meepmeepmayer Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Some good but unrelated discussion about ride modes has been moved here: 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Taras Posted January 20, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted January 20, 2021 (edited) ED photos and some words Edited January 20, 2021 by Kingsong Russia 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 New board! 18 mosfets, 3 caps. I think this is what you do when you should use better (bigger) parts, but use more cheaper parts instead Build looks better than the EX. No 3D printed brittle crap to be seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RagingGrandpa Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 (edited) The fan passage faces towards the direction of tire rotation?! C'mon guys... Edited January 20, 2021 by RagingGrandpa 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbolest Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 3 minutes ago, RagingGrandpa said: The fan passage faces towards the direction of tire rotation?! C'mon guys... I thought the exact same thing, until I realized that it wouldn't matter because the net airflow in the wheel cavity is going to be in the opposite direction. (assuming you're riding forwards, anyways xD) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hsiang Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, RagingGrandpa said: The fan passage faces towards the direction of tire rotation?! C'mon guys... Yup not good. Looking at their tear down I realized they were missing an additional 3d printed shield to help protect the exhaust port that was on the demo monster pro we have here. 1 minute ago, Arbolest said: I thought the exact same thing, until I realized that it wouldn't matter because the net airflow in the wheel cavity is going to be in the opposite direction. (assuming you're riding forwards, anyways xD) fan is not always on, when its off this is just an opening with the fan blades in the way 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbolest Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 1 minute ago, Hsiang said: fan is not always on, when its off this is just an opening with the fan blades in the way ...Yup... That is ALSO true and not something that I considered. I guess there really is no defending it then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hsiang Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 1 minute ago, Arbolest said: ...Yup... That is ALSO true and not something that I considered. I guess there really is no defending it then. worst part is that Gotway obviously realized that this is a problem and made a partial solution, but then they only put it on some of the wheels. Archie also didn't have this on his monster pro and reported significant water intrusion into battery compartment. Over heating, water + control board right next to the battery packs. Sounds like a recipe for disaster. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbolest Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, Hsiang said: worst part is that Gotway obviously realized that this is a problem and made a partial solution, but then they only put it on some of the wheels. Archie also didn't have this on his monster pro and reported significant water intrusion into battery compartment. Over heating, water + control board right next to the battery packs. Sounds like a recipe for disaster. I was only considering the airflow implications. I hadn't even thought about the water aspect yet!... Looking at it now this is SUCH a terrible design choice!! Are there any actual engineers left working at Gotway/Begode after the Veteran exodus? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Arbolest Posted January 20, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted January 20, 2021 Instead of making a vent to the inside of the wheels, why not just increase the size of the exposed portion of the heatsink and add more fins? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hsiang Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 4 minutes ago, Arbolest said: Instead of making a vent to the inside of the wheels, why not just increase the size of the exposed portion of the heatsink and add more fins? that's just crazy talk LOL. This is literally what they did with the EX board. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbolest Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Hsiang said: that's just crazy talk LOL. This is literally what they did with the EX board. I had seen that board and laughed when I saw it. The idea of adding more fins inside a sealed compartment defeats the whole purpose and is honestly laughable. I'm talking about adding more fins on the backside of the heatsink (in the wheel cavity) so that they can actually be used to exchange heat with the external air and perform some useful cooling. Edited January 20, 2021 by Arbolest 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Arbolest Posted January 20, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted January 20, 2021 Something like this lol Extend this hole like so... And then increase the length of the fins to fill up that gap. That way you get WAY more cooling surface area and the heatsink gets WAY more effective. That way you don't even need to have a vent in the first place. