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6 hours ago, Nick McCutcheon said:

Mickey's beeps at 39 are definitely better than the MSP HT, at least for me (I hit beeps at 34-35)

weird, it shoud beep at 38mph :blink1:

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Where should I start... Let's go with the 5cm of suspension travel first. If you have the suspension pumped up perfectly for your weight, the travel is just shy of 1" up, and the same distance down fr

Not a very good torque wheel at that. Just came back from the NYC EX demo, which I wasn't originally planning on going to, but went along with @chulander and the Queens crew to eat and ride after

What I don't understand is this idea of a "one wheel fits all" mentality. I have a mountain bike and road bike. I've tried "hybrids" and found them to be dangerous combination of the two. With motorcy

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On 10/20/2020 at 7:23 AM, gon2fast said:

I hope Begode/Gotway updates the firmware on production units to be able to compete with Veteran top speed. Otherwise their $3400 experiment is going to lose them some customers (IMHO).

a little better than the HT MSP, I thought that was the role of the RS HS, lol.

They wont, EX is a torque wheel. Not a speed wheel.

There might be a future Speed version though.

Edited by eve
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8 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said:

Pictures and detailed disassembly of the EX. As always from the fantastic guys at @EcoDrift.

Pictures: Russian Original - English (Bing Translator)

Disassembly (suspension!): Russian Original - English (Bing Translator)

ROFL from beginning of translated article: "First the weight. 39kg. No words, emotions alone."

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53 minutes ago, AtlasP said:

ROFL from beginning of translated article: "First the weight. 39kg. No words, emotions alone."

:D

My favorite quote is right at the start of the second article: "I really do not want to disassemble Begode EX, but it is necessary."

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5 hours ago, houseofjob said:

Not a very good torque wheel at that.

Just came back from the NYC EX demo, which I wasn't originally planning on going to, but went along with @chulander and the Queens crew to eat and ride after.

Out of my 5 years of EUC-ing, the EX is the worst Gotway I have ever ridden on, and I'm talking primarily the overall ride feel of the unit more than the suspension part. Much of the reaction from the other demo riders were similar to mine, or lukewarm at best.

Even on soft mode, the EX was super stiff, which is fine, not my taste. But if it's gonna be all hard modes, the wheel should at least have good acceleration and braking, ala MSP etc., but the EX feels like you're trying to move a huge pickup truck that doesn't have enough motor power for accel (think flooring it but stuck on gear 1 or 2), nor has strong enough brakes to stop in time; everything on that wheel is sluggish, you have to anticipate things way in advance compared to every other wheel on the market. The Shermona isn't even that far off in weight from the EX, and accel/braking is night and day from the EX, smokes the EX in both categories. If you didn't tell me the EX sported a new "3500W" motor I would have never been able to tell it was any different from Gotway's 2-2.5kW existing motors, and a much worse firmware'd one at that. Note that we are not mountain climbers here in flatland NYC, but even the reported king of hill climbing MSP Torque accelerates better on flats than the EX.

I am seriously hoping the suckiness of the EX is not indicative of how Gotway is programming the feel of the 24 Pro, because if that's the case, I think my wheel buying might be done for the year.

to this video, the EX made it up a hill FASTER than the MSP....wouldn't this make the EX one of the highest torque wheels in existence, if it can beat even the MSP in torque/hill climbing?
If it's slower than other wheels (in acceleration or up hills) I'd LOVE to see something to back that up or prove it....but from the very limited evidence I've seen so far, nothing has beaten the EX yet (in torque)


 

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8 hours ago, houseofjob said:

Even on soft mode, the EX was super stiff, which is fine, not my taste. But if it's gonna be all hard modes

i've not ridden EX yet, but i find this behaviour related to the torque motor, you know soft mode on a torque MSP is way different from the other gw wheels, a bit stiffer [ imho ]

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9 minutes ago, mrelwood said:

Well, the EX didn’t make it up the hill, the rider did. Acceleration tests on self balancing vehicles do not work like they do with cars. You can’t “floor it” and achieve the best acceleration the vehicle is capable of. Acceleration on an EUC depends on how far the rider is comfortable pushing the wheel. The limit of the wheel’s acceleration has been reached only once the rider overleans the wheel. Everything before that is just about how the wheel feels to the rider. You can’t compare accelerations based on that.

