"Veteran" New brand of high performance EUC's

[TedTheAtheist]

On 4/27/2020 at 10:51 PM, onizukagto said:

won;t lie. As a design engineer, i like the look of this unit! 
But suspension is the new thing i look most forward to, more then speed or range. 

Well, i'm glad i held off looking for a pre-order. Can afford to wait and see. 

Yea, I kinda wanted it to have suspension. I mean, the extra 20 pounds from the battery kind of sucks.

[erk1024]

Green and Fashion page says: "This is a brand new brand. Created by the original GOTWAY technical backbone Lao diao and lin's cousin Ma yi. The program of the earliest classic style MCM4 was programmed by Lao diao, and the subsequent electric unicycles were upgraded with his motherboard pro"

So that's where they got the software / tech.

Random thoughts:

• 77 lbs is pretty heavy. The Monster V3 is already really heavy, and we're talking 17 more pounds.
• Max payload is listed at 120kg or 265 pounds. But with the motor numbers it should be able to handle more than that. 
• What's the tire size again? specs says 20" Or is this the 18 inch rim means 20" diameter?

[EUC Addict]

20 minutes ago, erk1024 said:

Green and Fashion page says: "This is a brand new brand. Created by the original GOTWAY technical backbone Lao diao and lin's cousin Ma yi. The program of the earliest classic style MCM4 was programmed by Lao diao, and the subsequent electric unicycles were upgraded with his motherboard pro"

So that's where they got the software / tech.

Random thoughts:

• 77 lbs is pretty heavy. The Monster V3 is already really heavy, and we're talking 17 more pounds.
• Max payload is listed at 120kg or 265 pounds. But with the motor numbers it should be able to handle more than that. 
• What's the tire size again? specs says 20" Or is this the 18 inch rim means 20" diameter?

24” tire on the Monster Pro. Veteran is 20”. 

[FreeRide]

3 hours ago, Neon EUC said:

Beat me to it. I just came across this post bit found out the other day the veteran is made up of ex gotway engineers starting up their own company. Bit scary when you think a lot of gotways have blown up this week. 5 failures so far and still counting 🙄

See Read post 1, the news is not about the Gotway engineers at this point.

[FreeRide]

Do we know yet if the Sherman will have upgradeable Firmware?  That is the last box that needs to be checked I think.

[Jean eRide.ie Community]

53 minutes ago, FreeRide said:

Do we know yet if the Sherman will have upgradeable Firmware?  That is the last box that needs to be checked I think.

[EUC Addict]

51 minutes ago, FreeRide said:

Do we know yet if the Sherman will have upgradeable Firmware?

That's a great question. I've asked them about this, but am waiting to hear back. Gotway doesn't do this so it will be interesting if they (Veteran) think its a good choice.

[EUC Addict]

It appears the question has already been answered.

[mrelwood]

3 hours ago, shwinston said:

24” tire on the Monster Pro. Veteran is 20”. 

Veteran has said to have a 18x3.0” tire, the CST C-186 2.75-14.

They do call it 20” because it’s a tall knobby tire and 20” closer represents the actual outer tire diameter. But a slightly larger outer diameter doesn’t make it a 20” tire, just like being 3” wide doesn’t make the MSX/S18/V11 tire a 19” one. Or the Nikola/16X a 17” one.

[erk1024]

FYI, the Veteran Sherman just showed up for pre-order on eWheels:

https://www.ewheels.com/product/new-veteran-sherman-18-100v-3200wh-battery-2500w-motor-1000-deposit/

 

Edited June 14, 2020 by erk1024

[onizukagto]

23 hours ago, DjPanJan said:

 

 

Wooaaah that second video! 

 

It shows the veteran riders going from Beijing to Mongolia. (translated by my missus) 

Took them 20hrs : 09mins, over a distance of 322.4 km! 

If that isn't an extreme endurance stress test, I dunno what is! 

Edited June 14, 2020 by onizukagto
miles to km. sorry. missus said km, but I still wrote it down as Miles, old habits, die hard. lol

[FlyboyEUC]

1 hour ago, onizukagto said:

Took them 20hrs : 09mins,

I believe that is the GPS predicted time. In real life it's probably half that. I usually cut Google's bike time estimate I'm half when I ride MSX.

[Ben Kim]

1 hour ago, onizukagto said:

Wooaaah that second video! 

