Did I choose the incorrect wheel

[MDMason]

I'm 5'8 and 220 lbs. I purchased a Mten 3 as a first wheel. After a slow but progressive learning curve I can operate it with nervous confidence. Speeds have not exceeded 5-8 mph. 

I recently decided to purchase a larger wheel due to the instability I was experiencing with the Mten. My thoughts were that since I have the basics down I would progress faster with a larger wheel.

I decided to purchase a V10 because of it's 2K motor and reputation of being a very stable wheel. After a week with the V10 I think I have made a very bad decision. I can go maybe 3 feet before losing control. All the weight feels like its at the very top of the wheel and any degree of off center causes it to fall over. Due to its weight I am not able to recover. The torque feels absent compared to the Mten The Mten is unstable but carry's its weight low and corrections are very easy.

Any suggestions would be welcome. Is there a larger wheel that has the same characteristics of the Mten? (weight low and high torque)

 

[.....]

Maybe ride the one you are most comfy on for a little longer before making any decisions? I only say this, as 5-8mph speeds indicates that maybe you are still on the first steps of learning? I am learning on a "big" wheel, but I am pretty sure its similar. A 10" wheel is a tiny thing for you, but a wheel is a wheel( i KNOW, its hard to NOT compare them to your onewheels). As for being top heavy, I think that your lack of speed/muscle memory is making it seem even more. My wheel is heavy enough for my puny legs, i sometimes have a hard time standing around still with it one footed for long. Even so, the weight is GONE as soon as I get rolling.  I think the tiny 10" wheel fits a purpose, but maybe you are wanting more range and power. If you have time, just give it time. I dont know what your return policy is, but I hear the v10 is not a bad choice at all, its just a BIG difference from the mten you first stepped on. More torque = more batteries or smaller wheel diameter.  I think ALL wheels are a matter of where you want to compromise and where you want to focus. We are ALL looking for the wheel that weighs nothing, has tons of torque, uber stable, safe, very nimble, small format and will last forever. Tons of good info on first wheels here, and I'd bet every brand/kind has a success story attributed to it.

Edited March 4, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[Tazarinho]

@MDMason I think the trouble you are having is basically due to the narrower tire. An Mten has a ridiculously wide tire for its size and is therefore very stable for a EUC.
Especially at very low speeds as @ShanesPlanet pointed out, it will be much harder to learn to control. But once you do, it will feel amazing!

I don't think any larger wheel will be more stable than an Mten, except maybe for the Z10, but that will require a very different technique when you start to go faster. It also isn't the most reliable wheel; as there are many with issues.

There are a few that would be more stable than a V10 though. Basically everything with at least a 3 inch tire.

But I'm afraid it will mainly come down to the fact that you will have to put more work in learning how to ride it, whichever wheel you get.
Don't despair, most of us have had difficulties at the start, but anyone can learn to get confident on these wheels.

Edited March 4, 2020 by Tazarinho

[Mortal Coil]

Once you’re confident going faster the larger diameter wheel will show it’s worth. Stick with it!

[meepmeepmayer]

You are too slow. That's literally the problem. Speed stabilizes you, and you don't have that speed. Riding at walking speed or a bit above is hard. Riding at ~20kph/12mph is much easier, and this is where you should start. Just like with a bicycle, faster is more stable. You're too slow. 5-8mph with a V10 is torture.

Also, looks like you are at the beginning of the learning phase. It takes time. Don't expect too much in too short of a time.

But really, your problem is: you're too slow.

Try this (with the V10 first):

• Make sure you're not afraid to hurt yourself, damage the wheel, or hit something. Wear enough gear for that, pad your wheel up well enough, and find a place without obstacles or distractions or things that scare you, so you are comfortable and relaxed.
• Ideally, find a nice, empty, distraction free (no scary curbs to fall on, no parked cars, etc. - it's subjective) but confined straight road. You can use an empty parking lot or so, but ideally you want something more focused and much longer.
• I assume you can stand still on the wheel while holding on to a pole or wall, and balance/pendulum a little in place. And you don't immediately fall off once you start going from there. So you can start riding from holding on to something, instead of having to step on.
• So go to that road, hold on to something and step on, adjust your stance if necessary - and then just go.
• Don't do it cautiously - commit and accelerate. Get up to 15-20kph (10-15mph) speed right away, without much hesitation. Whenever you feel you're getting unstable, speed up (counterintuitively, braking makes it worse). Don't be afraid to lean in when starting - the wheel is powerful and will catch you. Don't be afraid of 20kph or even 25 kph (with the V10 at least, a bit too much for the mten3).
• You'll find out you can ride once you're only fast enough. Probably you can follow the road for a mile easily because nothing bad happens.
• Should you have to run off, do not try to catch the wheel, just run off and let it fall on its own (that's what the padding is for - your peace of mind to do that). And you can always emergency-brake by "sitting down" should you need to stop quickly.
  But you won't be that fast, so all you need to do is keep riding fast enough so you're stable and not so fast you get scared.

