Gotway RS

[Augus]

So if it does hardly anything, do you advise disconnecting the original fan?

[EMA]

Spoiler

maybe you can try in the cold season, i don't know in the summer. keep in mind that running at lower temperature is a better option for mosfet and electronics in general

maybe you can in the cold season, but be carefull in the summer, 

[DjPanJan]

Eucservice offer RS with 450Wh extra battery pack. Once they ubgrade pedal hangers i think this can be my new EUC. Because Veteran sherman is HS version now and i "need" HT version what veteran sherman propably never make. You think is worth incrase battery this 450Wh ? This change make RS +- 30Kg machine is ok or too many ? What you think?

This weekend i have oportunity ride/test veteran sherman (propably 1 or 2 batch) and in inclines and low speed inclines i can tell MSP HT is noticeably stronger compared to sherman ( i take this like fact sherman is speed euc not torq focused) just i want say no veteran sherman like future ubgrade my "old/classic"  MSP 2500W.

Sherman in real life is smaler what i imagine from photos/videos very nice EUC i was surprised how nimble is on knoby tire .

Soon i update my crash topic for final results and more details what i find.

[EUC Custom Power-Pads]

15 minutes ago, DjPanJan said:

Eucservice offer RS with 450Wh extra battery pack. Once they ubgrade pedal hangers i think this can be my new EUC. Because Veteran sherman is HS version now and i "need" HT version what veteran sherman propably never make. You think is worth incrase battery this 450Wh ? This change make RS +- 30Kg machine is ok or too many ? What you think?

I am in the same thoughts right now. But from the RS I'm pretty much discouraged right now and I'm thinking more about adding more battery to my MSP HT. The offer of EUCservice is well known, but honestly I would like to have 2700wh and the whole also preferably as real 24S6P.
I can imagine that Gotway will put a 20 inch wheel on the market with 2700wh 24S6P because the EX is unpopular and they have nothing to compete with the Veteran. I will wait and see, or upgrade my MSP if I get a reasonable offer. 450€ for 450wh and then to send the wheel for it is probably not worth it.

Edited November 16, 2020 by buell47

[Tasku]

5 hours ago, DjPanJan said:

Eucservice offer RS with 450Wh extra battery pack. Once they ubgrade pedal hangers i think this can be my new EUC. Because Veteran sherman is HS version now and i "need" HT version what veteran sherman propably never make. You think is worth incrase battery this 450Wh ? This change make RS +- 30Kg machine is ok or too many ? What you think?

You need to make your own mind but think through these points:

1. So more battery is better because it will make sure every battery stays in better condition as single battery gets less drain. I think majority of Gotway wheels come with just lil less than you would need. Gotways charging stops when any of the connected battery packs are full and then balancing to others continue with lower speed. The more you have packs and more they are mismatched the more problems. So there is that. There is good and bad to having many battery packs. After all, only one single battery to break and that pack needs to be entirely removed or performance goes to horrible.

2. Installing this battery pack should be just few wires connected. So if this is something you can do personally, then it might be worth. But if you are installing it and not familiar with electricity and batteries, then could be even dangerous.

3. If you have to send your wheel there then it would be fairly expensive to pay the mail there and back. So this part sounded like less value for money. Yet having that extra range.. priceless right?

4. If you are ordering new wheel with this extra pack? Take it, I would especially if it is Smart BMS. Will they do the other packs with smart BMS too? That would be worthy service to buy.

5. If your wheel goes often completely dry then you risk more change of having mismatching battery balances. Also it is less fun to drive a wheel that is limited to drive slow-mode, so having higher potential would give more pleasure cruising before you hit that low voltage limits. 

6. One last thing to consider is that will your wheel last? Will something break before you get to live the benefits of the battery packs? Like what if water damage breaks your motor or such.

5 hours ago, DjPanJan said:

and in inclines and low speed inclines i can tell MSP HT is noticeably stronger compared to sherman

Veteran Sherman's motor does not have high torque first ~20km/h but after initial speed that the motor will give you that torque.

