To nitrogen, or not to nitrogen?

[Will R]

Has anybody ever tried filling a wheel with nitrogen? I saw an escooter on Reddit showing off it's little green dust cap and it got me thinking. N is supposed to be slightly bouncier and be more efficient on battery use due to having less mass spinning around the axle amplified by centrifugal force.

 

I thought not only could this be good for saving our precious rims from dents, but also may noticeably reduce the gyro effect. In a 2.5" wheel like the 18XL that would mean much more agility at high speeds, especially over differently banking terrain. This is why I cannot personally get to grips with slime in tyres 16", as it ruins my high speed control.

In a 3" wheel like an MSX, this may mean much better battery life as you could inflate to a higher PSI due to the additional bounciness and have less rolling resistance, also may mean a few more mph in top speed due to the decreased centrifugal mass. What do you think? 

[Tinkererboi]

I'd say just do it and find out! No harm trying. 

Also not a fan of tubeless fluid. It's something more of an emergency quick fix to me rather than a long-term solution.

Will be eagerly watching your thread to see what the official results are 👀

[.....]

I think you are wasting your time. I also think your expectations are amazingly high. Nitrogen simply doesnt leak out of a tire so quickly. Nitrogen stays about the same pressure even as tire temperature increases. Neither of this is much benefit to a unicycle. I guess NOT having to add air to a tire for longer, could help, but not worth it. As to the rest of the claims, I wouldnt trust the validity of them at all. Less mass? cmon man, its a gas...thats a far stretch. More bouncey? Just buy a green cap, pretend its nitro in the tube, and it'll work like magic. Ive beachfront property in arizona for sale! Fwiw, I worked in auto industry as a tech for years. Nitrogen was common in race cars and Rv's. Its also mitigated as soon as you contaminate it with ANY regular air.  Benefit to nitrogen is : less loss over a greater amount of time (so what, we add a little air after a few month). The expansion (lack of) properties of nitrogen will not be noticed as we dont do high speeds under loads that increase tire temps much. With such little volume in our tires, you better not check your pressure w/o a nitro tank around.  Why not use helium and make the wheel lighter?

Edited May 15, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[RockyTop]

14 minutes ago, ShanesPlanet said:

Ive beachfront property in arizona for sale! 

Last time I bought beach front property I paid too much!! What’s your price? Don’t high ball me.   ... I’ll walk. 
 

To add to the subject CO2 seems to leak faster.

I wonder how Hydrogen would do. I bet it could add a little drama to a puncture. ..... 

Goodness Gracious Great Baaall of fire!! 

It Would be the Gas.. Gas..Gas.. ( and batteries) 

It could really make your wheel pop.

People would notice you.

It could raise your standing. 

You would be ..... “The Bomb!! “ 

I’m done. 

I came in like a flaming wrecking ball!! 

[Will R]

Nitrous oxide could be a laugh.

[DjPanJan]

simply you can use nitrogen without slime.

If you use slime or something like that no bonus if you use nitrogen.

78% air is nitrogen naturaly 21 oxygen 1% others.

Thats all is just that simple.

Nitrogen = no slime for little efect

Bacuase slime and others sealants include some form of water what negate all nitrogen advantages.

Just for euc use normal "AIR" is cheaper more practise and often control you PSI and inflate if need.  

 

[.....]

On 5/20/2020 at 2:29 PM, DjPanJan said:

simply you can use nitrogen without slime.

If you use slime or something like that no bonus if you use nitrogen.

78% air is nitrogen naturaly 21 oxygen 1% others.

Thats all is just that simple.

Nitrogen = no slime for little efect

Bacuase slime and others sealants include some form of water what negate all nitrogen advantages.

Just for euc use normal "AIR" is cheaper more practise and often control you PSI and inflate if need.  

 

excellent point, I totally forgot about moisture and how it negates the nitrogen. Damn, I need to revisit some old information, as my brain is starting to use too much white-out pen. Or is it I'm sniffing too much of it? Hell, I forget now...