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbolest Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 (edited) Ugh, I'm looking back through the teardown again and getting more and more angry. I mean, look at that last picture again... The heatsink has EIGHT MOSFETs sitting there with no fins behind them for cooling, and what's worse is that if the section that HAS fins fits the hole in the shell perfectly, then those 8 MOSFETs don't even have the bare back of the aluminum exposed to cooling air! They're going to cook inside the shell!!! And look at this! That corner of the board also has the main battery connection on it, so it has the highest concentration of current flow in the copper traces, meaning that the un-cooled section of the board is also the hottest section!!! @Hsiang, in the video that made the rounds a few days ago from when you opened up the shell of the Monster Pro... The one where the control board blew after someone jumped the wheel... wasn't this also the corner of the board with all the damage?... Edited January 21, 2021 by Arbolest picture spacing 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 24 minutes ago, Arbolest said: That corner of the board also has the main battery connection on it, so it has the highest concentration of current flow in the copper traces It is also the area that vaporised during @Marty Backe 's first Sherman overheat hill test. (I'll dig up a link if anyone wants) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuerte Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 I am assuming that someone has posted Speedy Feet's review already, but it was rough. He isn't going to carry it in his store. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post houseofjob Posted January 20, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted January 20, 2021 1 hour ago, Arbolest said: That way you get WAY more cooling surface area and the heatsink gets WAY more effective. That way you don't even need to have a vent in the first place. LOL, or go the Z10 route, make the WHOLE underbelly a Giant heatsink. Might as well, this thing is damn heavy anyways. 1 hour ago, Arbolest said: The heatsink has EIGHT MOSFETs sitting there with no fins behind them for cooling, and what's worse is that if the section that HAS fins fits the hole in the shell perfectly, then those 8 MOSFETs don't even have the bare back of the aluminum exposed to cooling air! They're going to cook inside the shell!!! LOL, you're gonna get even angrier if you think how they're probably still using silicon pads, instead of something like mica + thermal paste application, which @Phil McLaughlin proved a bit back is waaaay more efficient at transmitting heat from the MOSFETs to the heatsink metal, adding an even bigger heat escape bottleneck at the beginning of the chain, compounded by the ever shrinking surface area of the board heatsink. 1 hour ago, Arbolest said: That corner of the board also has the main battery connection on it, so it has the highest concentration of current flow in the copper traces, meaning that the un-cooled section of the board is also the hottest section!!! Yup. Vet, V11, heck even the older Z10 all have dual XT connects coming off the board to halve and spread out the power load, no reason Gotway shouldn't have this too, especially with the even higher motor powers. 1 hour ago, Arbolest said: Ugh, I'm looking back through the teardown again and getting more and more angry. I mean, look at that last picture again... Money talks, vote with your wallets, as I sure am (not touching any of these new Gotway hollow bores any time soon, esp. in this state). With stuff like Vet in the market, as well as the other companies starting to step up their games, I dunno why riders still think Gotway new wheels are an automatic viable buy based on old buyer confidence and reputation; it's always still model-to-model for me, for any EUC company, especially if they're recycling and band-aid modding old paradigms like this faux-MSuperV3 one Gotway has been kicking the can down the hill for the past 4+ years now. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taras Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 ED's preparing Monster Pro to first ride 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DjPanJan Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Im shocked what last begode power euc releases is. I try explain my "dilema". I own MSP 2500W "classic" this euc look like last troublefree euc gotway/begode produced(in POWER euc category i mean) . Because i overlean my MSP torque (Yes i am that stupid and its possible) i think about new euc with better speed/safety margin. Because holow motor bearingsgate ,not have simple solution good/quality/branded bearings pair cost +-350 Eur/dollar. I say ok then i give 400 eur to seller sad but i can live with this. But WEATHERproofing and i not speak about WATERproofing is realy terible for places where i live and ride with new Begode released EUCs. Begode EX sadly i no feel they use 3500w potential of raw power and suspension solution not look timeproof for heavy rider in places where i ride i expect wery fast wear and tear moving parts. I can go over all "begode features" if EX can rocket me to moon in hard lean. Is crazy how powerfull is just classic msp torque and low speed aceleration 2500w can achieve