Going straight and fast is easy, so start with that. Then comes doing curves, free-mounting (though you can do the thing above with free-mounting instead of starting from a pole), and finally you can start fast and then gradually slow down and see how slow you can go before you get instable (because going slow is hard).

The V10 is a heavy wheel and maybe (maybe) a lighter wheel (16S for example) would make learning a bit more easy. But you don't buy a wheel for learning, you buy it for riding. And you can learn with any wheel. And clearly, here your problem isn't the choice of wheel, but that you are going too slow. Double your speed, literally. You'll find that you're a much better rider than you may think, you just started at the wrong place (low speeds).

Trust your intuition and don't overdo it, but don't be afraid of (moderate) speeds when learning. They are your friend.

Edited March 4, 2020 by meepmeepmayer

[Mortal Coil]

Great post @meepmeepmayer!

 

[MDMason]

That would make sense and also explain why riding the MTen is easier because the speed required to maximise the gyro effect is at a much lower threshold due to it's 10 inch wheel.

I think what Shane suggested is also valid. I need to spend more time on the MTen and develop my skillset before moving to a larger wheel. 

At 64 years of age I am very careful to not risk falling off because I don't bounce any more, I break.

 

 

 

[.....]

Speed is your friend. MeepMeep nailed it. I am comfy going 20mph+ but shaky at walking speeds. SOMetimes I can stop smoothly, most the times i get wobbly as i near 0 mph. Just like a bicycle, theres a speed youll hit when it magically becomes smoother.  I am one that also thinks you should buy a wheel to ride not learn. Since you already have two of them, just ride the one you are more comfy on first. You will SURELY wind up on the bigger one 99% of the time, but whichever one you feel better on NOW, thats the one to start with. I started on an 18 inch. After a weeek (still couldnt hardly ride), I purchased a tiny 14" wheel. I returned it after 3 minutes of standing on it. My point is... comfort on your first wheel may boil down to which one did you step onto first. Id bet if i owned the 14" first, the 18" would have seemed the tougher of the two.

Edited March 4, 2020 by ShanesPlanet

[M640x]

On 3/3/2020 at 11:49 PM, MDMason said:

I'm 5'8 and 220 lbs. I purchased a Mten 3 as a first wheel. After a slow but progressive learning curve I can operate it with nervous confidence. Speeds have not exceeded 5-8 mph. 

I recently decided to purchase a larger wheel due to the instability I was experiencing with the Mten. My thoughts were that since I have the basics down I would progress faster with a larger wheel.

I decided to purchase a V10 because of it's 2K motor and reputation of being a very stable wheel. After a week with the V10 I think I have made a very bad decision. I can go maybe 3 feet before losing control. All the weight feels like its at the very top of the wheel and any degree of off center causes it to fall over. Due to its weight I am not able to recover. The torque feels absent compared to the Mten The Mten is unstable but carry's its weight low and corrections are very easy.

Any suggestions would be welcome. Is there a larger wheel that has the same characteristics of the Mten? (weight low and high torque)

 

I have the V10 and mten3.  I'm also 5' 9" and 210.  I have found for the mten3 I lock my feet tight to the sides.  I also lock my legs still from the waist down.  I then only lean my top half where I want to go.  It works.  The mten3 is so light that locking it down with my legs keeps it from moving and it doesn't get away from me.

As far as the V10, even though the tire is wider, it's still not Z10 caliber and not completely stable.  Even with the fact that I'm approaching 600 miles on EUC's, the V10 is taking me some time to get used to.  After 85 miles on it I'm just now getting the hang of it.

This tip is kind of a catch-22.  You have to get the time and miles on the wheel.  Problem is if you can't stay on it it's hard to get the miles in.  That was my initial problem.  Pick one of the two wheels and stick with it until u have 100 miles on it.  You should be comfortable on it after that point.  Each wheel is different and requires re-learning if you haven't been on it for a while.

Don't give up.  The mten3 was my savior as far as EUC riding.  I had all but given up before that.

Edited April 4, 2020 by Senior Coffee

[xorbe]

On 3/3/2020 at 8:49 PM, MDMason said:

After a week with the V10 I think I have made a very bad decision. I can go maybe 3 feet before losing control. All the weight feels like its at the very top of the wheel and any degree of off center causes it to fall over. Due to its weight I am not able to recover.

