Hunka Hunka Burning Love Posted September 19, 2019 Share Posted September 19, 2019 https://www.cbc.ca/cbcdocspov/m/blog/should-we-be-offended-that-germans-are-obsessed-with-north-american I mean I liked Pocahontas and the whole pow wow Indian vibe with the traditions and native heritage, but why does Germany? @meepmeepmayer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriull Posted September 19, 2019 Share Posted September 19, 2019 55 minutes ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said: https://www.cbc.ca/cbcdocspov/m/blog/should-we-be-offended-that-germans-are-obsessed-with-north-american I mean I liked Pocahontas and the whole pow wow Indian vibe with the traditions and native heritage, but why does Germany? @meepmeepmayer? Imho that's Karl May's fault - when he wrote his Winnetou/Old Shatterhand (fiction) books. It's (was) one of the standard adventure books for youngsters - in time reading books was still common. And then with the Winnetou movies in the 1960s this got even more popular - with open air Winnetou theatre, etc... So everyone here "knows and likes indians" by the fictious story about Winnetou... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted September 19, 2019 Share Posted September 19, 2019 2 hours ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said: https://www.cbc.ca/cbcdocspov/m/blog/should-we-be-offended-that-germans-are-obsessed-with-north-american I mean I liked Pocahontas and the whole pow wow Indian vibe with the traditions and native heritage, but why does Germany? @meepmeepmayer? I am pretty sure that the article exaggerates a tiny little bit and most Germans actually don't care. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted September 19, 2019 Share Posted September 19, 2019 5 hours ago, Mono said: I am pretty sure that the article exaggerates a tiny little bit and most Germans actually don't care. That's too nice. I'd say the article is just a bunch of BS. While the Karl May books exist, that's about it. Don't take any writing seriously that unironically uses "cultural appropriation". 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunka Hunka Burning Love Posted September 20, 2019 Author Share Posted September 20, 2019 (edited) CBC usually produces pretty truthful documentaries as far as I have seen, but maybe the author's view is slightly tainted? Who woulda known. Com'on, admit it, you all have Indian costumes hidden away in the closet somewhere! @Tilmann? EDIT: Oh geez, Tilmann hasn't visited since December 2017??? https://www.cbc.ca/cbcdocspov/features/teepees-powwows-and-indianer-camps-germanys-long-and-some-say-weird-fascina Edited September 20, 2019 by Hunka Hunka Burning Love 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjunlee Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 On 9/18/2019 at 10:27 PM, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said: https://www.cbc.ca/cbcdocspov/m/blog/should-we-be-offended-that-germans-are-obsessed-with-north-american I mean I liked Pocahontas and the whole pow wow Indian vibe with the traditions and native heritage, but why does Germany? @meepmeepmayer? Kind of like American's obsessing over Vikings right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 20 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said: That's too nice. I'd say the article is just a bunch of BS. While the Karl May books exist, that's about it. Don't take any writing seriously that unironically uses "cultural appropriation". Quote Cultural appropriation is the taking from another culture, without permission, and reducing their history, art, and rituals to mere fashion or toys. The key word is permission. Yellow-face for Halloween is gross appropriation. Signing up for a Tai Chi class is not. Can someone tell me who this institute/person is we can ask permission from? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanghamP Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 2 hours ago, ir_fuel said: Can someone tell me who this institute/person is we can ask permission from? Permission or public condemnation? Many people, perhaps most, mix up these two, because they are trying to give themselves more legal power than they actually have, in the hopes of preventing your perceived bad behavior. I find sexy Indian girl, ghetto 'ho, and redneck Daisy Duke's trash all equally hilarious. White Wall Street banker bankrupting the US with another private public venture, on the other hand, is something that can't be made fun of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, ir_fuel said: Can someone tell me who this institute/person is we can ask permission from? Yep that's what I was "wondering" (as in ), too. The King of the Black People in his reed hut? The magic mysterious "Chinese" wise man in his remote mountain temple abode? And so on. If that's not the stereotyping (all X people are one homogenous blob of clones with the same opinion) and orientalism they would surely claim to condemn... 