with 3500w potential is almost unlimited sadly most reviewers and people say EX heavy feel and relatively slugish :-( Adam (Wrongway chanel) climb 40 degree incline with EX no dip problem is maybee in firmware is realy hard get full power from EX maybee efortless aceleration can make miracles well time show. RS T or S is not "ubgrade for me" if i own MSP overall from long perspective looks like both is downgrade. (both euc can climb 40 degree) MONSTER Pro only time show ho sucess or fail this euc be we need more test and reviews or experience. For me is monster family pure cruisers. Is not my category 100 people 100 tastes. Logicaly all this point to Veteran Sherman what is good product what come out in good tested release state. Except rim troubles. FW (dip). Batery disbalance. My troubles with sherman is my weight. Adam (wrongway) tested and 30 degree is max for veteran if more incline incline dip power is very close to nikola 100V. Its just speed cruser motor focused/tuned and FW is tuned for speed and i respect that fully this many riders love and i understand this. I test veteran myself (first batch) and is noticeable compared to MSP T. This is logical i no say is bad is like compare apples and bananas. Dont forget i overlean MSP i am woried i can overlean Sherman too. BEGODE EX.N is my last hope please Begode not ruin my hopes and dreams again! I realy want belive something magical happen and this can be my new "love". My brain say man you be sad but my hearth want belive. About quality "old" Gotway i can give my only crash test what i experienced. MSP clasic survived 54+ km/h crash and rolling over 20m (with euc guard and "generic" cinese padas" + front 3d printed bumper and 3d printed mudguard). MSP ride no wobles no serious problems (troley is harder to release and scratch logicaly around corners coused by rolling) Spoiler 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flying W Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 @DjPanJan I was going to try to get your wheel, but wanted eWheels support and got the RS HT instead because there wasn't anymore MSPs. I love the climbing ability, but the bearings will be in the back of mind all the time. I might be changing jobs so I can wheel to work again, but it's a 23 mile round trip 5days a week. That's almost 6k miles a year. I know I won't ride everyday to work but I'd bet instill put 4k miles a year on the EUC. I know the old bearing setup will do this in problem, I have a 16s and an mcm5 both are almost at 4k miles and have not had any issues that weren't my fault. If I take the new position we should know about the RS's bearing life pretty quick. I have 300 miles on it right now with about 200 of them off road and no issues. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Taras Posted January 21, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted January 21, 2021 6 hours ago, DjPanJan said: BEGODE EX.N is my last hope EX.N is just a RS HS w/ bigger battery. It's the same MSP HS c30 HB motor. Your hope totally ruined. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planemo Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 9 hours ago, DjPanJan said: Dont forget i overlean MSP i am woried i can overlean Sherman too. Wowsers. That's some slide. And if anyone says 'I don't need a helmet, I have never hit my head when I've fallen', I shall point them towards your video 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EMA Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 11 hours ago, DjPanJan said: I can go over all "begode features" if EX can rocket me to moon in hard lean. i didn't understant what you are searching for but i can tell you that EX motor is really similar to torque msp, the wheel feels less zippy in the 0-25kmh range, above 25-30 accelerate a bit faster. motor is smoother and it has the same godlike climbing ability at any speed, the suspension makes the wheel faster when facing imperfection and bumps, specially at speed 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hsiang Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 22 hours ago, Arbolest said: @Hsiang, in the video that made the rounds a few days ago from when you opened up the shell of the Monster Pro... The one where the control board blew after someone jumped the wheel... wasn't this also the corner of the board with all the damage?... Yes, that corner completed melted and the wire came right off. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbolest Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 hour ago, Hsiang said: Yes, that corner completed melted and the wire came right off. Welp... Now we most likely know why. The buildup of heat in that corner of the board probably reached the point where the solder joint on one of the main battery wires lost integrity. I bet it came loose (maybe from the impact when the wheel landed after the jump) and shorted through one of the nearby components. Either that, or the surge in current was just too much for a chronically overheated MOSFET to handle and it went off like a small grenade in that corner of the case. Either way, I hope Gotway/Begode redesign this particular version of their control board and come up with something more electrically and thermally stable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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