King Song S18 Discussion

[NYC_Frutips]

I’m thinking of buying this wheel (second batch with new and improved suspension according to the dealer). 
 

Is there anything I should check with the dealer or ask for in terms of mods and fixes or upgrades before buying the wheel?

 

thanks for the help. 

[Rehab1]

29 minutes ago, NYC_Frutips said:

I’m thinking of buying this wheel (second batch with new and improved suspension according to the dealer). 
 

Is there anything I should check with the dealer or ask for in terms of mods and fixes or upgrades before buying the wheel?

 

All of the above.

There is a misperception about batches. Batches 1and 2 are essentially the same as one arrived by air the the other 3-4 weeks later by boat.

Some dealers may have performed the S18 suspension updates to batch 2 before shipping. 

Batch 3 looks like it’s arriving at Ewheels mid November which should have all of the OEM mods. 

Edited October 13, 2020 by Rehab1

[NYC_Frutips]

5 hours ago, Rehab1 said:

All of the above.

There is a misperception about batches. Batches 1and 2 are essentially the same as one arrived by air the the other 3-4 weeks later by boat.

Some dealers may have performed the S18 suspension updates to batch 2 before shipping. 

Batch 3 looks like it’s arriving at Ewheels mid November which should have all of the OEM mods. 

Thanks - so in terms of necessary fixes to the suspension, would it be accurate to say that following the instructions and videos on this thread would suffice?
https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/20030-my-s18-suspension-mods/

I'm trying to direct the dealer to one source of information where he can take a look at what is wrong with the first / second batch and make the necessary fixes. Thanks again. 

Also thinking of doing this mod but maybe unnecessary and not fully tested. Thoughts? https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/19926-s18xl-custom-version-with-20s4p-2170-battery-setup/

 

[Rehab1]

48 minutes ago, NYC_Frutips said:

Thanks - so in terms of necessary fixes to the suspension, would it be accurate to say that following the instructions and videos on this thread would suffice?
https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/20030-my-s18-suspension-mods/

Your welcome. FYI...my S18 mods went way beyond what was necessary. It is possible your S18 will be fine out of the box.

@NastyFartPants performed some minor mods with great results.

I suppose the best suspension test is to simply deflate the shock’s positive and negative chambers, push the wheel downward to depress the shock and then lift the wheel up to see if it rebounds by gravity. Would your dealer perform that test before shipping?

 

[Elliott Reitz]

On 10/11/2020 at 1:50 PM, AlexIsTheBest said:

I expect my S18 to arrive sometime in the next week or so.

I have been following the thread to keep up with all the upgrades, fixes, and also what to purchase in preparation. I am a tinkerer so I am excited to disassemble and upgrade (if needed of course).

Besides the suspension test mentioned above (disconnect shock), what other fixes/upgrades should be my top priority, perhaps before even riding? I have seen a few things that I am considering purchasing, such as the Black Crow KingSong S18 motor wire protector). Are there any other purchases that you guys reccomend?

That said, what can I expect to be fixed/upgraded with this latest batch, if anything?

Also, I REALLY like Lukasz's battery upgrade and I plan to do this or something similar eventually: 

Thanks everyone for all of the helpful posting! So excited to get this beauty soon!

So the mod-kits I want, hope to purchase before spring:

1. Suspension repair kit (Washers bearings etc so it works like it should).

2. 4p battery kit

3. Kill the fkin beeper switch kit

4. over-size fender kit (for K262 tire)

5. motor-bearing replacement kit (for that clicking noise)

6. seat kit

7. tail-light kill switch kit (for turning off the tail light (hunting season is soon)).

Edited October 14, 2020 by Elliott Reitz
spelling

[feguti]

He estado siguiendo las 151 páginas de este foro sobre el KSS18 y recibí mi nuevo KSS18 el 7 de octubre. Con este mensaje intento exponer mi propia experiencia para que ayude en lo posible a aclarar posibles dudas.

He tenido suerte de que mi KSS18 tenga la suspensión en perfecto estado y funcione bien.

El cable del motor estaba rozando como pasa en todos los demás, pero con un codo de cobre de 10 mm y 90º he podido solucionarlo bien como podéis ver en las siguientes fotos.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ighw5sd4nzpbaut/DSC03004r.jpg?raw=1

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xw9vf0k2gmf0vhu/DSC03008r.jpg?raw=1

https://www.dropbox.com/s/4xigazcqq4gdq48/DSC03009r.jpg?raw=1

Faltaba el bloque de hierro que se coloca detrás de las plataformas y eso quiere decir que el concesionario ha reformado y arreglado las KSS18, pero se ha olvidado de enviármelas y las he reclamado porque son imprescindibles para poder cambiar la altura. de los pedales.