This is said to be because the MSP HT has mismatching magnets, giving it a torque feel but it also loses a lot of the efficiency as the wheel goes faster therefore you lose range more with higher speeds.

Sherman gives extreme range, something that not everyone needs. It for good reason is said to be for the few who want that range. Not for the first wheel they all seem to say. It offers long range and extreme speed potential. Long range cruiser with best value on how many kilometres you can travel with invested money.

My last thoughts:

Personally I think the potential Sherman has to offer in terms of performance ability is the wheel I been keeping my eye on. I just wanna make longer and longer cruises and not to worry that the wheel would cut out on me cause I accelerate one part of my trip harder. But Sherman does not fulfill my everyday needs, it is such heavy wheel after all. I play the waiting game but tempted to get the Sherman, patch 3, maybe. Anycase MSP HT and Sherman might be what I go for with wheels.

Edited November 16, 2020 by Tasku
english teacher was mad for my my typos and was haunting me

[Shape]

On 11/13/2020 at 1:31 PM, Simply_Striking said:

I'm new to this, but my first impression was that this thing is loud, and when the fan turns on it is even louder. It doesn't bother me while ridding, but while trolling it in stores people hear it coming. And the beeps, to turn on, off or when settings change... It scares my soul out of my body everytime, even tho I'm prepared for it.

Hi all!

I have the new RS since about 2 weeks....that’s a ridiculously insane wheel, I love it! 😁

But, as mentioned in the quoted post, my question is: is there a way to mute the starting and the shutting down BEEP?

It’s so damn loud, eheheh! 😆😅🤪

Thank you! 💪🏻

[Nick McCutcheon]

2 minutes ago, Shape said:

Hi all!

I have the new RS since about 2 weeks....that’s a ridiculously insane wheel, I love it! 😁

But, as mentioned in the quoted post, my question is: is there a way to mute the starting and the shutting down BEEP?

It’s so damn loud, eheheh! 😆😅🤪

Thank you! 💪🏻

Unfortunately not, though some (including myself) choose to install a switch in line with the beeper to toggle it off temporarily for this reason. The only downside is you have to cut a hole in the casing and you have to remember to turn it on before riding (a must). Unless you decide to do some arduino wizardry and use a capacitive touch sensor with a relay to avoid cutting a hole in the case 

[erk1024]

1 hour ago, Tasku said:

1. So more battery is better because it will make sure every battery stays in better condition as single battery gets less drain. I think majority of Gotway wheels come with just lil less than you would need. Gotways charging stops when any of the connected battery packs are full and then balancing to others continue with lower speed. The more you have packs and more they are mismatched the more problems. So there is that. There is good and bad to having many battery packs. After all, only one single battery to break and that pack needs to be entirely removed or performance goes to horrible.

I think it's also good to consider that after-market modifications can fail. Several of the battery fires have happened to battery modified wheels. The problem is that when you modify it, you're invalidating a lot of testing that the factory and other riders have done on the wheel.

[Mike Sacristan]

I have done almost 7000km on my 2664Wh Nikola Plus since the end of June.
Summer was okay... I could do 50km and have 66% battery left.
Some times I had done 100km and had 33% battery left.

Now I ride faster and it is a bit colder (last days have been around +10C). I also changed tyre from my slick CST C-1488 to a CX-321.
So I am lucky if I get 100km. I just finished a 50km cruise and I am down to half battery. 

Mostly it's because I ride faster though.

So in the end no battery will save us. The Sherman is also a 100km wheel if riding it at speed and being a medium weight rider.

My Nik weighs 29.5kg so it is very planted but it definitely takes a while to get used to. As does a Sherman.
An 8A charger will do more than a large battery.

I have monitored my charging and balancing via the SmartBMS many times and there has never been any issue.
The voltage of the cells is always close.

There are freak accidents like burning batteries, dead cells, etc but I don't see this as a widespread problem. Maybe one day we will tell the story of the three wheels in 2019-2020 that caught fire to our grandchildren.

