How to ride an electric unicycle - understanding the dynamics

[Marty Backe]

1 hour ago, Glitched said:

Well that's somewhat a relief, ironically, as this was meant to be my learning wheel anyway (and was an absolute steal of a deal) and as you've seen I'm looking for an upgrade now that I'm over the worst of the learning curve. I guess the KS14S that I'm potentially waiting on wouldn't suffer from this bump unpredictably, being a bit stronger at 800W and more torque-y as a 14" vs my 16"... great to know! The ride of the f260 is really smooth overall but I'll happily take slightly more choppy bumps for much more predictable bump climbing, hah. I guess all the Airwheels would be a nightmare to ride in DC/any urban area. Heck the InMotion V5 should have this same problem as it has a similar motor rating, IIRC.  Also all 14-16" Ninebots. 

Edit: I saw you experienced the same 'ditching' affect as me, @Marty Backe, but in one of your trail riding videos with the MCM5. You ran off as the wheel literally jammed into the edge of the trail where there was a steep transition up off the path. ?

That was a rather severe rut that I was going through. Is that the kind of bump that you're talking about 

But I will say that my 16-inch wheels would not have gotten stuck due to the bigger diameter wheels.

[mrelwood]

3 hours ago, Glitched said:

bump/transition anxiety.

As said, your wheel is underpowered for going over bumps at more than 8mph.

How do you prepare and ride over the bumps though? If you’re doing nothing, even the slight reduction in speed can throw you off, even on more powerful wheels. I do a ”toe jump”, in which I jump, but only enough to lighten my weight. And while I’m coming back up from the preparing crouch, I press down with my toes. This causes the wheel to accelerate slightly to the front of me.

And for the bump anxiety? Do not get a 14” wheel. All bumps would be 13% bigger.

Edited June 27, 2018 by mrelwood

[Glitched]

8 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

That was a rather severe rut that I was going through. Is that the kind of bump that you're talking about 

But I will say that my 16-inch wheels would not have gotten stuck due to the bigger diameter wheels.

Yeah I'm not talking like dips or mini hills on pavement or sidewalk.  More like this type, which I've stumbled upon with grass/sidewalk borders and roads too (typically about half as high as this though). I'll typically slow down to 2-3mph or lessfor bumps like these. FWIW adding I'm like 145lbs fully loaded and the wheel weighs like 30lbs.

 

7 hours ago, mrelwood said:

As said, your wheel is underpowered for going over bumps at more than 8mph.

How do you prepare and ride over the bumps though? If you’re doing nothing, even the slight reduction in speed can throw you off, even on more powerful wheels. I do a ”toe jump”, in which I jump, but only enough to lighten my weight. And while I’m coming back up from the preparing crouch, I press down with my toes. This causes the wheel to accelerate slightly to the front of me.

And for the bump anxiety? Do not get a 14” wheel. All bumps would be 13% bigger.

Not quite sure I follow. You're saying on my underpowered wheel, going faster makes bumps harder, but even a slight reduction in speed can throw off any wheel? See pic above for the type of bumps I'm talking about. 

To clarify, I slow down to like 2-4mph approaching bumps/ruts and bend my knees more, for fear of the wheel jamming and throwing me off, and that's about it. So with this toe jump maneuver, you first crouch down shifting most of your weight to your toes, jump up right at the tip of the bump and land toe first? 

 

Edited June 27, 2018 by Glitched

[Shad0z]

1 hour ago, Glitched said:

Yeah I'm not talking like dips or mini hills on pavement or sidewalk.  More like this type, which I've stumbled upon with grass/sidewalk borders and roads too. I'll typically slow down to 2-3mph or lessfor bumps like these. FWIW adding I'm like 145lbs fully loaded and the wheel weighs like 30lbs.

 

 

well. i ended up in such a bump at 50 kph...

i went flying. the asphalt had cracked so the next day there was huge bump that i noticed too late  

[Marty Backe]

2 hours ago, Glitched said:

Yeah I'm not talking like dips or mini hills on pavement or sidewalk.  More like this type, which I've stumbled upon with grass/sidewalk borders and roads too. I'll typically slow down to 2-3mph or lessfor bumps like these. FWIW adding I'm like 145lbs fully loaded and the wheel weighs like 30lbs.

