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andrew900nyc

Which BIG wheel has the MOST TORQUE?

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I'm curious as to the following

Out of the high-end, big wheels, which one do you think has the most torque?

In a race, which big wheel do you think would be the fastest at 0 - 10 mph?

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18L, 18XL, 18S, MSV3S, MSX, Monster.. if you consider the Nikola or 16X to be big wheels they would easily beat out any of these 

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1 hour ago, Darrell Wesh said:

It doesn’t matter. The differences are so minimal and even if they weren’t weight differences matter so it’s not like you can expect to beat someone on an MSX whose 20pounds lighter than you despite your 18XL accelerating faster. 

Also, it’s not a throttle where you can just pull or twist to the max. You have no clue if you’re accelerating as fast as you can unless you almost or do cut out (Unless you get beeps every time you lean, then some days you lean 90% of max and other days only 80% of max) You get what I’m saying?

There’s no point racing EUC’s 

i think it was theoretical.. of course something like the MCM5 or Tesla would have way more torque than the monster, no matter who is riding it.. if youre saying big wheels only presumably ~18"+ then it comes down to the weight of it, the tire size, and the firmware or board layout.. but yes, it is so minimal that on average you would not know the difference going from one to the next

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2 hours ago, Rywokast said:

18L, 18XL, 18S, MSV3S, MSX, Monster.. if you consider the Nikola or 16X to be big wheels they would easily beat out any of these 

Out of interest,  although the difference is minimal, is this list in order in your opinion? So 18L having the most torque?

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2 hours ago, Rywokast said:

18L, 18XL, 18S, MSV3S, MSX, Monster.. if you consider the Nikola or 16X to be big wheels they would easily beat out any of these  

I can sign this list in this order, too! i own or owned all those wheels, beside the V3s.

I would make no difference between Land XL as the only difference is battery size.

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3 minutes ago, RoCan said:

Out of interest,  although the difference is minimal, is this list in order in your opinion? So 18L having the most torque?

partially but nobody will have a definitive answer lol.. im going by motor power, tire width, weight etc.. i know the V3S is lighter than the 18XL but the V3S is quite old now so not up to spec compared to todays wheels.. the tire on the MSX is quite a bit bigger than anything else on this list besides the monster, and its quite obvious given how huge the monster is why it would be the most sluggish... i wouldnt let it influence your decision really i mean unless comparing first to last here were probably taking about a fraction of a second difference lol

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6 minutes ago, US69 said:

I can sign this list in this order, too! i own or owned all those wheels, beside the V3s.

I would make no difference between Land XL as the only difference is battery size.

i have owned the V3S and it felt sluggish in comparison.. reason i put the L before XL is because it weighs less, so technically it shouldnt be possible for it to have LESS intitial speed, im not entirely sure if it is more or the same, but i have seen quite a few comments from people who have tried both saying the L was ever so slightly more peppy.. of course it could just be their imagination no one has done any scientific testing of this haha

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Thanks for your answers! I very much appreciate the feedback, especially from people who have experience riding several wheels.

On 6/17/2019 at 1:20 AM, Rywokast said:

i think it was theoretical.

Yes, it was a theoretical curiosity, so I wasn't asking because I thought there would be significant real world differences. 

On 6/17/2019 at 12:03 AM, Darrell Wesh said:

Also, it’s not a throttle where you can just pull or twist to the max. You have no clue if you’re accelerating as fast as you can unless you almost or do cut out (Unless you get beeps every time you lean, then some days you lean 90% of max and other days only 80% of max) You get what I’m saying?

There’s no point racing EUC’s 

I appreciate your excellent points about the limitations of EUC's, but I wholeheartedly disagree with your statement that "There's no point racing EUC's."

The reasons I disagree with your statement are as follows:

I don't think the top speed limitation (risk of a cut-out) is a significant limiting factor. There is plenty of skill needed to race through a road racing track on any motorized vehicle that is capable of a decent speed, so I don't think a top speed limitation will be a problem. It takes skill to know how to ride the right lines for the course, to be able to brake hard at the right points, to be able to hook turns and accelerate hard at the right points, and to be able to overtake fellow racers, even if there is a top speed limitation.

