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Zulix

First-timer - advise on choosing a a wheel

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Hi, I'm Zulix.

I recently became aware of EUCs after falling down a YouTube rabbit-hole doing research on the OneWheel.  I say "become aware" when I should say "become obsessed."  For months, I've been watching every YouTube vid I can find, reading articles, and I've just found this forum, which seems like it will be a great resource as well.  EUCs seem just better in every way to the OneWheel, except maybe in the initial learning curve learning to ride.  I've decided I'm going to get one.  But at their prices, it's a significant chunk of change for me, so I'm agonizing over getting the right wheel.  

I live in Springfield, Missouri.  There is no EUC community here.  There's not really any PEV's at all in my town.  I think I found an article in my local paper from about a year back about a lady who rides one here, but I've never seen her.  There's one older lady in my neighborhood that rides a hoverboard occasionally to the nearby gas station, but I've never really spoken to her, as she gives off a super-methy aura.  So I've never seen an EUC in person, and sadly have no way to try one to see if I'm going to like it before pulling the trigger on one myself.

So, given that I'll be taking a chance I won't actually enjoy it once I get one, I figure it's best to start small and not go for the top-of-the-line models right away - Limit my loss if I end up not being as into it as it feels like I will be.  I'm 6'0" and weigh about 220lbs.  I fluctuate, but 220lbs is about where I cap out, and I figure it's best to budget for the worst-case.  Most of the less-expensive starter wheels (KS 14D, Inmotion V8) either cannot support my weight, or I'm on the very top end of what they can handle, leaving not enough wiggle room for safety gear and carrying stuff with me (I intend to commute to work and run errands with my wheel, so I wanna leave room in the weight-budget for me to carry maybe 30-40lbs of stuff).  So the lower-end is out, just `cuz I'm a larger guy.  Probably best, because I'd like a wheel with room to grow into if I like the hobby before I have to buy another one.

So I'm mostly eyeing the mid-range wheels, the Inmotion V10F, The King Song 16s, and the Gotway Tesla.  All more than I'd like to spend on an experiment I don't know if I'll love or not, but better than plunking down $2000, then not liking it.  If I like it as much as it seems like I will, I might save up for one of the big fellas.

I've learned that KingSong throttles your speed with a whole half of your battery remaining, and I don't like the vocal warnings KS wheels give.  I'd rather beeps, or better yet, sounds I could set up myself.  And throttling at 50% seems way way too early.  I understand it's for safety reasons, but I'd rather the wheel stay at peak performance as long as it can.  The KS wheels all seem the strongest on paper, but those two items turn me off to the whole brand.  Inmotion, very few people talk about.  The community, at least on YouTube, seems to favor KingSong and Gotway.  So Gotway seems best to me. 

I'm leaning towards the Tesla v2.  It has the most weight support in its price range, decent range and speed, what looks like Gotway's only tolerable trolley handle.

What do you guys think?

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You've done your homework and only you can make the decision on how much to spend. It seems you've made a good choice for the price and capabilities you need. Have you looked at the used market?? Some are not open to buying used equipment due to the mystery factor. It is a personal choice.

It sounds as if you are not sure you will like riding EUC's, or at least leaving room for the possibility you may not take to it. You can sell if it does not work out and recover some of your money, maybe most of it.

In many ways we are in the same boat. We are on the larger side and that reduces our choices and options. Neither of us have access to anyone that we could talk to and maybe have them help us test the water. We live in areas where there are very few if anyone riding. But you've watched the videos and used your imagination. If you've done all that, it seems you are committed. And as you have read here and seen on the videos, it will take a big commitment to learn to ride. The reward is a lot of good clean fun.

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2 hours ago, Scottie said:

It sounds as if you are not sure you will like riding EUC's, or at least leaving room for the possibility you may not take to it.

I think the chances I won't like it are slim to none, really. It looks so fun. But since I've no way to try one, I have to admit it's possible.

