Why the NEED to Lecture Gearless stranger on an EUC?

[ir_fuel]

1 minute ago, Patton250 said:

Having an opinion on someone’s behavior whether positive or negative is not judging

English is not my native language, so I resort to a dictionary:

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/judging

"to form an opinion or estimate"

 

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/judging

"to express a bad opinion of someone's behaviour, often because you think you are better than them"

[Hsiang]

As had been mentioned, IMHO wrist guard might be even more important since you might not hit your head in a fall, but you'll very likely land on your hands. But people seem to assign some magical protective qualities to helmets, to the point that driver seems to be willing to take more risk around you if you were wearing a helmet.

https://www.bicycling.com/news/a25358099/drivers-give-helmet-cyclists-less-room/

[Patton250]

Just now, Hsiang said:

As had been mentioned, IMHO wrist guard might be even more important since you might not hit your head in a fall, but you'll very likely land on your hands. But people seem to assign some magical protective qualities to helmets, to the point that driver seems to be willing to take more risk around you if you were wearing a helmet.

https://www.bicycling.com/news/a25358099/drivers-give-helmet-cyclists-less-room/

 I don’t think it adds more magical qualities but one can recover from a broken wrist, collarbone or shoulder but it’s much more difficult to recover from a coma. 

[Ryan C]

Its a riders choice to wear safety gear or not. Your body, your choice.

Strangers have shared their opinions on my wheel, bike, and at the ski hill. Mind your own business and let me enjoy the wind in my hair

[Patton250]

1 hour ago, Ryan C said:

Its a riders choice to wear safety gear or not. Your body, your choice.

Strangers have shared their opinions on my wheel, bike, and at the ski hill. Mind your own business and let me enjoy the wind in my hair

 I think what some have argued here and I disagree with them on this is that if and when you fall and crack your head open unless you have some incredibly awesome insurance or a wealthy family then society will be burdened with the expense of your treatment.  Anyway welcome to the forum 

 

 

[Marty Backe]

1 hour ago, Patton250 said:

 I think what some have argued here and I disagree with them on this is that if and when you fall and crack your head open unless you have some incredibly awesome insurance or a wealthy family then society will be burdened with the expense of your treatment.  Anyway welcome to the forum 

Personally, I hate that argument. If we go down the path of what affects society, we won't be allowed to do anything but live in a padded room.

[Patton250]

24 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

Personally, I hate that argument. If we go down the path of what affects society, we won't be allowed to do anything but live in a padded room.

 I 1,000,000% agree with you. 

[winterwheel]

On 8/12/2019 at 3:17 AM, CptSalami said:

Still I'll just chime in and say that on both my 30km/h+ crashes my head is the only thing not to have touched the ground. I wear a light open face helmet. 

This has been my experience as well. I've always been a sports guy though, so used to falling in ways that don't cause too much damage.

[winterwheel]

29 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

Personally, I hate that argument. If we go down the path of what affects society, we won't be allowed to do anything but live in a padded room.

Polluting the planet into oblivion also affects society, I'm on board with trying to stop that, but agreed otherwise.

Edited August 20, 2019 by winterwheel

[Patton250]

7 minutes ago, winterwheel said:

Polluting the planet into oblivion also affects society, I'm on board with trying to stop that, but agreed otherwise.

 I suspect you’ll be writing strongly worded letters to the Chinese and Indian governments then?

[Darrell Wesh]

On 8/16/2019 at 12:01 PM, Hsiang said:

As had been mentioned, IMHO wrist guard might be even more important since you might not hit your head in a fall, but you'll very likely land on your hands. But people seem to assign some magical protective qualities to helmets, to the point that driver seems to be willing to take more risk around you if you were wearing a helmet.

https://www.bicycling.com/news/a25358099/drivers-give-helmet-cyclists-less-room/

It’s just silly to see people riding around on MIPS full face helmets or $500 motorcycle helmets but have a t shirt and shorts on with no other gear. 

And then they fall and they never hit their head but have to take off work because their hands are so badly abraded they can’t grip anything or type. 

My priority for gear is based on the most likely part to be damaged in a crash. So gloves is highest priority, followed by knee pads (from my falling history). Gloves are mandatory even on 2min trips to the store. Helmet is not.

[winterwheel]

2 minutes ago, Patton250 said:

 I suspect you’ll be writing strongly worded letters to the Chinese and Indian governments then?

No, just doing what I can in my own neighborhood.

[Patton250]

8 minutes ago, winterwheel said:

No, just doing what I can in my own neighborhood.

 So you’re not polluting your neighborhood? That’s good. 

10 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

It’s just silly to see people riding around on MIPS full face helmets or $500 motorcycle helmets but have a t shirt and shorts on with no other gear. 