The RS is a very nice wheel. So is the MSP be it HS or HT. They are the best all purpose wheels that are also the most mod-friendly.
If you can solve a problem with money that is a luxury. Money comes and money goes.

If you ride the hell out of your 1800Wh wheel and get 50km of range and add 450Wh then you are getting 25% more which would make that 62.5km.
And if you ride slow and get 100km of range then added pack would make it 130km.

The 6P could definitely be beneficial though... but one of the riders in the group is quite aggressive and has hit 76kmh on his MSP HS. And that's 4P.
Scary, scary stuff.  And our new RS HS rider hit 69kmh within two days of owning his new wheel. Coming from an 18XL.

The Loomo Nik riders are still ticking and their wheels are functioning perfectly.

But the RS has just one board? So no daughter board like the MSP?
 

[KiwiMark]

I'm thinking that I might at some point buy a Veteran Sherman for long range riding, but would possibly keep my RS for the 8kg less weight for riding where I don't need more than the 1,800Wh can provide.  The problem with the Veteran Sherman is that it still weighs 35kg, even when you are going for a short ride to the shops - it isn't like a fuel tank that you can half fill to have less weight (I know a guy that does that on his motorcycle that has a VERY large (over 40 litre) after-market fuel tank).  If I could afford to buy several wheels, I might have decided to buy a smaller wheel like a Tesla V2 for short trips, with the RS for medium rides and then a Veteran Sherman for longer rides.

I'm hoping that I don't find the 1,800Wh too restrictive for a while at least.  I'd like it to be a good 'do everything' wheel, at least until I buy more wheels for specific uses.

[Tasku]

21 minutes ago, Mike Sacristan said:

An 8A charger will do more than a large battery.

Good point.

Having a charger with you is good plan. Range is not only buying point, but when you go to your first group ride and notice you are the one running out of juice.. I still would avoid draining the battery too low in attempt to squeeze everything out of em, unless there is absolute must to do so. These chargers do take some space and tend to break if you carry em around. Chargers also do not like water and if you break em and charge at cafe shop, that would be nasty experience. If you go for the "I keep a charger with me" route, makes sure it stays in perfect condition (getsome package to cover it).

For some covid-19 reason I have been trying to stay off any extra stops and just fill it up at home or work. For me range is value that I prefer to have. 

Waiting for that day, as new battery tech brings us more range with less weight, watersealed + temperature regulates battery casings.. We should expect less weight in future wheels making our dreams possible. Unless they ban our nerd wheels before that 

I had today a talk with a guy on his 7000 euro electric bike. His jaws dropped when I traveled faster than him and even my range was better. I bet my ass he is searching EUC topics right now  

The High speed version is what I would recommend from the RS. Safer with that higher speed potential and better efficiency for range.

 

 

[Ben Hatfield]

55 minutes ago, Tasku said:

better efficiency for range

is it known that the high speed RS is more efficient?  is there specific #'s on this?

I have the high speed MSP.  Based upon my experience and research is it not more efficient than the torque, and if ridden fast, one can burn down the hs battery faster than the msp torque.  Perhaps the speed is more efficient if kept the 20-30 mph range?

[Mike Sacristan]

1 hour ago, KiwiMark said:

I'm thinking that I might at some point buy a Veteran Sherman for long range riding, but would possibly keep my RS for the 8kg less weight for riding where I don't need more than the 1,800Wh can provide.  The problem with the Veteran Sherman is that it still weighs 35kg, even when you are going for a short ride to the shops - it isn't like a fuel tank that you can half fill to have less weight (I know a guy that does that on his motorcycle that has a VERY large (over 40 litre) after-market fuel tank).  If I could afford to buy several wheels, I might have decided to buy a smaller wheel like a Tesla V2 for short trips, with the RS for medium rides and then a Veteran Sherman for longer rides.

I'm hoping that I don't find the 1,800Wh too restrictive for a while at least.  I'd like it to be a good 'do everything' wheel, at least until I buy more wheels for specific uses.

