KS-16X Firmware 2.03 (was 20.22)

[ManjaroBlack]

Has anyone tried the new firmware? I tried updating via SoftTuner, but it still shows firmware 2.02. Would love to see a fix for vampire drain. 

Edited October 14, 2020 by ManjaroBlack
Firmware name changed. Updated title.

[Tinkererboi]

Here to find out as well. I doubt we are anywhere near KS finally giving us a little more top speed, but a man can dream.

[Crooznfbroozn]

I got it today on the ks app on android.... Aaaand it bricked my wheel! Luckily running the firmware upgrade from an iphone fixed it

 

🤣

Edited October 19, 2020 by Crooznfbroozn

[DjPanJan]

Best what you can do is wait to official release please!

Please nobody try this FW!

This FW can be just optimisation for newest batches and actualised control board just new revision propably.

Impact on other old moldels (control boards) is unknow i recomended not try now.

  

[Crooznfbroozn]

7 hours ago, DjPanJan said:

Best what you can do is wait to official release please!

Please nobody try this FW!

This FW can be just optimisation for newest batches and actualised control board just new revision propably.

Impact on other old moldels (control boards) is unknow i recomended not try now.

  

Btw, I got it through the king song app. Didn't use any other applications. (And it is a very very recent batch, so that would make sense)

Edited October 18, 2020 by Crooznfbroozn

[stephen]

Oooh shit why did i look here,,I want to try it now I love updates I can't say no i want to press the upgrade button😬😬

Edited October 18, 2020 by stephen

[Meso]

Hi guys and girls,

I did the firmware upgrade kind of by mistake but It also happend that my gf crashed my wheel badly (Before the upgrade). After some repairs, the wheel ride now perfect but there is a small problem and I wonder if its a bug caused by the new firmware or its a problem caused by the crash damages.

When the wheel is charging, on every apps (Kingsong App, WheelLog, UEC World ) the amps reading is around 0.3A. With stock charger it sould normaly read around -1.5A. The problem does not come from the charger.

My KS 16X is a V1

Anyone made the upgrade and can compare his results with mine. What is your amps reading when you are charging?

Right now I suspect a firmware bug but it might also be a motherboard issue or a BMS issue. It will put my mind at ease if some of you get the same results as it will likely indicate that my wheel if just fine.

Thx for your imput !

[Nuno Esteves]

21 minutes ago, Meso said:

Hi guys and girls,

I did the firmware upgrade kind of by mistake but It also happend that my gf crashed my wheel badly (Before the upgrade). After some repairs, the wheel ride now perfect but there is a small problem and I wonder if its a bug caused by the new firmware or its a problem caused by the crash damages.

When the wheel is charging, on every apps (Kingsong App, WheelLog, UEC World ) the amps reading is around 0.3A. With stock charger it sould normaly read around -1.5A. The problem does not come from the charger.

My KS 16X is a V1

Anyone made the upgrade and can compare his results with mine. What is your amps reading when you are charging?

Right now I suspect a firmware bug but it might also be a motherboard issue or a BMS issue. It will put my mind at ease if some of you get the same results as it will likely indicate that my wheel if just fine.

Thx for your imput !

Hello.

I Have a 16x V2, and just upgraded my.

In chargins is all ok. between 1.1A and 1.9A. With avarage power .137W.

 

 

 

[Meso]

Thx for the info. So far it looks bad for my wheel...

Anyone could take the same reading with a KS 16X v1 and firmware 2.03? It will help to confirm if there is a problem with my wheel

 

Thx in advance

[Eric Bloch]

Same problem with mine the charger (a fast charger with voltage and amp reading) showing 3 amps is different from the DarknessBot showing 0,3 amps 

 

[Meso]

Ok, well that is a good news for me, It probably means that the problem come from the new Firmware and not from the wheel.

Txh for the imput

[RoadRunner]

My 18XL is reading 0,3A as well from the beginning.

Just look how long it takes for a charge, if it doesn’t take 4 days i think you’ll be good. 

[Meso]

Ya, you are right, thats what I am doing atm and I am monitoring battery température. So far everything seems normal.

[mploy1515]

Crap, as a new KS-16X owner, what sort of battery / voltage / temperature ranges should I be watching out for?

Never really thought about this before, but now you guys got me worried haha

[stephen]

I noticed there was a new firmware (2.03) upgrade on euc world @Sebacan you confirm this is official release and not a beta and everything is safe now?

Edited November 7, 2020 by stephen

[Seba]

12 hours ago, stephen said:

I noticed there was a new firmware (2.03) upgrade on euc world @Sebacan you confirm this is official release and not a beta and everything is safe now?