At some point, that top speed limitation will disappear when the EUC's are faster than could be ridden on the track or faster than any racer is willing or able to ride. For example, let's hypothetically say EUC's evolve to the point where the top of the line race versions have a maximum speed of 100 mph or less (mainly due to wind/drag resistance factors of the rider in the upright position). If EUC races were held on certain kart racing tracks (road racing, not oval), the limitations of the size of the track (the limited distance between turns) would prevent racers from ever being able to reach the maximum speed of their wheel, so there would always be excess power available that wouldn't be utilized. Even if the track weren't a limiting factor, wind resistance will be, so theoretically there could always be a wheel that has the needed reserve of extra power. 

Until such time that a wheel has more power than a racer could utilize at max speed, the cut-out is simply an issue racers need to be skilled enough to contend with. Top racers will have a feel for how fast they're going even if they don't have a speedometer. While wind conditions and other factors will change the speed at which the wheel will cut out, that is part of the risk top racers will deal with and it will be something that makes the sport even more exciting to spectators. Ultimately, I believe it will a be non-issue when wheels have excess power at max speed, but until then it simply adds that extra level of excitement for the spectators.

Lots of people love racing and I think the unique qualities of EUC's could make EUC racing one of the most unique, interesting, and exciting forms of motorsport. It will also help drive development of better wheels for consumers, since the technology from the racing wheels will trickle down to the consumer wheels. 

Just have a look at the video below of chooch tech racing his wheel at a kart track in Colorado. Now imagine chooch tech racing against twenty other highly skilled riders, shoulder to shoulder,  on top-of-the line racing wheels that have a max speed of 75 mph. Do you think that would be exciting? I sure do! I'd be interested to hear the opinions of other members of the forum on this topic.

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, andrew900nyc said:

Thanks for your answers! I very much appreciate the feedback, especially from people who have experience riding several wheels.

Yes, it was a theoretical curiosity, so I wasn't asking because I thought there would be significant real world differences. 

I appreciate your excellent points about the limitations of EUC's, but I wholeheartedly disagree with your statement that "There's no point racing EUC's."

The reasons I disagree with your statement are as follows:

I don't think the top speed limitation (risk of a cut-out) is a significant limiting factor. There is plenty of skill needed to race through a road racing track on any motorized vehicle that is capable of a decent speed, so I don't think a top speed limitation will be a problem. It takes skill to know how to ride the right lines for the course, to be able to brake hard at the right points, to be able to hook turns and accelerate hard at the right points, and to be able to overtake fellow racers, even if there is a top speed limitation.

At some point, that top speed limitation will disappear when the EUC's are faster than could be ridden on the track or faster than any racer is willing or able to ride. For example, let's hypothetically say EUC's evolve to the point where the top of the line race versions have a maximum speed of 100 mph or less (mainly due to wind/drag resistance factors of the rider in the upright position). If EUC races were held on certain kart racing tracks (road racing, not oval), the limitations of the size of the track (the limited distance between turns) would prevent racers from ever being able to reach the maximum speed of their wheel, so there would always be excess power available that wouldn't be utilized. Even if the track weren't a limiting factor, wind resistance will be, so theoretically there could always be a wheel that has the needed reserve of extra power. 

Until such time that a wheel has more power than a racer could utilize at max speed, the cut-out is simply an issue racers need to be skilled enough to contend with. Top racers will have a feel for how fast they're going even if they don't have a speedometer. While wind conditions and other factors will change the speed at which the wheel will cut out, that is part of the risk top racers will deal with and it will be something that makes the sport even more exciting to spectators. Ultimately, I believe it will a be non-issue when wheels have excess power at max speed, but until then it simply adds that extra level of excitement for the spectators.

Lots of people love racing and I think the unique qualities of EUC's could make EUC racing one of the most unique, interesting, and exciting forms of motorsport. It will also help drive development of better wheels for consumers, since the technology from the racing wheels will trickle down to the consumer wheels. 

