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Ninebot One P disappointment


Cranium
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I took my P out for it's first long ride today with my son riding my E+.  Both are pretty new.  Both were fully charged.  This was only his second time on an EU but he picked it up quick.  We spent the afternoon riding around UCF campus (which is pretty big) and I didn't think of tracking distance because I didn't think we would drain the Ninebot's batteries.  But we did.  So I am able to only post some observations and only a couple of captured facts.  I was riding the P the whole time and my son was riding the E+.

  • As expected, the P out accelerated the E+ and would go faster than the E+ but our average speed was the same since we stayed together.
  • The P has overheating issues.  I mentioned this as a concern when I first got the P and noted that it was using the same board and heat sinks.  I am now much more concerned.  The outside temperature was about 77°F (25° C) and the P was running about 20°F (6.8° C) hotter than the E+.  About 5 miles into the ride I noticed my P was at 149°F (65° C).  I said we needed to stop for a bit to let mine cool down.  His was quite a bit lower.  I didn't think of taking screenshots until about 5 minutes after we stopped to let my P cool down a little.  My son continue to ride the E+ during this time.
     

Ninebot One P temp
Screenshot_20151206-150932.jpg.ab2dfadc4

Ninebot One E+ temp
Screenshot_20151206-150917.jpg.33ee10d98

  • The P battery didn't last as long as the E+.  To be fair, I'm about 15 lbs heavier than my son.  But the battery capacity is higher and I was going the same speed as he was so I didn't expect the P to cut our riding short.  I hobbled the P back to the parking garage and it made it up to the third floor but it wouldn't let me go more than about ~4 MPH before it would tilt back.  At my car, battery was down to 1 bar and the temp was at 147°F even after going at the pace of a fast walk for the last half mile.  My son continued to ride around the parking garage for about 10 minutes and then said he was starting to get battery issues.

These are just my first observations running the two side by side.  The over heating is the MOST concerning of the two.  I am in Florida with flat terrain.  I would think I could run at rated speed an not worry about the EU overheating in cooler weather.  The E+ has no issues at running at it's rated speed and keeping cool.  I think that either my unit has a heat sink issue or it is a bigger issue affecting all Ps.  

I will be doing this again next weekend with him and will run GPS on the ride and see if the results are similar.

 

Edited by Cranium
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I had an opportunity to try Ninebot P today for a couple of miles and i was disappointed also. Now i only have limited experience with e plus as well as P, but what i noticed is that i would get tiltbacks on moderate acceleration and moderate speed. This didnt feel right. Now maybe its because i am 100kg but hey - its rated for my weight. Dont really have anything else to complain about but i only used it for a short time. It felt pretty stable overall though

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Cranium, oh wow, I read that post you made and it made sense. Now it is indeed starting to be worrisome! I can't imagine how it will be in Summer! Did your weight difference overcome the battery capacity difference though? I have no idea how much you guys weigh but the perhaps the % difference in batteries and weights need to be compared? Also, the bigger motor is probably going to be really sucking all that extra juice. Maybe you guys can try swapping and see how it does next round!

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Ok, interesting.  I also have a P for less than week.   I am not getting ant tilt back and am easily running faster for much longer distances than my e+ .  Today i ventured completely across my town and back at very fast consistent speed....probably avg 12 to 14mph but not really watching.

One thing that I figured would eat battery faster is that you get less brake regeneration.  With the E+, everytine i got tilt i would slow down....this charges battery.  With P I'm getting no tilt so I'm not actively slowing to avoid speed warning.....thus less brake regeneration! 

The P gave me exactly what I wanted ...smooth , fast power that is more than enough.

I would be concerned about the temps you posted though cranium.  One thing i posted in another posr was that i want to add active cooling....maybe a small fan.  This could be the thing that helps.  I just need someone to tell me where i should draw power from.  A small electronics fan may do trick.

I'm guessing you wont see mb upgrade in p until closer to P + launch.....kinda like in the E+ . 

