Justify buying a Gotway Monster v3?

[Finn Bjerke]

I have 3 Gotways: The MCM5, SMX and Mten3 - also Im having wet dreams of the Gotway Monster. Ive been driving daily for 4 weeks - the SMX - Mten3 combo is very good for learning I have to admit The small wheel is often used indoors, which is great fun.  Is this just the EUCAC (electric Unicycle Aquiring Syndrome)

[The Fat Unicyclist]

The Monster is a niche wheel... It isn't as agile as smaller wheels, but you can have a very comfortable and extremely long range ride (depending on battery choice), so there is definitely a place for it in your collection!

[Finn Bjerke]

thx for that  I was under the impression that the Monster was much stronger in off road conditions.

[EUCGUY]

1 hour ago, Finn Bjerke said:

thx for that  I was under the impression that the Monster was much stronger in off road conditions.

The monster is a bit on the heavy side as a daily wheel for hard trail riding. Ive used mine daily up until the first snow fell here in Norway. I started to get some pain in my knees as i was riding it hard in turns on a daily basis. This wheel in my option might be best as a long distance wheel, as if you have longer trips planned. if to be used daily, dont ride it like other wheels, be more relaxed and softly lean into it 90% of the time.  Its very comfy to use for sure, and you feel more powerfull riding it, but as an example, the msx 100v for me is much more fun as it allows me to accelerate and move about faster.

This is not to say that i will not ride the monster next year, i will for sure as much as possible, but i have to do some more carefully.

[Darrell Wesh]

As long as you plan on using it for seated riding the Monster is a luxury you cannot miss out on! Forget the “last minute” seat add on to the uncomfortable MSX. The monster seated riding is a game changer.

Recently upgraded to the monster after selling my ks18s which used to be my go to exploring new city/place wheel. 

[Finn Bjerke]

Thx for very good info, If this Huge wheel gives knee pain I must consider the fact that I have a fracture on the left knee, good Norwegian surgeons have operated on it but maybe I should rethink. I now live in flatland Denmark ...

Seated riding sounds interesting ... Lots to think about ...

[Hatchet]

One of the biggest reasons I'd want a Monster is seated riding. It's just ..civilized.

It's too much wheel for my needs though, I'd never be able to justify it.

[Bri]

I have about 800miles in my V3 and find myself sitting more than not. Now the only time I’m not seated is in unfamiliar terrain. It’s a great wheel!

[Mrd777]

I own a 100volt monster and owned a 84v. I do like the wheel and have to agree with @EUC GUY as the wheel is a great long distant road warrior. The Monster has little torque therefore it’s not the best hill climber or off road machine. Its perfect for getting up to speed and maintaining that speed. I put a trolly (euc guy) on mine which has made it more convenient..  On the negative side I wish it had more of an acceleration rush, it doesn’t. I’m looking forward to getting my power pads which I’m hoping will help with this. (Euc guy, thanks)

I think you should try one before you buy it

Edited November 28, 2019 by Mrd777

[Finn Bjerke]

Monster is civilised, I wonder why I didnt think of that, put some fun between your legs and act civil guys and dolls.

regarding acceleration: you should buy the 100V v3 with 21700 batteries to get the best accelaration right ?

[Finn Bjerke]

EUC GUY bloody well rules. Very relevant techie videos:

 

[mrelwood]

 

13 hours ago, Finn Bjerke said:

regarding acceleration: you should buy the 100V v3 with 21700 batteries to get the best accelaration right ?

There should be very little if any difference in acceleration between 84V or 100V, and likely no difference at all between 18650 and 21700 models.

The slow acceleration is due to the huge tire diameter, and as long as the riding modes are identical, the acceleration is practically identical as well.

For me personally, the MSX is absolutely the largest tire diameter I’d go with. I’ve actually been thinking of a smaller one for my next wheel. Nikola+ is looking strong.

[EUCGUY]

4 hours ago, mrelwood said:

 

There should be very little if any difference in acceleration between 84V or 100V, and likely no difference at all between 18650 and 21700 models.

The slow acceleration is due to the huge tire diameter, and as long as the riding modes are identical, the acceleration is practically identical as well.

For me personally, the MSX is absolutely the largest tire diameter I’d go with. I’ve actually been thinking of a smaller one for my next wheel. Nikola+ is looking strong.

It's plenty strong for acceleration, the main issue as standard is grip. Therfore acceleration is limited also. Unless you lean past no return 

[mrelwood]

1 hour ago, EUC GUY said:

It's plenty strong for acceleration

I’m sure. But the effort required is larger on large wheels, no matter what. I find power pads essential already for the MSX, but while they provide stability when leaning hard, the wheel still requires the same amount of lean, ie. effort as without the power pads.