I did the same thing with MTen3 and KS16X.  The latter was a huge shock to me, I couldn't recover balance due to weight once it started tipping.  It's frustrating, but you will eventually get the hang of it.  I actually bought a 14" wheel and came back to the 16" later, which was much easier after learning the 14".

[PennBruce]

On 3/4/2020 at 6:22 AM, MDMason said:

............At 64 years of age I am very careful to not risk falling off because I don't bounce any more, I break.

It takes a lot longer for those of us of an advanced age to learn to ride an EUC.  A young person can achieve in a week (or less) what it took me six weeks to learn.

I made the mistake when first learning to ride that slow would be better.  Not so, you need a bit of speed to get comfortable on the wheel.  

Armor up, if you're concerned about breaking body parts.  A motorcycle jacket with a upgraded spine protector and motorcycle pants with hip protectors should help.  Ankle and shin guards (I use Invisa-lite) will greatly improve the learning process by alleviating the pain that everyone experiences when starting out on an EUC.  Also, knee guards if they are not built into your riding pants.

When you do move on to  your larger wheel, you are going to be astonished by the comfort of the larger wheel. You will swear that it has a suspension system.

BTW, I learned to ride on a tennis court.  Tennis courts have nice smooth surfaces and a fence to use to get mounted.   Also, the fence prevents the wheel from taking off on a cross country tour on its own.

Persevere!

Bruce

 

 

 

 

[bigwave]

On 3/3/2020 at 11:49 PM, MDMason said:

Any suggestions would be welcome.

I recently learned on an 18XL and one of the keys to success for me was learning to control the wheel with your dominant leg. There are a couple drills which will greatly improve your control of the wheel. One would be the circle drill where you have one foot on the ground and rotate around it . Do it till your dizzy....lol. The other key drill is the on/off drill where you push the wheel like a skateboard ,stepping on then, off . This drill will make self starting much easier . Watch the video below, and do everything he says and you will be riding in a couple hours. 

 

Edited April 5, 2020 by bigwave

[.....]

It's really quite simple in the grand scheme of things... Just chant this to yourself before you go ride everytime.. "I can do this....I can do this." The rest comes naturally and with time.

[Daley1]

its not the wheel,its the riders skills! Persistant practice and perserverance will show u in a couple of months time that ur wheel choice is acceptable !

[poison]

On 3/4/2020 at 5:49 AM, MDMason said:

I'm 5'8 and 220 lbs. I purchased a Mten 3 as a first wheel. After a slow but progressive learning curve I can operate it with nervous confidence. Speeds have not exceeded 5-8 mph. 

I recently decided to purchase a larger wheel due to the instability I was experiencing with the Mten. My thoughts were that since I have the basics down I would progress faster with a larger wheel.

I decided to purchase a V10 because of it's 2K motor and reputation of being a very stable wheel. After a week with the V10 I think I have made a very bad decision. I can go maybe 3 feet before losing control. All the weight feels like its at the very top of the wheel and any degree of off center causes it to fall over. Due to its weight I am not able to recover. The torque feels absent compared to the Mten The Mten is unstable but carry's its weight low and corrections are very easy.

Any suggestions would be welcome. Is there a larger wheel that has the same characteristics of the Mten? (weight low and high torque)

 

How is your skills now?

I'm a bigger man than you - 6.3ft and 264.5lbs. I've bought 1.5 week ago first EUC - V10F, so we made similar decision.

Don't give up man! I have big problems with my riding but I'm fighting. I know that you wrote this post at March, so probably you're riding very well now. I've just started. Couple years before I was very active person and had about 44lbs less then now. In last years my physical activity was piece of nothing. Now I know that I must make my legs stronger and work about balancing. I have similar problem - too low speed. I put 40 PSI to my tire and I'm just thinking which pad sensitivity choose, default was 100%, now I'm trying to 0 and default angle of pads +3 degree.

Someone needs really 30minutes and other people weeks of hard works - it's nothing bad. I think the demons that I'm fighting with are smaller everyday. Of course - I have some "bad days" (like today) where I feel like "I can't", but the rest between trainings is very important too. This evening I go to train very frustrated and this wasn't a good idea. I don't myself hurt because I try to protect myself but this could be issue too - Too many jump out from a wheel, probably if I longer stay on the EUC - the learning will be shorter. I don't give a F about scratches but a little to much give a F about my health.

Best regards!

 

[Scottie]

@poison I like your attitude. As a fellow big guy, I know we are fighting laws of physics and inertia that are more punishing, but it is still possible and an amazing feeling when your are finally gliding along. It sounds like you've got it going on, and I'm sure you will have it click for you soon also. Keep rolling.