[ir_fuel]

In theory if you never deflate your tire and only add air the ratio oxygen/nitrogen will decrease anyway because the oxygen escapes more easily.

I don't think it's worth it.

[Boogieman]

To me, its a waste of money. The advantages of nitrogen vs air are nice on race cars where temps can vary insanely over a track (and thus make rubber too hot or cold in a less forsee able way), but for EUCs that doesn't even make rubber blobs fall of when pushing it in corners or when braking...nah not that usefull...also we run on bicycle rubber, not racing rubber. You would need a racing motor bike tyre and a really powerful ride to reach the temp limit of the rubber that makes it start shaving and get GRIPPY (racing tyres are the grippiest right before they start to melt of rubber blobs)

1. Nitrogen doesn't change pressure with temperature even closely as much as normal air does. = Pressure stays the same if outside temp change or you ride hard soft on asphalt or dirt track. 

2. It also doesnt age the rubber (close to nothing) compared to air that hss oxygen that age all materials.

 

Edited July 15, 2020 by Boogieman

[Planemo]

On 7/15/2020 at 1:20 PM, Boogieman said:

but for EUCs that doesn't even make rubber blobs fall of when pushing it in corners or when braking...

true, they dont melt but you can easily ripple them with hard carving so they are generating decent heat no question...

Edit: Pic removed - having a cull of my uploads to retrieve space.

 

Edited March 4, 2022 by Planemo

[Boogieman]

27 minutes ago, Planemo said:

true, they dont melt but you can easily ripple them with hard carving so they are generating decent heat no question...

All stress generates heat, but not that kind of heat + bicycle rubber is not the same as motor bike racing rubber. Take temp on the rubber a hot summer day. Start after allowing the sun and road to heat up the tyre in low pace. Then drive like crazy and measure again. It will be warmer and grip might increase a bit, but its not the same as the allmost on off feeling from race tyres as they reach proper temps.

While not a preferable scenario, this kind of (over)heat is easy to achieve on a motor bike or a car if pressure is a bit too low (even if just for a portion of the track, for example hard braking after a straight or a long fast curve...though hard braking on non slicks often give "ski hill" pattern instead which makes the tyres wine). Not very easy on a EUC, maybe the veteran will change that if someone goes racing at 75km/h but at 40-50 the energy isn't enough (in my experience, but we also never go past 30°C here).

Edited July 15, 2020 by Boogieman

[Boogieman]

Maybe i have to correct myself. I just went and checked my previous tyre that i rode fairly agressive on the edges...sure looks like tiny pieces of melted rubber  (Kenda 16*2.125 on a Tesla @ 3.5-ish Bar)

 

Edited July 15, 2020 by Boogieman

[Planemo]

2 hours ago, Boogieman said:

All stress generates heat, but not that kind of heat + bicycle rubber is not the same as motor bike racing rubber. Take temp on the rubber a hot summer day....

I am well aware having tracked bikes with slicks but cheers anyway. My post was somewhat tongue in cheek. Maybe I should have made that clear..

[.....]

3 hours ago, Boogieman said:

Looks like my tires after pushing interstate for 20 minutes on the bike(less the chicken strips anyhow). I'm still not sure that we are coming anywhere NEAR this amount of heat on a lowly euc. A person could always buy a green valve cap and pretend its nitrogen filled. If you tell yourself every night before bed "my euc is filled with nitrogen", you may wakeup and believe it. Once you believe it, youll immediately notice improvement.

Edited July 15, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[StuartL]

Pure nitrogen has an insignificant effect for normal road use, given that approx 3/4 of the air we fill our tyres with is already nitrogen.

There's a reasonable article on the subject here: https://www.lesschwab.com/article/are-nitrogen-filled-tires-worth-the-cost.html

Note that the claim that nitrogen is more temperature stable is largely bogus.  Any differences are so small as to be insignificant.  Tire pressure maintenance is critical for the quality of an EUC ride and filling with nitrogen doesn't take away the requirement to check your tyre pressures frequently, though it may increase the cost of doing so!