MCM5 v2 3-inch tire?

[Asphalt]

5 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

I highly disagree man. It doesn’t matter what your shoe size is, the general stance is to stand with the middle of your foot in the middle of the pedal(unless you use a staggered stance). This gives the best balance. A bigger shoe will have more hanging off the front AND rear, which will counter balance each other.

In fact, a smaller foot size will accelerate better because they will have more pedal to stand on and thus more fine control over their acceleration through the balls of their foot. 
 

And reduced body weight SIGNIFICANTLY effects your acceleration. Why do you think race vehicles make such efforts to shave even a few pounds to be able to go faster? A powerful motor won’t even sweat moving a light body.
 

You can’t seriously think a 300lb obese American can accelerate faster than a 100lb Chinese man. 

Like most things, there’s a bell curve for optimal weight vs acceleration.

I understand your example of the 300lb rider when considering the force required to be generated by the wheel in order to move both wheel and rider.
F=m*a
Greater mass requires greater force to achieve the same acceleration.

My point considers the amount of force that the rider can apply to the pedals. If you look at the opposite extreme example, consider a 50 lb child trying to accelerate a Gotway Monster. The child will have difficulty because the Monster’s firmware is programmed to stay upright with a torque force equivalent to the torque applied by the rider. With small feet the child will have to place their foot very far forward on the pedals to generate the equivalent force that a 300lb rider could.
T=F*r

When you consider both total mass and ability for the rider to generate force applied to the wheel, the result is a bell curve where there’s some optimal acceleration point.
A lightweight rider needs to improve their force output to approach this optima. Conversely, a heavyweight rider will need to reduce mass.
The optima will vary between wheel models.

[Darrell Wesh]

4 hours ago, Asphalt said:

lightweight rider needs to improve their force output to approach this optima. Conversely, a heavyweight rider will need to reduce mass.
The optima will vary between wheel models.

You sound like you’re talking about sprinting. But this is not sprinting. We’re not using muscle to move the EUC. Just changing center of mass angles. I don’t think you realize how effortlessly the Monster would shoot off if a 50lb boy adeptly accelerated it. 
 

Irregardless, your scenario is absurdly extreme. There are no 50lb Monster riders. Most if not all riders are 100lb and up.

Edited October 4, 2020 by Darrell Wesh

[houseofjob]

On 10/3/2020 at 11:41 AM, Darrell Wesh said:

Yea the v1 mcm5 pedals were too low coupled with 2.1” tire which made z10 like 360s Awkward and forced. But a wider tire, even with low pedals, would allow those easy little 360s. Is there any fight back to turning since the tire is wider? 

Eh, I might not be the greatest to judge all this, as I think even the Monster is easy to 360 with the right amount of toe English. If you mean like how the Z10 tire "fights back", no, these tires don't have pointy sidewalls like the Z10 Moto tire.

 

23 hours ago, Asphalt said:

Thanks for the advice both @houseofjob and @Darrell Wesh. A lot of good points to consider. In my 10000km riding I haven't really needed to optimize my riding technique, but I have a Sherman coming in a few weeks, so I'm eagerly anticipating learning techniques for taming the 77lb beast. I only weigh 135lbs and hesitate to use power pads, so I don't expect I'll be able to max out the performance without taking advantage of leverage through skill and technique.

Take it slow man, and if you're going for the soft mode thing, try it on medium first, as if you don't know how to control the overswing with your back heel on soft mode, you can bust ass like I did when I tried OG Monster soft for the first times.

I both agree and disagree with @Darrell Wesh on the rider stat points FWIW. For sure, being lighter is always an advantage for performance on a wheel, and being able to squeeze that performance out of the wheel IMHO shouldn't be any more difficult than a heavier rider so long as you know how to use your leverage angles and you're natural gravity to you're advantage (ie. don't just superman lean with no leverage angle English on the wheel)

But the longer-foot-has-more-torque I Do subscribe to. The whole point of my soft mode technique is to create a longer torque moment arm, by not just operating/leveraging the pedals front-to-back, but more on a diagonal hypotenuse, across from right pedal front right corner -to- left pedal back left corner, and vice-versa, since the hypotenuse length is a longer moment torque arm than the pedals front-to-back. Same goes for pedal length; even switching from old MSX pedals to the longer Nik style ones on my Monster, I felt more torque leverage doing the same motion as before, from just those pedals being longer.

 

23 hours ago, Asphalt said:

@houseofjob This seated hamstring curl posture seems a little terrifying - doesn't seem to be much of chance you're running off if there's a cut-out. I'm still going to try it though.

Really, any seated riding puts you in a precarious position for falls, but the benefits are just too good (better torque, comfort in riding, etc) that I would never not have a proper seated wheel in my stable.

Also, a lot of guys, including myself, say that, esp with the EUC speeds increasing, trying to run anything out on an EUC is not smart, as we've seen many cases of this leading to bone breakage, dislocation, etc. Landing on all-fours and sliding on your gear is a much better way to land and not jeopardize any greater injury.

For anything seated, just always be ready to push off your arm back into standing, for brakes, danger etc, and I think you'll be good.

