KS 16S or KS 18l for my first wheel? Help please

[Marty Backe]

3 minutes ago, Rywokast said:

you do not.. and you dont have to give your phone number or call to china thats just with the newest all blue app that you have to register.. use the lame orange social app and you can unlock it no problem.. its literally only locked because of the issues they had with batch 1 wheels turning on in shipping.. now they cant do that

Thanks for the clarification. Good to know 

[Dave U]

2 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

you dont have to give your phone number or call to china thats just with the newest all blue app that you have to register.

Well here is another one, if you want to update your 18L/XL to 1.13 you need to get the new blue KS app and enter your info including phone number. The old lame orange app won't let you, so they got you again by requesting more info on you.

[Rywokast]

5 hours ago, Dave U said:

Well here is another one, if you want to update your 18L/XL to 1.13 you need to get the new blue KS app and enter your info including phone number. The old lame orange app won't let you, so they got you again by requesting more info on you.

hmm lame.. but at least you can unlock it and have a functional wheel.. probably the majority of people dont do firmware updates and new ones should be on newer firmware if you just got it

anyone wants that app they can get it here https://gofile.io/?c=gKTAEv

Edited July 8, 2019 by Rywokast

[Nils]

27 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

Maybe I'm really out-of-loop now and don't understand how bad it is. You actually have to have personal contact with a KS representative to unlock a wheel? And once unlock, do you ever have to use the KS app again?

 

18 minutes ago, Rywokast said:

you do not.. and you dont have to give your phone number or call to china thats just with the newest all blue app that you have to register.. use the lame orange social app and you can unlock it no problem.. its literally only locked because of the issues they had with batch 1 wheels turning on in shipping.. now they cant do that

Marty, Rywokast: My post didn't refer to general unlocking of wheels' speed, but the fact that apparently newer KS wheels employ geo-based restrictions in order to allegedly protect local sellers, which makes me vary of of purchasing any KS wheels before I know the full story and extents of it.

Now, this is not from personal experience, so I'll happily stand corrected if this has been addressed in the last couple of months or if I've misunderstood the previous posts attesting to this, but this is my source:

Starting at the relevant page in the discussion provides some background:  https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/13284-has-anybody-problems-withe-the-new-kingsong-app/page/3/

 

Edited July 7, 2019 by Nils

[Rywokast]

8 minutes ago, Nils said:

 

Marty, Rywokast: My post didn't refer to general unlocking of wheels' speed, but the fact that apparently newer KS wheels employ geo-based restrictions in order to allegedly protect local sellers, which makes me vary of of purchasing any KS wheels before I know the full story and extents of it.

Now, this is not from personal experience, so I'll happily stand corrected if this has been addressed in the last couple of months or if I've misunderstood the previous posts attesting to this, but this is my source:

Starting at the relevant page in the discussion provides some background:  https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/13284-has-anybody-problems-withe-the-new-kingsong-app/page/3/

 

i think thats just general firmware updating problems.. anybody has the slight chance to brick any EUC with a firmware update, i think its just some annoying lost serial thing that sometimes happens maybe.. to let you know, i upgrade the firmware on my KS18XL with the newest blue app and had zero issues.. im pretty sure its all figured out now ive seen multiple reports later on in that thread that people got it working now.. but dont forget firmware upgrades are always optional and gotway wheels arent even capable of it.. you can literally just unlock the wheel/speed and never use the app again.. my original ks16 i had for two years and it wasnt until i got the second one that i ever tried upgrading the firmware (successfully)

Edited July 7, 2019 by Rywokast

[Marty Backe]

19 minutes ago, Dave U said:

Well here is another one, if you want to update your 18L/XL to 1.13 you need to get the new blue KS app and enter your info including phone number. The old lame orange app won't let you, so they got you again by requesting more info on you.

I guess that explains why I haven't been able to upgrade to 1.13

I'll temporarily install it. Thanks.

[Rywokast]

Just now, Marty Backe said:

I guess that explains why I haven't been able to upgrade to 1.13

I'll temporarily install it. Thanks.

i think they just no longer support the orange app.. same as the very old green app the only wheel it can find is up to the 16S, and i cant use it to upgrade to a recent firmware

[MaxLinux]

4 minutes ago, Rywokast said:

My post didn't refer to general unlocking of wheels' speed

As I understand it, there is another type of "unlocking" involved with at least some 18XLs. Apparently at least some (including mine) come "locked" in the sense that they cannot fully turn on, which as I understand it was because in early shipments quite a few were ruined because they turned on and were spinning inside the box during shipping. So at least some, including mine, require an initial "unlocking" to allow the wheel to fully turn on. There's a sticker or slip of paper (I forget which) telling the customer to download the app and unlock the wheel before doing anything else.