 

3 hours ago, Scottie said:

Have you looked at the used market?? Some are not open to buying used equipment due to the mystery factor

I'm not opposed to it at all, especially for my first wheel, but I couldn't find anything on Craigslist anywhere near my area, and didn't see any posts on this forums selling section near me. I don't think Missouri has really discovered these yet.

Maybe I'll start something

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36 minutes ago, Zulix said:

Maybe I'll start something

I hear that! Once the others see you having fun, who knows. Do you have any friends that might want to risk EUC addiction?

The guys I know are on the older side and are very conservative. I'm sure a few of them would have jumped at it in their youth though. So for me, it is hard to recruit riding buddies. But I was lucky enough to meet up with another older crazy guy like me. I never saw the young cat again, that whizzed by me on a larger EUC while I was bike riding. As far as I can tell, it is just the two of us around here.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Zulix said:

I think the chances I won't like it are slim to none, really. It looks so fun. But since I've no way to try one, I have to admit it's possible.

It is possible, at least @Jason McNeil has mentioned that he has had one return in the past, where the buyer told him that he just couldn't learn it, after a long time of trying. But, I'd claim that vast majority of people who stick with it will learn it eventually, and enjoy it (although to be fair, those who don't likely won't come to the forums to tell that, but still I'd say pretty much any person in the world capable of riding a bicycle will learn it if they really want to). The initial learning before things "click" varies wildly, from days to months before being ready to ride in the "general public", of course the only judge of that is the rider him/herself, as there's no license or such required anywhere as far as I know. Just getting going without any support might take a while (I didn't have anything to lean on when starting on the street, don't know if that made things quicker or not... I had to jump on and off the wheel for a good 30 minutes or so, sweating like a pig, before I could get even my first couple of feet with both of my feet on the pedals...). Some people with "manual" unicycle -experience might pick it up in minutes. ;)  Apart from the learning curve, I find it highly unlikely someone who does all the "work" of learning about the wheels themselves before getting one wouldn't like it. Who'd even spend all that time trying to learn (+ money to buy) and then realize it's not something they actually wanted? But, I guess (I don't remember anymore, and was "lucky" to learn fairly quick) the learning curve in the beginning can be depressing if you feel you're not progressing (but even that's likely temporary, a week later from feeling like you're not "getting" it or progressing, you' could be riding without issue).

There's a huge amount of information, tutorials, reviews, general chatter, moral support etc. etc. in these forums, so much that I've actually more or less given up trying to stay on top of things a few years back... :rolleyes:  Look around, you'll learn things the videos never show or tell you  :P  And most of all, welcome to the forums and enjoy, it's going to be heck of a ride  ;) 

 

Edited by esaj

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The best way to learn is with somebody else. Which is shall we say, difficult, to pull off right now.

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Quote

"become obsessed."  For months, I've been watching every YouTube vid I can find, reading articles,

This is as clear of a sign for a successful beginning as there can be. I think that only if the idea of riding the EUC would sound alien to you, would there be any real possibility for the hobby not to stick. But the Tesla is already a wheel one could well be happy with for months, even years. So it does sound like a good choice for you, although the general trend has lately been navigating towards wider 3.0” tires. Maybe also check for a 2nd hand Nikola at the forum, eBay etc?

Quote

I've learned that KingSong throttles your speed with a whole half of your battery remaining, and I don't like the vocal warnings KS wheels give.

The warnings on KS can be changed to play beeps only. And the throttling threshold varies for each model. The older 2000W 18XL only throttles at 25, or was it 30%.

Quote

The KS wheels all seem the strongest on paper

The power ratings must be taken with a huge grain of salt, for every manufacturer. Announcing the inherently varying amount of power with just a single number is just not precise enough. So a 2200W wheel is not at all necessarily more powerful than a 2000W wheel.

 Welcome to the funnest hobby there is!

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Posted (edited)
21 minutes ago, mrelwood said:

The power ratings must be taken with a huge grain of salt, for every manufacturer. Announcing the inherently varying amount of power with just a single number is just not precise enough. So a 2200W wheel is not at all necessarily more powerful than a 2000W wheel.