La función de estos bloques cuadrados de hierro es que se quitan después de apretar los cuatro tornillos que los sujetan a los tubos.
Es importante disponer de ellos porque a la hora de retirarlos es muy difícil volver a desenroscar estos tornillos si queremos subir o bajar las plataformas de los pies, ya que los tornillos sin ellos soportan una fuerza de cizallamiento muy fuerte y al querer sacarlos lo haríamos incluso Romperíamos la cabeza de los tornillos o deformaríamos el bolsillo hexagonal. Para poder desenroscarlos, primero debe volver a colocar los cubos y luego aflojar los tornillos.
Para volver a apretarlos también es fundamental volver a ponerlos en posición y luego Kingsong aconseja quitarlos, supongo que es para que la suspensión funcione mejor.

Ya he recorrido 150 km con dos cargas de batería y la peculiaridad es que siempre lo uso en caminos de montaña con muchas piedras y dificultades ya que lo hice con mi viejo KS18L y estoy acostumbrado y los resultados no pueden ser mejores. .

Espero que esto aliente un poco que todos necesitamos en este momento difícil.

 

 

Edited October 15, 2020 by feguti

[FinRider]

2 hours ago, feguti said:

I have been following the 151 pages of this forum about the KSS18 and received my new KSS18 on October 7. With this message I try to expose my own experience so that it helps as much as possible to clarify possible doubts.

I have been lucky that my KSS18 has the suspension in perfect condition and it works well.

The motor cable was rubbing as it happens in all the others, but with a 10 mm and 90º copper elbow I have been able to solve it well as you can see in the following photos.

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ighw5sd4nzpbaut/DSC03004r.jpg?dl=0

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xw9vf0k2gmf0vhu/DSC03008r.jpg?dl=0

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/4xigazcqq4gdq48/DSC03009r.jpg?dl=0

The iron block that is placed behind the platforms, was missing and that means that the dealer has reformed and fixed the KSS18, but he has forgotten to send them to me and I have claimed them because they are essential to be able to change the height of the pedals.

The function of these square iron blocks is that they are removed after tightening the four screws that secure them to the tubes.
It is important to have them because when removing them it is very difficult to unscrew these screws again if we want to raise or lower the foot platforms, since the screws without them support a very strong shear force and when wanting to remove them we would even break the head of the screws or we would deform the hexagonal pocket. To be able to unscrew them, you must first put the hubs back on and then loosen the screws.
To re-tighten them again it is also essential to put them back in position and then Kingsong advises to remove them, I suppose it is to make the suspension work better.

I have already traveled 150 km with two battery charges and the peculiarity is that I always use it on mountain roads with many stones and difficulties since I did it with my old KS18L and I am used to it and the results they can't be better.

I hope this encourages a little that we all really need at this hard time.

 

 

Great feedback.

 

do us a favor though and change your dropbox links. At the end of the link where it reads dal=1, take it out and replace it with raw=0 (or was it raw=1), this will create an embedded image.

[Rehab1]

I was able to loosen an S18 suspension's barrel nuts coated in red loctite using a simple soldering iron that heats up to 350 degrees.

2 days ago I coated one of my spare barrel nut threads with red loctite. With an application of heat on the barrel head generated by a soldering iron I was able to loosen the barrel nut and screw without striping the hex out of the barrel and screw.

I applied heat to the surface of the barrel nut for approximately 15 minutes allowing the heat to radiate through the entire nut and bolt. The heat process softened the loctite enough where the disassembly was extremely easy.

 

 

[Mac]

On 8/19/2020 at 12:07 PM, FinRider said:

You are absolutely right!

Why Shouldn’t I Use WD-40 on Everything?

WD-40 actually stands for “Water Displacement formula 40,” and while it can help loosen rusty bolts, the film of oil left behind isn’t nearly enough for good, long-lasting lubrication. You might find that the troublesome squeak subsides for a little while, but soon enough you’ll have to go spray it away again. Using the right lubricant the first time will ensure that the problem is solved long enough for you to forget all about it. Save the WD-40 for what it does best: light lubrication, cleaning, and freeing stuck-together Lego bricks.

Your suspension was an excellent design, but your suspension has not been assembled properly. You can add as much oil, silicone, or grease you like but until you disassemble your entire suspension replace the bearings that are behind the lock washers, cut down the bolts that are too long, add spacers and align your suspension you’re just wasting your time. 