 

Not quite sure I follow. You're saying on my underpowered wheel, going faster makes bumps harder, but even a slight reduction in speed can throw off any wheel? See pic above for the type of bumps I'm talking about. 

To clarify, I slow down to like 2-4mph approaching bumps/ruts and bend my knees more, for fear of the wheel jamming and throwing me off, and that's about it. So with this toe jump maneuver, you first crouch down shifting most of your weight to your toes, jump up right at the tip of the bump and land toe first? 

 

Good picture! Yeah, that's a bump that you want to be careful with. A more powerful wheel has a better chance of climbing it with no issue, but there are techniques for riding over these kind of features.

[Hunka Hunka Burning Love]

Basic EUC riding 101:

Here's my technique - slow down just before the step, dismount wheel, look around to see if anyone’s watching, nonchalantly pick up the bottle of goodies , lift wheel up and over the sidewalk hazard, remount and be on your way.  

Edited June 27, 2018 by Hunka Hunka Burning Love

[Unventor]

2 minutes ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said:

Basic EUC riding 101:

Here's my technique - slow down just before the step, dismount wheel, look around to see if anyone’s watching, nonchalantly pick up the bottle of goodies , lift wheel up and over the sidewalk hazard, remount and be on your way.  

This you just have to document on video before I kind of believe you ?

[Hunka Hunka Burning Love]

The bottle is half full!    Just make sure they aren't generics.  Toss those babies!    Brand name only for me!

Edited June 27, 2018 by Hunka Hunka Burning Love

[Glitched]

You guys are hilarious ... most of the bumps that I do take the fall for aren't nearly as obvious as the one I pictured. I just go slow or divert when I see anything close to that rut, and usually come out the other end surprised how well my wheel went over it without much drama other than my own. One time I was pitted between a bad sidewalk rut ahead, and a sidewalk rut on my left if I wanted to switch sidewalk 'lanes' if you will and avoid the rut ahead on my side of the slabs(double wide sidewalk). I tried to switch 'lanes', and the wheel got disturbed enough to send me driving it into the grass. I suspect that would've gone even worse with my relatively high PSI I pumped in last night.  But like on my last ride, TWICE I got thrown because of two different hidden ruts (bumps? ruts? you get the idea I hope) because the pavement was raised up maybe 1-3 inches but the grass was largely hiding the difference.  Maybe I should carry a measuring tape everywhere I wheel. ?

Edited June 27, 2018 by Glitched

[Shad0z]

5 hours ago, Glitched said:

You guys are hilarious ... most of the bumps that I do take the fall for aren't nearly as obvious as the one I pictured. I just go slow or divert when I see anything close to that rut, and usually come out the other end surprised how well my wheel went over it without much drama other than my own. One time I was pitted between a bad sidewalk rut ahead, and a sidewalk rut on my left if I wanted to switch sidewalk 'lanes' if you will and avoid the rut ahead on my side of the slabs(double wide sidewalk). I tried to switch 'lanes', and the wheel got disturbed enough to send me driving it into the grass. I suspect that would've gone even worse with my relatively high PSI I pumped in last night.  But like on my last ride, TWICE I got thrown because of two different hidden ruts (bumps? ruts? you get the idea I hope) because the pavement was raised up maybe 1-3 inches but the grass was largely hiding the difference.  Maybe I should carry a measuring tape everywhere I wheel. ?

the bump i rode over was pretty high, but the asphalt had always been a little cracked with a little bump, but now it cracked completely and was a big bump, but it also tricked you because the ground went down about a few inches before the bump, making it look the same but effectively is about doubled

[dmethvin]

Yeah, the Firewheel definitely will give you respect for bumps and potholes due to its weak motor. Even though I hard-wired it to its "hard" or "sport" setting it's still softer than many newer wheels. It's fine under 10mph in most cases but can't climb its way out of deep holes the way a stronger motor will. The good news is that your caution will serve you well when you get a new wheel, at least until you learn to trust it and lose your fear. THEN you're in trouble.

[Hunka Hunka Burning Love]

THEN you break a leg!  

 

Sorry... too soon?  

[Glitched]

23 minutes ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said:

THEN you break a leg!  

 

Sorry... too soon?  

Just before that happens I buy this for $800 ?. Cheaper than PT! 