 

Edited by Paulandjacquelyn
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2 hours ago, Cranium said:

 

 

@Cranium what was your riding style when you tested the P. Overheating often happens during rapid and frequent acceleration and braking. Was your style mire aggressive with P because you wanted to try it out as opposed to when you were riding the e plus? Or in co parison with your son's? 

I am constantly battling my kingsong's overheating issues, which i still dont know if they are because of my weight (100kg) and affinity for rough riding or because all of them have this flaw or because my unit is faulty. All i know if acceleration really affects the temperature

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I am just over 100 KG and my son is probably just under 100 KG.  Don't know his weight for sure though.  

Our riding style was not a lot of aggressive riding.  It was his second day on a EU and I was having to keep his pace on the E+.  I may accelerate a little faster but we were only slowing down for turns and people on the campus walkways.  Since the outside temperature was cooler and we were pretty much constantly moving forward, I would have thought the airflow would help the temperature of the board stay low.

I completely agree on the testing mythology suggested on switching Ninebots to see if the weight difference had a big affect on temp.  I had suggested this yesterday but my son didn't want to get on my P yet because he was afraid of crashing it. :)

Further testing is certainly warranted before any conclusions can be made..  As one of the tests, I would like to have my son carry some of his books in a backpack to get our weights equal and see what the temps do.  

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Worth considering is the style of riding for heating / overheating etc.

At least in my experience of R/C models (particularly the larger ones) and ESC (electric speed controller) is that using a higher power output actually means the electronics work at a cooler temperature - 80%+

Consistent use at lower power outputs means the electronics have to 'deal' with excess power input in different ways and one of them is to dissipate into heat - around 50%.  Running at very low power outputs - 20-30% - results in a lot of ESC's overheating and cutting out from thermal sensors.

May be by running the P+ at a slower speed to keep up with an E+ you weren't allowing it to run as efficiently as it needs to to keep it cool?

Of course, might be total bo!!ocks so please forgive me if I'm barking up the wrong tree etc. ;) it's very cold over here at the moment so hard to get it clear in my mind what's like to ride around in warmer climates?

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With my kingsong it almost didnt matter what the ambient temperature was - i was still getting overheating at 27c and at 5C alike. In my mind it has very little effect because overheating temperature is so much hugher than the differences between the ambient. Although with ninebot perhaps it matters if the control board is cooled by the air that passes through it, so i dont know.

what matters more is riding style. Slower speeds could cause more overheating - it depends on what exactly is being done - going back and forth for example at slower speed can heat it up a lot while slightly adjusting speed going fast wont. On the other hand going fast can cause you to brake and accelerate more if for example you are moving on a sidewalk with lots of people. So its impossible to state which cause more overheating, going slow or fast, based on speed alone. In any case, i dont believe that the difference in speeds alone between e plus and P can make such a drastic effect on the way they overheat.

Edited by Cloud
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Cranium,

Have a chat with Ian Sampson at Speedyfeet UK.  He sells Ninebot One P's and spends a lot of time testing the NInebot one units (all models). It's true that he lives in the UK and so the outside temperature is around 5-10 degrees at the moment.  Ian may also have heard something similar based on the number units he's sold so far.  It may be the case that this happens in E+ models too and it's something which is not 'P' specific (and so has a fix...maybe).

If it were me - I'd take the left side shell off and take a look at the controller board, make sure its got enough heat paste between the metal plate and board and that the heat sink is positioned correctly.  There are plenty of videos on You Tube (especially via Speedy feet) showing NB1 tear downs and closeups of the controller board etc.

Don't be scared of taking the unit apart - just watch the tear down vids from Ian S at Speedyfeet and then follow the steps carefully.  I have taken my NB1 apart countless times to clean all the grime away, respray, change tyre etc it's easy if you take it one step at a time and don't force anything.  Mine works like new and I've done over 600 miles.

