Airwheel X3 - One Year Battery Life ???????

[I now HATE Walking!!]

I got my airwheel x3 in Oct 2014 and ride it an average of 5 city blocks per day.  When it was new, I only had to charge it once per week.  By Dec 2015, I now have to charge it every day.  The battery is almost trash.  I have two questions:

1 - Is this normal?  Do you have to buy a new battery every year?

2 - Airwheel.net wants $320 for a battery.  Where can I get a cheaper one?  Or one that lasts longer?

Thanks,

I Now HATE to Walk!

[esaj]

Batteries do wear over time, but from what I've read, high quality cells should last at least 300-500 cycles (under heavy use and maybe some abuse ) before the total capacity starts dropping noticeably. With more gentle use, that number could go considerable up (>1000 cycles). Read here for more information: 

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/bu_808b_what_causes_li_ion_to_die

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/bu_808c_what_the_user_can_do

EDIT: About getting the a new battery: There are sellers in Aliexpress/Banggood/Ebay/Amazon that sell batteries, but usually the cheaper it is, the more likely it has low quality cells. I'd expect that custom built, you can get a good 210Wh (if it's a single pack wheel) for less than that Airwheel.net -pack.

[SlowMo]

You can buy this Samsung 174wh battery for cheap at Banggood:

http://www.banggood.com/2900mAh-Electric-Unicycle-Battery-18650-16S-Lithium-Ion-Battery-60V-p-1006976.html

[Achim63]

Mhm, seeing this I start to seriously doubt the advertising slogans of EUCs being "green". Needing new batteries or even a completely new wheel after only one year doesn't seem very environmentally friendly to me.

 

[esaj]

37 minutes ago, SlowMo said:

You can buy this Samsung 174wh battery for cheap at Banggood:

http://www.banggood.com/2900mAh-Electric-Unicycle-Battery-18650-16S-Lithium-Ion-Battery-60V-p-1006976.html

I'm always a bit skeptic about these, it only states "Samsung" cells, and when the seller was asked (I assume "elements" means the cells here):

Post on November 03,2015 01:03#1
what elements do you use on it? Is it really 2900mAh? Please inform me about BMS. Has it balance function? What max current can use?

Post on November 06,2015 03:06#2
Hi Marel,
It is  Lithium Ion Battery,rated capacity is 2900mAh.And Nominal Voltage is  60V.
About the BMS and balance function , dose them have any special for you ?

Best regards, 
Nicole Chen

(I'd put that in a quote-box but the manual quoting-button has disappeared from the new forum version! ).

The seller is pretty much repeating the same information that's on the front page and not answering about the BMS... does she even know what she's selling?

Not saying it's a scam, could very well be just fine.

[SlowMo]

I think I have the same Samsung 170wh pack on my generic X3 which still performs well until now although I'm not sure about it's authenticity. 

[Alex Bowman]

I also have an Airwheel X3 with about 200 miles on it.  I ride it to work about 4.5 miles each direction.  When it was new, it made the trip just fine.  However, over time ( this summer only )  it began to hit the 15% warning near home.  Work to home is slightly up hill.  Now, I'm hitting the 15% warning on my way to work and it hits 0% in my driveway.  I can no longer ride it to work and back based on the battery deterioration.  It's just not safe anymore.  I'm a bit disappointed in the deterioration and I'm considering Amazon's offer to return it based on the recent fire/explosion news.  I'm happy to hear that I'm not the only one with this problem. 

[esaj]

I almost bought an Airwheel in the spring, but then went for a Ninebot E (not E+) after reading lots of reviews and founding this forum, an order which I later on cancelled (due to import delays and having bought a used generic + a used Firewheel from vee73)... my personal opinion is that Airwheel is an overpriced brand name, but I can't say for sure, as I've never actually ridden one   But so far, I have heard fairly few good things about them, and in my own mind, I place in them in the same category with "all the other generics". This low-lifetime battery issue just makes that association stronger.

[I now HATE Walking!!]

I bought the $91 Samsung 170Wh at Banggood with the link provided by SlowMo (Thank you).  I realize I was taking a risk, but I am hoping to ride this wheel another year and let the wheel prices fall, before I get my next one.  I had no idea that Airwheel was an entry level EUC until I found this AWESOME board.  Thank you, esaj!  