I rate the 1800Wh wheels as 70km wheels for average riders in average conditions.
Once we are constantly over 40kmh things change though.

I went for a ride with Thomas a few weeks back. 8km ride to his place.
Then we went blasting to Moose Island. Then back to the city.
He wanted to slow down a bit on the way back because his battery was down to 30% and mine was at 50%.
So he had a little less than 600Wh left and I had a little more than 1300Wh left at that point.
We stopped at a bar to have a beer. He charged his wheel. We rode a bit more and stopped at another bar for another beer. (He likes beer).
He charged his wheel some more.
1 hour charge at 7A is still something.

Yesterday riding with Ronnie:

MSP HT 28.5km - 976Wh used. ~85kg rider + gear
1Rad Nikola Plus - 31km - 799Wh used. ~68kg rider with "gear"

The Sherman is a bit of a hassle to carry up and down stairs. No big deal taking it into shops.
But the MSP and RS are definitely do it all wheels. I wouldn't bother with a Tesla though.
An MSP or RS and a long range cruiser a la Sherman and you are good to go... but the Sherman will cover most things. Not my first pick of wheel to jump around a skate park though.

It all depends on how fast and how far you plan on riding.

[EMA]

7 hours ago, Ben Hatfield said:

is it known that the high speed RS is more efficient?  is there specific #'s on this?

I have the high speed MSP.  Based upon my experience and research is it not more efficient than the torque, and if ridden fast, one can burn down the hs battery faster than the msp torque.  Perhaps the speed is more efficient if kept the 20-30 mph range?

i have both wheels and HS version always give me the worst range, if you ride at 40-45 km/h top it's almost the same, but if you push around 50km/h and above you'll see the HS speed battery suffers a lot more.

torque motor is pretty efficient if you not push hard all the times, this tour was recorded some days ago: https://euc.world/tour/592346933825004

it's almost 50/50 off/street with a cruising speed around 35km/h, avg was 20 but everytime i can i was cruising at 35 and more, 72km with 30% left

[Augus]

19 hours ago, Ben Hatfield said:

is it known that the high speed RS is more efficient?  is there specific #'s on this?

I have the high speed MSP.  Based upon my experience and research is it not more efficient than the torque, and if ridden fast, one can burn down the hs battery faster than the msp torque.  Perhaps the speed is more efficient if kept the 20-30 mph range?

This was answered on Gotway when I asked about the two versions.

"Hello friend. The acceleration of C38 is more stable and the motor is more energy-saving.

If you weigh more than 80 kg, for example. or you like mountain climbing, please choose the C38 version.

If you're light and you ride mostly on flat ground, you can choose the C30"

 

Edited November 17, 2020 by Augus

[Augus]

10 hours ago, EMA said:

i have both wheels and HS version always give me the worst range, if you ride at 40-45 km/h top it's almost the same, but if you push around 50km/h and above you'll see the HS speed battery suffers a lot more.

torque motor is pretty efficient if you not push hard all the times, this tour was recorded some days ago: https://euc.world/tour/592346933825004

it's almost 50/50 off/street with a cruising speed around 35km/h, avg was 20 but everytime i can i was cruising at 35 and more, 72km with 30% left

Very good range. I'm already looking forward to my RS HT.

[Simply_Striking]

Dam, one of the reasons I got the HS was because I was expecting more range compared to the HT :(. 

[Tasku]

15 hours ago, EMA said:

cruising speed around 35km/h, avg was 20 but everytime i can i was cruising at 35 and more, 72km with 30% left

I envy that you can ride as the weather here drops below 0 and it is no pleasure to ride with slippery roads. I would love to be in Italy right now, riding all day long.

Those numbers look good. I usually run 40 km and end up with 30-40% battery life with my MSP HT. I envy your performance. I made my assumption based on the numbers others said about their ride with RS and they depleted the battery quite much quicker than you did. You must have done some smooth gliding. Very controlled accelerations and steady speeds? Please tell! The higher the speed goes the performance ratio goes down so quick. I feel going 35km/h is already out of my MSP HT performance per km ratio.  