 

It shows the veteran riders going from Beijing to Mongolia. (translated by my missus) 

Took them 20hrs : 09mins, over a distance of 322.4 miles! 

If that isn't an extreme endurance stress test, I dunno what is! 

2 full charge breaks at 10A @ 3 hours a piece at roughly 25-30 kmh (15-18 mph) this could be done. probably took 18 hours of riding plus 6 hours of charging, or perhaps spread out over 2 days.

Another option would be 2 charge breaks of 3 hours a piece and 6 hours on the road at 30 mph. This would cover 180 miles in a 12 hour span (or travel at 18 mph for 9 hours and one charge break of 3 hours)  

I’m totally down for such an adventure, any east coast USA future Sherman owners wanna go relive this?  

[FreeRide]

10 hours ago, Jean Dublin said:

Thanks!

So Sad. ☹️

[fryman]

Wow, that thing is 77 pounds. I would need a friend to get that in and out of my car.

[Esbu]

17 hours ago, mike_bike_kite said:

With the CPU's and GPU's in a computer you are just taking the heat from one major component and moving it from one end of the pipe to the other end. They are great in thin laptops where you need to move heat from the centre of the laptop to the edge of the laptop where the heat can escape. You still need a fan to get rid of that heat. It's also relatively easy to clamp the pipe to a single source of heat but many ECU motherboards have up to 12 mosfets all generating heat. I suspect it's easier, simpler and cheaper to just blow cold air over the board and vent the hot air out the back. 

There are photos in previous posts with duct intake behind front light and with two fans behind the duct. I can imagine aluminium radiator instead of air intake, connected via heatpipes with metal plate under the circuit board. Let radiator be exposed from shell where air intake is placed. When Shermen starts to move, there shuld ram cooling principle happen. But I never saw Sherman on my own, after I receive it, I can write something specific about.

Edited June 14, 2020 by ESBU

[mike_bike_kite]

 

18 minutes ago, ESBU said:

There are photos in previous posts with duct intake behind front light and with two fans behind the duct. I can imagine aluminium radiator instead of air intake, connected via heatpipes with metal plate under the circuit board. Let radiator be exposed from shell where air intake is placed. When Shermen starts to move, there shuld ram cooling principle happen. But I never saw Sherman on my own, after I receive it, I can write something specific about.

I can't see heat pipes ever working on an ECU. Heat pipes are great for laptops where you need to move a very limited amount of heat from a confined space to somewhere where you can vent it. You don't see heat pipes on desktop PC's because the space isn't limited and they produce more heat than the pipe can deal with. I use water cooling on my own PC because it's a more efficient way of removing the heat. Heat pipes are an expensive solution to a problem that doesn't exist on an ECU (how to remove heat from a very confined space).

Heat pipes also wouldn't be able to have a metal heat sink under the board because heat pipes work by evaporating a liquid. That gas goes up where it is cooled and then the liquid flows back down to the heat source. If the heat source is above the cooling plate then the liquid will never return. There's also the additional weight of the heat pipes to consider plus the weight of the radiator (a decent desktop PC radiator can weigh well over a Kg and they generate far less heat than our ECU's). Why pay extra for something that's unproven, will cost more, weighs more and is unlikely to work as well as a simple fan?

[Esbu]

2 minutes ago, mike_bike_kite said:

 

I can't see heat pipes ever working on an ECU. Heat pipes are great for laptops where you need to move a very limited amount of heat from a confined space to somewhere where you can vent it. You don't see heat pipes on desktop PC's because the space isn't limited and they produce more heat than the pipe can deal with. I use water cooling on my own PC because it's a more efficient way of removing the heat. Heat pipes are an expensive solution to a problem that doesn't exist on an ECU (how to remove heat from a very confined space).

Heat pipes also wouldn't be able to have a metal heat sink under the board because heat pipes work by evaporating a liquid. That gas goes up where it is cooled and then the liquid flows back down to the heat source. If the heat source is above the cooling plate then the liquid will never return. There's also the additional weight of the heat pipes to consider plus the weight of the radiator (a decent desktop PC radiator can weigh well over a Kg and they generate far less heat than our ECU's). Why pay extra for something that's unproven, will cost more, weighs more and is unlikely to work as well as a simple fan?

like this:

..of course alu radiator should be rotated 90° for better air flow

Edited June 14, 2020 by ESBU

[Esbu]

12 minutes ago, ESBU said:

problem that doesn't exist on an ECU (how to remove heat from a very confined space).