[Hsiang]

On 11/27/2019 at 5:19 PM, Finn Bjerke said:

Thx for very good info, If this Huge wheel gives knee pain I must consider the fact that I have a fracture on the left knee, good Norwegian surgeons have operated on it but maybe I should rethink. I now live in flatland Denmark ...

Seated riding sounds interesting ... Lots to think about ...

the monster also have a softer tire and more "cushion" since you have more air volume given the larger diameter tire. If anything it would be easier to ride the monster if you have issues with your knees. seated riding is fine, but I mostly like my monster because of the greater stability and comfort that comes with having a larger diameter wheel.

I have yet to hear of anyone regret getting the Monster, only regret from selling theirs.

[Ben Kim]

Monster can be moved very quickly, you just need to learn the intricacies of the wheel and lots of practice. I would say it could move comparably quickly compared to my 100V Nikola (albeit with a lot more upper body effort.) 

[Darrell Wesh]

16 minutes ago, Ben Kim said:

I would say it could move comparably quickly compared to my 100V Nikola (albeit with a lot more upper body effort.) 

Ha ha. Good one. Can’t cheat physics man, 22” wheel moves slower than a 16” wheel with the same motors. So what happens if you use that same effort into the 100v Nikola acceleration? The nikola crushes the Monster, that’s what. 
 

The problem with the Monster is getting started without falling off the front trying to get it to MOVE. Powerpads are necessary. 
 

On my 100v nikola i always cruise to the front of stopped traffic because I know I’ll gap them on green. And this is on 40mph roads (not your 25mph city roads where cars accelerate slow). On the Monster I don’t even bother, I stay behind cars at red lights. 

Edited December 1, 2019 by Darrell Wesh

[Ben Kim]

8 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Ha ha. Good one. Can’t cheat physics man, 22” wheel moves slower than a 16” wheel with the same motors. So what happens if you use that same effort into the 100v Nikola acceleration? The nikola crushes the Monster, that’s what. 
 

The problem with the Monster is getting started without falling off the front trying to get it to MOVE. Powerpads are necessary. 
 

On my 100v nikola i always cruise to the front of stopped traffic because I know I’ll gap them on green. And this is on 40mph roads (not your 25mph city roads where cars accelerate slow). On the Monster I don’t even bother, I stay behind cars at red lights. 

side to side motion with foot pressure and core shifts (hard to put it into words without physically showing someone) I have powerpads, but they’re not really necessary to torque the wheel.  An extreme forward lean in NYC is a guaranteed faceplant, not a matter of if, but when due to our poor quality roads. You could also sit on the nose, as an alternative method. 

I use the same method to torque my nikola, as it’s less physically demanding than leaning. Yes with equal force the nikola can accelerate quicker, but i would not say the Monster can’t gap cars at a red light  once you’re past 15 mph it will move as quickly and have more steam up top as well. 

 

Edited December 1, 2019 by Ben Kim

[houseofjob]

1 hour ago, Ben Kim said:

side to side motion with foot pressure and core shifts (hard to put it into words without physically showing someone) I have powerpads, but they’re not really necessary to torque the wheel.  An extreme forward lean in NYC is a guaranteed faceplant, not a matter of if, but when due to our poor quality roads. You could also sit on the nose, as an alternative method. 

I use the same method to torque my nikola, as it’s less physically demanding than leaning. Yes with equal force the nikola can accelerate quicker, but i would not say the Monster can’t gap cars at a red light  once you’re past 15 mph it will move as quickly and have more steam up top as well. 

 

This narrative sounds mighty familiar buddy .....

 

9 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Ha ha. Good one. Can’t cheat physics man, 22” wheel moves slower than a 16” wheel with the same motors. So what happens if you use that same effort into the 100v Nikola acceleration? The nikola crushes the Monster, that’s what. 

True, but not nearly to the degree the tug-squeeze-and-lean riders on here make it sound like. Remember, the Monster physics are not ideal: for the comparative increase in wheel diameter, the pedal length technically should increase equally (to maintain the same torque arm to adjust), but we are stuck with the same length pedals across the board... there needs to be a better way to make up for the loss of exerted force, different than the norm.

I know this because I've experienced it (without powerpads or MJ lean), and have now taught it to at least one fellow local rider successfully. If I have my way, many more will experience this soon I hope....

 

9 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

The problem with the Monster is getting started without falling off the front trying to get it to MOVE. Powerpads are necessary. 

I'm fine without powerpads here, they actually get in the way; all back heel leveraging falls, alternating each side, wheel body is loosely tilting and kissing each inner shin with each "stroke".