Honestly, the Airwheel has been great for the entire year.  It goes about running speed, so if you wreck, you can just hop off and let it crash, and not hurt yourself.  Now that I know about "The Beast" mSuper, I, of course, want it, but it is no joke to fall at 20mph, so the Airwheel is a good starter. It goes up the parking garage hills just fine.  I even ride it on the hills at the skateboard park, although I have to take them on a slant.  It works for tricks too.  I paid $600, a year ago, and I have had SO MUCH FUN, that I am not sorry.  My username "I now HATE Walking!!" is absolutely true.  I take it everywhere I can.  I was pretty unhappy that the battery only lasted one year, but $91 will be a decent price, it it works.  Aside from the crappy battery, the Airwheel is a good EUC, in my opinion.  I have not tried any others, but I have loved it for the past year.  Next year, maybe I will give this AirWheel to my daughter and get an mSuper.  My wife does not want me to get such a powerful and dangerous machine, so I am going to have to stencil "AirWheel Plus" or something similar on it.

Achim63 - Who cares if it is green??  It is fun and fast.  If you want green, walk    Actually, I do see your point though.  A wheel with a good quality battery that lasts 3 years is a greener choice.

[I now HATE Walking!!]

I have a thought.  Is it possible AirWheel puts NiCads in their wheels?  This would make them a lot cheaper to build.  They say they use LiPo, but do they really?  I have a lot of experience with cordless drills, and honestly, the AirWheel battery "acts" like a NiCad.  LiPos hold up way better.

 

[Citi Wheel]

I am starting to see significant decrease in my E+ battery after only 1300 miles (100 cycles?)

[SlowMo]

7 hours ago, I now HATE Walking!! said:

I have a thought.  Is it possible AirWheel puts NiCads in their wheels?  This would make them a lot cheaper to build.  They say they use LiPo, but do they really?  I have a lot of experience with cordless drills, and honestly, the AirWheel battery "acts" like a NiCad.  LiPos hold up way better.

 

They say Airwheel uses the same lithium ion battery packs. People even shunt the BMS because they always get shutdowns while riding their Airwheel. If you are leaning to Gotway, they are selling the MCM4  High Speed (HS) version now and have Sony or Panasonic batteries. I just ordered one.  

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Gotway-MCM4-130wh-260wh-340wh-520WH-680WH-electric-unicycle-one-wheel-scooter-800W-motor-max-speed/32468490098.html

[I now HATE Walking!!]

The MCM4 looks like it only has an 800W motor.  I thought the mSuper had 1000W. Still 800 is pretty stout.  Actually, I don't know what my Airwheel has.  They don't seem to list it.  

[SlowMo]

1 hour ago, I now HATE Walking!! said:

The MCM4 looks like it only has an 800W motor.  I thought the mSuper had 1000W. Still 800 is pretty stout.  Actually, I don't know what my Airwheel has.  They don't seem to list it.  

Your Airwheel normally has the 350w motor and the 1st generation mainboard with a speed limit of 18km/h. 

[I now HATE Walking!!]

Thanks for that info.  I have never felt underpowered, but I am power hungry   I am also moving to a farm, and I will have rougher terrain.

[Umut Dogu Demirtas]

https://www.youtube.com/edit?o=U&video_id=pIYDKkzVgCw

Kılıf

ı trying  electric unicycle costume  :))

[Jie Janet]

It may lose power and can not be charged if long time no use. You can charge the battery for several times, it will be normal.

[Dr Bob]

On 12/11/2015 at 11:09 PM, SlowMo said:

You can buy this Samsung 174wh battery for cheap at Banggood:

http://www.banggood.com/2900mAh-Electric-Unicycle-Battery-18650-16S-Lithium-Ion-Battery-60V-p-1006976.html

hi all will the 170w pack fit straight in place of the 130w pack or do you need to mod housing to take it. Just wondering as 170w is a thicker battery pack than the 130w one.

[SlowMo]

7 hours ago, Dr Bob said:

hi all will the 170w pack fit straight in place of the 130w pack or do you need to mod housing to take it. Just wondering as 170w is a thicker battery pack than the 130w one.

Yes, they are both 16s packs. You will gain an additional 5 km mileage.

