"Veteran" New brand of high performance EUC's

[DjPanJan]

20 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

I just climbed a short curb at a "slight" angle and whacked one of the roll bars, denting it badly.

So I suspect their next revision of this wheel will address the front roll bar.

I'm glad my beliefs were confirmed, I noticed it for the first time on a video from the NY promo day.

Where they got stuck on the stairs then I saw a video from which I took a screenshot.

Maybe adjust the tubes to a rhombus to act as slides. As @Unventor wrote, when you put a road tire it will be even more common.

If it wasn't for Sherman I would have bought an MSP now I am thinking very strongly.  

[meepmeepmayer]

1 minute ago, DjPanJan said:

If it wasn't for Sherman I would have bought an MSP now I am thinking very strongly.  

I think a lot of people are in your position Hello @travsformation The MSP is as great as it ever was, but the Sherman blows it out of the water in so many ways. If only the bad 10% of the Sherman (its flaws) were not there... it would be no contest.

[Boogieman]

A few major things to fix for Sherman v2 to make it perfect. It is still AWESOME but to make all worries set to zero:

1. High temp capacitors (didnt fare well on over heat hill) and maybe even better cable insulation (or thicker cables) and non solid core hall sensor cables if I could make a wish.

2. Wider pedals (to fit big footed Europeans and Americans)

3. No rust or solder blobs in motor  (https://ecodrift.ru/2020/07/05/razbiraem-veteran-sherman-iz-pervoj-postavki-mnogo-udivitelnyh-otkrytij/ )

4. Better clearance for "roll cage" - preferably same height as pedals

5. Add fastening points for pedal hangers higher up by extending pedal hangers behind the trolley (to reduce stress on plastic chassis at a crash) as those GW mountin points around wheel axle isn't even enough for a comparingly light GW wheel

 

 

Edited July 13, 2020 by Boogieman

[FreeRide]

41 minutes ago, Boogieman said:

A few major things to fix for Sherman v2 to make it perfect. It is still AWESOME but to make all worries set to zero:

1. ..... non solid core hall sensor cables ....

.....

 

The motor cables seemed like solid wire or very stiff insulation, but I'm not sure about the Hall Sensor wires.  I would be surprised if that was the case, but maybe.

[onizukagto]

3 hours ago, Boogieman said:

 

 

I guess chooch will have to wait longer to get to test the veteran.... Haha  

[Marty Backe]

7 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said:

Dented where? The lower front corner?

Yes. It's been commented on before and now I can attest to this being a problem. And it's not a tiny dent. You can hear it happen in my overheat hill test. So that tubing isn't as strong as you might thing. Looks very easy to replace though.

[Marty Backe]

7 hours ago, DjPanJan said:

I'm glad my beliefs were confirmed, I noticed it for the first time on a video from the NY promo day.

Where they got stuck on the stairs then I saw a video from which I took a screenshot.

Maybe adjust the tubes to a rhombus to act as slides. As @Unventor wrote, when you put a road tire it will be even more common.

If it wasn't for Sherman I would have bought an MSP now I am thinking very strongly.  

I still love riding the Sherman and can't wait to have one in my stable

[Marty Backe]

2 hours ago, onizukagto said:

I guess chooch will have to wait longer to get to test the veteran.... Haha  

I don't think he's getting it for a long time. I'm getting two new control boards to try. Jason (EWheels) is determine to make the Sherman climb this hill.

[Marty Backe]

4 hours ago, FreeRide said:

The motor cables seemed like solid wire or very stiff insulation, but I'm not sure about the Hall Sensor wires.  I would be surprised if that was the case, but maybe.

Hall sensor wires are solid if I recall. Maybe @Rehab1 remembers if they are solid or stranded.

[MrRobot]

2 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

I don't think he's getting it for a long time. I'm getting two new control boards to try. Jason (EWheels) is determine to make the Sherman climb this hill.

Are they the same as the original?

 

Were you running the beta of darknessbot to get any temp/voltage data before it died?

