't really increase sealing nor will they prevent it, should a core leak/fail I think plastic caps seal nicely... perhaps it warrants a quick inspection, to confirm integrity of the seal inside. 13 hours ago, LanghamP said: leaving the cap on makes it foul Ah. Gotcha. Snag hazard. Been there. My favorite compromise now is this type of 'slim' stainless cap: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 31 minutes ago, RagingGrandpa said: I think plastic caps seal nicely... perhaps it warrants a quick inspection, to confirm integrity of the seal inside. Ah. Gotcha. Snag hazard. Been there. My favorite compromise now is this type of 'slim' stainless cap: Those quality caps like you have pictured can help seal sometimes. I just looked at the caps that come with the euc's i have. Aside from the mten with a nice metal cap, the others are no where near quality and havent got a seal for shit in the bottom. Come to think of it, 2 of my euc tubes came with loose cores too. No big deal, same ole story, its just the cheapest tubes they could find. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yuweng Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 18 hours ago, ShanesPlanet said: simple enough to check. Mark the sidewall and rim with grease pen or sharpie. If its tire slip, they wont line up. Typically a little air pressure holds it. My motorcross bike had locks, but its a WHOLE lotta power on a whole lotta tread with zilcho air. We never tightened valve stem nuts to kinda help from tearing. Im merely speculating, but Its possible you could get a tire to slip on an euc rim, but you'd have to run low pressures and REALLY fling that beast with good tread. If it is happening, its probably only happening to the SERIOUS riders. Just a guess. Please mark your tire and let us know if its happening. MTB run low pressure and have serious brakes, but maybe an euc is more similar than assumed. Haha, that's the first thing i did with a sharpie Tried with low/ high pressure, low is worse. Funny thing is that it won't slip with high pressure for a few rides then it happened again. Then i found out the more i carve, the more it will slip ! MTB forum's solution was to use rubber cement on the other side of the valve & seal the whole tyre to the side of the rim, some even recommends both sides ! Since i've upgraded to motorcross/ dirt bike tyre, forums there recommends bead/ rim lock & i wonder how the hell am i gonna do that on an EUC rim ! Spoiler Finally i went for the epoxy with fine sand solution & it never slips again Couldn't find that post, it mentioned this solution is actually done for cars, first they clean both sides of the rim, sprayed thick layers of silicone while wet, sprinkled fine sand on it, let it dry then install back tyre. i went for the extreme & did sand on the tyres too on both sides ! On my other wheel, it was an easy fix & i wonder why only non high performance EUCs uses steel rims, if not we can all go tubeless effortlessly ! Spoiler Tubeless tyre & tubeless valve solves the tyre slip issues ! Photo stolen from here 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 (edited) 24 minutes ago, yuweng said: Haha, that's the first thing i did with a sharpie Tried with low/ high pressure, low is worse. Funny thing is that it won't slip with high pressure for a few rides then it happened again. Then i found out the more i carve, the more it will slip ! MTB forum's solution was to use rubber cement on the other side of the valve & seal the whole tyre to the side of the rim, some even recommends both sides ! Since i've upgraded to motorcross/ dirt bike tyre, forums there recommends bead/ rim lock & i wonder how the hell am i gonna do that on an EUC rim ! Hide contents Finally i went for the epoxy with fine sand solution & it never slips again Couldn't find that post, it mentioned this solution is actually done for cars, first they clean both sides of the rim, sprayed thick layers of silicone while wet, sprinkled fine sand on it, let it dry then install back tyre. i went for the extreme & did sand on the tyres too on both sides ! On my other wheel, it was an easy fix & i wonder why only non high performance EUCs uses steel rims, if not we can all go tubeless effortlessly ! Reveal hidden contents Tubeless tyre & tubeless valve solves the tyre slip issues ! Photo stolen from here Holy crap, no wonder you're having tire slip. That aint an euc tire, thats a damn motocross knobby. We routinely put tire bead sealer on car and truck rims where the sidewall meets the rim. It was kind of a black glue type substance that dired into rubber. I could see how adding some course sand into that mix, would offer even more traction. Of course, I don't know about using it for tubeless. One could always go fancy and drill a hole and install a pair of tire locks I suppose, depends on how the rim is cutout. Tubeless will solve the valve 'issue', but it then may bring about the issue of losing air or busting a bead loose when run uber damn flat. Seems the epoxy/sand fix or rim lock would solve the problem. The problem isnt the valve, its the tire spinning on rim. Seems like the euc world is borrowing from mountain bikes and mountain bikes are borrowing from motorycles. Good fix, thanks for the post. Now I know, and knowing is half the battle... GI JOE!!! Edited January 14, 2021 by ShanesPlanet 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yuweng Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 i'm not a speed/ long range guy, tarmac doesn't offer much thrill anymore so i frequent MTB trails & with this tyre, it conquer it all. Fun to witness when MTB riders watch in disbelieve jaw dropping as i climb up hills with this little bastard with no effort at all, no matter wet or dry 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted September 11, 2022 Share Posted September 11, 2022 (edited) On 1/12/2021 at 2:22 AM, F.J. Abaya said: Last Saturday I had a flat tire with my Sherman and I had to change the inner Tube. I looked at the tire for puncture marks and I didn’t see any. This is the reason. Luckily I was only going 10-13mph on the sidewalk. I can just imagine what could have happen if I were on the street going 35mph. I reported the incident with Jason and he sent me a couple of inner tubes for free. What a stand up guy. Same thing happened to me today.. Literally the same images as you got.. (Luckily it happened right next to my house, at the end of the ride.) Somehow the valve stem was "sunken" in the rim hole and torn off. My guess the tire somehow slipped and tube got pulled with the tire. Resulting in torn off valve stem. Guess i have to "slow down". Can the tire "slip" at 30psi? I normally rode at 28psi. Lately i have started to increase the psi. 1 tube change, 2hrs latter - good as new. I glued the torn off valve back to tube, to check if i had a hole.. Or simply tire slipped. (Will know it for sure tomorrow.) Edited September 11, 2022 by Funky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerbera Posted September 11, 2022 Share Posted September 11, 2022 (edited) The valves do seem to be a weak point on these tyres after a decent amount of use. I have had at least 2 fail there at various points, though never to the point where they actually fell off ! I think one of those times a rogue twig may have got caught in it briefly ! Edited September 11, 2022 by Cerbera Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted September 11, 2022 Share Posted September 11, 2022 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Cerbera said: The valves do seem to be a weak point on these tyres after a decent amount of use. I have had at least 2 fail there at various points, though never to the point where they actually fell off ! I think one of those times a rogue twig may have got caught in it briefly ! Funny thing. I noticed a noise like a twig or something would be "scraping" in wheel well. I stopped to check - nothing. (Even checked tire pressure.) 1 minute later second time checked - again nothing. (Tire still was solid.) 1-2 minutes later, then i noticed it.. The tire went completely flat in instant. Maybe right at the moment when tire went flat - the tire slipped and tore off the valve. Who knows.. Sadly at those stops i didn't check the valve stem, where it was at the point. Edited September 11, 2022 by Funky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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