Why did I fall?

[Mono]

In the last six-or-so months I fell six times. Three times I was sliding away on a wet loamy soil. That was understandable and pretty predictable, if I only had know that the soil was that slippery. Three times I fell while recording myself doing what I quite regularly do, like the wheel-playing thing. I hadn't thought that recording would have such a big impact on my risk taking.

OK, I forgot that I also fell twice while practicing seated riding, but that's more like (more or less) gracefully getting to the ground than falling.

Edited December 9, 2019 by Mono

[MeepLaw]

Maybe you're diverting some of your attention from wheeling towards filming? Might just be that little bit of focus lost that caused your fall. Or maybe you felt the need to show off for the camera. 

[Tazarinho]

1. Less attention to the act of riding, and more to the act of recording. Even if the riding is completely natural by now, part of your brain is now focused on something else and makes that the primary task. It's the main reason why there are so many selfie-accidents, even when doing something natural like just walking.

2. Unless you are setting up a recording device and going past it, your balance is different. Whether you are using a selfie-stick, extending an arm or operating a drone on your phone, your center of gravity shifts. If you don't do it regularly it means you're not used to it and are more prone to dropping your wheel.

Just my 2 cents.

[Mono]

I should have mentioned that I didn't hold the camera myself. It's presence was purely virtual in my head, so to speak.

[atdlzpae]

If you ride on soil often invest in a knobby tire. :-)

[Tazarinho]

On 12/6/2019 at 6:17 PM, Mono said:

I should have mentioned that I didn't hold the camera myself. It's presence was purely virtual in my head, so to speak

In that case, maybe trying to impress the audience. Or the person holding the camera!

[Rehab1]

Hey Mono. Questions: Was there a second person filming you or was the camera statically mounted to your chest, helmet, wheel...etc? Any footage depicting your series of falls? 
 

We all fall but it appears your concerned about the undetermined circumstances which is understandable. 

 

[Unventor]

Well I don't know why you fall...

But I think you saw my posts of me sliding commuting home from work. It was a classic, I didn't anticipate it to be icy anywhere, but it just so happens ice on pedestrian road markings that Iam doing a L-turn to while braking. 

Yep I had an ordinance too, 2 women I were passing and trying to get in front of. Not an issue at all normally, but on icy white road markings, it was bound to happen as gravity always works here where I live. Wierd right? 

It is always about risk taking vs what you expect vs what happens you didn't expect or plan for. 

I always spend time to reflect once I get home. When I had a fall or incident, my first concern is to get back up, if possible. It is how I work to avoid fear of riding sets in. Like I rode to hospital with dislocated shoulder for like 800m. Not the smartest decision I admit. But I kept riding. I might not ride as fast anymore in general, which I am glad on the icy slip incident lately. 

So if this is the same for you @Mono I can't say. But I move up from my V8 as I didn't trust its power to be sufficient. I still fall but now for different reasons 😜🤪🤕

[RockyTop]

I know you love that V8 but switching over to a different wheel might be the challenge that you are looking for. ............ Or maybe not.

[Mono]

5 hours ago, Unventor said:

Well I don't know why you fall...

But I think you saw my posts of me sliding commuting home from work. It was a classic, I didn't anticipate it to be icy anywhere, but it just so happens ice on pedestrian road markings that Iam doing a L-turn to while braking. 
[...]

 I move up from my V8 as I didn't trust its power to be sufficient. I still fall but now for different reasons 

I don't think more power helps to prevent falling on slippery surfaces. I am pretty sure it's rather the opposite: on slippery ground the lack of power will, if anything, prevent falls.

[LanghamP]

On 12/5/2019 at 5:23 PM, Mono said:

last six-or-so months I fell six times.

Crashing is caused by not crashing often enough, that is, by not purposefully crashing in conditions that you're practicing on, you'll then accidentally crash in conditions you've purposefully avoided. You don't have to be stupid about it, for example taking your wheel out into wet conditions at night around drivers, but purposefully ramming your wheel into curbs, potholes, parking stops, and yes even wet leaves is necessary so you'll get that experience for when you do accidentally encounter those situations.

[Mike Sacristan]

33 minutes ago, Mono said:

I don't think more power helps to prevent falling on slippery surfaces. I am pretty sure it's rather the opposite: on slippery ground the lack of power will, if anything, prevent falls.

Haha yes indeed. I did a burnout on mud today on my 16X.

I was riding on grass and to avoid mud. I eventually had no choice but to ride on the mud. I rode carefully on the mud as if I were walking on a tight rope.
The tyre lost traction and slid to the side, I corrected it, it slid to the other side, I corrected it and pushed forward because I was going way too slow. Tyre started spinning, I lol:ed and walked off. 16X tipped to the side and got mud everywhere. Mud on my pants and boots, wiped it off so I could get some on my gloves too.

Lucky I didn't have my GoPro. I already had enough with the voices in my head saying "MIKE COME ON DO THIS AND DO THAT AND DO THIS SO YOU CAN PROGRESS AS A RIDER".

I find filming stuff to be a nice boost for trying stuff I normally don't dare to do. I push myself just a bit harder because suddenly I am accountable.
Otherwise if nobody is watching I can just say to myself... No.. I won't go down those stairs.

[Unventor]

1 hour ago, Mike Sacristan said:

The tyre lost traction and slid to the side, I corrected it, it slid to the other side, I corrected it and pushed forward because I was going way too slow. Tyre started spinning, I lol:ed and walked off. 16X tipped to the side and got mud everywhere.