Don't know for sure, but I think the nominal numbers are more like "this is the average power the motor manufacturer has calculated that the motor should withstand in normal conditions constantly (like infinitely) without burning", and even then they're of course highly likely rounded. I'd imagine a western manufacturer would downplay the numbers and use conservative values so that customers couldn't claim warranty for cases where the motor was burned by overpowering it constantly, but for other (read: Chinese) manufacturers, it might be "better" to overestimate it.

Nevertheless, the peak powers during extreme situations can be multiples of these, whereas riding on a flat surface at a steady speed requires very little power (a few hundred watts, or roll down even slightly declining road, and you could see close to 0W, or slightly negative power when the motor is actually braking a little to keep you balanced). Most of the time you aren't really using that much power. More likely the batteries will be the limiting factor, rather than whether the motor can take it. I'd assume it'd take a good while before the motor actually got damaged (read: overheat, melt the lacquering around the coils and short circuit it, at least I can't think of another way to destroy this kind of motor with plain current, not voltage) through overpowering, people have done long hill climbing tests and such, and if something blows, it's usually the mainboard MOSFETs, long before the motor. Or overleaning and ending up on their face, but with the amount of power the current wheels have, I'd think you'd really have to try that on purpose and hard, and going fast enough to overcome the battery voltage is a whole another issue (who's crazy enough to try that with these speeds)...

The difference between 2000 and 2200W, in my opinion, is just marketing ;) 

Edited by esaj
Whoops, "break" vs "brake" ;)

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13 minutes ago, esaj said:

The difference between 2000 and 2200W, in my opinion, is just marketing ;) 

I view this more as different construction or focus, not as much as 10% extra power.

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Hi Zulix, I'm like you. I turned 60 and got infected by the EUC bug, I have my eye on a Gotway MSX pro.

Patiently waiting for it to become available, meanwhile watching all the tutorials I could get my hands on

you tube. I have been shopping for protective stuff too, getting ready for the big day! Reading all the good advice on

this forum.

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1 hour ago, mrelwood said:

 

This is as clear of a sign for a successful beginning as there can be. I think that only if the idea of riding the EUC would sound alien to you, would there be any real possibility for the hobby not to stick.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure I'll enjoy it, which is why I'm willing to take the plunge. I probably should get one of the higher end wheels right off, but I figure I'll want a second eventually, for teaching and to shake things up, so might as well bang up my eventual backup learning, and get the good one once I know I can handle it.

 

1 hour ago, mrelwood said:

The warnings on KS can be changed to play beeps only. And the throttling threshold varies for each model. The older 2000W 18XL only throttles at 25, or was it 30%.

See, 25 or 30 is not bad at all. They have to have some kind of measures in place to keep you from riding them to zero and injuring yourself. I thought they were all throttled at 50% just by rote, and that seemed silly. Maybe I will consider a kingsong then. 

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Posted (edited)

Mine throttles from 30mph to 26mph(maybe 27idr) at around 25% battery. I am on an 'outdated' ks18L tho. I study my telemetry after rides and I dont ever manage to get warnings until I'm at 5% battery or lower. I think it varies by wheel, but most all of these bigger wheels are plenty enough to learn on and enjoy for many many miles. I usually just travel a highway and maintain 20-30mph for the trip. I went to town today and it's definitely a different set of requirements. IN town, the power of an 18L is way more than enough. On highways its enough power but not enough speed. On mountainous roads, Im finding I lose traction going up hills, before I run out of power.  Basically, even the now dated and underspec'd 18L is a VERY viable form of euc travel. I dont think youll find the newer euc's lacking, as the specs Im pretty happy with, are now mediocre. Buy once, cry once....get the disease and start collecting. It seems stupid, but a good trolley is amazing. Before I got an euc, i had no idea how akward to carry, they ALL are.

Edited by ShanesPlanet

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On 5/21/2020 at 5:14 AM, Zulix said:


So, given that I'll be taking a chance I won't actually enjoy it once I get one, I figure it's best to start small and not go for the top-of-the-line models right away - Limit my loss if I end up not being as into it as it feels like I will be.  I'm 6'0" and weigh about 220lbs. 

