Why the NEED to Lecture Gearless stranger on an EUC?

[Patton250]

20 minutes ago, ir_fuel said:

Or you can take a third path, whereby good healthcare is considered a luxury for those able to afford it, and even those should pay through the nose when they need it. That's what the United States has done.

 

 Brother. Don’t go there. 

  You really don’t want to. Believe me. :-)

[atdlzpae]

31 minutes ago, ir_fuel said:

So you have infinite resources on your bank account. Some illnesses/treatments can cost hunderds of thousands of euros, if your insurance doesn't intervene. Good luck paying all that from your bank account directly. You never know what might happen to you. You might get run over by someone, and that someone could have no money at all to pay your medical bills. What are you going to do next?

Not infinite, but a reasonable amount. Right now I have insurance because the gov forces me to. 3 years ago I didn't have by choice. And the worst thing that could really happen (broken leg or appendicitis) would cost 1-2k Euro. Even if I get cancer I'd probably rely on private healthcare since public healthcare has outrageous waiting times.

31 minutes ago, ir_fuel said:

So you claim that riding a 2-wheeled vehicle with a cruising speed of 10mph is as unsafe as riding an electric one-wheeled vehicle with a cruising speed of 20mph?

?????????????????????????????

Your direct quote: There are tons of alternative ways of transportation that are a lot safer. Walking or running for instance. There are absolutely zero reasons to be riding EUC's in our society.

No. You need to compare apples with apples. Compare either per km, or per minute. Per km is important if you're trying to get somewhere (commuting to work for example). Per minute if you're treating it as an exercise.

Safest to least safe per km IMO:

• Car
• Motorcycles
• Bicycle
• EUC / Scooters
• Quads
• Walking
• Running

Safest to least safe per minute IMO:

• Walking
• Car
• Running
• Bicycle
• EUC / Scooters
• Quads / Motorcycles

So my direct answer is:

There are absolutely zero reasons to be riding EUC's in our society. - I disagree. They're more convenient than bikes and slightly less safe, but not outrageously so (way safer than quads).

There are tons of alternative ways of transportation that are a lot safer. Walking or running for instance. - I disagree about walking and running. Per km (when you're trying to get to work) walking/running is way less safe than bicycle or EUC.

Edited August 11, 2019 by atdlzpae

[ir_fuel]

2 minutes ago, atdlzpae said:

There are tons of alternative ways of transportation that are a lot safer. Walking or running for instance. - I disagree about walking and running. Per km (when you're trying to get to work) walking/running is way less safe than bicycle or EUC.

Where did you get that statistic from?

[Rywokast]

36 minutes ago, ir_fuel said:

Yeah and people in good shape never ever ever ever get ill....

You are a typical 20's individual. They all feel immortal. Give it some time, that idea will change when you will see nasty shit happen around you, to people you least expect it from. 

Seriously. How short-sighted can you be.

not really what im saying at all.. im saying nobody should have to pay for me and i shouldnt have to pay for anybody else.. allow me the choice whether or not to purchase private insurance.. here, i have no choice.. everyone pays and everyone has it.. drug addicts get free drugs and needles and endless priority free care, meanwhile my granddad pays out the ass for his diabetes medication and has practically gone blind now because he couldnt get in to have his eyes operated on because the wait time is literally in years.. you have mandatory coverage for everyone then people take advantage of the system, wait times for anything are unbearably long and specialists are in short supply because they can make way more in the US

[ir_fuel]

10 minutes ago, Patton250 said:

 Brother. Don’t go there. 

  You really don’t want to. Believe me. :-)

If I see a 40K bill for an appendix surgery, and I see that where I live that same surgery costs 4K, BEFORE public health insurance intervenes (so apples to apples, not "you pay it through taxes anyway"), and I don't live in a third world country, or the ridiculous prices they tend to charge for trivial stuff such as pain killers and bandages, then, yes I dare go there.

Do you want the government or yourself to pay for your health insurance? That's one debate and there are good and bad sides to each option and there are many "hybrid" in betweens. 

Should a hospital be able to charge $50 for a stupid bandage? That is pure theft, whether it's paid by you out of your own pocket, by your insurance company or by your government.

 

Another example:

https://www.businessinsider.com/how-much-does-it-cost-to-have-a-baby-2018-4?r=US&IR=T

This has nothing to do with how your insurance system works. This is full price pre-insurance. 

 

And there are countless examples of this.

[ir_fuel]

1 minute ago, Rywokast said:

not really what im saying at all.. im saying nobody should have to pay for me and i shouldnt have to pay for anybody else.. allow me the choice whether or not to purchase private insurance.. here, i have no choice.. everyone pays and everyone has it.. drug addicts get free drugs and needles and endless priority free care, meanwhile my granddad pays out the ass for his diabetes medication and has practically gone blind now because he couldnt get in to have his eyes operated on because the wait time is literally in years.. you have mandatory coverage for everyone then people take advantage of the system, wait times for anything are unbearably long and specialists are in short supply because they can make way more in the US

That's more a problem with Poland than with the way healthcare works. We also have "forced" insurance and it doesn't work like that at all.