[Purplecycle]

On 10/10/2020 at 5:01 AM, Elliott Reitz said:

My wheel also has a bearing noise.  It goes away for a day or so whenever I put  oil or wd-40 on the spacers as best I can angle them to get the oil into the center.

I've done lots of rain riding.. even crossed a creek with a 2 foot deep spot where I had to jump off.  And yea, with the inner fender mostly gone (kept only left side to mount the k262).

The first time I removed my motor to change the tire I later found shims on the floor that I later yet learned were used by KS to eliminate the tire rub.  The inner fender is too small even for the stock wheel and for some reason the sliders don't seem to align properly.  At least with the my inner fender's top removed I have enough there that shims aren't needed.

Haven't done a lot of rain riding (yet); that's why I am quite surprised. I also spray WD40 (Specialist dry lubricant with PTFE) every now and then, but like you said, the noise goes away for a while and then comes back. The clicking sound is quite noticeable -- to me this is a sound of faulty bearings. Looks like I will probably have to replace them, unless my distributor surprises me with some good news...

 

[Purplecycle]

And talking about surprises...just realized at least one of my suspension rods is intensely rubbing against the inside of the fork.

[Feynman]

On 10/11/2020 at 3:30 PM, Bridgeboy said:

You could replace all the bolts with high-strength variants. The ones Kingsong used are extremely soft metal. I'm currently stuck right now because I stripped out the Allen heads of two bolts on my shock assembly because the metal is so soft. Be careful taking your S18 apart.

FWIW I replaced all my suspension bolts and posts with these:

1. 15mm L x M6 Cap Bolts (8 total) -- https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07L56Z4SY/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 $6.89

2. 12mm L x M6 Button Head Bolts (4 total)  -- https://www.belmetric.com/6mm-c-563_581_584_606/sb6x10ss-button-allen-socket-head-stainless-p-3278.html $0.64

3. 20mm L x 10mm OD x M6 round coupler (4 total) -- https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07SQLZ568/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1   $7.99

4. 25mm L x 10mm OD x M6 round coupler (2 total) -- https://www.amazon.com/Coupling-Connector-Threaded-Adapter-Stainless/dp/B07X9W4DS1/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=m6+x+25+coupling&qid=1600211214&s=industrial&sr=1-1  $6.99

 

[Elliott Reitz]

7 hours ago, Feynman said:

FWIW I replaced all my suspension bolts and posts with these:

1. 15mm L x M6 Cap Bolts (8 total) -- https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07L56Z4SY/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 $6.89

2. 12mm L x M6 Button Head Bolts (4 total)  -- https://www.belmetric.com/6mm-c-563_581_584_606/sb6x10ss-button-allen-socket-head-stainless-p-3278.html $0.64

3. 20mm L x 10mm OD x M6 round coupler (4 total) -- https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07SQLZ568/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1   $7.99

4. 25mm L x 10mm OD x M6 round coupler (2 total) -- https://www.amazon.com/Coupling-Connector-Threaded-Adapter-Stainless/dp/B07X9W4DS1/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=m6+x+25+coupling&qid=1600211214&s=industrial&sr=1-1  $6.99

 

Parts ordered.  @FeynmanDo you have links for the washers needed too? 

Edited October 15, 2020 by Elliott Reitz

[Bridgeboy]

9 hours ago, Feynman said:

FWIW I replaced all my suspension bolts and posts with these:

1. 15mm L x M6 Cap Bolts (8 total) -- https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07L56Z4SY/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 $6.89

2. 12mm L x M6 Button Head Bolts (4 total)  -- https://www.belmetric.com/6mm-c-563_581_584_606/sb6x10ss-button-allen-socket-head-stainless-p-3278.html $0.64

3. 20mm L x 10mm OD x M6 round coupler (4 total) -- https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07SQLZ568/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1   $7.99

4. 25mm L x 10mm OD x M6 round coupler (2 total) -- https://www.amazon.com/Coupling-Connector-Threaded-Adapter-Stainless/dp/B07X9W4DS1/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=m6+x+25+coupling&qid=1600211214&s=industrial&sr=1-1  $6.99

 

 

Thanks for the list!   

 

2 hours ago, Elliott Reitz said:

Parts ordered.  @FeynmanDo you have links for the washers needed too? 

 

I 2nd that! Yes. What washers/spacers did you use @Feynman?

[feguti]

17 hours ago, Purplecycle said:

Y hablando de sorpresas ... acabo de darme cuenta de que al menos una de mis barras de suspensión se frota intensamente contra el interior de la horquilla.