I'd be afraid of flying off the wheel unexpectedly due to a tire jam even at 8-9mph. I guess the wheel slows me down a bit pre-take off because the pedals resist dipping as my weight shifts to my toes before I get launched. ? I'll try to figure out @mrelwood's technique over steep bumps.

Curious how your KS-14C handles deeper bumps/ruts in comparison to the firewheel f260, better or worse given it's a 14" but more powerful? I like the smaller wheel for the practicality in our locality but I sure do value my limbs more. 

Edited June 28, 2018 by Glitched

[Hunka Hunka Burning Love]

You might want to ask @Rehab1 about his pair first to see what he thinks of them.  The good ones probably take some time to put on.  Still, a little bit of prevention can go a long ways.

I think most people are likely fine without them.  It's just if you're doing a lot of night riding or off-road trips that maybe they might come in handy.  It's difficult to prevent injury during accidents, but if you cover the main areas it hopefully should help. 

I wonder though if they might get in the way of your calves contacting the wheel. 

Edited June 28, 2018 by Hunka Hunka Burning Love

[mrelwood]

3 hours ago, Glitched said:

I'll try to figure out @mrelwood's technique over steep bumps.

I was able to use an advanced imaging software to provide you this detailed hi-res 3D illustration on the various motions that are going on in the situation:

Other things I’ve done to succesfully overcome obstacle anxiety, pick yours:

- Pedal calibration to a slight/moderate tilt-back. When the obstacle slows the wheel down, feet will grab the pedals harder instead of slipping off. Even before you have time to react.

- Lower tire pressure rolls over obstacles easier. 3.3 bars is quite hard, 2.8 is a lot easier for me.

- Best grip possible for the pedals. In addition I used to have screws dull screws coming up 1-2mm thru the pedals as studs.

[Lamin]

From zero to hero on my IPS 122 (t260) electric unicycle (EUC). These are my short notes adding to the wealth of information in this thread about learning to ride the EUC.

For the first three hours, this vehicle showed its clear intends of killing me, or at least make me look funny while obtaining severe injuries. Now, after about five hours of practice, I do starts, stops and turning. I also handle riding down small curbs, passing over speed bumps and riding as slow as walking pace. I bit shaky, some missed starts still, the fear is almost gone is not gone, but  can relax and ride. And it is addictive. So addictive!

The notes, all of them, are allready said in other threads. Thank you. Just repeating what has stood out as more important for me to learn, and hopefully that will help someone else too.

1. Foot position. Hels flush with the back of your EUC:s foot rest. Toes will make a big overhang at the front, but this is essential to get enough pressure on the front part of the foot rest to accelerate from a stand still and start riding.
2. Leg position at start. About 45 degree angle between your straight leg on the ground, and the leg going on your EUC. The video from SimonVideo explains this much better than me How to step on an Electric unicycle.
3. Control the EUC with one foot at start and stop. Myung Shul Kim shows a great exercise to learn this in his Ninebot One video. When you can steer your electric unicycle in a half circle, with the other leg in the center on the ground, back and forth, you will build up the skills to start with one foot on the EUC, and jump on with the other after gaining a little speed. After braking and coming to a stand still, you can keep one leg on the electric uniwheel and safely step of with the other foot.
4. Body position. Bent legs and straight upper body. Look far ahead and where you want to go. The legs should do almost all the work. More like downhill skiing than bicycling.
5. Short sessions. For me, short training sessions of about 15 to 30 minutes was what I could handle. After that my feet where so tense that they hurt, and my brain overloaded with new input from the wheel. But after a good night sleep, I started the next lesson on a new level. It is like many others in this forum has said, the brain seem to work on the new information when sleeping. Some days I shortly took a step or two back again, and rode worse than ever. But the improvements kept coming each day.
6. Accelerating and braking. At first I believed I had to lean forward to accelerate. And braking was too scary to even think about (but somehow I did come to a stop every time, I credit the survival instinct screaming like severe tinnitus in both ears). After a while my wife, that had studied me learning explained it like stepping up on my toes when wanting to accelerate. And standing on my heels when decelerating or braking to a stand still. This mental image worked for me. And when needing to brake harder, I imagined taking a seat on a chair. A method mentioned somewhere here on this forum. That did work too.
7. Turning. For me riding the EUC is more like downhill skiing. The legs does all the work, except for when turning when going at some speed. Then I look where I want to go, and turn my upper body in that direction. The wheel will follow. Going slower I turn by twisting my legs.
8. Let the legs do the work. I can not stress this enough, the legs and feet handles all the acceleration, braking and low speed turning. Plus suspension. I have found out keeping my upper body out of the way most of the time gives a much more stable ride.
9. Support. Walls did not work as support for me. It felt like I was trying to learn my body another way of riding, being dependent on a wall. I imagine support wheels are as bad for your learning curve as I realized walls would be for me. Besides moral support and encouragement, my wife let me feel how it was to ride before I could even start. Just walking besides me, holding my hand, or me using her shoulder to hold on to while ridning the wheel. A strap attached to my IPS 122 (or T260 as they are called in some countries) feels important to me, as I can keep the wheel from bouncing off when stopping or having to jump off.