I'm 220lb too. 18XL pulls me to pretty steep hills. And app shows that it only used 1600 watts of peak power. I have no concerns of 18XL pulling me up. I also had no overheating issues so far. 

On 5/21/2020 at 5:14 AM, Zulix said:


I've learned that KingSong throttles your speed with a whole half of your battery remaining, and I don't like the vocal warnings KS wheels give.  I'd rather beeps, or better yet, sounds I could set up myself.  And throttling at 50% seems way way too early.

User Manual said it throttles at 30%  First of all I WANT it to throttle. because safety depends on power headroom.  With lower battery charge you have less of it, and with 220lb weight it might be an issue.  Second of all i try to never bring battery below 40% because, besides lower power headroom you also decrease battery life that way. luckily 18XL has no issues with battery capacity.   Voice alerts can be disabled in the app and then it just beeps.

On 5/21/2020 at 5:14 AM, Zulix said:

  I understand it's for safety reasons, but I'd rather the wheel stay at peak performance as long as it can. 

I'd never want to reach peak performance of my wheel. Reaching peak means you don't have extra power left for keeping balance. Its not like car when you cant accelerate anymore, when you reach peak on the wheel the next step is falling face down on concrete. Some people even disable tiltback on MSX, that is just crossing line to craze IMO.

On 5/21/2020 at 5:14 AM, Zulix said:

The KS wheels all seem the strongest on paper, but those two items turn me off to the whole brand.  Inmotion, very few people talk about.  The community, at least on YouTube, seems to favor KingSong and Gotway.  So Gotway seems best to me. 

My impression is that gotway is focused on giving you max performance no matter what, giving you the most speed possible.  Not everybody cares about max speed (diminishing return, you get used to fast speed very fast). I certainly don't. I want to get the most fun with least broken bones. It does not mean i would not get MSX, bigger wheel is good, i certainly woul love  to try it at least! But ergonomics of carrying it on a bus was questionable for me and i had no wheel available to try to use it that way. 18Xl, while being still quite heavy, is still small enough to take it on a bus and in the office and it is big enough to carry my 220lb uphill and far away with no significant battery drain. It is reasonably slim, and carrying suite case handle is pretty nice  and ewheels.com sells it with free neoprene cover.

On 5/21/2020 at 5:14 AM, Zulix said:

 



I'm leaning towards the Tesla v2.  It has the most weight support in its price range, decent range and speed, what looks like Gotway's only tolerable trolley handle.

What do you guys think?

 

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Posted (edited)
23 hours ago, Alj said:

 Not everybody cares about max speed (diminishing return, you get used to fast speed very fast). I certainly don't. I want to get the most fun with least broken bones.

 

My concern with speed is only based on what I've been able to find about the laws in Missouri for euc's. They're not mentioned at all, so I'm assuming they are policed in the same category as electric scooters, which aren't allowed on sidewalks here, and only allowed on roads where they can reach the speed limit. Even little residential roads have a 30mph speed limit in my town, so I need a wheel that can reach 30 or else I really can't ride it anywhere. I'm not a speed demon, and would probably ride much slower than that if there were no cops around, but I'd need it to have three capability to hit 30 if I wanted to be legal. As for the 18xl, it's definitely one I'm eyeing for later on, but I can only afford around 1500 right now, so the Tesla seems like the right fit for me for starters. 

 

Course, today was the day I was going to go ahead and pull that trigger, and today's the day ewheels ran out of Teslas, so I have to wait til they restock anyways

Edited by Zulix

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Oh man !!!!   I just got hooked on MiniPro's  ,  been playing with my sons Swagtron hoverboard for like a year now and I'm way to big for it.  but I really loved the experience.  So I picked up a MiniPro 2 wheel and really liked it,   bought 2 more refurbs that came with the larger battery.  Got thrown off randomly from the 1st used one I got that had the smaller battery.  I am over the weight limit at 250 pounds, 6' 2"   (Fat American  eek..)   But this is soo much fun.   but I can quickly feel the limitations of this Ninebot minipro  and as a mechanical design engineer  I am savvy to electric motor systems etc and fully get the limitations with my minipro's.

anyway,   I'm 41, not in shape since I drive a mouse all day.   Is it really possible for someone like me to get into one of these EUC's ?  I admit this is the first day I have spent reading about it and I do plan on reading a lot here.

am I going to break myself learning to ride these ?   I am Savvy with power sports and ride a Honda CRF450 on trails etc.