3 hours ago, LanghamP said: Permission or public condemnation? Many people, perhaps most, mix up these two, because they are trying to give themselves more legal power attention than they actually have, in the hopes of preventing your perceived bad behavior not getting attention because there is no reason why they would get anyone's attention (no coincidence a big percentage is fat and unattractive women). FTFY. There are tons of valid causes to support and fight for. But the kind of people who use meaningless (and therefore arbitrarily malleable) terms like "cultural appropriation" certainly don't care about those causes, as the example above shows. They simply learned (from their parents, blame those) that the louder you scream and cry, the more attention people have to give you (whether they like it or not). Baby behavior. Bonus if someone let's himself bullied by this, giving them power they don't actually have. Assuming their behavior is about some cause instead of about them gives them too much credit. Ignore these crazies, that's all. Edited September 20, 2019 by meepmeepmayer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, ir_fuel said: Can someone tell me who this institute/person is we can ask permission from? LOL. It's me. You do have permission. Period. Edited September 20, 2019 by Mono Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanghamP Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 2 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said: If that's not the stereotyping (all X people are one homogenous blob of clones with the same opinion) and orientalism they would surely claim to condemn... I find you all equally worthless...I do not racially discriminate... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanghamP Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 2 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said: terms like "cultural appropriation" certainly don't care about those causes, as the example above shows. They simply learned (from their parents, blame those) that the louder you scream and cry, the more attention people have to give you (whether they like it or not). Baby behavior. Bonus if someone let's himself bullied by this, giving them power they don't actually have. Being bullied is probably good for you; toughens you up. I mean, I've been bullied quite a bit at certain points of my life and it's just a process a group goes through in order to make that person fit in. Bonus points: you get to bully the next newer guy. Ah, I remember getting my nose broken by a boxer who was way better than me, then trying to run away, then doing my best Huggie Bear impression, then say giving up and saying "that all you got, bitch!" Those were the good old days. However, I do think there are legitimate causes out there that, if left unchecked, while leave us just a huge pile a trouble. For instance: Public government debt. Foolish infrastructure spending. Not taxing people equally. It's grossly unfair to tax cities then distribute that money to suburbs by a factor of 5 to 1. Environmental degradation and overpopulation. Worrying about cultural appropriation, then, recedes into the background noise as the truly minor problem it is. There isn't even a trace of self-realized irony of this person assaulting another for wearing dreadlocks while being dressed and using clothing and accessories almost entirely invented by white males. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 3 minutes ago, LanghamP said: Being bullied is probably good for you; toughens you up. I mean, I've been bullied quite a bit at certain points of my life and it's just a process a group goes through in order to make that person fit in. Bonus points: you get to bully the next newer guy. Ah, I remember getting my nose broken by a boxer who was way better than me, then trying to run away, then doing my best Huggie Bear impression, then say giving up and saying "that all you got, bitch!" Those were the good old days. You mentioned the important part: if you're a bully, you better be actually in a position of power (stronger or whatever). Which the "cultural appropriation" people are not (that's why they are going nuts in the first place, nobody listens to them otherwise). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanghamP Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 52 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: You mentioned the important part: if you're a bully, you better be actually in a position of power (stronger or whatever). Which the "cultural appropriation" people are not (that's why they are going nuts in the first place, nobody listens to them otherwise). You mentioned the most important part; nobody bullies better than women. I swear, women bully each other relentlessly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunka Hunka Burning Love Posted September 21, 2019 Author Share Posted September 21, 2019 (edited) Americans obsess over Vikings? I think it’s rather flattering that different cultures take such an interest in other ones. It would have been interesting to see what Native Indian people think of some German people’s fascination with their culture. Not sure why that African American girl was hassling the dreadlocks guy. Is that hairstyle copyrighted or exclusive to a certain people? It was definitely disrepectful of her to bother the guy and physically grab a hold of him. Not cool. All this hubbub about Justin Black/Brownface Trudeau is all slimey politics at its best. Someone timed the release of photos perfectly just before election time to try to taint things. I’m not a big fan of Trudeau being from the west, but I’m sure he’s not all bad. I don’t like how he handled SNC Lavalin and the attorney general mess along with buying a pipeline, but to play the racist card just because a guy puts some make-up on? It’s just something silly he did