It seems that as the protection has been displaced over the tube, sand is getting inside and scratching the entire surface of the tube.

You should disassemble the tubes and clean them to remove all the sand, otherwise you will have to change the part with the entire tubes.

[Purplecycle]

37 minutes ago, feguti said:

It seems that as the protection has been displaced over the tube, sand is getting inside and scratching the entire surface of the tube.

You should disassemble the tubes and clean them to remove all the sand, otherwise you will have to change the part with the entire tubes.

Gracias por el consejo. El protector lo levanté yo para ver si había suciedad dentro -- algo hay, pero tampoco tanta como para causar ese roce. Tiendo a creer que es un problema del tubo exterior, que no tiene el diametro correcto por dentro.

Dicho eso, casi seguro que la tendré que desmontar muy pronto para arreglar otras cosas, así que aprovecharé para echarles un vistazo a los tubos de la suspensión.

[Feynman]

12 hours ago, Bridgeboy said:

 

Thanks for the list!   

 

 

I 2nd that! Yes. What washers/spacers did you use @Feynman?

These are the washers I used.  However, keep in mind that I 3D printed custom bushings to replace the bearings, so my build will likely be different than yours.  That said, the posts and bolts above should work regardless.  If you want to see my whole process, look at the Suspension Overhaul thread.  If you want a set of bushings, let me know; I think I have at least one extra complete set and can print more as needed.

 

7. M6 Stainless Flat Washers (4 total) -- https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B009OK2AZK/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o09_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1  $9.52

8. 0.5" ID x 0.75" OD x 1/32" thick PTFE washers (6 total) -- https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-2-Washer-3-4-OD-1-32-thk-PTFE-Plastic-Insulating-Fastener-Z78070/392789577456?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&var=661675992196&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649 $9.99

9. 0.25" ID x 0.562" OD x 0.062" thick PTFE washers (6 total) -- https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B006GHXY90/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 $14.52

Edited October 16, 2020 by Feynman

[dsd317]

New S18 Firmware Update.  Who's doing it?

Edited October 16, 2020 by dsd317
Added image

[Xolition]

Rode for the first time in the cold today (45F) and after about 10mins the suspension got very weird. It almost felt like it was trying to tilt me back in a low-battery situation. I got uncomfortable enough that I just rode it as slowly as possible the last few blocks to work. Checking my app I was at 45% battery, so no clue what was going on.

On a positive note, lubing the suspension made a world of difference. I feel like I went from a skateboard to a pogo stick.

[feguti]

22 minutes ago, Xolition said:

Monté por primera vez en el frío de hoy (45F) y después de unos 10 minutos la suspensión se volvió muy extraña. Casi sentí que estaba tratando de inclinarme hacia atrás en una situación de batería baja. Me sentí lo suficientemente incómodo como para montarlo lo más lento posible las últimas cuadras para trabajar. Revisando mi aplicación, tenía un 45% de batería, así que no tenía ni idea de lo que estaba pasando.

En una nota positiva, lubricar la suspensión marcó una gran diferencia. Siento que pasé de una patineta a un palo de salto.

When the battery is discharged, the KSS18 with the latest firmware version remains tilted forward and not lifted backward.

 

[the0r1st]

4 hours ago, dsd317 said:

New S18 Firmware Update.  Who's doing it?

i upgraded, went for a 15 mile ride and it works fine...

Edited October 16, 2020 by the0r1st

[dsd317]

4 minutes ago, the0r1st said:

i upgraded, went for a 15 mile ride and it works fine...

That's great news!  I've also updated, but haven't been able to ride because it's raining here.

Did you calibrate after updating?  Just curious because I've read somewhere that said to calibrate after updating firmware.

[the0r1st]

3 minutes ago, dsd317 said:

That's great news!  I've also updated, but haven't been able to ride because it's raining here.

Did you calibrate after updating?  Just curious because I've read somewhere that said to calibrate after updating firmware.

no, did not calibrate. just updated restarted the wheel and took off.

[dsd317]

1 hour ago, the0r1st said:

no, did not calibrate. just updated restarted the wheel and took off.

Good to know.  I calibrated anyway.

[Beachboy]

3 hours ago, dsd317 said:

Good to know.  I calibrated anyway.

Havent calibrate the wheel since I got it, I’m afraid if I did the calibration will make the wheel feels weird just like my old KS14M..

Do I really need to calibrate anyway?

I have updated FW but havent ride it outside just standing on it and move it back & forth, but the pedal felt “soft” when tilting...curious..🤔