Hollow bore motor bearing failure Thread

[Wise Rides]

Just a quick question, why aren't we just removing, cleaning, greasing, and reinstalling these bearings?  I've seen numerous Youtube videos of people doing this for a variety of bearings, including roller bearings like the v11 and RS19.  All they do is remove the bearing, clean and degrease, and then repack them with grease and reinstall.  It's pretty simple process once you get the bearing out of the wheel casing and it saves you from buying new bearings or having your wheel down while you wait for replacements.  Ideally, we want higher quality bearings than what we're getting from the manufacturer and "dust covers" or seals/gaskets installed over the exposed part of the bearing (thingiverse plans are out for the v11 and RS19, I think links are in this thread).  But in the meantime, we can just re-use what we have and keep riding!

 

 

[tumbla.jr]

Just now, Wise Rides said:

Just a quick question, why aren't we just removing, cleaning, greasing, and reinstalling these bearings?  I've seen numerous Youtube videos of people doing this for a variety of bearings, including roller bearings like the v11 and RS19.  All they do is remove the bearing, clean and degrease, and then repack them with grease and reinstall.  It's pretty simple process once you get the bearing out of the wheel casing and it saves you from buying new bearings or having your wheel down while you wait for replacements.  Ideally, we want higher quality bearings than what we're getting from the manufacturer and "dust covers" or seals/gaskets installed over the exposed part of the bearing (thingiverse plans are out for the v11 and RS19, I think links are in this thread).  But in the meantime, we can just re-use what we have and keep riding!

 

 

Been there done that. Still makes noise just less of it. Tried a bunch of different greases. Same result. I had both sides go bad. One faster than the other. I caught the other side early enough and it was fine. The other was not having it. 

[.....]

3 minutes ago, Wise Rides said:

Just a quick question, why aren't we just removing, cleaning, greasing, and reinstalling these bearings?  I've seen numerous Youtube videos of people doing this for a variety of bearings, including roller bearings like the v11 and RS19.  All they do is remove the bearing, clean and degrease, and then repack them with grease and reinstall.  It's pretty simple process once you get the bearing out of the wheel casing and it saves you from buying new bearings or having your wheel down while you wait for replacements.  Ideally, we want higher quality bearings than what we're getting from the manufacturer and "dust covers" or seals/gaskets installed over the exposed part of the bearing (thingiverse plans are out for the v11 and RS19, I think links are in this thread).  But in the meantime, we can just re-use what we have and keep riding!

 

 

Some people are. However, when you account for the time in labor, its usually a good idea to just replace the part. Once a bearing begins to make noise, its possible galling has occurred. Lubricating an inadequate design is a band-aid solution at best. Ask your mechanic how he would feel about removing, lubing and reinstalling a noisy wheel bearing in your car. If he even ponders your request for a  moment..find a new mechanic. These arent caged roller bearings that benefit from regrease and reseating.

Edited March 11, 2021 by ShanesPlanet

[tumbla.jr]

1 minute ago, ShanesPlanet said:

Some people are. However, when you account for the time in labor, its usually a good idea to just replace the part. Once a bearing begins to make noise, its possible galling has occurred. Lubricating an inadequate design is a band-aid solution at best.

I'm not sure what's changed between the ones that came out and the replacements but I've ridden the rs through a questionable amount of water and its been fine so far. Just over 1000 miles now. 

[QUENTINDETO]

On 2/23/2021 at 8:06 PM, xiiijojjo said:

The temperature in the housing does not heat up beyond the insignificant heat produced from within the bearing due to friction so all that hassle is for nothing. 

All this misinformation is starting to annoy the shit out of me along with the multiple different ways people try to fix the same problem when the solutions are much less complex than what people assume/claim.  I have read this entire thread 2 or more times now (and other related threads even more) and most of the so-called solutions are overcomplicating the fixing process or are downright not true and based on fringe theories. 

So for any readers dealing with bearing knocking or suspected bearing failure please disregard most of this (and other) thread except the following:

For suspected bearing failure:

1. Confirm that you are in fact dealing with a bearing failure. The most easy way to identify this problem is to first place your euc horizontally on the floor and to manually spin the wheel with your hand both clockwise and counter clockwise. IF the euc makes a constant grinding sound when turning the wheel you are most likely dealing with a bearing failure.

