WARNING: Monster V3 DOA / Smoked [AliExpress Green Fashion 2460WH MOD]

[chrisjunlee]

I'm amazed Gotway hasn't addressed the issue of accidental power on during transit.

The only thing I can think of is having a fuse/ignition slot. The receiver would have to slip in a high amperage automotive fuse on arrival. It would be a cutout the same size as the existing USB slot. 

A Kingsong style software lock is probably the cheapest and easiest way though. 

 

[Ben Kim]

Fun fact for tech nerds after dissecting my burnt 2460Wh Monster 3:

Monster 3 is wired +1 +2 -4 -5 on the charge port with 18AWG silicone wire.  It can DEFINITELY take 10A if you have a charger wired properly for it.  

[houseofjob]

9 minutes ago, Ben Kim said:

Fun fact for tech nerds after dissecting my burnt 2460Wh Monster 3:

Monster 3 is wired +1 +2 -4 -5 on the charge port with 18AWG silicone wire.  It can DEFINITELY take 10A if you have a charger wired properly for it.  

Curious if this is all V3 or just the GF mod. 🧐

[Ben Kim]

1 hour ago, houseofjob said:

Curious if this is all V3 or just the GF mod. 🧐

It’s funny, I was JUST talking about how this would make so much sense on telegram the other day, now I know the monster at least, can take it. 

I somehow doubt GF would go through that much effort on the charge port, given its not needed since they send us a standard 3A charger. 

Edited September 2, 2019 by Ben Kim

[houseofjob]

1 hour ago, Ben Kim said:

It’s funny, I was JUST talking about how this would make so much sense on telegram the other day, now I know the monster at least, can take it. 

I somehow doubt GF would go through that much effort on the charge port, given its not needed since they send us a standard 3A charger. 

Er, I think it would kinda make sense cuz they're offering a custom 10A charger. I think I'll check the next time I get an opportunity to voltmeter a stock Monster V3.

Edited September 3, 2019 by houseofjob

[Ben Kim]

1 hour ago, houseofjob said:

Er, I think it would kinda make sense cuz they're offering a custom 10A charger. I think I'll check the next time I get an opportunity to voltmeter a stock Monster V3.

TBH, the wiring got a slight upgrade to 18AWG, instead of 20 like it’s predecessors, should be able to take the heat even in the stock +1 -5 config if it’s not blazing hot outside. 

[learnerofskills]

I'm looking to buy a monster soon. Do you guys think it's worth taking the risk, and ordering from AliExpress to get the larger battery pack mod? Or do you think it's a better idea to spend the same amount of money at a more reputable distributor, such as e-Wheels, but forego the larger battery?

[Ben Kim]

35 minutes ago, learnerofskills said:

I'm looking to buy a monster soon. Do you guys think it's worth taking the risk, and ordering from AliExpress to get the larger battery pack mod? Or do you think it's a better idea to spend the same amount of money at a more reputable distributor, such as e-Wheels, but forego the larger battery?

considering i’m the only one who had this issue, i think it’s ok. I would also assume the seller learned his lesson and will pack the wheel better. 

You could ask him to disconnect the power from the mainboard to ensure it won’t be fried in transit. Honestly if i buy another wheel from China, i’m specifically going to ask for that. 

[learnerofskills]

38 minutes ago, Ben Kim said:

You could ask him to disconnect the power from the mainboard to ensure it won’t be fried in transit. Honestly if i buy another wheel from China, i’m specifically going to ask for that. 

I will do that! Thanks!

[erk1024]

1 hour ago, learnerofskills said:

I will do that! Thanks!

@learnerofskills I don't know of anyone on this forum who would recommend getting a Monster as your first wheel--for a variety of reasons. I learned on an 18XL and that was already a borderline decision. But I'm a big guy, and that limited my choices. I bought a Monster V3, but only after having 350 miles of riding experience.

Reasons NOT to start with a Monster:

• It's heavy! Every time you drop it, you're going to have to pick it up off the ground. That will wear you out in a hurry, even with lighter wheels.
• Even experienced riders take some time figuring out how to maneuver this beast. Just ask @Marty Backe
• The new case is a big improvement, but Monsters are not known for their durability. You're going to drop it over and over when you're learning.
• There is no trolley handle, so you have to crouch over to roll it to a spot. While you're learning, a trolley handle is super useful. 
• You have to figure out if this hobby is for you, and why plunk down $3K to find out?
• The Monster is a specialized cruising wheel. Maybe you should start with a more general purpose wheel.

