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AtlasP

eWheels needs a new website

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See attached image with its highlighted contradictions (and that's just from 'above the fold'), and it's the same story on almost every page. I'm not commenting on the aesthetics, just the contradictory figures/details throughout the content. (Such is unfortunately somewhat inevitable with a site built on manually edited pages with manually created table images instead of a modern database-driven retail site that propagates product info from a single product database.)

It gets even worse on pages which include multiple different configurations (of things like battery size and/or voltage) but where it's not specified how/which values correlate with which configuration(s). (What's the max speed or range for any one particular battery/system voltage configuration versus another for those that are included on the same page?)

eWheels is an awesome company with awesome customer support and ran by what seems to be an awesome guy. I wonder when it might get a site worthy of the brand/company?

Signed, "an OCD eWheels fan" :-)

Edit: yes I'm completely aware that some of these specs changed between initial reveal and launch/release which was likely the source of some of the old numbers, my point is simply that they changed/updated some of the numbers and not others resulting in a contradictory mess.

ewheels mess.png

Edited by AtlasP

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Wh is watt hour. It's how batteries' capacities are measured.

W is watt. Max power of a motor.

They have nothing to do with eachother.

1554Wh can be crudely rounded up to 1600Wh.

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Since apparently it needs to be spelled out, contradictions in that image include:

  • 2000 W versus 2200 W
  • 1554 Wh vs 1600 Wh
  • 65 miles versus 70 miles

I'm not arguing over which of the stated values are more correct (or what is or isn't an acceptable approximation), I'm pointing out the inconsistency between what's listed in the title versus in the bulleted text versus in the stats bar along the bottom, etc. Surely whatever values eWheels decides to use should be consistent throughout their product pages instead of multiple different variations scattered throughout.

Edited by AtlasP

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40 minutes ago, alcatraz said:

Wh is watt hour. It's how batteries' capacities are measured.

W is watt. Max power of a motor.

They have nothing to do with eachother.

What are you on about? I know what both Wh and W are, and nowhere did I imply anything about their relation. The point is that the numbers in the same color boxes don't all match one another when they obviously should.

Edited by AtlasP

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AtlasP - Sounds like you know how to fix it.  If you want to do it, just approach Jason with a proposal directly.

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I think some of them are prerelease values that later were adjusted.

They give a pretty accurate picture still.

20km/h probably gives you 3 times as much range than 50km/h so the range numbers are useless.

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8 minutes ago, Mark Frey said:

Hi was wondering since I got a 16X on backorder ..it states :  If you already own a Gotway rapid-charger, we offer a special adapter connect that converts the GX16 4- connector to the rectangular Lenovo style connector.      Does that come standard with the 16X?      I already have the 84 volt rapid charger.

 

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29 minutes ago, Mark Frey said:
29 minutes ago, Mark Frey said:

There is no link to purchase the connector but there is a pic of it next to the 84 v charger.   

 

 

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@Jason McNeil

If it is constructive/helpful, here is a partial list of other inconsistencies/potential-errors/configuration-ambiguity throughout just the EUC listings:

  • The MTen3 page/stats bar is muddled by orphaned details on a 325Wh version which I believe you no longer carry?
  • The KS14S page/stats bar is muddled by orphaned details on a 680Wh version which I believe you no longer carry?
  • (!)The V10/V10F page lists the V10 as 680Wh instead of 650Wh? (I'm pretty sure the original version was 650Wh according to InMotion's site, although Ecodrift has since documented a silent refresh to 750Wh...)
  • (!)The Tesla V2 page lists it as both a 1900W and 2000W motor? (I'm fairly sure it's 1900W according to Gotway's site.)
  • (!)Presumably the KS18L/XL page needs updated to reflect the new 2200W motor. Do new 18L's have the same updated 2200W motor as the new 18XL's? And is the max speed on these all 30 or 31 mph? (eWheels says both in different places. KingSong's site says 31mph. Not to mention on eWheels the KS16X is listed as 31mph while the KS18L/XL page currently lists 30mph, and I assume they should probably match?)
  • (!)The KS18S page claims only 50lb for the 1680Wh battery which greatly contradicts what is stated further down the page that that version is closer to 57lb?
  • The Monster V3 page is missing the stats bar entirely.
  • (!)Can we get separated max speeds for:  (approximated speed-ranges are fine, just some addressing of the difference between configurations)
    • Nikola 84V vs 100V
    • MSX 84V vs 100V
    • Monster V3 84V vs 100V
  • Can we get separated device weights for:  (approximated weight-ranges are fine, just some addressing of the difference between configurations)
    • KS14D 340Wh vs 420Wh (KS says 12 vs 12.5 kg)
    • Nikola 1600Wh vs 2100Wh vs 1845Wh
    • MSX 1600Wh vs 1230Wh vs 1845Wh
    • Monster V3 84V vs 100V
  • Can we get separated mileage ranges for:  (approximated range-ranges are fine, just some addressing of the difference between configurations)
    • KS14D 340Wh vs 420Wh (KS says 30-40 vs 40-50 km, but those are obviously wildly inflated MF numbers)
    • V10 vs V10F (IMworld says 43.5 vs 55.5-62.5 mi, but those are obviously wildly inflated MF numbers; and the V10 will likely change again with the 750Wh silent revision if/when ewheels gets them)
    • Nikola 1600Wh vs 2100Wh vs 1845Wh
    • MSX 1600Wh vs 1230Wh vs 1845Wh
    • KS18S 840Wh vs 1680Wh
    • Monster V3 84V vs 100V
  • The site across many pages refers to a voltage of 84.2, but I've been told elsewhere that 84.2 doesn't exist in EUC-land and that it should just be 84 even--such that the spread of voltages is supposedly 67.2 or 84 even or 100.8. Not sure who/what is correct, but this seems worth looking into for accuracy. (I would certainly love to know.)
  • All of this is just from looking at the top of each of these pages/'above the fold', without even getting to the majority of content on the rest of each page/'below the fold'.
  • The main comparison table hasn't been updated since October 2018 and contains some of the same above contradictions/outdated-info as well as lacking the latest Nikola/KS16X releases and a few other notable omissions such as the V10(F).

Also while I have your eye if I could ask a few other specific questions that I have been wondering about and unable to find answers to:

  • What is the stock charger situation for all of the 100V Gotway wheels? (The charger I received with my Nik+ 100V doesn't look like stock [maybe it is?] but isn't the typical eWheels-style charger either.) What is the stock charger amperage which comes with or is supposed to come with the 100V wheels?
  • Is there an eWheels Gen-V-style (with the 80/90/100% option) Rapid-Charger for the 100V Gotways? (I only see 84V and 67V versions publicly visible on the site.) Supposedly these would have a max of 4 Amps instead of 5?
  • Can one use an eWheels Gen-V 84V Rapid-Charger with the mTen3? If so, what is the max Amps one should limit to?
  • Do the forthcoming 21700-based 100V Gotways still use GX16-5 charging connectors like previous 100V Gotways?
  • Do you know if the forthcoming V8F added bluetooth speaker functionality?
  • What's the cell count and pack configuration for the cheaper 340 Wh KS14D? Is it the same cell count/config as the 420 Wh version just with lower capacity cells (similar to the V10 vs V10F)?
  • Are you sick of me yet? :-)

Signed, "helpful OCD eWheels fan--aka, unpaid eWheels labor" ;-)

__
Edit: disappointed this never got any acknowledgment or response. I understand that some of these would be more demanding/time-consuming to address than others and might need put on a future to-do list, but some are straight text changes/corrections that could be done in minutes for what are explicit errors (V10 Wh, Tesla motor wattage, KS18S weight, etc). Jason needs a few more interns/lackeys. ;-) The wheels are turning. :-)

Edited by AtlasP

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8 hours ago, comp_2 said:

AtlasP - Sounds like you know how to fix it.  If you want to do it, just approach Jason with a proposal directly.