[Nils]

19 minutes ago, Rywokast said:

i think thats just general firmware updating problems.. anybody has the slight chance to brick any EUC with a firmware update, i think its just some annoying lost serial thing that sometimes happens maybe.. to let you know, i upgrade the firmware on my KS18XL with the newest blue app and had zero issues.. im pretty sure its all figured out now ive seen multiple reports later on in that thread that people got it working now.. but dont forget firmware upgrades are always optional and gotway wheels arent even capable of it.. you can literally just unlock the wheel/speed and never use the app again.. my original ks16 i had for two years and it wasnt until i got the second one that i ever tried upgrading the firmware (successfully)

No, that's not my understanding from reading the linked page:

 

Edited July 7, 2019 by Nils

[Nils]

10 minutes ago, MaxLinux said:

As I understand it, there is another type of "unlocking" involved with at least some 18XLs. Apparently at least some (including mine) come "locked" in the sense that they cannot fully turn on, which as I understand it was because in early shipments quite a few were ruined because they turned on and were spinning inside the box during shipping. So at least some, including mine, require an initial "unlocking" to allow the wheel to fully turn on. There's a sticker or slip of paper (I forget which) telling the customer to download the app and unlock the wheel before doing anything else.

Yes, there is, from what I understand for preventing the wheels to accidentally turning on during shipping IIRC, but this is something else.

[Rywokast]

3 minutes ago, Nils said:

No, that's not my understanding from reading the linked page:

 

ewheels customers have had this issue too though.. if theres the odd chance you have the issue i dont think it wouldnt be possible to sort it out, otherwise dealers wouldnt be selling them.. i think its due to countries that impose these restrictions like singapore who will not allow them to be sold unless they have these restrictions, and its just some mixup.. there are no such restrictions in north america

Edited July 7, 2019 by Rywokast

[US69]

4 hours ago, Benphysics said:

I just want you to be aware that, due to Kingsong's new app, I now have had my new wheel (KS 18XL) for two days and still cannot enter the app to unlock my wheel. I've crashed my phone; down to its android OS. Had Walmart exchange the phone. I spent all day yesterday, all night , and am still trying. The app requires insane permissions to work, such as: 1) allow Kingsong to make and manage phone calls on my device, 2) to access photos, media, and all files on my device, 3) take pictures and record videos from my device, 4) and record voices and audio from my device... This is apart from location and storage permissions... At this point, I sincerely regret buying a Kingsong wheel. I should have chosen a Gotway. If you want this wheel, You can have it for $2,000. flat. I purchased it from ewheels; it should have full warranty and has "0" miles. I am this frustrated.

The KS app needs exactly the same permissions as any other EUC app with included Social media and maps

Same as GW, same as other wheels...Thats GPS for location, camera and mike for recording videos through app.

Sorry, for your bad experience....but also Jason should be able to help you out.

 

1 hour ago, Nils said:

Well, everyone don't calm down too much. This later development with the KS wheels requiring phone-home to China (and personal contact with a KS representative) to unlock speeds based on geo-locking for certain locations for instance is quite frankly not something that seems OK to me no matter what (being in one of these non-mainstream regions). I'd be very hesitant to buy a KS wheel for my next wheel if this persists, and making this known to KS is the only way we'll potentially see a change. Of course, that's only if people cares about it and are vocal about it. As I've stated in an earlier post in another thread I'm expecting to buy a fully functional physical wheel and not some weird DVD region thing I need to unlock at the discretion of the manufacturer: no, just sell me a good wheel and get out of my hair. Unlocking based on distance, locking down speeds due to my geographical location - no thanks!

It's really not OK, and we shouldn't give them a pass on it.

It seams that some infos are really, really misinterpreted....

 

 

Ok,  to clear things  up:

As someone else said, KS (and GW an IM and all) dont like grey imports!

So the ONLY thing that is kinda Locked, is that Chinese Serial number (aka grey imported) wheels will NOT allow you to set the speed....and that does ONLY not work in countrys with EXCLUSIVE sellers....for example in France!

Wheels from Other countrys work EVERYWHERE....so it also does not affect second hand market.

And NO ...the app does NOT need to „phone home to china or make contact with a KS official“

 

And in the case of any problems/errors or what not...it is ALLWAYS possible to have your seller reset the wheel...

 

And for general ‚locking the wheel“...

All KS wheels are now motor locked, to prevent the wheels from starting in the package...can be unlocked by app easily. There should be also a sticker on the box about that....

 

 

Edited July 7, 2019 by US69

[Dave U]

59 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

I guess that explains why I haven't been able to upgrade to 1.13

I'll temporarily install it. Thanks.

Marty, after you do the update you should re-calibrate the wheel, if not you might feel pedal dipping while turning.