Better to start with something cheaper, lighter and zippier... 

What do you think your riding weight is going to be?

[Ben Kim]

2 minutes ago, erk1024 said:

@learnerofskills I don't know of anyone on this forum who would recommend getting a Monster as your first wheel--for a variety of reasons. I learned on an 18XL and that was already a borderline decision. But I'm a big guy, and that limited my choices. I bought a Monster V3, but only after having 350 miles of riding experience.

Reasons NOT to start with a Monster:

• It's heavy! Every time you drop it, you're going to have to pick it up off the ground. That will wear you out in a hurry, even with lighter wheels.
• Even experienced riders take some time figuring out how to maneuver this beast. Just ask @Marty Backe
• The new case is a big improvement, but Monsters are not known for their durability. You're going to drop it over and over when you're learning.
• There is no trolley handle, so you have to crouch over to roll it to a spot. While you're learning, a trolley handle is super useful. 
• You have to figure out if this hobby is for you, and why plunk down $3K to find out?
• The Monster is a specialized cruising wheel. Maybe you should start with a more general purpose wheel.

Better to start with something cheaper, lighter and zippier... 

What do you think your riding weight is going to be?

You bought your Monster 3 from eWheels right?  Do me a favor, open the right side of the inner shell.  I suspect if you bought it a while ago, you didn't get a real V3, and received a frankenstein V2 with a V3 housing.  It happened to one of the local guys to me.  

[erk1024]

8 minutes ago, Ben Kim said:

You bought your Monster 3 from eWheels right?  Do me a favor, open the right side of the inner shell.  I suspect if you bought it a while ago, you didn't get a real V3, and received a frankenstein V2 with a V3 housing.  It happened to one of the local guys to me. 

Yes, that's the case. It's a V2 with an upgraded V3 shell. I decided to keep it as I don't actually want the bluetooth module announcing to everybody that it's connected. It's a good stealth wheel. I also got it for the V2 price. The shell is good. All the metal screws go into copper bushings. I've had to take it apart twice already:

1. Fix the magnet on the right side that wasn't installed correctly. Disable the dodgy lift switch

2. Fix the slow leak in the tube from the factory (eWheels sent me a replacement tube)

AFAIK the rest is the same as the V3. And the lift-switch? I disabled it because it would get stuck sometimes and keep the wheel from balancing!

Edited September 17, 2019 by erk1024

[Ben Kim]

3 minutes ago, erk1024 said:

Yes, that's the case. It's a V2 with an upgraded V3 shell. I decided to keep it as I don't actually want the bluetooth module announcing to everybody that it's connected. I also got it for the V2 price. The shell is good. All the metal screws go into copper bushings. I've had to take it apart twice already:

1. Fix the magnet on the right side that wasn't installed correctly. Disable the dodgy lift switch

2. Fix the slow leak in the tube from the factory (eWheels sent me a replacement tube)

AFAIK the rest is the same as the V3. And the lift-switch? I disabled it because it would get stuck sometimes and keep the wheel from balancing!

That's not the point, the point is did he represent the product as a V2 with a V3 shell, or did he represent it as an actual V3?  As dodgy as GF was when handling my issue, eWheels selling frankenstein wheels hoping their users are too stupid to notice is FAR worse.  

The only reason he got caught was their customer enlisted someone (me) with a REAL V3 to replace his board (his "new" wheel came with 20 miles on the control board) and when open, it was surprising.  And no, eWheels never disclosed it was a V2 with a V3 shell to him.

Edited September 17, 2019 by Ben Kim

[erk1024]

1 minute ago, Ben Kim said:

That's not the point, the point is did he represent the product as a V2 with a V3 shell, or did he represent it as an actual V3?  As dodgy as GF was when handling my issue, eWheels selling frankenstein wheels hoping their users are too stupid to notice is FAR worse.  

I have to agree.  

[Ben Kim]

4 minutes ago, erk1024 said:

I have to agree.  

This same customer also just bought an MSX 100V from eWheels and it showed up with Nikola pedals.  Like, seriously.  You jerk him once, and you do it again?  No, they don't come from the factory like that.  Guy bought a 14S, Nikola 100V, Monster 100V, and MSX 100V inside one month and you sell him used junk?  I'm sorry, but this NEEDS to be called out. I wouldn't be surprised if the battery packs in those wheels aren't new either (which really disturbs me).