While that's a fair hypothesis, I promise I'm not a web developer/this is not a thinly veiled attempt to sell anyone a website.

I'm just an enthusiast/geek who's obsessed with specs and numbers and bothered when things don't quite add up/fit together perfectly. ;-)

Edited by AtlasP

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6 hours ago, AtlasP said:

I'm just an enthusiast/geek who's obsessed with specs and numbers and bothered when things don't quite add up/fit together perfectly. ;-)

Im just like you. By the way if I ever have a website about EUC you’ll be my content manager :)

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I have to agree and I'm glad you brought this up @AtlasP. I've thought the same thing about the ewheels site for years (the site, not the company or Jason).

One of the main reason I'd like to see a modern website for ewheels is because the EUC companies don't have one worth visiting. Plus it's pretty bad in its current form by today's standards.

Good to hear @Jason McNeil

 

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No Jason is really good..but I think he is overburdened. Perhaps I made a mistake and the Lenovo style connector is listed somewhere but I didn't see it.  I didn't want to have to write an email so am trying to get an answer on the forum.   But yea am really enthused about the 16X . I assume there is some other style rectangular (lenovo) port for charging . I assume it also comes with a standard kingsong charger but is not the 80 percent efficient ewheels charger that is also used for Gotways. 

  Like whatever..we all can roughly know the specks anyway. Is not that important. But yea ..I need that lenovo adapter obviously and  this link  https://www.ewheels.com/product/ewheels-84-2v-rapid-chargers/   shows the adaptor    .  It doesn't mention the 16x ..   just 18L/XL    but I assume is same.  There is no link to get the rectangular yellow lenovo adapter . I already have the GW Standard GX16-4 pin connector/84v. I use it for my mcm5.  I have a 64v  for my ks16s  and dualtron ultra.  I have the 100 v also for my msx. I have never heard of this Lenovo rectangular yellow adapter. There is no link to get it . Can you send it with my 16x on last week in November when shipment arrives? Thanks so much. Your the best. 

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19 hours ago, PY ⠀ said:

Im just like you. By the way if I ever have a website about EUC you’ll be my content manager :)

Actually I do already manage a public spreadsheet of EUC information, available here: https://1drv.ms/x/s!Ag0ky7mWfH9cm9dMfvYothdqZtIsdw :) (Make sure to start with "Read First--Table Notes".)

It started as a way to organize my thoughts in planning my next upgrade, but quickly grew beyond the original scope due to by my aforementioned obsession with organizing/systematizing data. Working on it has given me an extremely detailed familiarity with the set of manufacturers/models/configurations/specifications currently available, but also with the minutia of the current state of listings/specs found on major reseller sites (like ewheels) and in manufacturer documentation. (Hint: a lot of it is an absolute mess. But at least in an exciting, wild-west sort of way. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ )

Edited by AtlasP

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1 hour ago, AtlasP said:

Actually I do already manage a public spreadsheet of EUC information, available here: https://1drv.ms/x/s!Ag0ky7mWfH9cm9dMfvYothdqZtIsdw :) (Make sure to start with "Read First--Table Notes".)

It started as a way to organize my thoughts in planning my next upgrade, but quickly grew beyond the original scope due to by my aforementioned obsession with organizing/systematizing data. Working on it has given me an extremely detailed familiarity with the set of manufacturers/models/configurations/specifications themselves, but also with the minutia of the current state of listings/specs found on major reseller sites (like ewheels) and in manufacturer documentation. (Hint: a lot of it is a mess. But at least in an exciting, wild-west sort of way. ;-) )

Hey, great work. Been looking for something like that for a while...
And indeed on some sites the info is contradictory, which leads to further searches from potential buyers on "what spec is now correct" (and deviated sales for merchants)

How do you feel about adding other criteria (more subjective) such as water / dust proofing, error rate ?
We all know the EUC should not be used as a submarine, so any disclaimers going that direction is only beneficial to common law, but some people don't live in a sunshine state all the time :-p

PS: One of the retractables is in the wrong color :-) (Z10)

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13 hours ago, Meulebeest said:

Hey, great work. Been looking for something like that for a while...