[Marty Backe]

17 minutes ago, Dave U said:

Marty, after you do the update you should re-calibrate the wheel, if not you might feel pedal dipping while turning.

Thanks. I just updated. It literally took over 40 tries. The app would show progress, and reset of 8%, 14%, 4%, etc. Then finally it had a run that reached 100-percent.

On mine it automatically entered the calibration mode when I turned the wheel on.

All good now. I think I'll leave this app installed and fully enabled to see how they spy on me    Let me know if you see any secret photos of me on the web 

Edited July 7, 2019 by Marty Backe

[Rywokast]

4 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

Thanks. I just updated. It literally took over 40 tries. The app was show progress, and reset of 8%, 14%, 4%, etc. Then finally it had a run that reached 100-percent.

On mine it automatically entered the calibration mode when I turned the wheel on.

All good now. I think I'll leave this app installed and fully enabled to see how they spy on me    Let me know if you see any secret photos of me on the web 

fyi anyone wondering you can, with the app still installed, remove all of its permissions in the android apps list.. then if you absolutely have to use it again, just accept the permissions again.. but youd have to be pretty paranoid haha

[Thatmustache]

5 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

All good now. I think I'll leave this app installed and fully enabled to see how they spy on me    Let me know if you see any secret photos of me on the web 

@Marty Backe which app was it that you used? The official Kingsong app, or another?

[Marty Backe]

Just now, Thatmustache said:

@Marty Backe which app was it that you used? The official Kingsong app, or another?

I archived my 1.54 version and then installed the latest from the Playstore. Took a few tries to register because they only give you 60-seconds to complete the form and half of that time is lost waiting for the round-trip to China.

[Dave U]

27 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

half of that time is lost waiting for the round-trip to China.

[mrelwood]

My friend here in Finland had issues with registering with the new app for his brand new 18XL. He was also very frustrated, naturally. But the way I see it, while it may take even a few days to get the wheel working, once it’s done it’s done and you’ll have the best all-around wheel that is currently available.

I chose the MSX for the huge tire, and I do benefit from it. But the wheel required several laborous modifications for it to be comfortable enough for me. And still every time I try the 18XL, my first impression is how comfortable and usable the wheel is right out of the box.

Some people are happy with their MSX as is, but compared to the much more refined 18XL, I think the difference in comfort is huge. And a large difference in range as well. I never recommend the MSX, especially for a first wheel, unless the rider is certain that he would utilize the wheel in a way that would make it a worthwhile purchase over the 18XL, and that he’d be ready to do some modifications if needed.

[Joker10]

48 minutes ago, mrelwood said:

I chose the MSX for the huge tire, and I do benefit from it. But the wheel required several laborous modifications for it to be comfortable enough for me. And still every time I try the 18XL, my first impression is how comfortable and usable the wheel is right out of the box.

I am surprised you went with the MSX mrelwood, I believe you have many miles on the 16s if my memory is correct.  I had to stay with king song after all the problem free miles , and big smiles I had with the 16s.  Plus the oversized pedals are so comfortable.

 

[mrelwood]

1 hour ago, Joker10 said:

I am surprised you went with the MSX mrelwood, I believe you have many miles on the 16s if my memory is correct.  I had to stay with king song after all the problem free miles , and big smiles I had with the 16s.  Plus the oversized pedals are so comfortable.

I do, 9200km on the 16S. The two reasons that forced me to take the risk with a Gotway were that 1) 18XL was not out yet, and the 18L was not a big enough improvement in range, and 2) I needed the big tire. I had been riding on a 2.5" tire for most of the time with 16S, and after crashing due to it sinking in wet gravel I decided I need to have a wider tire. Had the 18XL been out at the time my choice would've been very difficult.

[Thatmustache]

@mrelwood i imagine the MSX is still a beast though! How do you feel about the inclined foot pedals?

[Rywokast]

3 minutes ago, Thatmustache said:

@mrelwood i imagine the MSX is still a beast though! How do you feel about the inclined foot pedals?

like this haha 

 

[mrelwood]

4 minutes ago, Thatmustache said:

@mrelwood i imagine the MSX is still a beast though! How do you feel about the inclined foot pedals?

Yeah, I didn't feel them for long... Filed the angle down to 11 degrees quite instantly.

[Thatmustache]

4 minutes ago, mrelwood said:

Yeah, I didn't feel them for long... Filed the angle down to 11 degrees quite instantly.

@mrelwood Whoa!! That's an effective way to change how you ride it lol! It feels like i hear people say they hate the angled foot pedals, or it doesn't bother them at all. I don't know yet whether i wouldn't mind them, or if I'd hate them. I would hate to spend all my money and then find out I hate riding a specific wheel. Hmmm