As this is my first post, I also want to say him and thank you for all the good information on riding an EUC. A fantastic vehicle that transports whats necessary, and leaves the rest in the garage. Like 3 more seats and a ton of steel and plastics. Besides three unnecessary wheels:)

Edited August 1, 2018 by Lamin
Spelling correction

[meepmeepmayer]

15 hours ago, mrelwood said:

I was able to use an advanced imaging software to provide you this detailed hi-res 3D illustration on the various motions that are going on in the situation:

Yep, that's what I'm doing, too, with obstacles/starts of an incline. Brake a little, bend your knees a bit, absorb the bump with your knees, then straighten up. This let's the wheel jump up the obstacle with much less weight on it, and then it supports you straigthening (lifting your weight). So you temporally separate the two power demanding maneuvers.

Edited June 28, 2018 by meepmeepmayer
Always one §&/$/ typo!

[Keith]

@Lamin, welcome to the forum, and may I say that, as a first post, your above post is absolutely excellent ?

i have to confess that walls did work for me, mainly because it rained for three days after I got mine so I was stuck indoors and I got impatient. Having someone walk or run alongside you supporting you as you did with, obviously a very supportive wife ( in both meanings of the word ?) is however definitely considered the best way to get started.

[Lamin]

7 hours ago, Keith said:

@Lamin, welcome to the forum, and may I say that, as a first post, your above post is absolutely excellent ?

i have to confess that walls did work for me, mainly because it rained for three days after I got mine so I was stuck indoors and I got impatient. Having someone walk or run alongside you supporting you as you did with, obviously a very supportive wife ( in both meanings of the word ?) is however definitely considered the best way to get started.

Thank you @Keith ?

I guess that the most important thing to learn is to actually practice riding, in any way you can!! During the first week there was many days it felt impossible to learn riding and EUC.

I wrote the post quite late, and now found more spelling errors. Is it possible for me to edit those?

[Keith]

49 minutes ago, Lamin said:

I wrote the post quite late, and now found more spelling errors. Is it possible for me to edit those?

I shouldn’t worry about the very few spelling mistakes, they do not detract from the post at all.

The ability to edit, and how long after the post is made you can edit, gets turned on as your reputation and number of posts increase.  Once you can,  you will see an edit link at the bottom of the post.

[Lamin]

Ok, no problem. Thank you @Keith?

[mrelwood]

On 6/28/2018 at 6:13 AM, Glitched said:

 I'll try to figure out @mrelwood's technique over steep bumps.

Here's a proper video on how I go over curbs and bumps:

 

[Mono]

Speaking of, my technique of climbing curbs is similar to this, that is, without much of the crouching or jumping in advance:

Climbing curbs is in my books definitely one of the surprisingly challenging riding skills.

Edited June 29, 2018 by Mono

[mrelwood]

39 minutes ago, Mono said:

Climbing curbs is in my books definitely one of the surprisingly challenging riding skills.

Perhaps because:

39 minutes ago, Mono said:

my technique of climbing curbs is similar to this, that is, without much of the crouching or jumping in advance

 

(My video is mostly aimed for riders who have challenges with curbs. My way is the only way I can do it, so perhaps it can help someone else as well.)

[beast@tanagra]

Anyone have a good technique for short drops other than bending your knees at the right time? I find drops more jarring than bumps, especially with a more inflated tire.