2. To confirm this suspicion place the euc in a vertical position and turn it on, lift it slightly off of the floor and force it to accelerate, you don't need it to go fast, you only need to  confirm that the euc will still make a constant grinding noise.

3. If it still makes a constant grinding sound congratulations you have to buy new bearings and replace the old ones. 

For bearing knocking:

This can easily be confused for a bearing failure but if you have this issue you are " in luck" 

1. Confirm that you are in fact dealing with bearing knocking. The most easy way to identify this problem is to first place your euc horizontally on the floor and to manually spin the wheel with your hand both clockwise and counter clockwise. IF the euc makes an intermittent knocking sound when turning the wheel in either or both directions you are most likely dealing with bearing knocking.

2. To confirm this suspicion place the euc in a vertical position and turn it on, lift it slightly off of the floor and force it to accelerate slowly at first, the knocking should be most pronounced the slower you go and each time you hear a knock you should be able to feel a bump of vibrations in the handle you are lifting the euc by. The more you accelerate the less pronounced the vibrational feedback gets, and the less sound the knock will produce, until you start to accelerate it very fast and the knocking sounds along with the vibrations should ebb out to the point where they are impossible to hear/feel, and should reappear as you decelerate the wheel to a very slow speed.

3. If this is the case for you congratulations you are dealing with bearing knocking and the reason is that one of the two bearings has become unaligned within the motor cover in which it resides. Now there are two fixes the first is potentially the ideal fix and the second is my own temporary solution which might prove to be worthwhile in the long run.

Solution 1 - potentially permanent fix.

The bearings are supposed to fit snugly within the motor cover but if a bearing has 2-3mm (yes that little) of wiggle room within the motor cover due to sloppy manufacturing processes of making the motor cover, a bearing can misalign itself from external vibrations caused by jumping, going up curbs, going fast in general and probably many other reasons. Once the bearing has been unaligned the knocking will start.

1. Remove both side covers of the euc, disconnect batteries on both sides and turn the euc on after. This will remove all electricity from its circuits and make it safe to work with both for you and for not damaging components. 

2. Disconnect motor wires from the mainboard and remove the plastic body of the euc by unscrewing the screws fixing it to the motor. For gotway rs this is easy for other models i don't know. Also unscrew and remove pedal hangers.

3. I am left foot dominant so i started by taking off the left motor cover as i rightly assumed that side was under the most stress in my daily riding with one legged riding and whatnot. I looked into the now unattached left motor cover and saw no signs of unalignment but then i took a mallet (wooden or rubber) and knocked the bearing into the motor cover and heard a metal to metal *clunk* meaning the bearing was not pushed all the way into the motor cover as it was supposed to be, but had been pushed "inwards" towards the rotational axis (center of the motor) by a few millimeters. 

4. Now to make sure this unalignment doesn't happen again you need to 3d print some of these spacers our beloved @EMA has made available from this link https://www.dropbox.com/sh/zernjdwgt54s0zr/AAD0JmlGVQwuyvXsWGkwwWBZa?dl=0 (these are for RS i believe but i know he has for EX too) In regards to what thickness to use i cannot tell you precisely as it may vary from euc to euc but i approximate that my bearing had moved around 3mm due to grooves or rather scratches within the bearing housing of the motor cover. However i suspect any spacer smaller than 2mm will be too little, also if you make one too thick friction between the spacer and bearing may cause problems but that is only a suspicion and is not substantiated. 

Once you have fitted a spacer of the correct thickness and reassembled the euc the knocking issue should not return, for that side of the motor cover, but may very well start from the other side one day, i don't know yet.

Solution 2- potentially temporary but easy and fast solution:

1. Remove both side covers of the euc, disconnect batteries on both sides and turn the euc on after. This will remove all electricity from its circuits and make it safe to work with both for you and for not damaging components. 

2. Disconnect motor wires from the mainboard and remove the plastic body of the euc by unscrewing the screws fixing it to the motor. For gotway rs this is easy for other models i don't know. Also unscrew and remove pedal hangers.