Also what are your settings for EUC WORLD? @EMA Are you using custom battery levels? That would prolly explain why my numbers are so different. 

Also when I earlier assumed High Speed version to provide better overall performance per/km traveled, I assumed general smaller motor power would provide smaller potential to consume, therefore giving better range, as we seen in so many cases. Oh well anyway, I found the range interesting sidetrack of the general conversion but considering how much attention it has got, it must be important to us all 

[EMA]

On 11/18/2020 at 2:08 AM, Tasku said:

I envy that you can ride as the weather here drops below 0 and it is no pleasure to ride with slippery roads. I would love to be in Italy right now, riding all day long.

0 C man, damn that's hardcore riding for sure

btw i'm using standard battery setting in EUC world and using hard mode right now ( usually medium on MSP ), i don's see difference in range between MSP and RS.

comparing range in general is not easy, speeds and accelerations means a lot, i always found 30-35km/h a good spot for speed and range.

this tour has some hardcore riding you can compare with, but this was recorded in the summer with like 30 C : https://euc.world/tour/589643455836155


about RS :
this thing is crazy smooth, don't know how much is bearings related or firmware, but riding this wheel  seems "flying", you don't feel the rolling or the motor at all, no matter the speed , this thing just go over and over.

Can't wait to try latest firmware with higher pedals (witch i'm missing)

[xiiijojjo]

17 minutes ago, EMA said:

about RS :
Can't wait to try latest firmware

Do gotway now also make firmware updates? how do you get it from ordering a chip (like sherman) or from some gotway app?

[EMA]

4 hours ago, xiiijojjo said:

Do gotway now also make firmware updates? how do you get it from ordering a chip (like sherman) or from some gotway app?

no, they are still "old" at this point, need to swap the board...

like they are updating the EX firmware, they have done to the RS too (pedals deep too much in soft and medium mode  compared to msp)

Edited November 19, 2020 by EMA

[xiiijojjo]

4 minutes ago, EMA said:

no, they are still "old" at this point, need to swap the board...

like they are updated the EX firmware, they have done to the RS too (pedals deep too much in soft and medium mode  compared to msp)

I've been waiting for my wheel for 3 weeks it still has not arrived and i find out while it's in transit that i need new pedal hangers and control board before it's even gotten here... wow..  I guess i can't complain that they are fixing stuff but goddamn. I only ride in hard mode so i hope i won't feel the need to upgrade the control board but the second i see new pedal hangers on ali i'm going for 'em.

[EMA]

9 minutes ago, xiiijojjo said:

I only ride in hard mode

RS hard mode is really awesome, i like it more compared to msp

 

also about RS:

finally they upgraded shell to hex screws (not side panel)

the fan starts at 40 C, it's not pulsing anymore when you just turn on the wheel, newer version will start at 50 C

Edited November 19, 2020 by EMA

[EUC Custom Power-Pads]

RS hard mode compared to MSP hard mode? 

MSP hard mode is sucks. Soft mode too. 

[Mike Sacristan]

4 hours ago, EMA said:

no, they are still "old" at this point, need to swap the board...

like they are updated the EX firmware, they have done to the RS too (pedals deep too much in soft and medium mode  compared to msp)

Noted this last night when riding Fredrik's MSP HS which he received last week.
The wheel came with a 2-3 degree forward pedal tilt. This combined with medium mode made it a bit tricky when riding irregular asphalt as bumps in succession make the pedals shift more and more eventually putting us on the balls of our feet / toes.

We ended up switching to hard mode and it is just fine now. And the hard mode is still squishy and more like MSP medium or maybe even soft.

Definitely a nice floating feeling and what seemed like endless power and speed. I ran out of balls at 60kmh and slowed down. We need to fix his Russian pads and make them a bit fluffier in the front and back. Met a cop car on the bike path too. At first I thought it was two idiot cyclist riding next to each other. I had my new lights on though so I bet he didn't see much.