Edited - I just saw in another post that you have already stripped your NB1 so no need for the above advice from me ;-)

HTH's

Edited by Thumper0511
Strike through of unnecessary information
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8 hours ago, Cloud said:

I had an opportunity to try Ninebot P today for a couple of miles and i was disappointed also. Now i only have limited experience with e plus as well as P, but what i noticed is that i would get tiltbacks on moderate acceleration and moderate speed. This didnt feel right. Now maybe its because i am 100kg but hey - its rated for my weight. Dont really have anything else to complain about but i only used it for a short time. It felt pretty stable overall though

@CloudYou mean for a couple of minutes lol ;)

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9 hours ago, Cloud said:

I had an opportunity to try Ninebot P today for a couple of miles and i was disappointed also. Now i only have limited experience with e plus as well as P, but what i noticed is that i would get tiltbacks on moderate acceleration and moderate speed. This didnt feel right. Now maybe its because i am 100kg but hey - its rated for my weight. Dont really have anything else to complain about but i only used it for a short time. It felt pretty stable overall though

Was it someone else's wheel?  Maybe they had the speed limit set?  Maybe they had the riding style set different?  (3 or 4 as opposed to 0)  Just thoughts on what else it could have been.

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11 minutes ago, SuperSport said:

Was it someone else's wheel?  Maybe they had the speed limit set?  Maybe they had the riding style set different?  (3 or 4 as opposed to 0)  Just thoughts on what else it could have been.

Yes it was. Its possible that the riding mode was not the optiomal mode. I doubt about the speed limit...i guess i shouldnt make any ridig statements as this was a very short experience, maybe i am missing something

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24 minutes ago, Cloud said:

Yes it was. Its possible that the riding mode was not the optiomal mode. I doubt about the speed limit...i guess i shouldnt make any ridig statements as this was a very short experience, maybe i am missing something

I've never been on one, so I have no idea, just thinking out loud. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

I went on another ride with my son on the E+ & P this past weekend.  We went a total of 10.3 miles and the E+ battery went low first this time.  But the concern with the temperatures stayed the same.

After 30 minutes of riding, we stopped for a short time so I could check the temperatures of both units.  I was on the P and my son was on the E+.  I am heavier than my son by about 15 pounds.  The temperature difference was the same as the previous week showing about a 20°F higher temperature in the P.  I traded with him the rest of the day so I was on the E+ and him on the P to see if that made any difference.  At 5 miles in we stopped for dinner and by the time we were done, it was dark which is reflected in lower speeds below.  At around 9 miles, he wanted to start to practice going backwards so we found an area where both of us just worked on this skill.  

The switching of the units allowed the temperatures to come with 10°F of each other but the P still ran hotter than the E+ for the same speeds.  At no point did he leave me behind on the P.  I will also have to say that I noticed that I am a little more aggressive rider with starts and stops which I can attribute to having more time on them than he does.  

 

Capture.PNG.a148f22c51a06314795d48bcafba

Ninebot One P temp after 30 minutes (me riding)

Screenshot_20151212-171044.thumb.png.4d0

Ninebot One E+ temp after 30 minutes (son riding)

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Ninebot One P temp after 1.5 hours (son riding)

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Ninebot One E+ temp after 1.5 hours (me riding)

Screenshot_20151212-183545.thumb.png.ed5

Edited by Cranium
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  • 2 years later...

Hey Cranium.  I am going to be over near UCF this weekend and was thinking about taking a ride there Friday.  I haven’t been there since I graduated a long time ago.  Anything I should know about riding the euc there?  Any places that I should avoid?

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6 minutes ago, Joker10 said:

Hey Cranium.  I am going to be over near UCF this weekend and was thinking about taking a ride there Friday.  I haven’t been there since I graduated a long time ago.  Anything I should know about riding the euc there?  Any places that I should avoid?

Being as this guy has not been on the forum since May and that this particular post is almost 2 3 years old, I don't think you should expect a response before Friday. I would suggest posting a new thread in the 'general discussion' area.

Edited by Esper
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