3. Put the wheel horizontally on floor and lightly tap the motor cover with a wooden or rubber mallet around the center of the motor cover 20 times or so. You don't want to hit it too hard and dent the motor cover as you are only trying to push the bearing back into place by a few millimeters but you also don't want to hit it too lightly as the force will be insufficient for pushing the bearing back in place.  

4. Flip the wheel over and tap in the same fashion of the other side and now both bearings should be rightly positioned within the bearing housings of the motor covers without having to unscrew the motor covers at all. 

I suspect this solution is temporary and that the knocking will return but after mistreating my euc for a good 40km yesterday to test it, the knocks still have not returned and all seems well for now. If you just need to get rid of the knocks quickly and don't have access to a 3d printer this is a good solution and may prove to work for 100's of kilometers. If or when the knocks return, which you should be prepared for, hopefully you will have printed a few different spacers in the mean time so that you can potentially permanently fix the knocking issue the next time around IF the knocks return. 

 

I hope this guide will stop people from spending good money on bearings they may not need (yet or ever), or stop them from wasting their time trying many of the different "solutions" in this thread( and the Gotway RS thread and others too), many of which will surely seem completely uneducated guesses in light of this post. 

I also want to thank the people in this thread who have worked to delegitimize these false "solutions" and work towards isolating the actual issues and solutions especially @EMA who has been pivotal in this regard. Also for making the spacers available! I will finish by saying that the quality of information on this forum would not be the same without his sharp wit and observations. 

edit: I want to repost this on other threads spreading misinformation about the bearing failure / knocking issue but i don't want to come off as spamming. So maybe just refer people to this post if you see misinformation. 

Thanks for thoose explainations,

For my part I have the 2nd bearing issue, I would like to  print thoose spacers,  but I dont know everything  on 3D  printing, what material should I have to use ?

[EMA]

3 hours ago, QUENTINDETO said:

Thanks for thoose explainations,

For my part I have the 2nd bearing issue, I would like to  print thoose spacers,  but I dont know everything  on 3D  printing, what material should I have to use ?

use TPU if you can, but i think simple PLA will also work

[EMA]

sharing pic of a new c30 motor: different bearings, cover, and no dead trap for water and dirt i think

Edited March 16, 2021 by EMA

[JirkaMak]

@EMAHi EMA. Thanks for sharing.

So they basically made the motor cover hole bigger cutting the extra material covering the bearing on the original design and replaced the bearing to the new one with a better seal?

[EMA]

14 hours ago, JirkaMak said:

@EMAHi EMA. Thanks for sharing.

So they basically made the motor cover hole bigger cutting the extra material covering the bearing on the original design and replaced the bearing to the new one with a better seal?

yes, the cover also has direct contact to the external ring of the bearing. basically the bearing seal the hole, i suppose if the sealing is good we will not have problems in the future.
 

[MartE]

On 2/26/2021 at 10:06 PM, EMA said:

@xiiijojjo tnx man, really appreciate your words.

of course i've uploaded the RS spacer becouse the motor is way more popular but i can share also the same spacers for the EX 

Hi, Do you happen to have it for Monster pro, by any chance? Thanks!

[EMA]

1 minute ago, MartE said:

Hi, Do you happen to have it for Monster pro, by any chance? Thanks!

not 100% sure but i suppose that M24Pro use the same as RS, the motor is the same as EX but the hole inside is smaller.

Didn't have it  really love to try the wheel

[MartE]

[Hansolo]

7 hours ago, EMA said:

not 100% sure but i suppose that M24Pro use the same as RS, the motor is the same as EX but the hole inside is smaller.

Didn't have it  really love to try the wheel

I confirm, the RS and the Monster Pro have the same 6824 2RS bearing

[Yo_Yo]

RS has been protected.Now we r testing EXN .600km was gone in all weather condition already

 

 

[LeGiroquoi]

My brand new v11 has that problem too. After only 70kms and yes, a small ride with some slush and wster from melting snow. But I did ride with all my wheels without problems for years .. only this v11 has bugged..

Anyhow, warranties exist for this reason, and inmotion will send another motor.