 

I'm guessing this would only happen if putting high amounts of stress on the wheel with little to no external airflow coming in (that's probably why it has the giant hole cutout).  So unlikely this would happen in normal high speed riding...still a bit concerning though...

 

What do you guys think?  Anyone reconsidering?

Edited July 14, 2020 by MrRobot

[Marty Backe]

14 minutes ago, MrRobot said:

Are they the same as the original?

 

Were you running the beta of darknessbot to get any temp/voltage data before it died?

 

I'm guessing this would only happen if putting high amounts of stress on the wheel with little to no external airflow coming in (that's probably why it has the giant hole cutout).  So unlikely this would happen in normal high speed riding...still a bit concerning though...

New boards with new features. Getting the same board again would just mean it'll fail again.

[Chriull]

3 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

I don't think he's getting it for a long time. I'm getting two new control boards to try. Jason (EWheels) is determine to make the Sherman climb this hill.

You could sacrifice something like a wireless barbeque thermometers to monitor the capacitor temperature...

30 minutes ago, MrRobot said:

I'm guessing this would only happen if putting high amounts of stress on the wheel with little to no external airflow coming in (that's probably why it has the giant hole cutout).  So unlikely this would happen in normal high speed riding...still a bit concerning though...

Yes - low speed high burden situations are the worst a wheel has to take. Motor currents get huge and cause power dissipation by the square of their value...

[DjPanJan]

Dont forget Veteran Sherman not have/missing temperature monitoring in MOTOR/ENGINE. 

[mike_bike_kite]

@Marty Backemight it be worth taking a fire extinguisher on these stress tests? I could picture things going horribly wrong if the batteries caught fire in that dry landscape. Just a thought anyway. 

[travsformation]

15 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

I just climbed a short curb at a "slight" angle and whacked one of the roll bars, denting it badly.

6 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

Yes. It's been commented on before and now I can attest to this being a problem. And it's not a tiny dent. You can hear it happen in my overheat hill test. So that tubing isn't as strong as you might thing. Looks very easy to replace though.

 This is a big issue for me personally. Depending on how "slight" that angle is and how fast you're going, that could lead to some nasty falls... 

Worries me for rutted off-roading too, I really hope they address this

6 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

I'm getting two new control boards to try. Jason (EWheels) is determine to make the Sherman climb this hill.

Goooooo Jason! It's awesome that we have him lobbying on our behalf, keeping manufacturers in check and trying to get them up to Western design and safety standards (insomuch as possible) 

Edited July 14, 2020 by travsformation

[Jon Stern]

Here's a idea to prevent the roll bar from denting. Drill a small hole in the tube and inject in a low viscosity epoxy resin. Just enough to fill the bottom couple of inches. Let the epoxy cure with the wheel standing upright, then seal the hole.

[Ben Kim]

11 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

I don't think he's getting it for a long time. I'm getting two new control boards to try. Jason (EWheels) is determine to make the Sherman climb this hill.

Do us a favor, do a lift speed test, pedal test (soft/medium/hard) on both of these boards (if you get around to testing both) because I suspect there will be some changes in that regard. 

I also don't know why he's so determined to make that wheel climb the hill considering this motor is wound for top speed not torque.  One would think after so many years in the game he'd understand.  People bellyached for torque, then they get the MSPro.  People bitch about the top speed, then they get a speed version.  You have to give up something on one end to get something on the other.  I somehow doubt there is much that can be done given the characteristics of the motor (which is why I personally bought it).

Edited July 14, 2020 by Ben Kim

[HippoPig]

Just had a 20 min ride on the Sherman.

 

It’s an entirely different beast.

 

The reviews are right

[Ben Kim]

6 minutes ago, HippoPig said:

Just had a 20 min ride on the Sherman.

 

It’s an entirely different beast.

 

The reviews are right

And people are trying to change it based on a slope climb test that isn't applicable to people in the real world.  Those people can buy MSPro torque version.

[Antec]

26 minutes ago, Ben Kim said:

And people are trying to change it based on a slope climb test that isn't applicable to people in the real world.  Those people can buy MSPro torque version.