When in doubt, there is no greater acceleration on the Monster for me than to sit down on the nose, wedge my forefeet on the front edge of the pedals, then use that leverage to exert the force of my legs trying to tuck under my bum to really front press the hell out of the nose of the Monster while seated. This accel will be about on par to stand leaning a Nikola+ from rest IMHO.

 

On 11/27/2019 at 5:19 PM, Finn Bjerke said:

Thx for very good info, If this Huge wheel gives knee pain I must consider the fact that I have a fracture on the left knee, good Norwegian surgeons have operated on it but maybe I should rethink. I now live in flatland Denmark ...

Zero knee pain here, plus I've taught my Monster technique to a fellow local rider who has a history of knee pain, and asked him whether or not doing my method aggravated this, to which he said no.

But, like all things in this life, if you ride in a manner that stresses the knee (which IMHO you don't have to), then yes, you will mess up your knee on any wheel.

 

Edited December 1, 2019 by houseofjob

[Ben Kim]

1 hour ago, houseofjob said:

 

This narrative sounds mighty familiar buddy .....

 

True, but not nearly to the degree the tug-squeeze-and-lean riders on here make it sound like. Remember, the Monster physics are not ideal: for the comparative increase in wheel diameter, the pedal length technically should increase equally (to maintain the same torque arm to adjust), but we are stuck with the same length pedals across the board... there needs to be a better way to make up for the loss of exerted force, different than the norm.

I know this because I've experienced it (without powerpads or MJ lean), and have now taught it to at least one fellow local rider successfully. If I have my way, many more will experience this soon I hope....

 

I'm fine without powerpads here, they actually get in the way; all back heel leveraging falls, alternating each side, wheel body is loosely tilting and kissing each inner shin with each "stroke".

When in doubt, there is no greater acceleration on the Monster for me than to sit down on the nose, wedge my forefeet on the front edge of the pedals, then use that leverage to exert the force of my legs trying to tuck under my bum to really front press the hell out of the nose of the Monster while seated. This accel will be about on par to stand leaning a Nikola+ from rest IMHO.

 

Zero knee pain here, plus I've taught my Monster technique to a fellow local rider who has a history of knee pain, and asked him whether or not doing my method aggravated this, to which he said no.

But, like all things in this life, if you ride in a manner that stresses the knee (which IMHO you don't have to), then yes, you will mess up your knee on any wheel.

 

Yes cause it finally clicked with me  

[houseofjob]

9 minutes ago, Ben Kim said:

Yes cause it finally clicked with me  

Nice~ 

Now all you need to do is focus on using only body weight and maximizing body leverage angles relative to the falling of the wheel body. Rinse, repeat.

[Darrell Wesh]

2 hours ago, houseofjob said:

Yes with equal force the nikola can accelerate quicker, but i would not say the Monster can’t gap cars at a red light  once you’re past 15 mph it will move as quickly and have more steam up top as well. 

Absolutely wont gap cars over here. You city guys have it REAL good. In the country out here (lmao) on these 40mph roads  these cars put their foot down off the line. The best you can do is stay level with them on the Monster.

Like I said, the problem is getting started. That first push. The Monster has great acceleration once you’re going. 
 

The thing with the Nikola is when I kick start it, it GOES. I can push extremely hard(I told you about my “3pt stance” kick start) and the nikola just takes off. I can’t do that on the monster; my momentum from my kick start and arm swing will cause me to fall over the edge. 

2 hours ago, houseofjob said:

I'm fine without powerpads here, they actually get in the way; all back heel leveraging falls, alternating each side, wheel body is loosely tilting and kissing each inner shin with each "stroke".

When in doubt, there is no greater acceleration on the Monster for me than to sit down on the nose, wedge my forefeet on the front edge of the pedals, then use that leverage to exert the force of my legs trying to tuck under my bum to really front press the hell out of the nose of the Monster while seated. This accel will be about on par to stand leaning a Nikola+ from rest IMHO.

I actually took off my powerpads as they get in the way of my seated riding. 

 

2 hours ago, houseofjob said:

True, but not nearly to the degree the tug-squeeze-and-lean riders on here make it sound like. Remember, the Monster physics are not ideal: for the comparative increase in wheel diameter, the pedal length technically should increase equally (to maintain the same torque arm to adjust), but we are stuck with the same length pedals across the board... there needs to be a better way to make up for the loss of exerted force, different than the norm.

I know this because I've experienced it (without powerpads or MJ lean), and have now taught it to at least one fellow local rider successfully. If I have my way, many more will experience this soon I hope....

I know this too. I use the same alternating technique on the Monster. 
 

