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My V11 Trials, Tribulations, and Triumphs


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7 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

 

Has a bad feeling ever since the control board did something funny when you tried the firmware update, later with the odd tilt-back and then the inability to activate "go-home" mode. 

I'm not gonna write this result off but that's a sad development. 

I just hope @Inmotion Global will see this and send you a production version to put to rest all our fears.

On the other hand, can't wait to see the pre-production s18 do the test, as they say "misery loves company" :rolleyes: :roflmao:

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I'm very impressed with the build quality of the V11 and the amount of metal in it. Everything that holds your body to the wheel is metal. The plastic only servers to contain the batteries. And t

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13 hours ago, Skywalker said:

The brutal overheat hill challenge. I don’t know why, but I love this test the most. I guess is that if the motor can handle this it can take whatever I throw at it

It’s the tension and drama that make this test compelling. And then there’s the potential for smoke.

Edited by Jon Stern
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23 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

 

Twice in a row now that you had to pull wheels down the mountain.. :( Well, know that it's appreciated, I always look forward to these videos in particular!

For the V11, it's a real disappointment for sure, especially considering the weak performance of the V10F I would have thought that they had learned from the previous mistakes. I didn't know whether to expect it would make it up the hill or not or just overload in the usual Inmotion fashion, but I didn't expect this for sure.

 

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10 minutes ago, Nils said:

Twice in a row now that you had to pull wheels down the mountain.. :( Well, know that it's appreciated, I always look forward to these videos in particular!

For the V11, it's a real disappointment for sure, especially considering the weak performance of the V10F I would have thought that they had learned from the previous mistakes. I didn't know whether to expect it would make it up the hill or not or just overload in the usual Inmotion fashion, but I didn't expect this for sure.

 

I don't think this failure is related to overstressing the wheel. It should have been cooling down so something strange happened when it laid down with the power still on.

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1 minute ago, Hal Farrenkopf said:

I don't think this failure is related to overstressing the wheel. It should have been cooling down so something strange happened when it laid down with the power still on.

Right, well we'll see as we don't know yet exactly what the issue was, but still looks like possible under-insulated wires / under-cooled MOSFETS / etc. Time might possibly tell I guess. My point is more along the lines that I expected Inmotion to have more safe guards in place considering how often the V10F told me to step off. That was very annoying, but still made sense as they wanted to have a safe wheel, etc. and the V10F was to weak to allow more. But at least this particular wheel seems to have burned Gotway style however.

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7 hours ago, Nils said:

But at least this particular wheel seems to have burned Gotway style however.

Marty didn't see anything burnt. Marty, did you smell any burnt smell when you opened it up? Did you have a temperature reading when you un-laid it? Did a fuse blow since you couldn't turn it on afterwards?

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10 hours ago, Hal Farrenkopf said:

Marty didn't see anything burnt. Marty, did you smell any burnt smell when you opened it up? Did you have a temperature reading when you un-laid it? Did a fuse blow since you couldn't turn it on afterwards?

Sorry, I didn't necessarily mean burned in the literal sense of fire and smoke but broke down hard. But again, will be interesting to find out what it was, if we ever do - provided Marty or Inmotion will attempt to delve deeper into it and provide information.

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19 hours ago, Nils said:

Twice in a row now that you had to pull wheels down the mountain.. :( Well, know that it's appreciated, I always look forward to these videos in particular!

For the V11, it's a real disappointment for sure, especially considering the weak performance of the V10F I would have thought that they had learned from the previous mistakes. I didn't know whether to expect it would make it up the hill or not or just overload in the usual Inmotion fashion, but I didn't expect this for sure.

 

I think your are jumping to conclusion a bit too early. 

I've seen the video of a V11 go up a steep slope that looks just as steep as marty's Over heat hill. 

The same hill that killed a veteran. 

Veteran Sherman on the same slopes. 

 

 

Edited by onizukagto
Add veteran slope burnout video
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6 hours ago, onizukagto said:

I think your are jumping to conclusion a bit too early. 