Well... It's really hard to distinguish between beta and public firmwares in case of King Song  Of course I'm joking. According to my informations, 2.03 for KS-16X has been released to public some time ago. In case of any problems there is aways an option to downgrade.

[travsformation]

3 hours ago, Seba said:

It's really hard to distinguish between beta and public firmwares in case of King Song

But they're all so packed with FEATURES!!!!

[Dreygun]

What are the features of the new update? Haven't bothered yet cos mine is perfect atm and I don't want to screw that up

[Crooznfbroozn]

6 hours ago, Dreygun said:

What are the features of the new update? Haven't bothered yet cos mine is perfect atm and I don't want to screw that up

Says something about charging optimization? That's it

[DjPanJan]

I tested many ks 16x firmwares in some time ago(here is big tread use search if you want) here i try be short. Results can be very diferent it depends on mainboard version. Example fw 1.05 on board v1.4 is great but fw 1.05 on board 1.5 is garbage. Respect you original factory firmware because is tailored for you control board/mainboard exactly. Not downgrade under you factory version.  . Thank you. 

Edited November 8, 2020 by DjPanJan
edit

[travsformation]

As @DjPanJan so humbly put it (😜), downgrading from your factory firmware isn't the best idea. Upgrading is a matter of choice and...risk tolerance?

I wouldn't go so far as say "never ever upgrade your firmware", but I wouldn't hesitate to say "Don't upgrade your firmware just because the app offers a new version, without doing your research first". Look it up in the forum, if you can't find it, start a new thread (such as this one ) and see what others' experience with it is. Even if you're curious, the safest approach is to wait until it's been i the wild for a couple of months and its reliability has been proven (especially if you're a new user).

The first thing I to consider, before anything else, is that FW upgrades aren't risk-free.

 

- I personally avoid upgrading with the official KS app for Android (or using it at all for that matter). Although it's improved over time (especially since it changed devs), it has quite a track record for instability and has bricked many a' wheels.

- KS's SoftTuner app (available for Android and iOS), was previously only provided by distributors, under demand, when a user ran into a FW problem and needed to downgrade or re-flash. Now it's the official KS app for iOS (and can be found in the wild for Android if one looks for it). It's a better choice for upgrading than the official Android app, and it also allows you to downgrade, re-flash, etc., but it has been known to randomly crash or take a vacation mid-upgrade and has caused several wheels to become unusable.

- If you're adamant on upgrading, EUC World (Android only) is by far the safest option. I've been on the beta-testing team for quite a while and have done more test upgrades and downgrades than I can remember and have had zero issues with it. The update process was intentionally designed to be fail-proof and free of the risks that come with the KS apps, and what's more, it can recover a failed upgrade by any of the KS apps. It is the only app I trust FW upgrades/downgrades. To the point I'd suggest that iOS users are better off borrowing an Android phone from a friend and installing EUC World to do the upgrade than using either of the KS apps

You can find a tutorial on how to upgrade/downgrade using EUC World here.

 

As to the changes that come with FW upgrades...

FW updates tend to come more often and closely after one another for new wheels and grow further apart in time as the wheel matures. The 16X is an excellent example. It was released more or less at the same time as the Nikola (2 brand new performance 16" wheels with 3" wide tires), and since KS couldn't outdo GW in terms of speed, they decided to blow the Nikola out of the water in the torque/acceleration department. But their FW was too torquey and several (heavier) users experienced cutouts when accelerating hard above 45 km/h (this is a good argument against buying 1st batch wheels). This was corrected in subsequent FW releases, and over times, KS has refined the torque delivery algorithm, made it more consistent at different speeds and battery levels, etc. So upgrading your firmware isn't necessarily a bad thing, but there are a few things worth taking into account:

• If you like the way your wheel rides and the upgrade isn't being touted as a fix for a serious safety issue, you don't need to upgrade.
• One has to know his wheel well (how it behaves, how it accelerates, brakes, corners, etc.) in order to feel/experience the nuances from one FW to another, so (most) upgrades aren't as relevant to new riders. If you're a new rider, or have only bought your wheel recently and aren't entirely familiar with it, I think it's better to wait and get acquainted with its riding dynamics, particularities and idiosyncrasies before even considering upgrades (unless it's giving you problems/you're unhappy with the way it rides).
• KS has a bad habit of issuing FW upgrades with no release notes, which leads to much speculation on whether they're beta versions or not. The safest approach is to wait.
• KS's release notes are often cryptic and fail to list many of the actual changes. Reading other users' experiences on what the has actually changed vis a vis the previous version tends to be much more insightful, but do bear and mind that whatever you read is based on subjective perception (in a word: speculation) and may differ greatly from user to user, so take it with a pinch of salt.
• FW updates probably shouldn't be take at face value: Maybe the manufacturer discovers (this is a made-up example) that a specific firmware (let's say 1.0) delivers a little too much torque at high speed, which involves a risk of cutout for heavier riders, so they release an update (1.01) to reduce the torque. They aren't going to state "The previous FW was dangerous" in the release notes, but rather something like "Safety was improved", or an even more vague "Torque algorithms tweaked". But maybe the new FW reduced torque across the board, and since the previous FW was only sketchy for riders above 250lb, you'll find lots of negative feedback from light riders, who had no issues with the previous FW. Maybe the next release (1.02) will say "Smoother torque delivery" when what was really done was increase the torque in the 15-25 km/h range, but leave it capped from 0-15 km/h and above 40 km/h (where there's the highest risk of overleaning). Meaning that this release model can lead to very different experiences and opinions depending on the rider. Experienced riders below 250lb who are careful not to accelerate too aggressively above 40 km/h might prefer 1.0 and boldly state that all subsequent versions are terrible, while riders who've had a cutout will feel safer on 1.01 and claim that all other FWs will try to kill you; other users will preach the wonders of the perfectly-balanced 1.02, others will receive their wheel on 1.02 directly and wonder what the hell all the fuss is about, and others will downgrade to 1.0 because they heard its torquier. In a sentence: welcome to the exciting world of FW updates!

The smartest option is to wait it out. In most cases, if you're happy with the way your wheel rides and don't have any issues with it, the changes probably won't be significant enough to warrant the update. But in some cases, they are: The upgrade to FW 2.0 for the KS18(X)L eliminated the motor whine and provided a boost in torque and smoothness that was so significant it made it feel like a new wheel altogether. But that's the only case I know of that's been so pronounced/worth it. Then again, I'm sure there are users who don't like change and preferred their wheel the way it was

But either way, the best way to find out whether a FW upgrade is next-level like that or not is to wait for other more experienced, risk-prone riders to try it out (or riders with a collection of wheels who can afford for one of them to become unrideable for a while until they can fix it) 😂

Edited November 8, 2020 by travsformation

[travsformation]

In terms of FW 2.02, I haven't installed it (yet), but based on the vague "charging optimizations" mention in the release notes, I can list the previous charging-related changes that have been introduced over the past few upgrades and speculate about what might have changed. I'm not sure I got the versions below right (I think @buell47 might be able to help/correct on this one), but the progression is loosely:

- In FW 2.0 (I believe it was) KS set the wheel to beep if the charging current exceeded 5A, to make sure no one fried the wires by using 2 x 10A chargers, for instance (If I remember correctly, max. charge current should be 10A total (no more than 5A/port), or 9A to be on the safe side.

- In FW 2.01 they increased that value to 5.5A because tons of users were complaining about the beeping and the fact it was too conservative a value (since 5A is a common current for fast chargers, and it's common for them to charge at 5.1-5.2A).

- FW 2.02 introduced what they called "Charging optimizations", which pretty much boiled down to: If you left the wheel plugged in for days (or weeks) and the battery voltage decreased slightly, the BMS would allow the wheel to top off the battery (Not sure what the point of that "upgrade" was TBH). They also introduced the option to configure auto power-off after the wheel was left idling (from 5' to 4h). It may or may not be connected to that feature, or to the battery topping-off feature, but since 2.02, the wheel is on "standby" when charging, and doesn't switch entirely off when finished charging / the charger is unplugged. Meaning that if you don't switch the wheel all on and then off again after charging, it will beep loudly several times and then switch off after the established power-off time has passed, in many occasions scaring the crap out of unsuspecting riders (such as myself).

So I'm guessing it's possible the update may have to do with the above, but what exactly it does, we won't know until someone installs it and reports back. It could also include unlisted changes relating to cornering algorithms, it's anyone's guess 😅

My advice is to wait, as it appears this is a minor upgrade or bug fix.

[RoadRunner]

2 hours ago, travsformation said:

since 2.02, the wheel is on "standby" when charging, and doesn't switch entirely off when finished charging / the charger is unplugged. Meaning that if you don't switch the wheel all on and then off again after charging, it will beep loudly several times and then switch off after the established power-off time has passed

Mine has never done that.

[travsformation]

44 minutes ago, RoadRunner said:

Mine has never done that.

Lucky you!

I found the instance in the thread below. It was reported by more users in other threads but I'm too lazy to look for it 😅

 

[stephen]

I've been on firmware 2.03 for few days now, there's not much I can tell you it rides good not much to notice but it's safe, I'm v1 first batch , no issues so far on any firmware

1.07 was my favourite the pedals felt the best( more stable), so after trying different firmware many times I'm liking 2.03 the pedals stay level and good for corners, 

BTW the 16x is the sweet spot for everyday riding I still like this wheel