Sometimes you just have to let it slide 😉 

But yes @Mono power isn't the solution to everything...

But once I started to ride a 2000w motor and a battery to match it, I found the V8 to feel like a toy. The V8 will be fine fully charged, but at 0C at 50% you are at a much bigger risk zone than a KS18L or V10F. 

I tend to find bigger rim size to stand firmer on snow/ice and less prone to sliding. 

Nevertheless I don't know why you fall, but for me I know so far why and what I can do better.

[Daley1]

i,m not crashing into anything ON purpose.I crash enough accidently that i know its gonna hurt and i would like to keep riding without injuries. Doesnt mean i dont continually seek new challenges and look to improve at every opportunity .I practiced on sand last week and it was a bit sketchy,and this week did the same sand which had become deeper at speed .The results were a faceplant .Learnt that speed is not always the answer!

[Mono]

13 hours ago, Rehab1 said:

Was there a second person filming you or was the camera statically mounted to your chest, helmet, wheel...etc? Any footage depicting your series of falls? 

I just placed the camera statically myself. As of today another person filming me didn't have the same effect 

Funnily enough, after reviewing the footage, the three falls really had somewhat different reasons.

• loss of traction due to applying too much force for the given grip I knew I had on this ground
• unintentionally found a slippery patch at the edge of the track
• sliding off the pedal while being on one foot, I think somewhat due to having more grip on the ground than I expected and the tire being stuck when I expected it to rotate

That leaves being overly optimistic or even careless as the single cause 

15 hours ago, Tazarinho said:

In that case, maybe trying to impress the audience.  

That's the only explanation I have. Not sure how that worked out

Edited December 10, 2019 by Mono

[Mike Sacristan]

3 hours ago, Unventor said:

Sometimes you just have to let it slide 😉 

I lol:ed. 

[Mike Sacristan]

3 hours ago, Mono said:

I just placed the camera statically myself. As of today another person filming me didn't have the same effect 

Funnily enough, after reviewing the footage, the three falls really had somewhat different reasons.

• loss of traction due to applying too much force for the given grip I knew I had on this ground
• unintentionally found a slippery patch at the edge of the track
• sliding off the pedal while being on one foot, I think somewhat due to having more grip on the ground than I expected and the tire being stuck when I expected it to rotate

That leaves being overly optimistic or even careless as the single cause 

That's the only explanation I have. Not sure how that worked out

Hahaha awesome vid. My wife calls it care free.
She called riding on the MSX in bad weather, slippery wet leaves, mud, snow/ice care free also.
Next day she landed on her ass.

[Rehab1]

3 hours ago, Mono said:

I just placed the camera statically myself. As of today another person filming me didn't have the same effect 

 

 

[Mono]

I recognized that too.

[mrelwood]

14 hours ago, Mono said:

I don't think more power helps to prevent falling on slippery surfaces. I am pretty sure it's rather the opposite: on slippery ground the lack of power will, if anything, prevent falls.

It does indeed. For the winter a softer riding mode also does wonders for the same reasons. Doesn’t help much with slipping sideways though.

13 hours ago, LanghamP said:

Crashing is caused by not crashing often enough

Hmm. I don’t quite agree. I haven’t crashed since about 9000km ago, soon after which I got my MSX. Not pushing the envelope isn’t the reason for me. Although I’m not counting in failing on very hard technical spots where my speed is lower than walking speed, even if my butt touches the ground. That’s just tumblin’, not crashin’.

[Rehab1]

My last fall was this past weekend. No excuse. I just missed the pedal while mounting in  darkness. What is suppose to be second nature ended with me hitting the ground. 

[LanghamP]

10 hours ago, mrelwood said:

Not pushing the envelope isn’t the reason for me. Although I’m not counting in failing on very hard technical spots where my speed is lower than walking speed, even if my butt touches the ground. That’s just tumblin’, not crashin’.

I count all "loss of control followed by a bail" to be a crash. They may be light, moderate, or hard depending on how much damage you incur. Decoupling the loss of control with the injury level makes sense since one could have a terrible injury from a mere step off, or no injury from a 30 kmh bail.

If you're constantly stepping off at low speed due to losing contact with your wheel, then that is still a crash with light or no injuries, as plenty of people have crashed as you have but end up in the hospital.

[mrelwood]

3 hours ago, LanghamP said:

I count all "loss of control followed by a bail" to be a crash.

Damn. I’ve crashed a lot on an EUC. 

[Mike Sacristan]

40 minutes ago, mrelwood said:

3 hours ago, LanghamP said:

I count all "loss of control followed by a bail" to be a crash.

Damn. I’ve crashed a lot on an EUC. 

But have you crashed as much as Monika?
Does just casually walking off the wheel also count as a crash? 
I never knew that was an option until I saw her do it.
Do you get bonus points for launching it into a kid on his bicycle?

 

[LanghamP]

1 hour ago, Mike Sacristan said:

Does just casually walking off the wheel also count as a crash? 

It's not casually walking off when you think of the number of riders who have experienced pedal bite if they're lucky, and an acl tear when not. That's why age is such an important factor; older people are several times more likely to injure themselves in any fall.

The "graceful crash dismount" whereby the rider bails in the most casual manner should be highly respected. The manly rider makes the dangerous bail look easy. Hell, I've crashed so badly in a zero speed crash that I had to crawl up the steps on all fours, and going to the bathroom was a serious business.

These are high speed unstable vehicles we're riding! While death rates are low, injury rates are sky high. When the local skateboarders try your wheel then refuse to go twice after their first huge crash, then you know no EUC crash is minor.