[Darrell Wesh]

1 hour ago, houseofjob said:

Landing on all-fours and sliding on your gear is a much better way to land and not jeopardize any greater injury.

👀and where’s your gear at?? I only see you wear like one elbow pad and wrist guards in videos lol 

[houseofjob]

2 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

👀and where’s your gear at?? I only see you wear like one elbow pad and wrist guards in videos lol 

LOL, knee pad when I have shorts/exposed legs too!

I cover where and how I fall, and it's remarkable how we fall the same way every time.

[Asphalt]

@Darrell Wesh I found a racing partner for your next sprint start video. 

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1115649585491136/permalink/1473489216373836/

[Surfling]

@houseofjob Would you update us once you tried the Kenda K329 on the MCM5? 

    Thank you..

[houseofjob]

On 11/23/2020 at 5:02 PM, Surfling said:

@houseofjob Would you update us once you tried the Kenda K329 on the MCM5? 

    Thank you..

Sorry, might be awhile chief. The Bridgestone was cutting it close already, so I was kinda resigned to thinking the Kenda would be too big an outer diameter to spin freely.

[Camenbert]

In short, you had to Dremel your MCM5 v1 to fit a Bridgestone HOOP 2.75-10
Same task on MCM5 v2 to fit CYT H-5167 14x3.0 (76-254)

But will the Bridgestone HOOP 2.75-10 fit MCM5 v2 as is?

[feosky]

On 10/2/2020 at 5:18 PM, houseofjob said:

You mean like this? 

MCM5 v1 (left) with Bridgestone HOOP 2.75-10 & MCM5 v2 (right) with CYT H-5167 14 x 3.0 / 76-254

 

Both require cutting the shell wider and higher, but the v1 you need to install new pedal arms to get the wheel/motor to drop lower for bigger diameter clearance from the undershell (you can either acquire v2 pedal arms, or here, I used EUC You MCM5 20mm dropping pedal arms; you will have to cutout the inner shell pedal arm junction area for the v1 mod some to expose for the axle nut, since the location is different than the original cutout). 

The CYT is not a true 3", more 2.8", and the sidewall is bigger now, making this CYT a 15.5" outer diameter, while the Bridgestone is a slightly bigger sidewall and outer diameter at 15.6".

I think this is why when fitting the Bridgestone on the v1, I had to cut quite a bit higher/deeper into the U undershell, but it also could have been the EUC You pedal arm axle nut position was slightly higher than the v2 pedal arm axle nut position, not sure.

Since both tires are approaching 16" outer diameter, I used a 16" x 3" Nikola/16X inner tube.

I picked these 2 tires to mod with because they were the smallest diameters in the 2.75-10 / 3.00-10 range. I have a Kenda K329 2.75-10 as well, but that one was the biggest outer diameter of the 3 I bought, and I have yet to try to fit it on.

Ride-wise, neither the Bridgestone HOOP or CYT H-5167 are anything amazing, but both feel very meatier and weighted (not actual heavier tho) when riding, and the wider 2.75-2.8 gives a much more planted feel that I prefer over thinner 2.125 & 2.5 tires.

Don't you change something on V2 exept plastic?

[houseofjob]

7 minutes ago, feosky said:

Don't you change something on V2 exept plastic?

Nope! V2 was just cut some of the side and under plastic, then you can use one of the tires I mentioned with a 16 x 3 inner tube.

[feosky]

15 hours ago, houseofjob said:

Nope! V2 was just cut some of the side and under plastic, then you can use one of the tires I mentioned with a 16 x 3 inner tube.

Are you really happy with this mod, or you don't want to repeet it again?

[houseofjob]

2 hours ago, feosky said:

Are you really happy with this mod, or you don't want to repeet it again?

Super happy. I can’t ride 2.125 or 2.5 wide any more, it’s too annoying and uncomfortable with the crap streets in New York.

[Camenbert]

21 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

Super happy. I can’t ride 2.125 or 2.5 wide any more, it’s too annoying and uncomfortable with the crap streets in New York.

I did not get if Bridgestone 2.75-10 fit MCM5 v2 as is
For sure it less mod than fitting a 3.0, but by how much? I have no dremel...

 

[houseofjob]

14 minutes ago, Camenbert said:

I did not get if Bridgestone 2.75-10 fit MCM5 v2 as is
For sure it less mod than fitting a 3.0, but by how much? I have no dremel...

I haven’t tried the HOOP on the v2 yet, but I’m pretty sure it would fit, just might require higher cutting (dunno).

None of this is possible if you don’t have a Dremel or rotary tool to cut some of the shell.

And true 3.0 width tires I don’t think can fit either v1 or v2 since the tire diameter will become 16” or larger (at least not with the current v2 pedal arms or EUC You longest raisers). And again, the CYT 3” wide is not really 3” wide.

[thendless]

Thanks for providing so many details on how to do this. Question about inner tube. Is the inner tube that comes with https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32756888603.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.51d53c00bggVG2&mp=1 not compatible? Or is the 16 x 3 inner tube the same size?