My question is, is it dangerous riding with it? It does some noise, not that disturbing to me..(at least people hear me coming! 😄) But I'd like to continue riding it until the motor arrives, which can be long.. how bad can it goes?

 

[Flying W]

1 hour ago, Eric plam said:

My brand new v11 has that problem too. After only 70kms and yes, a small ride with some slush and wster from melting snow. But I did ride with all my wheels without problems for years .. only this v11 has bugged..

Anyhow, warranties exist for this reason, and inmotion will send another motor.

My question is, is it dangerous riding with it? It does some noise, not that disturbing to me..(at least people hear me coming! 😄) But I'd like to continue riding it until the motor arrives, which can be long.. how bad can it goes?

 

I'd guess worst case it gets bad enough to overheat other components but I'm sure you know before hand. It would feel like going up a steep hill on flat ground from the drag of the bad bearings. 

Of it were me I'd ride it as long as felt normal, noise be damned lol

[Rawnei]

4 hours ago, Eric plam said:

My brand new v11 has that problem too. After only 70kms and yes, a small ride with some slush and wster from melting snow. But I did ride with all my wheels without problems for years .. only this v11 has bugged..

Anyhow, warranties exist for this reason, and inmotion will send another motor.

My question is, is it dangerous riding with it? It does some noise, not that disturbing to me..(at least people hear me coming! 😄) But I'd like to continue riding it until the motor arrives, which can be long.. how bad can it goes?

 

Yes but the problem will happen on the new motor as well, it's just a matter of time unless you waterproof the bearings yourself, I just put some waterproofing seals on mine the other day now I can ride it again without having to worry about it happening again.

It's not dangerous, it can go a long time like that.

[LeGiroquoi]

5 hours ago, Rawnei said:

Yes but the problem will happen on the new motor as well, it's just a matter of time unless you waterproof the bearings yourself, I just put some waterproofing seals on mine the other day now I can ride it again without having to worry about it happening again.

It's not dangerous, it can go a long time like that.

Hi. 

Yeah that's what I feared, that inmotion will only supply new motors that can fail. But yet again, many v11 and Gotway users didn't have that problem, so maybe I'll be good.

I will also check on your profile to check if you explained somewhere on how to waterproof it. If you can help me go faster with a link that would be just awesome!😗

 

[Rawnei]

43 minutes ago, Eric plam said:

Hi. 

Yeah that's what I feared, that inmotion will only supply new motors that can fail. But yet again, many v11 and Gotway users didn't have that problem, so maybe I'll be good.

I will also check on your profile to check if you explained somewhere on how to waterproof it. If you can help me go faster with a link that would be just awesome!😗

 

Everyone will get problems sooner or later because the bearings are quite large and just protected by a small rubber part within the seal which is not enough to protect against water and dirt ingress over time, to waterproof the V11 it you need to print and install this: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4741590

There are other variants of this seal for Gotway models.

[WI_Hedgehog]

On 1/7/2021 at 3:40 PM, pontoonpete said:

I've made a video to show visibly what I can't explain verbally LOL. I'm a shower not a talker

 

 

Thank ewe for the video, I now know what you're talking a boot.

LOL

(Awesome video Pete. Thanks.)

[Silver]

2 hours ago, Eric plam said:

But yet again, many v11 and Gotway users didn't have that problem, so maybe I'll be good.

Many users don't ride in the rain or snow

[Rawnei]

1 hour ago, Silver said:

Many users don't ride in the rain or snow

You don't need to ride in rain and show to get moisture or dirt in the bearings.

[Silver]

1 hour ago, Rawnei said:

You don't need to ride in rain and show to get moisture or dirt in the bearings.

True, but it will still take much longer for them to go bad.

[LeGiroquoi]

I think everybody will eventually have to ride in some water. Obviously not snow for many, but hard to avoid being caught in rain or just riding in a small amount of water... That's what I did. Never purposely ride in deep water..

[Rawnei]

2 hours ago, Silver said:

True, but it will still take much longer for them to go bad.

No its random, luck of the draw, I rode 4 times in good weather and got busted bearings, others ride 1000km in wet weather before it happens.