EUC rider killed by Bus driver in Ukraine

[Lefteris]

And another video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDBDKLpGHRI

 

 

Edited September 11, 2020 by Lefteris
url

[Rawnei]

44 minutes ago, Lefteris said:

Found clear picture of the wheel.

It was a V10F, seams like a Nikola type tyre.

Same tire that was shipped with my V10F.

[alcatraz]

Cst C1488 tire.

[winterwheel]

13 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

Sure looked like the bus was passing him, not the other way around 

If the bus was passing him then the bus hit him on purpose.

[rainystateguy]

12 hours ago, Justin Boivin said:

Sorry this happened, very tragic. It didn't look intentional, but its certainly careless driving. Drivers should be looking for cyclists and PEVs just as they would look for other cars. Drivers and riders both: pay attention to your surroundings. Always look and don't assume that you're seen.

Just a dose of reality here.  Most drivers don't even know that there are such things as PEVs on the road  I learned early in my motorcycling days that it is common for a car driver's brain to just disregard anything they see on the road that is not a car or truck.  four wheeled vehicles are what they are looking for, so those - and only those - are what the driver "sees".  You must always assume that car drivers you share the road with are deaf, blind, drunk and texting.  

[Gasmantle]

1 hour ago, winterwheel said:

If the bus was passing him then the bus hit him on purpose.

How did you determine he was hit on purpose?

I'd say it's far more likely the driver didn't see him and it was a tragic accident.

[Alex Tsepkov]

When I first watched the video, it seemed like the bus driver was overly aggressive and left no room for the EUC to safely travel, he definitely did not slow down for the EUC. But after re-watching it several more times, it looks like the real problem was the double-parked truck that left no room for EUC to travel and EUC rider was forced to switch lanes (to avoid collision), but the bus was too close at that point. From the hand gestures of the EUC rider it also looks like he lost balance. Could the bus driver have slowed down?  If he saw the EUC rider, then yes, but it's possible he didn't see him.

Double-parking in general is a big problem that often creates dangerous situations exactly like this one for bicycles, EUCs, and scooters. I wish that cities penalized double-parked vehicles more severely and made enforcing such fines simpler (i.e. grab a photo of the offending vehicle and send to DMV instead of hoping that a traffic officer is around to write a ticket). The problem is the drivers who double-park don't care about the danger they create, and they will not care until authorities take these cases more seriously.

[Dave Wood]

6 hours ago, Lefteris said:

And another video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDBDKLpGHRI

 

 

Can anybody translate what the police woman is saying into english ?

[Alex Tsepkov]

2 minutes ago, Dave Wood said:

Can anybody translate what the police woman is saying into english ?

I speak Russian, not Ukranian, so I don't completely understand everything she said but she's mostly explaining where/when the accident occurred and that they're still investigating it.

[Antec]

very sad to hear this

Everyone please be vigilant on the roads

[Gasmantle]

I'm in the position of having driven buses for a year or 2 and also ride an EUC regularly.

In the following video it looks very much to me that (assuming the bus was left hand drive) the driver would have had great difficulty seeing the rider coming up his blind side at speed.

I'm not suggesting the bus driver was totally blameless but I do think there is more to consider than simply blaming the driver for what is probably a terrible accident

 

[joca]

3 hours ago, winterwheel said:

If the bus was passing him then the bus hit him on purpose.

It doesn't look like the bus is passing him, it looks like he is passing the bus (on the inside). The rider is positioned towards the back of the bus at the start of the footage and catches up to the front of it by the time they collided. It's hard to tell whether that happened because the bus started slowing down to change lanes, or because the rider was going faster to begin with, the footage doesn't start early enough to see.

There is a huge problem with large vehicles not having adequate mirrors to check for small vehicles on the inside of them. But bus/lorry drivers don't design their vehicles. If this was a blind spot problem, it was not the driver's fault.

Undertaking is dangerous, don't do it.

[winterwheel]

2 hours ago, Gasmantle said:

How did you determine he was hit on purpose?

I'd say it's far more likely the driver didn't see him and it was a tragic accident.

I believe the rider was catching up to/passing the bus, not the other way around.

However, it's been suggested by others that the bus was overtaking the rider. For that to be true then the rider would have been in front of the bus at some point and therefore visible to the bus driver, hence it would have been a purposeful collision on the part of the bus.

 

Edited September 11, 2020 by winterwheel

[Gasmantle]

7 minutes ago, joca said:

It doesn't look like the bus is passing him, it looks like he is passing the bus (on the inside). The rider is positioned towards the back of the bus at the start of the footage and catches up to the front of it by the time they collided. It's hard to tell whether that happened because the bus started slowing down to change lanes, or because the rider was going faster to begin with, the footage doesn't start early enough to see.

There is a huge problem with large vehicles not having adequate mirrors to check for small vehicles on the inside of them. But bus/lorry drivers don't design their vehicles. If this was a blind spot problem, it was not the driver's fault.

Undertaking is dangerous, don't do it.

I'd agree.

Surely the EUC rider could have slowed down in anticipation of the bus turning toward the kerb - instead he appears to have tried to overtake on the drivers blind side.

On the subject of inadequate mirrors on large vehicles, as someone with experience of driving a bus I can confirm it is very difficult to see a small vehicle like a bicycle or EUC on the drivers blindside as that vehicle gets closer to the front of the bus. It is hard enough trying look look for a bicycle that is moving slowly - trying to see a fast moving EUC would be virtually impossible.