[houseofjob]

2 hours ago, thendless said:

Thanks for providing so many details on how to do this. Question about inner tube. Is the inner tube that comes with https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32756888603.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.51d53c00bggVG2&mp=1 not compatible? Or is the 16 x 3 inner tube the same size?

Sure.

So I didn't trust that the inner tube in the CYT 14 x 3 tire listings have the right valve angle for EUCs (0 degree), as there is no mention of EUC in the title-ing.

But, as you suspect, fortunately, the CYT "14 x 3" and the Bridgestone 2.75 tires are really about 15.5"+ diameter (not 14), so I used a 16 x 3  Nikola / KS16X inner tube instead.

[Surfling]

4 hours ago, Camenbert said:

I have no dremel...

Here's an option: find a small knife (preferably with a wooden handle) and heat up the tip til it's glowing hot. Will carve any plastic. I would try carving scraps first for practice. Then use sandpaper or nail-file to smooth out your edges. Note: your working with heat so sensibility and precautions prevail.

[feosky]

On 10/3/2020 at 6:13 PM, houseofjob said:

 

 

I hear something like tire touching the shel inside, did you ever feeld like this with this big tire?

[houseofjob]

5 hours ago, feosky said:

I hear something like tire touching the shel inside, did you ever feeld like this with this big tire?

You’re hearing a brand new never used tire rubber sound against dry pavement, it’s not inner rubbing.

The new tire “spikes” will sound hitting against the inner shell, but those break off with use of the tire.

If you ride over any debris, any build up of that debris will sound against the under shell unless you remove it, as there is less of a gap between tire and wheel.

But for both mods, I had no significant tire rub with the undershell, or else I wouldn’t have kept the after market tires installed.

Edited May 18, 2021 by houseofjob

[SorenStarr]

On 10/2/2020 at 7:18 AM, houseofjob said:

You mean like this? 

MCM5 v1 (left) with Bridgestone HOOP 2.75-10 & MCM5 v2 (right) with CYT H-5167 14 x 3.0

Since both tires are approaching 16" outer diameter, I used a 16" x 3" Nikola/16X inner tube.

Did you encounter any problems after using the 16x3 inner tube? I'm thinking about running the Bridgestone HOOP on my V2 and I'm wondering if I would be fine just reusing the 14 inch inner tube. If need be I'll purchase a 16x3 tube for the swap. Does the inside diameter of the 16 inch tube still fit the 14 inch rim?

 

Edited June 1, 2021 by SorenStarr

[houseofjob]

59 minutes ago, SorenStarr said:

Did you encounter any problems after using the 16x3 inner tube?

Not really.

One of my mods I had an inner tube blow, but that's after a bit of use, and normal with any wheel usage.

 

59 minutes ago, SorenStarr said:

I'm thinking about running the Bridgestone HOOP on my V2 and I'm wondering if I would be fine just reusing the 14 inch inner tube. If need be I'll purchase a 16x3 tube for the swap. Does the inside diameter of the 16 inch tube still fit the 14 inch rim?

So, in the end, this is an inflatable rubber tube, like an inflatable balloon. It can be blown up to different degrees, but the farther away from its limits you go, the more you risk popping it, just like an inflatable balloon.

In the bike world, they say you can stretch an inner tube one size up without issue (say 2.125" wide to 2.5" wide, or 2.5" wide up to 3" wide), but beyond that, you're testing the limits of it popping. For me, I didn't want the hassle of unnecessarily having to do an extra inner tube swap just because I wanted to recycle the stock inner tube, and besides, buying the 16 x 3 Nik/16X inner tube doesn't cost that much to begin with.

 

[OneLeg]

Maybe all the improvements here are not due to the 3", it is due to CYT tire....

I recently discovered Chao Yang Tires, they are super soft and gummy like and the results of a 16 x 1.95 on a GT16 have been amazing... firm and bouncy. Confy to ride, great to jump on and off pavements, doesn't feel like you are smashing the axle...

I got GT16 and it has a 2.5" and it was total shit, sluggish, couldn't manover, the tire is square so you can't lean it, you need to use your leg... so I replace it with a CYT 16x1.95....

After trying the CYT I don't like the hard feeling of the Kenda, the bumps etc are too much, kind of like what our NY poster said earlier....

I am now looking for more to replace my MCM5 V1 and my V5s/V8s tires... with chao yang.

Edited June 3, 2021 by OneLeg

[Camenbert]

5 hours ago, OneLeg said:

it is due to CYT tire....

I recently discovered Chao Yang Tires, they are super soft and gummy

Great feedback, but what model?

There are dozen CYT, Kenda, CST...
They all behave differently I guess, even if some brands might have their specificity

[OneLeg]

1 hour ago, Camenbert said:

Great feedback, but what model?

There are dozen CYT, Kenda, CST...
They all behave differently I guess, even if some brands might have their specificity

I just checked the tire, there is no model or 3 or 4 digit code.. I will ask my friend that got them for me on taobao... BTW, I bought 2 for 88 RMB, like 11 USD with inner tubes...

will find out.