Thanks.

13 hours ago, Meulebeest said:

How do you feel about adding other criteria (more subjective) such as water / dust proofing, error rate ?

Actually I'm extremely apprehensive of/protective against including any criteria which are hard to quantify and/or without an adequate source of objective, reputable data--and likewise I outright refuse to include any kind of crowd-sourced "data" relying on random people to submit individual values.

IP Rating would be an interesting metric though. Looking into that one now. (Edit: apparently only InMotion and Ninebot-Segway have sought and acquired IP ratings for their wheels.)

13 hours ago, Meulebeest said:

PS: One of the retractables is in the wrong color :-) (Z10)

Actually no it's not. Both the Z10 and MSX retractable handles are in yellow because while they are retractable, their positioning at the back of the wheel (versus like a luggage handle on the V8 or King Songs) makes them less-than-ideal, hence I group them with the scorpion handles in terms of overall usability/desirability.

Edited by AtlasP

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21 hours ago, Jason McNeil said:

Thanks for your feedback, yeah a couple inconsistencies there, since corrected. The 16X had evolved with the 2200W motor when first announced. Trouble changing the URL title, is it breaks the SEO. There is a plan to do a complete site fresh early next year during the slower winter months. 

Good to know.  Be sure it is tested from an iPad, the current site has several glitches when viewed from the iPad. I've not tested it with iOS 13 or new iPadOS, but at least up to that point it was not really usable. 

Edited by FreeRide

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6 hours ago, AtlasP said:

Actually I do already manage a public spreadsheet of EUC information, available here: https://1drv.ms/x/s!Ag0ky7mWfH9cm9dMfvYothdqZtIsdw :) (Make sure to start with "Read First--Table Notes".)

Nice table! I actually made one myself and looked up yours for reference last week. I see there are no dimensions though. Also, why did you choose to have the features as rows instead of columns?

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On 11/9/2019 at 8:44 AM, Jason McNeil said:

The 16X had evolved with the 2200W motor when first announced. 

did any wheels get shipped with this motor?

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On 11/10/2019 at 8:10 AM, Giffy said:

did any wheels get shipped with this motor?

Someone correct me if I’m wrong, but it’s my understanding that every final KS16X has the 2200W motor.(Although there might be earlier pre-production prototypes floating around with the old 2000W one.)

Edited by AtlasP

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On 11/10/2019 at 6:58 AM, PY ⠀ said:

Nice table! I actually made one myself and looked up yours for reference last week. I see there are no dimensions though. Also, why did you choose to have the features as rows instead of columns?

Thanks.

I used to have dimensions but they were an inconsistent mess and I removed them. (Different sources for measurements seemed to be using different methodologies which made them useless for making comparisons--the whole point of having them in a table.) I might go back and try again now that Gotway Kebye has redone their English site with somewhat passable spec sheets. Edit: started looking at these again. Length and Height are mostly ok-ish, but it's Width that's especially all over the place (which is the one that'd actually be the most useful to have). It appears some are measuring width including the pedals down (which is an absolutely useless number IMO), while others are measuring with them up and/or not including pedals--but even in the latter case, some seem to be measuring the width with the pedals up and including the pedals/pedal stand-offs, whereas others are measuring just the case/body minus the pedal stand-offs at all? Either of these would be ok/usable if everyone did it the same way (I personally would prefer body width ignoring pedals/pedal stand-offs completely), but as it stands now the officially reported width measurements are worse than useless--they're extremely misleading by virtue of their different measuring methodology.

Regarding columns vs rows, I've actually tried it both ways on multiple occasions. The other way would certainly fit slightly better on screen, but I find the current configuration much more readable for reasons that are hard to pinpoint. I think it's mainly due to cutting down on the amount your eye has to move/scan to see all the data about any one wheel. (Wheels-as-columns makes each individual wheel's data shorter in length versus wheels-as-rows makes each wheel's data an extremely long and skinny strip that's much harder to read/perceive as a single unit.)

Edited by AtlasP

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