You wouldn't buy a car that was known to blow an engine part on certain angle Hill climbs would you? No matter if you would think you'd never use it for Hill climbing or not.

It would be a failure, until the the manufacturer fixes it.

There would be a world wide re call to get it resolved.

The same should happen with the sherman in my opinion.

Don't get me wrong the sherman is is a beast wheel with great potential but it's clearly an unfinished product that needed more time for testing and bug fixing,

Good luck to those who have the sherman. I'm waiting for their next wheel after you beta testers report bugs back to them

Edited July 14, 2020 by Antec

[Shield]

10 minutes ago, Antec said:

Good luck to those who have the sherman. I'm waiting for their next wheel after you beta testers report bugs back to them

The Veteran Mini or perhaps the Veteran Chaffee. 

[mike_bike_kite]

13 minutes ago, Antec said:

Its clearly an unfinished product that needed more time for testing and bug fixing

Marty's test is a stress test and it's interesting to know what the limits are. All wheels have their limits but fortunately most of us aren't trying to run our wheels up mountains under the hot desert sun so we'll never meet those limits.

[Antec]

6 minutes ago, mike_bike_kite said:

Marty's test is a stress test and it's interesting to know what the limits are. All wheels have their limits but fortunately most of us aren't trying to run our wheels up mountains under the hot desert sun so we'll never meet those limits.

The msx 84v passed over heat Hill. There is no reason for a super hyped beast sherman to fail it. Unless they were rushing out production without doing proper tests or cutting corners.

You'd think manufacturers would have their own R&D team and their own version of a stress test.

I'm not hating on the sherman, I was very close to buying one but my inner gut feeling and buying first gen products saved me some heart pain and/or buyers remorse.

I'm speaking as a normal average consumer who uses EUC for hobby and commute, I have no affiliation with anyone, I just want  good value for money 

Edited July 14, 2020 by Antec

[Ben Kim]

37 minutes ago, Antec said:

You wouldn't buy a car that was known to blow an engine part on certain angle Hill climbs would you? No matter if you would think you'd never use it for Hill climbing or not.

It would be a failure, until the the manufacturer fixes it.

There would be a world wide re call to get it resolved.

The same should happen with the sherman in my opinion.

Don't get me wrong the sherman is is a beast wheel with great potential but it's clearly an unfinished product that needed more time for testing and bug fixing,

Good luck to those who have the sherman. I'm waiting for their next wheel after you beta testers report bugs back to them

Just out of curiosity, do you understand how they managed to get the Sherman to have such a high top speed with the same voltage as an equivalent Gotway wheel? 

Once you know and research that question, you'll know why your automobile argument is invalid. 

(I wouldn't take a Ferrari off-roading where a Hummer would thrive).  

Veteran gave some of us exactly what we wanted.  Nothing would upset me more than a vendor changing things to appease one crowd to upset another.   That's why there are different wheels for different use cases.  You want to tackle overheat hill, go buy an MSpro.  You want efficient high speed on the street, the Sherman is your choice.  If Veteran wants to go the route of a torque and speed version, by all means.  Don't f*** up the wheel for those who want speed just to pass some asinine slope test.

I see the same thing happening on the V11 thread, ONE youtuber complains about pedal scraping so they make it have the highest pedal height to where it's laughable.  These companies need to stick to their guns; there is no such thing as a one-size-fits-all EUC.  

Edited July 14, 2020 by Ben Kim

[Antec]

1 minute ago, Ben Kim said:

Just out of curiosity, do you understand how they managed to get the Sherman to have such a high top speed with the same voltage as an equivalent Gotway wheel? 

Once you know and research that question, you'll know why your automobile argument is invalid. 

(I wouldn't take a Ferrari off-roading where a Hummer would thrive).  

No doubt the top speed is ground breaking but at this rate I wouldn't take a sherman offroad where a msp would thrive  

The sherman shouldnt of been released this early is what I'm trying to say, maybe for testing yes but the wheels are being sold to the public now.

Some will say the the units people are receiving are the final versions with  new revision boards, but I think Its a little early to confirm which ones have the latest revision boards or not.

Let's hope the sort it quickly.

All the best