I've seen the video of a V11 go up a steep slope that looks just as steep as marty's Over heat hill. 

The same hill that killed a veteran. 

Veteran Sherman on the same slopes. 

 

 

We dont know the history of that wheel or what kind if trip it took before taking on the hill.  For all we know that was a cold start on a brand new wheel.  

 

The wheel marty fried was abused by testers for weeks had hundreds of miles on it, and had just completed a 10 mile ride to the hill on a hot day.  Plus it wasnt the hill the killed it, which is the scary part.  It failed during a low stress situation, thats terrifying.

 

Personally im still going to wait for my v11 to get here, but you cant bury your head in the sand and pretend theres no potential MAJOR issue here.

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8 hours ago, onizukagto said:

I think your are jumping to conclusion a bit too early. 

I've seen the video of a V11 go up a steep slope that looks just as steep as marty's Over heat hill. 

The same hill that killed a veteran. 

What conclusion is that? I am as I said disappointed to see this happen, and it was not a nice failure. As for what caused it we don't know. Hopefully this was a one-off, or the new production board fixes the issue somehow, but as far as conclusions go I think the only thing we can conclude at the time is that we don't know.

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3 hours ago, GoGeorgeGo said:

We dont know the history of that wheel or what kind if trip it took before taking on the hill.  For all we know that was a cold start on a brand new wheel.  

 

 

Exactly. Marty had a pre-production wheel that was heavily abused. 

 

Edited by onizukagto
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My guessing hat is that something in the pre prod board got confused when it was laid on its side and it brick'd itself. 

It didn't appear to have anything burned up inside.....but the motor wire were still shorted so it's just a guess lol. 

So @Jpd is putting it through some stress and it's doing well. 

By the way, has anyone activated the go home function yet?

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On 8/14/2020 at 4:47 PM, Hal Farrenkopf said:

Marty didn't see anything burnt. Marty, did you smell any burnt smell when you opened it up? Did you have a temperature reading when you un-laid it? Did a fuse blow since you couldn't turn it on afterwards?

I don't think the V11 has any fuses (that's a KingSong thing). I do plan on fully removing the board to see if damage can be seen on the underside. No smells.

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45 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

I don't think the V11 has any fuses (that's a KingSong thing).

The V10 series at least has fuses, but they are soldered on the board. 

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11 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

I do plan on fully removing the board to see if damage can be seen on the underside.

Pretty Please Marty:

We'd like to know just a little more about the charging input of the V11, and breaking into the controller enclosure is not convenient for most of us...

-- Would you please grab some detailed photos of the chips nearest the charging wires? --
The wires from the charging ports go directly to the board- they should be easy to follow.

Specifically I'm interested in which FET part number they use, because it will help us evaluate how much input current is appropriate.

This device (#1) is of interest too (a mechanical relay perhaps). The charging interruptor is either this, or another driver hidden somewhere (under the board? in the pack?).
ACtC-3f-CemlCqM8TrTcys3SASabdxnyBKj1QxCx

Cheers

Edited by RagingGrandpa
added ecodrift pic
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22 minutes ago, Zopper said:

It's a known point of failure, which is better than if you (as a manufacturer) don't know what burns first and whether it can start a fire. Take it as an fire-escape valve on gas tanks and so on. If there is a catastrophic failure, do it at least in a controlled way.

I understand their use.

What's nice with KingSong's approach is that instead of the control board needing to be replaced, you replace a fuse. We've done in the field previously during hill climbs that failed.

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The on-PCB soldered fuses are normally the "Oh s**t" fuse.  They are normally the last thing to blow and normally only blow when there has been a catastrophic component failure.  I would still normally expect (hope) for an external replaceable fuse.  If the on-PCB fuse blows you normally need to replace PCB components to solve the problem anyway.

If external fuses aren't installed as standard on the V11 I may retrofit one using some automotive blade fuses when mine arrives :) Will depend a little on how intrusive I'd have to be to install it...

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