His frankenstein Monster 3 also came with spray painted black Nikola pedals, which I know shouldn't be the case as I'm staring at a crippled, burnt Monster 3 sitting in my room with the silver pedals.  

Moral of the story?  Don't buy from eWheels.  You're almost better off buying from China with PayPal for protection.  At least they send legitimate, NEW wheels.

Edited September 17, 2019 by Ben Kim

[Sketch]

20 minutes ago, Ben Kim said:

Moral of the story?  Don't buy from eWheels.  You're almost better off buying from China with PayPal for protection.  At least they send legitimate, NEW wheels.

I was considering buying a new Monster and Jason was up front telling me he was putting a V3 shell on a V2.  It didn’t bother me. There is no way I would ever tell people to avoid buying from ewheels.  He has done nothing but treat me fairly with over 8 wheels I have purchased from him over the last 3 years. He has also done a lot for this community.  I would have unhappy buyers contact him personally and give him the chance to correct an issue if it is warranted.

[Ben Kim]

4 minutes ago, Sketch said:

I was considering buying a new Monster and Jason was up front telling me he was putting a V3 shell on a V2.  It didn’t bother me. There is no way I would ever tell people to avoid buying from ewheels.  He has done nothing but treat me fairly with over 8 wheels I have purchased from him over the last 3 years. He has also done a lot for this community.  I would have unhappy buyers contact him personally and give him the chance to correct an issue if it is warranted.

Yes, but these customers did not get proper disclosure, which is the problem; Jason was hoping they didn't know any better.  That's dishonest and immoral.  

[Arbolest]

4 hours ago, Ben Kim said:

Yes, but these customers did not get proper disclosure, which is the problem; Jason was hoping they didn't know any better.  That's dishonest and immoral.  

Ok, I just need to be sure I'm understanding this correctly because I trust Jason almost without question and the above situation just doesn't sound right from what I, and many others, know of his character... Did your friend contact Jason before-hand and SPECIFICALLY ask for/order a V3 from eWheels, or did he order a "Monster" from the eWheels website and receive one in a V3 shell?

Because if it's the latter, then he basically just received a free upgrade to a much better, more robust shell and it's nothing at all to complain about.

Edited September 17, 2019 by Arbolest
punctuation...

[Marty Backe]

5 hours ago, Ben Kim said:

This same customer also just bought an MSX 100V from eWheels and it showed up with Nikola pedals.  Like, seriously.  You jerk him once, and you do it again?  No, they don't come from the factory like that.  Guy bought a 14S, Nikola 100V, Monster 100V, and MSX 100V inside one month and you sell him used junk?  I'm sorry, but this NEEDS to be called out. I wouldn't be surprised if the battery packs in those wheels aren't new either (which really disturbs me).

His frankenstein Monster 3 also came with spray painted black Nikola pedals, which I know shouldn't be the case as I'm staring at a crippled, burnt Monster 3 sitting in my room with the silver pedals.  

Moral of the story?  Don't buy from eWheels.  You're almost better off buying from China with PayPal for protection.  At least they send legitimate, NEW wheels.

I don't think it's quite so black and white as you portray it. For example, Monsters originally (and maybe still do) came from the factory with the smaller ACM pedals. Jason had Gotway install the MSuper V3 pedals on his Monsters. So depending on where you bought your Monster you would have different pedals. Same thing could be happening now but instead of MSuper pedals he is having Gotway install Nikola pedals. I absolutely do know that EWheels gets Gotway (and KingSong) to deliver wheels with various modifications that the rest of the world (or other American dealers) won't get.

Are you aware that Gotway is now producing black Nikola pedals?

So I think you're being a bit hyperbolic with your conclusions and recommendations (junk, buy from China, etc). Of course you're free to express your opinion and I'm actually glad you're doing so here, publicly and not in private messages to potential customers. At least then some of your accusations can addressed and or refuted.

I will agree with you that anyone who buys a Monster V3 should be getting a virgin wheel from Gotway unless specifically told otherwise. I knew EWheels was re-purposing the batteries and motors from New V2 stock and this was known to customers. I didn't know that some customers were not aware of this. I wonder if said customers really weren't informed of the practice? But again, I'm with you if this is true. However, I don't think the practice equates to selling "used junk" as new, but I would expect to get a price break for such a wheel.