And then they fall and they never hit their head but have to take off work because their hands are so badly abraded they can’t grip anything or type. 

My priority for gear is based on the most likely part to be damaged in a crash. So gloves is highest priority, followed by knee pads (from my falling history). Gloves are mandatory even on 2min trips to the store. Helmet is not.

  Brother I understand what you’re talking about however your hands and arms will heal but your brain probably won’t.  Most of the videos I see of people riding their wheel is in traffic. I believe you that you are extremely confident that if and when your wheel cuts out you won’t smash your face into the pavement however the cars hitting you is a completely different story. 

[winterwheel]

2 minutes ago, Patton250 said:

face into the pavement however the cars hitting you is a completely different story. 

I've had two heavy collisions with cars, in those two instances it was exactly the same story.

[Patton250]

2 minutes ago, winterwheel said:

I've had two heavy collisions with cars, in those two instances it was exactly the same story.

What was the story?

[winterwheel]

On the first occasion a car failed to stop at a crosswalk and plowed into me, on the second occasion a car crossed into a bike path without looking to see if anything was coming and I plowed into him.

Edited August 20, 2019 by winterwheel

[Patton250]

5 minutes ago, winterwheel said:

On the first occasion a car failed to stop at a crosswalk and plowed into me, on the second occasion a car crossed into a bike path without looking to see if anything was coming and I plowed into him.

 I’m glad you didn’t get killed. My wife and I watched a car hit a motorcyclist that was going about 10 mph. He smashed his skull on the pavement and died instantly. I’ve never seen that much blood in real life only in the movies. 

[winterwheel]

When the car hit me in the crosswalk I marvelled at how well the wheel (ACM2) handled it. His front bumper basically knocked the wheel out from under me and my forward momentum carried me past the car and on to the side of the road so there was no further contact, I didn't even hit the ground on that occasion. Had I been on foot it would have been much, much worse.

Edited August 20, 2019 by winterwheel

[ir_fuel]

6 minutes ago, Patton250 said:

He smashed his skull on the pavement and died instantly.

He rode without a helmet?

1 hour ago, Marty Backe said:

Personally, I hate that argument. If we go down the path of what affects society, we won't be allowed to do anything but live in a padded room.

Hey you, EUC rider! PUT ON THAT HELMET.

*a couple of feet further 15 people are smoking. Nobody says a thing*

[Patton250]

3 minutes ago, ir_fuel said:

He rode without a helmet?

Hey you, EUC rider! PUT ON THAT HELMET.

*a couple of feet further 15 people are smoking. Nobody says a thing*

 Yes this particular man wasn’t wearing a helmet. I didn’t know him we were just waiting at a red light. It was just outside of our neighborhood also. 

[Elliott Reitz]

On 8/11/2019 at 12:27 AM, Rywokast said:

that's weird, never worn a helmet on anything in my life and never once had someone tell that to me lol.. probably tell them to eff off and mind their own business haha

{+} I prefer to turn it back on them regarding choices for the ride... like "i might if I were riding for speed".... and "do you know helmets actually make motorcycles more dangerous?"  (my researched statistics later in this post - and IDK if anyone disagrees with me, its worth speaking the ####ing truth!)

On 8/11/2019 at 5:38 AM, atdlzpae said:

I've faceplanted several times and my helmet never got a scratch. The hierarchy for me is:

1. Wrist guards
2. Knee pads
3. Helmet
4. Elbow pads

And so, I only wear wrist protection when grocery shopping. Everything else only if I'm going far/fast/pushing limits.

I agree completely.  And I like the choice to me my own.  I don't gear up to take the dogs for a run (avg 7 mph).  Per prior hoverboard experience I learned to appreciate wrist guards as #1 for gear selection

2 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

Personally, I hate that argument. If we go down the path of what affects society, we won't be allowed to do anything but live in a padded room.

Right on Marty!

46 minutes ago, Patton250 said:

 Yes this particular man wasn’t wearing a helmet. I didn’t know him we were just waiting at a red light. It was just outside of our neighborhood also. 

Back in the late 1990s I analyzed helmet statistics and found evidence that helmets actually kill more motorcycles than they save.  Why?  Because they only protect impacts between 8 to 13 mph (maybe it would have saved that particular guy).  However, they cause more broken necks than saved skulls.  They also cause heat/wind fatigue... though I like wearing one in the winter or in the rain because of the face-shield.  The data got killed from Abate, Maryland, etc... like an early version of 'info-warz". 