Yup, this too, well said.

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18 hours ago, houseofjob said:

This video is hardly a scientific race, I don't see anywhere where they state battery level and modes used, and actual start line to finish, stopwatch synched footage (was anyone measuring directly at the start line, not just the finish line? I can't even see the guy who stops the stopwatch on camera. And where is the side-by-side side-view footage to compare the lean angles used on both wheels?). And I dunno what other EX reviews you are referring to.

This was just my impressions, echoed by many of the seasoned NYC riders who are predominantly MSX/MSP Speed riders. Consensus was the EX feels super sluggish across modes. I say this as nothing but a rider, no motivation to get you to click my EX review video, as I don't have one! You don't want to believe all this? Then don't!

And again, you're not gonna get a true hills opinion from anyone in NYC, we simply don't have them compared to an SF or LA.

 

It's not that I "don't believe it"  but with all of those riders making claims, have any of them recorded video of this behavior and posted it?  It's very difficult to find any videos of the wheel in general, and I'll take a claim with video evidence over a claim without it.  Also, given that the wheel is supposed to be more powerful than others before it, yet it has a lower top speed than the fastest wheels, I'd imagine it would have decent torque, and therefore acceleration and hill climbing abilities.  It wouldn't make a lot of sense for the wheel to somehow be more powerful and yet be slower and have worse torque....since power=torque*rpm.  I'd really like someone to show a video of the EX being compared in an objective test next to other high end wheels (MSP, RS, Sherman, etc)

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41 minutes ago, shellac said:

The Ex seems like it has all the necessary hardware to be a powerful high torque wheel, so hopefully the issues noted can be fixed with a firmware update. 

I agree and it does seem like Gotway is tweaking things. When I contacted eWheels about the EX and asked for a shipping ETA this is what they had to say...

"Joe,

We don't have a definitive date on the EX (Gotway is making some last-minute adjustments to the Wheel before full production). As soon as we know, it will be up on the site for *official* preorder."
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17 hours ago, EMA said:

i've not ridden EX yet, but i find this behaviour related to the torque motor, you know soft mode on a torque MSP is way different from the other gw wheels, a bit stiffer [ imho ]

I tried/rode now both EX and MSP first run FW wheels, both on soft, and yes, they feel basically like hard modes.

But FWIW, they changed the latest MSP FW to be spongier than the original MSP FW, but unfortunately I only felt it on hard mode on that riders' MSP.

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26 minutes ago, AtlasP said:

Agree with houseofjob, but just one very important fact to add--the EX is literally over 50% heavier than the MSP (like one whole MSP with half of a second MSP glued to the side of it). So the EX's motor could even be 'somewhat' more powerful than the MSP motor, but the point is it's nowhere near 50% more powerful/enough to make up for the massive weight difference.

also that at 40lbs, the motor plus wheel assembly on the EX is nearly the weight of the entire MSP (52lbs)!! also that motor weight is further out from its centroid due to its hollow core. so it'll take even more power to spin up this wheel. 

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Geometry, weight distribution, and firmware matter. Not motor specs like weight or (mostly meaningless) power rating.

To me it sounds like Gotway might make some firmware revisions. I can't see a reason why the EX has to be sluggish per se. The Sherman has a similar battery distribution and nobody complains about it being sluggish.

Maybe it just has bad geometry, or the suspension somehow influences that negatively?

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1 hour ago, meepmeepmayer said:

To me it sounds like Gotway might make some firmware revisions. I can't see a reason why the EX has to be sluggish per se. The Sherman has a similar battery distribution and nobody complains about it being sluggish.

 

I would hope, but usually they repackage the firmware updates as an entirely new model. Hopefully consumers will not buy into that nonsense now that the other manufacturers are upping there performance stats and closing the gap.  

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