I do plan on Helmet and pads etc.   I'll do my own research on the machine I should get.  I just basically want a good feeling that I should go ahead and pursue this cool hobby.

Thanks,

Dave

 

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1 hour ago, David Cook said:

Oh man !!!!   I just got hooked on MiniPro's  ,  been playing with my sons Swagtron hoverboard for like a year now and I'm way to big for it.  but I really loved the experience.  So I picked up a MiniPro 2 wheel and really liked it,   bought 2 more refurbs that came with the larger battery.  Got thrown off randomly from the 1st used one I got that had the smaller battery.  I am over the weight limit at 250 pounds, 6' 2"   (Fat American  eek..)   But this is soo much fun.   but I can quickly feel the limitations of this Ninebot minipro  and as a mechanical design engineer  I am savvy to electric motor systems etc and fully get the limitations with my minipro's.

I'm 220lb and i'm totally fine on 18xl. More weight means you just have to take not so steep hills and maybe not jump as much as others. But i cant see why you would not do it because the motor in those things is really powerful.

1 hour ago, David Cook said:

anyway,   I'm 41, not in shape since I drive a mouse all day.   Is it really possible for someone like me to get into one of these EUC's ?  I admit this is the first day I have spent reading about it and I do plan on reading a lot here.

am I going to break myself learning to ride these ?   I am Savvy with power sports and ride a Honda CRF450 on trails etc

I was learning to ride on a soccer field with sythetic grass. I think i fell hard only 1 time and on the field there were no bruises to me and no scratches to my wheel.  It was very scary at first and i did not know how am i going to ride on the pavement but It happened, i got confidence and now I ride it like a bicycle. Wearing protection gear of course (wrists, elbow, knee, helmet) and being alert all the time.  I'm older than you but i have a feeling of a kid who suddenly got a moped for present. I rode 15 miles today on some bicycle trails just for fun with no particular purpose.

1 hour ago, David Cook said:

.

I do plan on Helmet and pads etc.   I'll do my own research on the machine I should get.  I just basically want a good feeling that I should go ahead and pursue this cool hobby.

Thanks,

Dave

 

Pick more torque and bigger battery (more power means more safety, not opposite). I dont have experience with many other wheels but 18XL will be good enough for you based on my limited experience.

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2 hours ago, David Cook said:

Oh man !!!!   I just got hooked on MiniPro's  ,  been playing with my sons Swagtron hoverboard for like a year now and I'm way to big for it.  but I really loved the experience.  So I picked up a MiniPro 2 wheel and really liked it,   bought 2 more refurbs that came with the larger battery.  Got thrown off randomly from the 1st used one I got that had the smaller battery.  I am over the weight limit at 250 pounds, 6' 2"   (Fat American  eek..)   But this is soo much fun.   but I can quickly feel the limitations of this Ninebot minipro  and as a mechanical design engineer  I am savvy to electric motor systems etc and fully get the limitations with my minipro's.

anyway,   I'm 41, not in shape since I drive a mouse all day.   Is it really possible for someone like me to get into one of these EUC's ?  I admit this is the first day I have spent reading about it and I do plan on reading a lot here.

am I going to break myself learning to ride these ?   I am Savvy with power sports and ride a Honda CRF450 on trails etc.

I do plan on Helmet and pads etc.   I'll do my own research on the machine I should get.  I just basically want a good feeling that I should go ahead and pursue this cool hobby.