when he was younger. I don’t think it was intended in any way as disrepectful, but you know he’s forced to apologize for it now just for show. I remember seeing Jerry Lewis, Al Jolson, Bing Crosby, Fred Astaire all commit similar “crimes.” Maybe that automatically makes them culturally insensitive and racist? Apologies are needed all around! I won’t be voting for Justin, but it has nothing to do with some wishful “dirt” someone found on him years ago. People seem to love to jump on the knee jerk reaction bandwagon. Take for instance the “N” word. I never use it as it’s considered a disrepectful term. But it seems to be the cool word that African American rappers love to use in their songs and casual convo. But if a Caucasian fan utters it hoo boy, release the hounds! https://variety.com/2018/music/opinion/kendrick-lamar-rappers-should-stop-using-n-word-1202818977/amp/ People and culture are funny sometimes. Edited September 21, 2019 by Hunka Hunka Burning Love 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 3 hours ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said: I remember seeing Jerry Lewis, Al Jolson, Bing Crosby, Fred Astaire all commit similar “crimes.” Maybe that automatically makes them culturally insensitive and racist? Apologies are needed all around! I won’t be voting for Justin, but it has nothing to do with some wishful “dirt” someone found on him years ago. Comedians use to get away with many culturally unacceptable antics in the 1950/60’s. Trudeau’s brown face routine happened in 2001. He should have known better being his father was in a revered political position at the time. I accept the fact that people make mistakes when they were younger and would not repeat then now. I have no idea what’s currently in his heart but know that he’s sorry for getting caught. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanghamP Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 5 hours ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said: Take for instance the “N” word. I never use it as it’s considered a disrepectful term. But it seems to be the cool word that African American rappers love to use in their songs and casual convo. But if a Caucasian fan utters it hoo boy, release the hounds! Two events come to mind of white people saying "nigger" (a word so obscene Google stops me from using it via autocorrect). 1. A professor who almost lost her job for using the word in class in an academic sense. 2. A rapper who brought a white girl onto stage then condemned her when she repeated his words from a song. It's terribly racist to be able to use a word depending on who you are. Can you use it if you're 100% black? 100% white? Perhaps if you're 75% black and 25% Asian, then can you use it? 33% black? If you have to struggle with race percentages when deciding if an action is acceptable then that's probably a great indication that said people are entirely race based (ie no matter how black/white/Asian you act, you cannot be accepted by said people). A lot of my fellow Conservatives abhor using the word nigger yet say using said word shouldn't be forbidden. I say white people should use the word as often as possible, because rappers, who have money and women thrown at them, use the word extensively. If the most desired social milieu is using that word, then why shouldn't you? Or were you using that word to differentiate your group from others? Isn't that the very idea of racism? Trudeau looks exactly like a guy who would raise someone else's child. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunka Hunka Burning Love Posted September 21, 2019 Author Share Posted September 21, 2019 3 hours ago, Rehab1 said: Comedians use to get away with many culturally unacceptable antics in the 1950/60’s. Trudeau’s brown face routine happened in 2001. He should have known better being his father was in a revered political position at the time. I accept the fact that people make mistakes when they were younger and would not repeat then now. I have no idea what’s currently in his heart but know that he’s sorry for getting caught. I once put a bunch of corn starch into my hair and wore my grandfather’s clothes to a Halloween dress up day at school. My fellow sixth graders thought it was the funniest thing as I was all old and dusty! Was it in any way meant to be disrepectful of my elders or to demean them in any way? Nope. I think there’s a lot to consider when it comes to intent versus perception. I bet Justin never thought he’d follow in his dad’s footsteps when he was younger. How many 20 year olds want to be just like their good ol’ dad when they grow up? In politics you really have to have a squeeky clean image for sure, but who on the planet is that saintly? Who would have thought a little makeup would be perceived so differently when it’s intent wasn’t to offend but rather entertain? I just find it funny how some things are artificially perceived as black and white. Oh, you put black makeup on - it’s bad. Purple face makeup would have been fine. How about zebra stripe makeup? Is that sort of okay? On Tuesdays and Wednesdays only? This actor from Westworld must be so culturally insensitive to many races! What twenty year old goes to the trouble of painting his skin to try to offend people? Why is it offensive? Are black skin features bad, undesirable, or something to be ashamed of? Now imagine if there was some chemical process to permanently change a person’s skin colour. White people could now be black. Black white. So what? It’s just a colour. A pigment. George Hamilton was really, really tan. Was he offending brown people of East Indian descent? Does that automatically make him a racist? Hindsight is always 20/20. We all should have known better at one point in our pasts, but we just don’t at the time. It’s often not possible. Ever watch “Tropic of Thunder” with Robert Downey Jr or “White Chicks” with the Wayan brothers? Apparently there is an okay way to use blackface / whiteface as long as it is entertaining and not meant to be offensive? I just find certain conventions quite convoluted and more based on what certain people want the masses to believe and follow. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanghamP Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 45 minutes ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said: We all should have known better at one point in our pasts, but we just don’t at the time. It’s often not possible. Suppose someone is accused of a transgression. What's the punishment? I think the majority of offended people would agree death is acceptable, but only after you've been skinned first. Here's an example of such a situation. https://www.wired.com/story/videogames-industry-metoo-moment-male-fragility/ Wired condemns male strength and success, while bizarrely mocking their fragility. Here, a woman named Zoe Quinn publicly accuses another of unspecified sexual harassment, gets him fired, and he kills himself the next day. Oops, didn't see that coming, did you? Hilariously, she is now complaining for being publicly harassed for, get this, publicly harassing another. Oh, how unfair! The Muslims are correct about men and women. They absolutely need to be separated into their own enclaves, because silly drama like this comes about from mixing the genders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunka Hunka Burning Love Posted September 21, 2019 Author Share Posted September 21, 2019 (edited) Victims of harassment shouldn’t be vilified for speaking out and be further abused by random people who don’t fully know their situation. The lack of empathy and understanding for one another is a root cause of misdirected hatred and action. I don’t know the full details, but I don’t think coming forward to confront an abuser should be considered harassment. For example, someone reporting a school bully isn’t bullying the bullier. Take for instance Evan Rachel Wood from “Westworld.” She is fearful of retribution and has declined to identify her assailants because they are in powerful positions. How unfortunate is that to be prevented from seeking justice? I wouldn’t want to live in a gender segregated world. I would like to live in a world of peace and understanding with people who respect and get along with their fellow man/woman/non-binary/gender neutral/etc human beings. Edit: Here’s some more reading if anyone’s interested. https://www.rt.com/op-ed/467831-zoe-quinn-gamergate-alec-holowka-suicide/ https://m.imgur.com/a/l9jVlEM Edited September 22, 2019 by Hunka Hunka Burning Love Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanghamP Posted September 22, 2019 Share Posted September 22, 2019 2 hours ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said: Victims of harassment shouldn’t be vilified for speaking out and be further abused by random people who don’t fully know their situation. The lack of empathy and understanding for one another is a root cause of misdirected hatred and action. I don’t know the full details, but I don’t think coming forward to confront an abuser should be considered harassment. For example, someone reporting a school bully isn’t bullying the bullier. The Wired article is probably one of the most sympathetic to Zoe Quinn, while the article you posted is a great example of the difficulty of the genders working together. From reportedly fabricating sexual assaults, claiming that she had once been assaulted and stabbed the attacker to death, to systematic emotional abuse, detailed by her former boyfriend Eron Gjoni, to accepting $85,000 in funding money for a game that she has not begun to produce, to being a keen member of a message board that specialized on online harassment. A picture emerges of someone manipulative, ruthless, vindictive, self-serving, and unreliable. In the other hand, the accused was mentally ill, and his odd sexual behavior had been documented before, by others also didn't recourse to the police (but who also didn't setup a Twitter storm). The genders working together in close proximity is actually a very recent 20th century trend, and all cultures from all eras were, in our eyes, extremely gender segregated. While we of the 21st century should be able to trust each other to act like restrained and reasonable adults, the track record between the genders is poor (both of what I read in the news and in the organization I used to work for). The wisdom of the Ancients is not be dismissed, because most people act like monsters when given the opportunity. It's amazing that the US is now the safest it has ever been, and yet now we manufacture drama against each other. How do you make people more tolerant of each other, while still being responsive to their concerns? Eh, remove temptation, I say, to create drama. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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