[Ben Kim]

7 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

I don't think it's quite so black and white as you portray it. For example, Monsters originally (and maybe still do) came from the factory with the smaller ACM pedals. Jason had Gotway install the MSuper V3 pedals on his Monsters. So depending on where you bought your Monster you would have different pedals. Same thing could be happening now but instead of MSuper pedals he is having Gotway install Nikola pedals. I absolutely do know that EWheels gets Gotway (and KingSong) to deliver wheels with various modifications that the rest of the world (or other American dealers) won't get.

Are you aware that Gotway is now producing black Nikola pedals?

So I think you're being a bit hyperbolic with your conclusions and recommendations (junk, buy from China, etc). Of course you're free to express your opinion and I'm actually glad you're doing so here, publicly and not in private messages to potential customers. At least then some of your accusations can addressed and or refuted.

I will agree with you that anyone who buys a Monster V3 should be getting a virgin wheel from Gotway unless specifically told otherwise. I knew EWheels was re-purposing the batteries and motors from New V2 stock and this was known to customers. I didn't know that some customers were not aware of this. I wonder if said customers really weren't informed of the practice? But again, I'm with you if this is true. However, I don't think the practice equates to selling "used junk" as new, but I would expect to get a price break for such a wheel.

for this specific person, he called in to ask about V3 over the phone, never was he told it was a v2 in a v3 shell. 

Fwiw, he received his Monster V3 sometime in July, when they were JUST making it out to users in the wild. The finish on his Monster pedals was poor, you could see the drip marks from a bad spray paint job; I somehow doubt those came from Gotway in that timeframe. I’ll see if i can get the user to send me a photo of those. 

This isn’t an isolated incident... in the scooter community, I know of two instances where they’d received refurbished items (a Dualtron 2 LTD with a 20Ah battery when it should have come with a 28Ah) and an Ultra buyer which fit poorly, had wrong screws and was clearly not factory.

 Jason would blame his techs for the snafu, but why are techs touching supposedly “brand new” items? He should be throwing shipping labels on his stock and mailing them out.

As stated, if he clearly disclosed that a particular item is “reconditioned” or not factory, I would have no problem with it. He’s trying to sell reconditioned merchandise at new prices. 

I don’t sell PEVs, nor do I have any vested interest in who people choose to do business with. All I know is these statements are FACTS and need to be called out for people to base their own decisions on. Jason will eventually make good one way or another (be it by return, or replacement parts) but why put your customers in that spot to begin with?  If you have returns or overstock, sell them as such, don’t resell them as something they’re not. 

Edited September 17, 2019 by Ben Kim

[Ben Kim]

7 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

I don't think it's quite so black and white as you portray it. For example, Monsters originally (and maybe still do) came from the factory with the smaller ACM pedals. Jason had Gotway install the MSuper V3 pedals on his Monsters. So depending on where you bought your Monster you would have different pedals. Same thing could be happening now but instead of MSuper pedals he is having Gotway install Nikola pedals. I absolutely do know that EWheels gets Gotway (and KingSong) to deliver wheels with various modifications that the rest of the world (or other American dealers) won't get.

Are you aware that Gotway is now producing black Nikola pedals?

So I think you're being a bit hyperbolic with your conclusions and recommendations (junk, buy from China, etc). Of course you're free to express your opinion and I'm actually glad you're doing so here, publicly and not in private messages to potential customers. At least then some of your accusations can addressed and or refuted.

I will agree with you that anyone who buys a Monster V3 should be getting a virgin wheel from Gotway unless specifically told otherwise. I knew EWheels was re-purposing the batteries and motors from New V2 stock and this was known to customers. I didn't know that some customers were not aware of this. I wonder if said customers really weren't informed of the practice? But again, I'm with you if this is true. However, I don't think the practice equates to selling "used junk" as new, but I would expect to get a price break for such a wheel.

See above post.

With that said, if you are buying a new SKU (e.g. Nikola) close to release from Jason, you are probably getting a new item. If you’re buying an older SKU, your chances of getting a refurb are pretty high. All examples of this were people buying older models. 

Monster 3 from the factory comes with Silver Nikola pedals. Monster v2 does not. 

Edited September 17, 2019 by Ben Kim

[Marty Backe]

24 minutes ago, Ben Kim said:

See above post.