Thanks,

Dave

 

If you ride a honda crf450 on trails, you can handle the euc. OBVIOUSLY you arent scared to assume a measurable amount of risk. Obviously the thought of getting roughed up a bit, doesnt make you freeze. The euc is a totally different thing to learn than ANYTHING I've ridden (aside from a unicycle), but it's much more forgiving than other action sports. Think skateboard type incidents at worst in the beginning. An euc is nice in that its fairly low in overall strength requirements. If you are in meager physical condition, you just dont ride it for too long. This is assuming your knees and ankles work at least. I ride an 18L as my first. I followed the same story as most: almost bought a OW, saw the nosedive dillema. stumbled across the euc. Watched videos and decided 'i am definitely going to learn that!'. I found a used 18L with low miles on ebay and got lucky. After some upgrades and a required neoprene cover, I quickly got the disease. It is challenging but VERY rewarding. I mean shit, we ARE rolling around on one wheel like the jetsons! I'm glad I didnt buy a REALLY expensive wheel to start, as it still gets its ass kicked a little. But I am VERY glad I didnt get a smaller model. I like the refinement and understand the safety limitations that KS put into their wheels. As a newbie, I felt I needed someone to protect me from myself. As I get more comfortable, the need for a company to protect me from myself, is increasing.

Any of the larger reputable euc's out now, are NOT toys. I dont think you could go wrong, but perhaps trying to find one that can survive the potential beating during the learning curve, would be good idea. There is no 'end game' wheel. Like the rest of us, you will quickly want more wheels and flavors. I wouldnt shoot for the moon and buy a wheel, assuming you'll ride it exclusively forever. For a first wheel, perhaps invest in a proven and reliable wheel of size, try to save a few $$ and plan on keeping it as a spare, when you buy the latest and greatest as a supplement. :)

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Hi, how are you?

I think that when you strat choosing a EUC, you should look at 3 criterias :
1. For what you want to use it

2. Your weight

3. How much money you want to spend

:)

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2 minutes ago, EUC.SALE said:

Hi, how are you?

I think that when you strat choosing a EUC, you should look at 3 criterias :
1. For what you want to use it

2. Your weight

3. How much money you want to spend

:)

That is put simple. But to give more guidance on this, have a look at this video. Now wheel might apply different to the suggestions but the questions are pretty good to have in mind still. And how you rank these will help you to pick options. 

 

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1 minute ago, Unventor said:

That is put simple. But to give more guidance on this, have a look at this video. Now wheel might apply different to the suggestions but the questions are pretty good to have in mind still. And how you rank these will help you to pick options. 

 

Oh..

Thank you very much!
That helped me really well :)

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My timing is so bad.  Chompin' at the bit for the Teslas to restock on ewheels.  Hoping it'll be soon, pretty excited

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Well, it arrived. First night trying to figure it out has not been encouraging. Feel like I made zero progress. But I am determined

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On 6/4/2020 at 5:16 AM, EUC.SALE said:

Hi, how are you?

I think that when you strat choosing a EUC, you should look at 3 criterias :
1. For what you want to use it

2. Your weight

3. How much money you want to spend

:)

I dont think that weight is much a consideration on modern powered wheels. Unless you are going to try and buy the smallest thing out there and weigh like a moose, its not really THAT big a deal. Coupled with the fact that as a 'first' wheel, it probably won't see skate parks and tough conditions much. Even the tiny 10"mten is being ridden by 200lb adults.  

 

As for you @Zulix, youll get it, just be patient and dont rush so much that you stay too sore or tired. I'd imagine that in less than 2 weeks or 6 hours of trying, youll start to see a light at the end of the tunnel...

Edited by ShanesPlanet

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2 hours ago, ShanesPlanet said:

As for you @Zulix, youll get it, just be patient and dont rush so much that you stay too sore or tired. I'd imagine that in less than 2 weeks or 6 hours of trying, youll start to see a light at the end of the tunnel...

Yes, what ShanesPlanet said. Learning to ride an EUC is for delayed gratification freaks. But once you do get some gratification ... it is magical! And well worth all the work and frustration.

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