Popular Post photorph Posted October 8, 2019 Author Popular Post Share Posted October 8, 2019 (edited) I think we can draw some conclusions here: 1) anyone who has tried both Nikola+ and KS16x will almost always prefer the Nik+, and some even refer to the KS16x as a toy in comparison when it comes to performance. 2) A select few prefer kingsong 16x because of the ride feel, these are riders who usually a pretty mellow riding style and aren't speed demons 3) There's a few people participating here who didn't ride both. In my opinion you cannot make claims of what's superior unless you've ridden both at least someone what extensively. 4) Fact: KS16x did have issues upon release, and it seems the release was rushed. Nikola has had no major issues since MOSFETs were updated, with the exception of one blow up which is one isolated case 5) Gotway has informed us that they are upgrading their heat sink for the Nikola, this is part of routine improvements. So thermal management will improve even more. KS16x is continuing to develop firmware updates to improve, hopefully. In the last 2 years I have ridden/owned about 9 EUCs. My KS16x arrives soon, so I'll give my opinions. However, I am employed by eWheels and based on what I'm seeing I'm gonna have a lot less time to ride in the near future. But I'll do my best to get at least a written comparison in of the Nik+ and KS16x...with some cell phone pics/videos thrown in for good measure. Edited October 9, 2019 by photorph 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 I’m getting tired of Gotway fanboys flamebait, thank you forum for the ignore user function. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 3 hours ago, photorph said: However, I am employed by eWheels How exactly? Just wondering about ewheels. @Jason McNeil hasn't been here for 2 months but was quite active before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan acoustic-unicyclist Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 He started making $$$ and stopped caring about the customer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Lee Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 36 minutes ago, Declan acoustic-unicyclist said: He started making $$$ and stopped caring about the customer I don't know about you. I've dealt with Jason at Ewheels many times since I adopted this life style. He has been GREAT person to help me with my needs. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 43 minutes ago, Declan acoustic-unicyclist said: He started making $$$ and stopped caring about the customer I wouldn't go that far yet. Probably he's just even more busy than he always was. Jason has always been very helpful here. Anyways, not to stray too far off topic which is the 16X 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan acoustic-unicyclist Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Mark Lee said: I don't know about you. I've dealt with Jason at Ewheels many times since I adopted this life style. He has been GREAT person to help me with my needs. I have heard as much from other people, but this has not been my experience. He has gaslighted me on ongoing trouble with my XL (still with issues) The same has rung true for other riders, local to me. Edited October 8, 2019 by Declan acoustic-unicyclist 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Rehab1 Posted October 8, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted October 8, 2019 3 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said: How exactly? Just wondering about ewheels. @Jason McNeil hasn't been here for 2 months but was quite active before. 2 hours ago, Declan acoustic-unicyclist said: He started making $$$ and stopped caring about the customer Jason is extremely busy with customer service but does answer emails in a timely fashion. I just contacted him 2 days ago and received his response today. In my view a 48 hour response time is more than fair. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 11 hours ago, Mimolette said: @Unventor between the 16X and 18L which would you say is easier on the knee? Ahh well this is a very good and hard to answer question. To understand why this is a little long answer. So here goes. Right now I can't compare with my KS18L as I disassembled it 1 week before I got my KS16X. This was due to I found structure damage where side cover attaches. When I got my KS16X I intensionally kept a higher tire pressure than I would normally ride at. That was hard on my knee. But it forced me to develop a relearned ride stand and to understand and correct the wheels behaviour. Very much like standing on a V rather than an U shaped tire. And the mechanic of a wide tire wanting to follow edges. After some time I lowered the pressure from 30-32 psi to 25ish and it was so much easier to ride. At the same time I started to ride longer putting more strain on my knees and I ride with more suspension bend in my knees (more < vs ¦ if you like). So right now I am better to cope with curbs/pot holes/obstacles. If this is the wheel or my skills and strength have become better and how this will translate once I am back on my KS18L I simply don't know. But I would not trade my KS16X for any other wheel right now. But it took me 300km to adjust. During the adjustment period I kept putting small step targets on every ride. It was very hard at the start. But I kept sensing improvement every time that itself bought me huge joy. I hope this in someway answer your question. Maybe not the way you expected but sill. I do think you need to be very careful not to go too low on tire pressure though on the KS16X. If not feel free to ask more if you like. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post photorph Posted October 8, 2019 Author Popular Post Share Posted October 8, 2019 6 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said: How exactly? Jason isn’t here because of the ridiculous email volume and him being busy helping customers with complex issues. I’ll be practically full time and hope to make myself available on this forum as well. Ill be helping with front line communication and a few other things, but so far just doing email support for EUC. However there’s many pieces of the puzzle that I’m still learning. We are doing over a 1000 shipments a month and getting 100s of emails every few hours. @Declan acoustic-unicyclist There’s only so much one can do. I don’t want to go off topic on this though. But let’s keep this on topic. If anyone needs me or has questions they can reach me marc@ewheels.com or I’m also available here. However for warranty and post purchase issues email support@ewheels.com 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 Thanks for the detailed answer @Unventor . I recently got a 18XL for range, but also to reduce knee strain. As I don’t have much use of higher speed (city, soon to be speed limits) the 16X might be an interesting alternative. Trying to patch together impressions (as I can’t afford to have both at a time) and there doesn’t seem to be a clear winner yet. Possibly the main differences will be speed to nimbleness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 18 minutes ago, Mimolette said: Thanks for the detailed answer @Unventor . I recently got a 18XL for range, but also to reduce knee strain. As I don’t have much use of higher speed (city, soon to be speed limits) the 16X might be an interesting alternative. Trying to patch together impressions (as I can’t afford to have both at a time) and there doesn’t seem to be a clear winner yet. Possibly the main differences will be speed to nimbleness. I think you can rent one in Paris for a day to test out. From you description I would pick the KS16X any day. Like your said top speed is less useful in city center. But the low speed control and nimbleness and acceleration and braking is very useful in traffic. That said the KS18XL is good allround wheel. And it gives you time to see how well KS get the KS16X optimizer during the winter. Since you talk about a budget, I would wait a bit... at least for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travsformation Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) On 10/6/2019 at 12:35 PM, stephen said: I can see this too if you lean to far and the wheel speeds up to 30mph (in seconds)and your body isn't back over the wheel then the 16x hasn't got anymore power to get it back to vertical , you really don't need to do a Jacko lean with this wheel and if you do,, make it a short one and then gradually come back to vertical On 10/6/2019 at 1:25 AM, Unventor said: If you lean out far, some refer to this as a GW lean you might find the KS16X will not keep up with you, and you get into an overlean situation. I know I'm a bit late to the conversation, but wanted to add my 2 cents anyway: although the above are definitely things I could live with (every beast has its idiosyncrasies), since I don't mind adapting to a wheel's limits and particularities (it's part of the fun!), I'm surprised to hear that this particular type of issue is happening with a KS wheel. As safety-focused as they are, and with their record of overprotecting riders, I'm surprised to learn about such a serious safety oversight--and the fact it's still present after several firmware upgrades. Has this been brought the KS's attention? You can't unlock it to 50 kph until you've done 250 km, you can't disable top-speed tiltback (which I personally think is a good thing), but you can get a cutout if you don't "take the pedal off the medal" in time? On 10/6/2019 at 12:35 PM, stephen said: This is a fun wheel of you don't over do it The above sentence sounds SO out of place for a KS wheel... If no one knew what brand the wheel in question was, I doubt anyone would guess it's a KS Maybe the aesthetics aren't the only thing they changed... Anyway, I'm not hating and haven't ridden this wheel, just found myself chuckling at the irony and couldn't keep my mouth shut (as usual...) The main thing is for the issues to get fixed. Safe riding to those of you who have bought the wheel! (And patience for those waiting to get their 16X back!) Edited October 9, 2019 by travsformation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 6 hours ago, travsformation said: The main thing is for the issues to get fixed. Safe riding to those of you who have bought the wheel! (And patience for those waiting to get their 16X back!) The problem is not the wheel, it is how fast and well it respond to a demand that you hit product limit very fast. Similar to a Tesla Model S in this fast acceleration mode, if you engage this and don't know what you are doing you will get a nasty surprise. Or even better for got you have it in race car accelerate mode, and forgot about it... People who think they know the limit but have no data of what is actually going on can get in trouble from what were safe on other wheels. This is why KS did firmware changes and this is an ongoing process. I don't use my car at top speeds or max acceleration, nor do I do it with this wheel either. But we have seen many post after one another how people demand to ride at max speed limits at total wheel range.....I can't help thinking how people decided this is a smart idea. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 22 hours ago, Nic said: I just can't help thinking how can a guy like this claim that max speed is the most important factor over all other things in that kind of traffic. How he is going between cars .... He is really making sure that others can see him coming in that black cloths and look too. I wounder if he ever drive a car and understand how a car driver see the outside world from his/hers car. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WenInPhilly Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 7 hours ago, Unventor said: I just can't help thinking how can a guy like this claim that max speed is the most important factor over all other things in that kind of traffic. How he is going between cars .... He is really making sure that others can see him coming in that black cloths and look too. I wounder if he ever drive a car and understand how a car driver see the outside world from his/hers car. @MickeyMicklos I'm curious to hear your response to @Unventor's first point. Is top speed really weighted so high that this single aspect of the Nikola makes it a better wheel than the 16X? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Unventor Posted October 9, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted October 9, 2019 19 minutes ago, WenInPhilly said: @MickeyMicklos I'm curious to hear your response to @Unventor's first point. Is top speed really weighted so high that this single aspect of the Nikola makes it a better wheel than the 16X? I can't see how you can ride that fast between car at that speed and handle pot holes and people crossing road between stoped/parked cars. Or an animal (yes I know it is in NYC, but some animals adapt to ally life). If that is the case I think, he is the vey example why law makers will hit us hard with laws at some point. And what I view as a bad ambassador for EUC community. To me it is that simple. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RetroThruster Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) As a sport bike guy, I'm more interested in dragging my knee on this thing (wouldn't that be something) than doing top speed runs:) Edited October 9, 2019 by RetroThruster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 7 minutes ago, RetroThruster said: As a sport bike guy, I'm more interested in dragging my knee on this thing (wouldn't that be something) than doing top speed runs:) You mean like this guy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan acoustic-unicyclist Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 18 minutes ago, RetroThruster said: As a sport bike guy, I'm more interested in dragging my knee on this thing (wouldn't that be something) than doing top speed runs:) I like both :-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photorph Posted October 10, 2019 Author Share Posted October 10, 2019 (edited) So...initial impressions, wow this wheel is quieter than all the previous kingsong I have used! No high pitched whine. Definitely the best looking wheel. Lift disengage implementation is superior to the Nikola +. Feels like a more nimble wheel. I hope I get time to ride tomorrow, more testing to go. I rode it for half a mile but per usual kingsong fashion it’s restricted to something ridiculously slow. Need to get a hold of an android phone because the speed settings just don’t work with iOS iPhone 8 with kingsongs. Edited October 10, 2019 by photorph 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 2 hours ago, photorph said: So...initial impressions, wow this wheel is quieter than all the previous kingsong I have used! No high pitched whine. Definitely the best looking wheel. Lift disengage implementation is superior to the Nikola +. Feels like a more nimble wheel. I hope I get time to ride tomorrow, more testing to go. I rode it for half a mile but per usual kingsong fashion it’s restricted to something ridiculously slow. Need to get a hold of an android phone because the speed settings just don’t work with iOS iPhone 8 with kingsongs. That's one thing not many people mention allot ,, yes the wheel is super quiet 😊 I'm sure someone you know has an Android phone get the wheel unlocked😁 looking forward to your review , get the tyre pressure right and you can make this wheel feel like your floating depending how you want to ride😁 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photorph Posted October 10, 2019 Author Share Posted October 10, 2019 I’m gonna have to go ahead and say that this is the quietest electric vehicle I’ve ever had! IMG_5832.MOV 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post fourthewin Posted October 10, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted October 10, 2019 On 10/8/2019 at 10:27 AM, Mark Lee said: I don't know about you. I've dealt with Jason at Ewheels many times since I adopted this life style. He has been GREAT person to help me with my needs. +10001 on this. Jason has always given me great customer service. Matter of fact, we've been communicating back and for this week. He's a great ambassador to the community and runs a solid shop. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Matthieu Thegrey Posted October 10, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted October 10, 2019 You guys in the US are really lucky to have @Jason McNeil. In Europe the resellers are so roguish. I think he deserves much respect, because he is dealing with the same guys that our ressellers do, and it must not be a piece of cake. I am even tempted to get my next wheels to him, just because of all the stories i saw here, despite i'm living in France... 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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