I think, this is the main problem on EUCs. If we want some level of waterproof, there should be no holes. If there is heat production in closed space, theres a need to move the heat outside, not let the heat cumulate inside shell.

11 minutes ago, ESBU said:

Heat pipes also wouldn't be able to have a metal heat sink under the board because heat pipes work by evaporating a liquid.

Heatpipes are connected into a metal plate. Their working principle has nothing to do with metal plate. They can be connected to board hot spots with kind a piece of metal plate.

Edited June 14, 2020 by ESBU

[mike_bike_kite]

In your diagram the heat sink for the EUC (with a 2500W motor) is smaller than the heat sink for the headlamp. It's also missing a fan. Your design also channels all the hot air up into the riders crotch which I suspect will be unpopular. I understand that most of the waterproofing issues are either because the shells have large gaps which allow water to get onto the circuit board or their external switches aren't waterproof in the first place - it would seem simpler to fix these issues rather than make the whole unit air tight. I feel a bit like I'm beating my head against a brick wall here though - I suggest you simply build a prototype using any wheel and just see how it performs. You'll want to check the weight difference, cost and how well the system can remove heat. Obviously if the wheel cuts out due to excess heat then that will be just as bad as it cutting out due to rain.

[Esbu]

10 minutes ago, mike_bike_kite said:

In your diagram the heat sink for the EUC (with a 2500W motor) is smaller than the heat sink for the headlamp. It's also missing a fan. Your design also channels all the hot air up into the riders crotch which I suspect will be unpopular. I understand that most of the waterproofing issues are either because the shells have large gaps which allow water to get onto the circuit board or their external switches aren't waterproof in the first place - it would seem simpler to fix these issues rather than make the whole unit air tight. I feel a bit like I'm beating my head against a brick wall here though - I suggest you simply build a prototype using any wheel and just see how it performs. You'll want to check the weight difference, cost and how well the system can remove heat. Obviously if the wheel cuts out due to excess heat then that will be just as bad as it cutting out due to rain.

Better than diagram, this drawing is expression of my imagination. Not source for production.

In this case, crotch will know nothing about this heat - if EUC will be used for riding, not for standing on it by the wall.

Edited June 14, 2020 by ESBU

[Esbu]

49 minutes ago, ESBU said:

You don't see heat pipes on desktop PC's because the space isn't limited and they produce more heat than the pipe can deal with.

My friend, this is not true. Heatpipes are most efficient way how to cool CPU or GPU by air. I see computer cooling systems often, I work as IT technician

54 minutes ago, mike_bike_kite said:

I can't see heat pipes ever working on an ECU.

Let me say:

If you never saw this, or you can not imagine it, this does not mean its impossible.

[redsnapper]

There is a previous post on heat pipe cooling where the guy shows his implementation -  no idea how effective but he appears to have made provisions for water intrusion with the rubber seals. granted this implementation applies to this unit but as a proof of concept pretty cool!

 

[Esbu]

3 minutes ago, amelanso said:

There is a previous post on heat pipe cooling where the guy shows his implementation -  no idea how effective but he appears to have made provisions for water intrusion with the rubber seals. granted this implementation applies to this unit but as a proof of concept pretty cool!

 

I thought directly about this heatpipes, bur its cool idea. With kind of air intake, he exposed to air hot surface of inside pipe for better cooling.

For Sherman, where circuit board is under the top cover - this cover can be made from aluminum and absorb heat from hot air inside too.

[mike_bike_kite]

13 minutes ago, amelanso said:

There is a previous post on heat pipe cooling where the guy shows his implementation -  no idea how effective but he appears to have made provisions for water intrusion with the rubber seals. granted this implementation applies to this unit but as a proof of concept pretty cool!

Nice find but the copper pipe he's using is just an ordinary copper pipe that's just being used as an ordinary heat sink. A heat pipe is a sealed pipe that contains a liquid that changes from liquid to gas to move the heat from one location to another and this design is not doing this at all. 

27 minutes ago, ESBU said:

I see computer cooling systems often, I work as IT technician

I thought I explained fairly clearly why I thought your design wouldn't be effective. I suggest you answer those points before trying to pull rank.