I think acceleration to you means when you’re already standing on the wheel and “how can we get this to move faster while already on it”. In this context, sitting on the nose of the Monster I agree will likely equal a standing lean acceleration on the Nikola. 

However, to me, acceleration includes the start which is pivotal. How you start it determines how easily you can get up to speed. And in this context the Nikola blows the Monster away it’s not even close no matter if you have powerpads, sit on the nose, use pedal pumping etc.

Not sure how much effort you guys exert on the first push (or how much force you can produce in a first push!) but with my pseudo 3 pt start I will literally fall off the Monster. This is even with a hinged side lean too, not a straight on tall forward lean. 
 
On the Nikola it just propels my body forward, and I’m gone. 

[Darrell Wesh]

7 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Not sure how much effort you guys exert on the first push (or how much force you can produce in a first push!) but with my pseudo 3 pt start I will literally fall off the Monster. This is even with a hinged side lean too, not a straight on tall forward lean. 

Box Jump Record

In regards to this kick start I keep talking about, you can see the amount of force I can produce instantaneously might be different from the average person.... Using that much power into a kick start, the Monster can not keep up. 

[houseofjob]

1 hour ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Absolutely wont gap cars over here. You city guys have it REAL good. In the country out here (lmao) on these 40mph roads  these cars put their foot down off the line. The best you can do is stay level with them on the Monster.

Like I said, the problem is getting started. That first push. The Monster has great acceleration once you’re going. 

The first push off the blocks is all I'm talking about. Of course, for the entire run, we're not gonna catch a car if they wanna floor it and push 40 mph+.

But dead stop accel off the blocks, I'm gonna beat any ICE car (minus the $$$,$$$ sports cars) with my Monster seated "squeeze" technique; if you did the same, you would too. Of course, the ICE car will quickly catch up. Anything electric though, like a Tesla, etc., of course I'm not gonna be able to do this.

 

1 hour ago, Darrell Wesh said:

The thing with the Nikola is when I kick start it, it GOES. I can push extremely hard(I told you about my “3pt stance” kick start) and the nikola just takes off. I can’t do that on the monster; my momentum from my kick start and arm swing will cause me to fall over the edge.

In my experience with the side-to-side & seated technique, if you get it right, fastest accel to slowest: 1. Seated Monster Squeeze; 2. My Side-to-Side/Heel-to-Heel Motion on the Nik+; 3. Regular Lean on the Nik+; 4. Side-to-Side/Heel-to-Heel Motion on the Monster; .... big gap..... 5. (slowest) Regular Lean on the Monster.

 

1 hour ago, Darrell Wesh said:

I actually took off my powerpads as they get in the way of my seated riding. 

I for the love of me have no clue how guys can ride a Monster with that extra padding/thickness, as the Monster is super thick to begin with, stock.

 

1 hour ago, Darrell Wesh said:

In this context, sitting on the nose of the Monster I agree will likely equal a standing lean acceleration on the Nikola. 

IMHO, sitting will always win against standing, even seated Monster vs standing Nikola. The significantly greater leverage (again, literally squeeze) exerts so much more force than any standing technique.

 

1 hour ago, Darrell Wesh said:

However, to me, acceleration includes the start which is pivotal. How you start it determines how easily you can get up to speed. And in this context the Nikola blows the Monster away it’s not even close no matter if you have powerpads, sit on the nose, use pedal pumping etc.

Yes, all faster on the Nik+. Blow away? Not so sure it's that big a gap with the right rhythm/swing/leverage. And I'd beg to say I would get off the blocks a hair faster than the standing Nikola with squeeze seated Monster.

 

1 hour ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Not sure how much effort you guys exert on the first push (or how much force you can produce in a first push!) but with my pseudo 3 pt start I will literally fall off the Monster. This is even with a hinged side lean too, not a straight on tall forward lean. 

Zero exertion, all body angle leveraging and natural gravity weight falling, all plus the right rhythmic build up.

 

1 hour ago, Darrell Wesh said:

On the Nikola it just propels my body forward, and I’m gone. 

Believe me or not, with that same rhythmic motion I do on the Monster, doing so on the Nik+ makes it EVEN Faster than the norm!

 

[houseofjob]

2 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Box Jump Record

In regards to this kick start I keep talking about, you can see the amount of force I can produce instantaneously might be different from the average person.... Using that much power into a kick start, the Monster can not keep up. 

Nice jump 

EUC is not that kind of instantaneous burst push though IMHO, it's always felt more like a resistance force, like rowing or cable benching, etc., needs some more sustaining of force than just all initiation then instant release.

My motion is more like you're about to let the wheel body fall over and drop; that gravity based acceleration force sustained over distance of fall.

Edited December 1, 2019 by houseofjob