With that said, if you are buying a new SKU (e.g. Nikola) close to release from Jason, you are probably getting a new item. If you’re buying an older SKU, your chances of getting a refurb are pretty high. All examples of this were people buying older models. 

Monster 3 from the factory comes with Silver Nikola pedals. Monster v2 does not. 

I believe Jason is going to respond to this sub-thread.

You may be right regarding the pedals, but I wouldn't put any money on it for reasons that I explained above - pedals can be customized for specific resellers that buy large quantities of wheels.

[learnerofskills]

14 hours ago, erk1024 said:

@learnerofskills I don't know of anyone on this forum who would recommend getting a Monster as your first wheel--for a variety of reasons. I learned on an 18XL and that was already a borderline decision. But I'm a big guy, and that limited my choices. I bought a Monster V3, but only after having 350 miles of riding experience.

Reasons NOT to start with a Monster:

• It's heavy! Every time you drop it, you're going to have to pick it up off the ground. That will wear you out in a hurry, even with lighter wheels.
• Even experienced riders take some time figuring out how to maneuver this beast. Just ask @Marty Backe
• The new case is a big improvement, but Monsters are not known for their durability. You're going to drop it over and over when you're learning.
• There is no trolley handle, so you have to crouch over to roll it to a spot. While you're learning, a trolley handle is super useful. 
• You have to figure out if this hobby is for you, and why plunk down $3K to find out?
• The Monster is a specialized cruising wheel. Maybe you should start with a more general purpose wheel.

Better to start with something cheaper, lighter and zippier... 

What do you think your riding weight is going to be?

Thanks for your concern. I still think it should still be fine though... Reasons being...

I'm not simply getting this as a hobby. I'm a professional car hauler, and I'm buying this so that I can be more productive at work. I go to a lot of auctions, rail-yards, and manufacturing plants to pick up cars, and a unicycle would let me ride to the cars that I need to pick up, instead of walk to them, which will save me at least a half hour or more every day. It's also a useful option to get me to hotels, since sometimes I have to park my semi-truck down the street. My other options were to get an electric folding scooter or electric skateboard, but after doing my research, I decided the unicycle would be the best option. One of my co-worker's got himself a kingsong 14S, but he is a very short and small guy, so it works for him. I on the other hand am 6'6" tall and 230 lbs, so I need a larger wheel. At the price point of some of the larger wheels, I'd rather spend a bit more and be picky about the quality. If it allows me to do at least 1 extra load of cars every week (which it will), then it will pay for itself in the long run. So I'm not worried about the cost. Maybe I could tape some foam padding to the monster at first while I'm learning to protect the shell. Always open to suggestions though! Thanks!

[Ben Kim]

13 minutes ago, learnerofskills said:

Thanks for your concern. I still think it should still be fine though... Reasons being...

I'm not simply getting this as a hobby. I'm a professional car hauler, and I'm buying this so that I can be more productive at work. I go to a lot of auctions, rail-yards, and manufacturing plants to pick up cars, and a unicycle would let me ride to the cars that I need to pick up, instead of walk to them, which will save me at least a half hour or more every day. It's also a useful option to get me to hotels, since sometimes I have to park my semi-truck down the street. My other options were to get an electric folding scooter or electric skateboard, but after doing my research, I decided the unicycle would be the best option. One of my co-worker's got himself a kingsong 14S, but he is a very short and small guy, so it works for him. I on the other hand am 6'6" tall and 230 lbs, so I need a larger wheel. At the price point of some of the larger wheels, I'd rather spend a bit more and be picky about the quality. If it allows me to do at least 1 extra load of cars every week (which it will), then it will pay for itself in the long run. So I'm not worried about the cost. Maybe I could tape some foam padding to the monster at first while I'm learning to protect the shell. Always open to suggestions though! Thanks!

Wouldn’t get a Monster as a first wheel, although the V3 has made some improvements to shell durability, it’s still not something i’d use to learn on. As a second wheel once you know how to ride, I’d say go for it! 

If you must get a good wheel for your first, I’d recommend KingSong, they can take some serious abuse. 

[Ben Kim]

1 hour ago, Marty Backe said:

I believe Jason is going to respond to this sub-thread.

You may be right regarding the pedals, but I wouldn't put any money on it for reasons that I explained above - pedals can be customized for specific resellers that buy large quantities of wheels.

Looking forward to how he explains it. This isn’t a one-off occurrence, it’s happened multiple times in a small community across both scooters and EUCs.