mrelwood Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 (edited) On 6/10/2020 at 1:52 PM, mike_bike_kite said: Perhaps they detect the lean using feng shui because I can't see how science or electronics are going to help I actually tried to describe it to you with this link for more detailed explanation: https://www.sciencebuddies.org/science-fair-projects/references/accelerometer But according to you they were ”just wrong”. I guess because they didn’t consider feng shui. Maybe you don’t remember, after all it was almost a full week before your quote above... In short, the accelerometer chip that the EUCs use work in combination with a magnetometer, and by combining several sources, the chip is able to provide fairly accurate directional info despite being in motion. If the wheel should be fooled by banking, why not by just braking? Edited June 17, 2020 by mrelwood 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xorbe Posted June 18, 2020 Share Posted June 18, 2020 Seems like something that could be configurable through the app. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seage Posted June 18, 2020 Share Posted June 18, 2020 (edited) They could 100% do something about it, I think. Kingsongs used to have this strange glitch that happened pretty much only in drs offices and grocery stores where it would have a catastrophic failure, start batting back and forth super fast, sounded like a hammer then would shut down. Scared the hell out of me the first time, and i remember walking the wheel home because i didnt trust it. This ONLY happened when walking it, neverrrrr when riding. I dont think there was even one case. So the wheel must, in some way, know and react differently when there is no load. Or at least, it wouldnt be hard, hopefully, to create something that could tell. And if that was implemented, then we could attach the cutoff switch to that. Because theres nothing worse than riding a pumptrack, going around a bend and your wheel turns off, lmao. Theres also moments off road where i want to speed into a bend and lean it because if i go straight up theres a higher chance to catch the pedals. I do hope with all the new breakthroughs and tech in wheels now they revisit this concept and make it a little more complex for the type of riding people are getting into now. Edited June 18, 2020 by seage 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xorbe Posted June 18, 2020 Share Posted June 18, 2020 1 hour ago, seage said: Kingsongs used to have this strange glitch that happened pretty much only in drs offices and grocery stores where it would have a catastrophic failure, start batting back and forth super fast, sounded like a hammer then would shut down. Scared the hell out of me the first time, and i remember walking the wheel home because i didnt trust it. This ONLY happened when walking it, neverrrrr when riding. I dont think there was even one case. That's exactly right most likely. No load, and the self balancing was too torquey at a stop for no load, and then oscillated in an undamped fashion, overcorrecting itself over and over, worse each time. The wheel doesn't know if it's unloaded or not, it's just the end result of programming + physical response. Even the recent 16X had a funny thing if you rolled it back and forth with the handle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boogieman Posted June 18, 2020 Share Posted June 18, 2020 I happened to test out the max lean angle on my GW Tesla. If you compare the max angle (40°) before it cutouts in a very slow increase of angle...and think of what kind of grip that would require on gravel in a fairly high speed...i do not think it was a gyro based cutout, unless the board has a much lower cutout angle OR was totally tilted inside the wheel (mine was fairly loose before i fastened it, but angle diff no more than 1-2 degrees by eye from"rattle in the slot where board slides in"). Check the vid at the end of my "pedal mod post" for a fairly accurate test of maximum lean angle on a GW Tesla v1.2 (with mainboard fastened to prevent rattle) .of Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boogieman Posted June 18, 2020 Share Posted June 18, 2020 Other things to mention from the tests. When you are at theese steep angles, the wheel can suddenly decide to roll forward even if you dont tilt it forward,heck i even tries to tilt it backward but it still tried to roll forward so had to raise it to prevent a death spin in the kitchen :-) I guess the gyro in GW wheels is not accurate enough at angles beyond 35 to 40-ish degrees to decide forward/backward lean accurately, as this happened several times before it suddenly decided not to do it. I performed the exact same amouvre, but wheel behaved different :-) no micorwawes running or other odd electronics that might disturb the wheel electronics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boogieman Posted June 18, 2020 Share Posted June 18, 2020 Stopped video at max angle...its not 45° vs horizon, but i guess a short skid that is.missed by the video frame would be enough to pull.it past 40° Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike_bike_kite Posted June 18, 2020 Share Posted June 18, 2020 To me it just looked like he slipped and crashed in the dirt. I think he'd crashed a few times already. What we really need is a brave rider, a fairly fast EUC and a skate park. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boogieman Posted June 18, 2020 Share Posted June 18, 2020 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Boogieman said: Stopped video at max angle...its not 45° vs horizon, but i guess a short skid that is.missed by the video frame would be enough to pull.it past 40° As a reference, this is 40° where my modded tesla pedals hit the ground around 38-39° and gyro cuts right after 40° Edited June 18, 2020 by Boogieman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted June 18, 2020 Share Posted June 18, 2020 8 minutes ago, Boogieman said: Stopped video at max angle...its not 45° vs horizon, but i guess a short skid that is.missed by the video frame would be enough to pull.it past 40° youre assuming the plane is level... 5 degrees is not a lot, whose to say the ground hes on wasnt on an angle... i think it would be super obvious to tell a pedal clipping from a cut off from an experienced rider lmao... if you clip a pedal it is very jarring and does not cause the wheel to cut out, ive scraped lots of low pedals hard before never once has it caused me to stutter its just a horrible scraping sound, youd have to jam them in the dirt pretty dam good for it to cause you to be thrown off lol 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boogieman Posted June 18, 2020 Share Posted June 18, 2020 (edited) 1 minute ago, Rywokast said: youre assuming the plane is level... 5 degrees is not a lot, whose to say the ground hes on wasnt on an angle... i think it would be super obvious to tell a pedal clipping from a cut off from an experienced rider lmao... if you clip a pedal it is very jarring and does not cause the wheel to cut out, ive scraped lots of low pedals hard before never once has it caused me to stutter its just a horrible scraping sound, youd have to jam them in the dirt pretty dam good for it to cause you to be thrown off lol Horizon is the only thing that is likely to be level, thats why i chose horizon and omitted the foreground banks. Also i added some extra angle when free sketching, loon carefully. Compare with image (tesla) above that is 40° Edited June 18, 2020 by Boogieman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted June 18, 2020 Share Posted June 18, 2020 3 minutes ago, Boogieman said: Horizon is the only thing that is likely to be level, thats why i chose horizon and omitted the foreground banks. Also i added some extra angle when free sketching, loon carefully. Compare with image (tesla) above that is 40° hmmm... well its not like anything in any euc especially a GW is free from error lol... chooch is an extremely competent and experienced rider, if he says it cut out then i believe him, he would obviously know the difference... perhaps only for a split second or a quick jerk that stopped just short of the cutoff angle caused it to cutoff... not sure, but it happens multiple times in the video and many times in other videos of his 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boogieman Posted June 18, 2020 Share Posted June 18, 2020 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Rywokast said: hmmm... well its not like anything in any euc especially a GW is free from error lol... chooch is an extremely competent and experienced rider, if he says it cut out then i believe him, he would obviously know the difference... perhaps only for a split second or a quick jerk that stopped just short of the cutoff angle caused it to cutoff... not sure, but it happens multiple times in the video and many times in other videos of his About the jerk, i wrote it further up.. at edited video image. So yes it's a possibility that the frame was not captured. As an addition, the wheel does not behave"normal" at steep lean angles. It wants to accelerate even if you don't lean it forward. I guess gyro is not accurate enough at those angles to be sure if it's also leaning forward.. Cheap components profit and buyers that prefer low price (and speed);over quality...the GW way :-) I own a gotway, but i don't think i will own another one unless they improve quality, cable quality and management aso If they did not hold speed records i would switch manufacturer based solely on their low build quality... Upside, it leaves a lot of room for DIY MODS Edited June 18, 2020 by Boogieman 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musk Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 Most gyroscopes come packaged alongside accelerometers at very little cost compared to the individual components. It's totally possible for manufacturers to combine the angle data of the gyro with the acceleration data of the accelerometer to detect when a wheel is being leaned while being driven around a curve. This stuff isn't any more complicated than what late-generation Nintendo Wii controllers did once they had both sensors built in. The early generation wiimotes had only accelerometers, and a gyro was added later. Once you have both, the usefulness is greater than the sum of the parts. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CairnsBee Posted June 20, 2020 Share Posted June 20, 2020 (edited) Just happened on my 16x on a mountain bike trail. Went a little high on a banked corner and it shut down, lucky i had seen this thread otherwise would have been very confused on what happened. Was quite funny how it just shut down and tilted back and fell to the ground dead like it literally had died and lost all function. Just check my wheels, the ninebot one e+ shuts off at 50 degrees but my 16x shuts off at only 35 degrees! considering my area is full of mountain bike trails means have to take it easy on the banked corners, twkes a bit of the fun out of it Edited June 21, 2020 by CairnsBee 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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