[winterwheel]

2 hours ago, Alex Tsepkov said:

... But after re-watching it several more times, it looks like the real problem was the double-parked truck that left no room for EUC to travel and EUC rider was forced to switch lanes (to avoid collision), but the bus was too close at that point. From the hand gestures of the EUC rider it also looks like he lost balance....

Having watched it a couple of more times, I'd have to agree, the double-parked truck appears to have played a role in this. It looks like the bus and the rider were both planning paths around that parked vehicle. The rider corrects a bit to the left as the bus starts to go to the right, and they are now on a converging path. Rider then has to make an unexpectedly sharp correction back to the right to avoid the bus and goes out of control. The bus looks like it never saw the rider at all, perhaps because the driver had been again, focused on that unexpected obstacle in the road.

All that's missing is to know if the bus had a reason to be pulling into the right lane at that point. That's probably addressed in the second video, but I have no idea what's being said there.

 

 

Edited September 11, 2020 by winterwheel

[joca]

5 minutes ago, winterwheel said:

All that's missing is to know if the bus had a reason to be pulling into the right lane at that point. That's probably addressed in the second video, but I have no idea what's being said there.

Buses always stick to the inside lane where possible. That's where the bus stops are.

[Dave Wood]

51 minutes ago, joca said:

Undertaking is dangerous, don't do it.

 That's what u get when anybody can just jump on a euc/pev and ride with traffic in other words riders with zero road sense or knowledge of the highway code, this is also why i don't agree with kids/children riding pevs.. Absolute minimum requirement should be atleast a driving license for the reason iv just given

Edited September 11, 2020 by Dave Wood

[Rawnei]

9 minutes ago, Dave Wood said:

 That's what u get when anybody can just jump on a euc/pev and ride with traffic in other words riders with zero road sense or knowledge of the highway code, this is also why i don't agree with kids/children riding pevs.. Absolute minimum requirement should be atleast a driving license for the reason iv just given

EUC is not road legal to begin with, same rules as a bicycle applies, the problem is when there are no bike lanes then you have to it's also allowed go on the road also same as bicycle. So I don't think it's a vehicle problem, more a infrastructure + rider knowledge one (when riders are in traffic while there is bike lanes).

[joca]

1 minute ago, Dave Wood said:

 That's what u get when anybody can just jump on a euc/pev and ride with traffic in other words riders with zero road sense or knowledge of the highway code, this is also why i don't agree with kids/children riding pevs..

I wouldn't want people using low power/speed vehicles to be legislated off the road but it would definitely be a good idea for EUCers who don't have much road experience (but want to ride on the road) to do their cycle proficiency test and/or a CBT. If they ever become road legal, I'd expect something like that to become a requirement.

(UK terminology explainer: CBT is certificate of basic training, a half day of group training proving to the instructor that you can handle your motorbike safely and have a basic understanding of the road, required before you can ride on the road with L plates. Cycle proficiency, for pushbikes, is voluntary but strongly encouraged.)

[Al.Cash]

Police woman report:

"When patrolling the city today, we received a message on the work tablet about the road accident with casualties at Bendara Str 27. When we arrived, we found out that ambulance already took the injured person. Communication with witnesses and the driver revealed that the driver of the transport route vehicle ran over the unknown person riding on the road. Because of sustained injuries that person died. Investigation team is working at the incident scene to determine all the details."

[Dave Wood]

Just now, Rawnei said:

EUC is not road legal to begin with, same rules as a bicycle applies, the problem is when there are no bike lanes then you have to it's also allowed go on the road also same as bicycle. So I don't think it's a vehicle problem, more a infrastructure + rider knowledge one (when riders are in traffic while there is bike lanes).

My point still stands, it's scary how many riders are out there who don't even know the rules of the road, less alone how to drive defensively.

[Rawnei]

18 minutes ago, Dave Wood said:

My point still stands, it's scary how many riders are out there who don't even know the rules of the road, less alone how to drive defensively.

Same with bicycles and it would be impossible to regulate who are allowed or not to ride a bicycle, EUC, Scooter, Scateboard or virtually any other vehicle that doesn't count as a car and don't require a license, it's actually on the responsibility of the person driving the vehicle to be aware of the rules of the road they are traveling, be it a bike lane, sidewalk (yes there's even regulations for these), car road, so if you want to take it a step further it's a human problem because a lot of people don't give a damn and don't educate themselves and are happily unaware of traffic rules. The best the state can do is try to inform people in general about how important it is to learn and understand the rules. I guess the one thing that could actually be done is better information for kids in school so they get an early impression that it's important to learn.

[Alex Tsepkov]

Reddit posted an enhanced version of the video: https://streamable.com/ueqv1w

From there, it indeed seems like the bus driver was merging into the EUC lane without checking for EUC (note the dashed white line showing lanes).

[RockyTop]

About a year ago, I was in the bike lane. (right edge of the road) A bus started to pass me. Three seconds later when I was in the middle of the bus it crossed the bike lane to get to a bus stop with me beside it. Luckily I was able to move over and slow down enough to get out of the way. I am sure that the bus driver did not even noticed what he did. He didn’t even stop before taking off again. 

 

[Dgar]

Quote

If it translated the meaning of the word incorrectly in English, let moderator fix it please , so I have no problem with that and I will be glad it's not about me or my post, it's about you, my friends from this forum, take care of yourself.

@ DjPanJan If I appeared insensitive with my post on the word "Murdered" I apologize. It didn't occur to me until later that it was probably a translation thing. Did you know the person at all?