Anyway, my research indicated there was a 30% higher mortality per mile in states with mandatory helmet laws compared to states without such laws.  These states had 17% higher accident rates with mandatory helmets, and passengers with helmets had a 15% higher mortality rate per mile than passengers w/o helmets.  The most persuasive data inclued b4/after from states that either repealed or passed helmet laws.

Edited August 20, 2019 by Elliott Reitz
+

[Patton250]

18 minutes ago, Elliott Reitz said:

{+} I prefer to turn it back on them regarding choices for the ride... like "i might if I were riding for speed".... and "do you know helmets actually make motorcycles more dangerous?"  (my researched statistics later in this post - and IDK if anyone disagrees with me, its worth speaking the ####ing truth!)

I agree completely.  And I like the choice to me my own.  I don't gear up to take the dogs for a run (avg 7 mph).  Per prior hoverboard experience I learned to appreciate wrist guards as #1 for gear selection

Right on Marty!

Back in the late 1990s I analyzed helmet statistics and found evidence that helmets actually kill more motorcycles than they save.  Why?  Because they only protect impacts between 8 to 13 mph (maybe it would have saved that particular guy).  However, they cause more broken necks than saved skulls.  They also cause heat/wind fatigue... though I like wearing one in the winter or in the rain because of the face-shield.  The data got killed from Abate, Maryland, etc... like an early version of 'info-warz". 

Anyway, my research indicated there was a 30% higher mortality per mile in states with mandatory helmet laws compared to states without such laws.  These states had 17% higher accident rates with mandatory helmets, and passengers with helmets had a 15% higher mortality rate per mile than passengers w/o helmets.  The most persuasive data inclued b4/after from states that either repealed or passed helmet laws.

Um....... yeah......... right....... ok man.....

[Darrell Wesh]

18 minutes ago, Elliott Reitz said:

{+} I prefer to turn it back on them regarding choices for the ride... like "i might if I were riding for speed".... and "do you know helmets actually make motorcycles more dangerous?"  (my researched statistics later in this post - and IDK if anyone disagrees with me, its worth speaking the ####ing truth!)

I agree completely.  And I like the choice to me my own.  I don't gear up to take the dogs for a run (avg 7 mph).  Per prior hoverboard experience I learned to appreciate wrist guards as #1 for gear selection

Right on Marty!

Back in the late 1990s I analyzed helmet statistics and found evidence that helmets actually kill more motorcycles than they save.  Why?  Because they only protect impacts between 8 to 13 mph (maybe it would have saved that particular guy).  However, they cause more broken necks than saved skulls.  They also cause heat/wind fatigue... though I like wearing one in the winter or in the rain because of the face-shield.  The data got killed from Abate, Maryland, etc... like an early version of 'info-warz". 

Anyway, my research indicated there was a 30% higher mortality per mile in states with mandatory helmet laws compared to states without such laws.  These states had 17% higher accident rates with mandatory helmets, and passengers with helmets had a 15% higher mortality rate per mile than passengers w/o helmets.  The most persuasive data inclued b4/after from states that either repealed or passed helmet laws.

Most likely because riding without a helmet makes you ride more cautiously.

Some people also think the reverse is true, that riding with a helmet makes you take more risks. 

[LanghamP]

3 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Most likely because riding without a helmet makes you ride more cautiously.

Some people also think the reverse is true, that riding with a helmet makes you take more risks. 

I saw all studies assert the opposite, at least for motorcycle helmets (if we're talking about motorcycle helmets).

Like some demented social experiment, researchers looked at states that either invoked or repealed their helmet laws, and counted up the rider deaths and injuries. States with no helmet laws rode more often while having more crashes and deaths. 

What is interesting is the link between light trucks and motorcycle deaths; such vehicles kill motorcyclists.since such vehicles cause three times the deaths of a car collision, I wonder if it'd just be best to require a commercial drivers license and speed limiters.

Bicycle helmet laws, and the wearing of bicycle helmets, don't seem to work, except to reduce the number of riders on the streets.

 

[Darrell Wesh]

15 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Anyway, my research indicated there was a 30% higher mortality per mile in states with mandatory helmet laws compared to states without such laws.  These states had 17% higher accident rates with mandatory helmets, and passengers with helmets had a 15% higher mortality rate per mile than passengers w/o helmets.  The most persuasive data inclued b4/after from states that either repealed or passed helmet laws.

 

5 minutes ago, LanghamP said:

studies assert the opposite, at least for motorcycle helmets (if we're talking about motorcycle helmets).

Like some demented social experiment, researchers looked at states that either invoked or repealed their helmet laws, and counted up the rider deaths and injuries. States with no helmet laws rode more often while having more crashes and deaths. 

Well... which is true? we have two studies that are conflicting. 

@LanghamP perhaps your study didn’t take into account that more riders will mean more accidents by probability