[esaj]

7 hours ago, Dr Bob said:

hi all will the 170w pack fit straight in place of the 130w pack or do you need to mod housing to take it. Just wondering as 170w is a thicker battery pack than the 130w one.

The 18650 is (more or less) standardized size (about 18mm diameter, 65mm height):

So even different cell capacities should be the same size, like you can see from the dimensions schematic, there are slight tolerances though (and cells with internal safety circuits can be a bit taller, but you shouldn't use such in an EUC anyway).

EDIT: What can affect the battery pack thickness is the size of the BMS though, and those can vary.

[Dr Bob]

10 hours ago, esaj said:

The 18650 is (more or less) standardized size (about 18mm diameter, 65mm height):

So even different cell capacities should be the same size, like you can see from the dimensions schematic, there are slight tolerances though (and cells with internal safety circuits can be a bit taller, but you shouldn't use such in an EUC anyway).

EDIT: What can affect the battery pack thickness is the size of the BMS though, and those can vary.

Thank you for the answer, 170w just looked thicker by pictures.

[Dr Bob]

On 2/27/2016 at 1:30 PM, Dr Bob said:

Thank you for the answer, 170w just looked thicker by pictures.

well just put 170w battery in, charged it til green light(20 minutes). Um 1.6km more than the 88w battery that was in it. So I thought charge/run down a few times. Will not charge for more than 60 minutes, I get 2.7km further than the 80w battery now. Also have had 3 total shut downs with this new battery(all 1st use). Battery was from the link above. Pack had samsung on it 174w maybe dodgey pack? I do not know much about this type of battery but could it be through none use sitting on shelf the batteries are "lazy" and will come good in time or are they "thats it" type thing?

 

[SlowMo]

1 hour ago, Dr Bob said:

well just put 170w battery in, charged it til green light(20 minutes). Um 1.6km more than the 88w battery that was in it. So I thought charge/run down a few times. Will not charge for more than 60 minutes, I get 2.7km further than the 80w battery now. Also have had 3 total shut downs with this new battery(all 1st use). Battery was from the link above. Pack had samsung on it 174w maybe dodgey pack? I do not know much about this type of battery but could it be through none use sitting on shelf the batteries are "lazy" and will come good in time or are they "thats it" type thing?

 

I also have a 170wh (they say Samsung) pack on my generic x3. Having fears of sudden shut down, I followed the advice of @hobby16 and shunted the battery pack. Never had any cut-offs (knock on wood) but I never let my battery go down beyond 2 bars.

 

[Dr Bob]

20 hours ago, SlowMo said:

I also have a 170wh (they say Samsung) pack on my generic x3. Having fears of sudden shut down, I followed the advice of @hobby16 and shunted the battery pack. Never had any cut-offs (knock on wood) but I never let my battery go down beyond 2 bars.

 

 I try to keep in power range, if only 2 bars left I take it easy as in no hard acceleration or riding at 13kph. This battery pack is not even 130w in my books. Has not cut out again yet, but only getting 8km yes km a charge and only charges for 50 minutes now. 88w pack was better, more feel to the wheel as to say. New battery response is vague to say the least. very disappointed was hoping for at least 11km per charge. Has now been charged 4 times and run to stop 3 times. No change. My other problem/s now I have a bit more practice is slippery tyre. Tyre warms up good, 46psi, but slides a lot on sharp turns, also footboards scrapping. 

[SlowMo]

14 minutes ago, Dr Bob said:

 I try to keep in power range, if only 2 bars left I take it easy as in no hard acceleration or riding at 13kph. This battery pack is not even 130w in my books. Has not cut out again yet, but only getting 8km yes km a charge and only charges for 50 minutes now. 88w pack was better, more feel to the wheel as to say. New battery response is vague to say the least. very disappointed was hoping for at least 11km per charge. Has now been charged 4 times and run to stop 3 times. No change. My other problem/s now I have a bit more practice is slippery tyre. Tyre warms up good, 46psi, but slides a lot on sharp turns, also footboards scrapping. 

If you can open a portion of the battery pack and be able to get the  battery serial number, you can do a web search to determine if it is 2200mah or 2900mah. If it is only 130wh then you should raise a dispute thru Paypal. The other concern is if even though it says 2900mah, the batteries might not be original Samsung batteries. Still, you can try to raise a dispute. Some members inflate their tires less for added grip when making slaloms.