Maybe you should move then? Considering your age it should be easy to get settled in another country.

[Patton250]

1 minute ago, ir_fuel said:

If I see a 40K bill for an appendix surgery, and I see that where I live that same surgery costs 4K, BEFORE public health insurance intervenes (so apples to apples, not "you pay it through taxes anyway"), and I don't live in a third world country, or the ridiculous prices they tend to charge for trivial stuff such as pain killers and bandages, then, yes I dare go there.

Do you want the government or yourself to pay for your health insurance? That's one debate and there are good and bad sides to each option and there are many "hybrid" in betweens. 

Should a hospital be able to charge $50 for a stupid bandage? That is pure theft, whether it's paid by you out of your own pocket, by your insurance company or by your government.

 

Another example:

https://www.businessinsider.com/how-much-does-it-cost-to-have-a-baby-2018-4?r=US&IR=T

This has nothing to do with how your insurance system works. This is full price pre-insurance. 

 

And there are countless examples of this.

 OK I’m not gonna read your post but I’m going to request this of you. How about you keep your commentary on your own country and your own government? I will worry about my country and my government. Then let’s just keep the discussion to EUC’s.  After all that’s what we’re really here for. 

 And I’ll be kind enough to tell you why. Because if you squeeze your right index finger together with your right thumb as hard as you can, that’s how much I care about your opinion on anything that has to do with my country. I mean this with the upmost respect. :-) 

[ir_fuel]

There is also an ethical question. What are you going to do with people that in your example didn't take coverage, got seriously ill but can't pay the bill? Let them die?

[Rywokast]

Just now, ir_fuel said:

That's more a problem with Poland than with the way healthcare works. We also have "forced" insurance and it doesn't work like that at all.

Maybe you should move then? Considering your age it should be easy to get settled in another country.

there are a lot of countries that do it a lot better than us... i have no desire to move, it doesnt affect nor bother me personally, all im saying is given the choice i would definitely not choose the system we have in place as it is severely flawed.. obviously the US' is more so, but at least they have a choice

[ir_fuel]

1 minute ago, Patton250 said:

 OK I’m not gonna read your post

Whatever

1 minute ago, Patton250 said:

but I’m going to request this of you.

Sorry. I'm not going to read your post, so no idea what you said.

[Patton250]

Just now, ir_fuel said:

Whatever

Sorry. I'm not going to read your post, so no idea what you said.

 I’m sincerely glad we now see Eye to eye.  I would never be so arrogant as to comment on your country and its policies. I’d appreciate the same from you. 

[ir_fuel]

To get back on topic: mandating other people to wear helmets is hypocritical at best. Who are we to draw the line where one's risk taking is to stop. Ask 9 out of 10 people that never saw an euc and ask them if it's dangerous. What someone considers a nice pass-time is considered reckless behaviour by someone else. And everyone's idea of risky behaviour is different. For some it's downhill mountainbiking, for others it's eating steak 4 times a week.

[ir_fuel]

1 minute ago, Patton250 said:

 I’m sincerely glad we now see Eye to eye.  I would never be so arrogant as to comment on your country and its policies. I’d appreciate the same from you. 

WTF 

How about no.

It's ridiculous we can't have a civilised discussion about such things. I just gave my point of view. Please do comment on my country and its policies. I have absolutely no problem with that. We might even agree. Apparently that freedom of speech you all love so much can't be exercised when it is about certain subjects.

Djeez ...

[ir_fuel]

removed nonsense because of wrong country ... arg ... time to get to bed ..

Edited August 12, 2019 by ir_fuel

[atdlzpae]

8 minutes ago, ir_fuel said:

Where did you get that statistic from?

Experience. Please don't tell me that you don't walk or run sometimes.

Walking any distance longer than 10km is tiring and takes 2h. On a unicycle you can do 40km in the same time. I've done 60km a few days ago on a EUC. No problem.

Even if I was fit a marathon walking or running would leave me almost dying. Not to mention it would take me a whole day to walk that distance. I've done 50/60km walk a few times, a very unpleasant experience.

You risk breaking Achilles tendon while running. You risk busting your ankle if you step badly. You risk damaging your knees if you wear improper shoes. You can also faceplant, especially when exhausted.

EUC is safer than walking/running per km. Just like cars are safer than walking per km. Or how planes are safer than cars per km.

2 minutes ago, ir_fuel said:

Maybe you should move then? Considering your age it should be easy to get settled in another country.

Rywokast is in Canada.

Poland is an awful place to earn money, but a great place to live. Unlike in UK potato peelers are still legal and there have been zero beheadings or terrorist attacks so far. And Ukrainian immigrants behave themselves just fine.

[ir_fuel]

1 minute ago, atdlzpae said:

Poland is an awful place to earn money

Quite a few come earn money in our country. Especially in construction.

[ir_fuel]

2 minutes ago, atdlzpae said:

Rywokast is in Canada.

Seems I got everyone confused here, except for Florida Man  

Time to go to bed it seems. 

[Rywokast]

9 minutes ago, ir_fuel said:

There is also an ethical question. What are you going to do with people that in your example didn't take coverage, got seriously ill but can't pay the bill? Let them die?

that is not my decision and has nothing to do with me.. its not my dilemma... maybe, just maybe this government if it wasnt so corrupt would spend its own money on basic healthcare for those who cant afford it... maybe instead of paying politicians more money than they could spend in a lifetime, or the PM spending taxpayer money on personal holidays and campaigning... THAT money should be used, instead of forcing everyone in the country to pay MSP every month even if they dont want it.. and then if they need it theyre left with no choice but to get on a ridiculously long wait list...

[ir_fuel]

3 minutes ago, atdlzpae said:

and there have been zero beheadings or terrorist attacks so far. And Ukrainian immigrants behave themselves just fine.

lol, but true. There are maybe things to improve, but your immigration policies isn't one of those  

[ir_fuel]

1 minute ago, Rywokast said:

maybe, just maybe this government if it wasnt so corrupt would spend its own money on basic healthcare for those who cant afford it... maybe instead of paying politicians more money than they could spend in a lifetime, or the PM spending taxpayer money on personal holidays and campaigning... THAT money should be used, instead of forcing everyone in the country to pay MSP every month even if they dont want it.. and then if they need it theyre left with no choice but to get on a ridiculously long wait list...

I don't think there is one country on this planet where this kind of stuff doesn't happen, unfortunately. Seems impossible to solve :/ 

[ir_fuel]

9 minutes ago, atdlzpae said:

Experience. Please don't tell me that you don't walk or run sometimes.

Walking any distance longer than 10km is tiring and takes 2h. On a unicycle you can do 40km in the same time. I've done 60km a few days ago on a EUC. No problem.

Even if I was fit a marathon walking or running would leave me almost dying. Not to mention it would take me a whole day to walk that distance. I've done 50/60km walk a few times, a very unpleasant experience.

Just found some stats:

Quote

A recent analysis compared the fatality rate by mode of travel in B.C. There were 14 deaths per 100 million trips for bicycling, 15 for walking and 10 for driving – remarkably similar. Per 100 million kilometres travelled, there were three deaths for bicycling, seven for walking and one for driving. Using distance rather than trips shows that cyclists and pedestrians are more vulnerable road users.

 

[atdlzpae]

A study by the American College of Cardiology in 2009, found that the risk of death from running a marathon is 0.8 per 100,000 people.

That translates to 1 death per 3376000km, which translates to 29 deaths per 100 million kilometers.

 

Actually, if someone is willing to do the research, there are enough numbers to estimate the risk of death on an electric scooters.

Were there any deaths on EUC's?

Edited August 12, 2019 by atdlzpae

[Rywokast]

5 minutes ago, ir_fuel said:

I don't think there is one country on this planet where this kind of stuff doesn't happen, unfortunately. Seems impossible to solve :/ 

yup.. greed runs the planet.. my only point is, at least it is here, we dont have free healthcare, we have forced insurance with slow af healthcare.. i pay the exact same amount as an alcoholic whos extremely overweight, i pay as much as a chain smoker, i pay as much as anyone no matter what i want or what coverage i have and i have no choice to pay more for more, or less for less.. those who are drug addicts and break the law daily pay nothing, yet have more priority over me.. it is not a good system even though the government will boast about it and mock countries with privatized healthcare

[ir_fuel]

1 minute ago, Rywokast said:

. i pay the exact same amount as an alcoholic whos extremely overweight, i pay as much as a chain smoker, i pay as much as anyone no matter what i want or what coverage i have and i have no choice to pay more for more, or less for less..

Jup, that's indeed the big downside of any "flat rate" system. I have a life insurance policy for the loan on my house. You need to fill out a bunch of questions + pass a health exam, and then they decide what you are going to pay. My wife and I both have this. Back when we did it she paid less than I, because apparently men have a higher risk of death. 

Well, guess what. Nowadays men and women pay the same because it was deemed "discrimination" to have different amounts for men and women ... The net result being that women now simply pay more.

[Patton250]

28 minutes ago, ir_fuel said:

WTF 

How about no.

It's ridiculous we can't have a civilised discussion about such things. I just gave my point of view. Please do comment on my country and its policies. I have absolutely no problem with that. We might even agree. Apparently that freedom of speech you all love so much can't be exercised when it is about certain subjects.

Djeez ...

 I’m quite confident it would not end well if I gave you my opinion on European socialism. That’s why I thought we should just stick to Electric unicycles.  I very much value your opinion on that as well as your insight and experience.   So thank you.