Just have a look at the video below of chooch tech racing his wheel at a kart track in Colorado. Now imagine chooch tech racing against twenty other highly skilled riders, shoulder to shoulder,  on top-of-the line racing wheels that have a max speed of 75 mph. Do you think that would be exciting? I sure do! I'd be interested to hear the opinions of other members of the forum on this topic.

 

 

 

Uhhh hell yes. I think euc races and competitions of all sorts will be huge  and awesome.. I would love. To race EUC’S . And. I would support and watch them!

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1 hour ago, andrew900nyc said:

Thanks for your answers! I very much appreciate the feedback, especially from people who have experience riding several wheels.

Yes, it was a theoretical curiosity, so I wasn't asking because I thought there would be significant real world differences. 

I appreciate your excellent points about the limitations of EUC's, but I wholeheartedly disagree with your statement that "There's no point racing EUC's."

The reasons I disagree with your statement are as follows:

I don't think the top speed limitation (risk of a cut-out) is a significant limiting factor. There is plenty of skill needed to race through a road racing track on any motorized vehicle that is capable of a decent speed, so I don't think a top speed limitation will be a problem. It takes skill to know how to ride the right lines for the course, to be able to brake hard at the right points, to be able to hook turns and accelerate hard at the right points, and to be able to overtake fellow racers, even if there is a top speed limitation.

At some point, that top speed limitation will disappear when the EUC's are faster than could be ridden on the track or faster than any racer is willing or able to ride. For example, let's hypothetically say EUC's evolve to the point where the top of the line race versions have a maximum speed of 100 mph or less (mainly due to wind/drag resistance factors of the rider in the upright position). If EUC races were held on certain kart racing tracks (road racing, not oval), the limitations of the size of the track (the limited distance between turns) would prevent racers from ever being able to reach the maximum speed of their wheel, so there would always be excess power available that wouldn't be utilized. Even if the track weren't a limiting factor, wind resistance will be, so theoretically there could always be a wheel that has the needed reserve of extra power. 

Until such time that a wheel has more power than a racer could utilize at max speed, the cut-out is simply an issue racers need to be skilled enough to contend with. Top racers will have a feel for how fast they're going even if they don't have a speedometer. While wind conditions and other factors will change the speed at which the wheel will cut out, that is part of the risk top racers will deal with and it will be something that makes the sport even more exciting to spectators. Ultimately, I believe it will a be non-issue when wheels have excess power at max speed, but until then it simply adds that extra level of excitement for the spectators.

Lots of people love racing and I think the unique qualities of EUC's could make EUC racing one of the most unique, interesting, and exciting forms of motorsport. It will also help drive development of better wheels for consumers, since the technology from the racing wheels will trickle down to the consumer wheels. 

Just have a look at the video below of chooch tech racing his wheel at a kart track in Colorado. Now imagine chooch tech racing against twenty other highly skilled riders, shoulder to shoulder,  on top-of-the line racing wheels that have a max speed of 75 mph. Do you think that would be exciting? I sure do! I'd be interested to hear the opinions of other members of the forum on this topic.

 

 

 

Cool, but that wasn’t what I meant when I said “racing”. Usually “race” evokes visions of friends trying to race each other in a straight line ala drag racing.

This typical drag racing is pointless on an EUC, as that will inevitably result in someone going home hurt. 

Your first post asked which wheel was fastest 0-10mph, so you can surely see why I assumed you meant a straight line race. Now you’re talking about track racing with twists and turns. 

This perspective of racing like “EUC NASCAR” is very different. In that scenario it would certainly be feasible and fun to “race” EUC’s and skill would be a large factor. 

Edited by Darrell Wesh

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12 hours ago, Darrell Wesh said:

Cool, but that wasn’t what I meant when I said “racing”. Usually “race” evokes visions of friends trying to race each other in a straight line ala drag racing.

This typical drag racing is pointless on an EUC, as that will inevitably result in someone going home hurt. 

Your first post asked which wheel was fastest 0-10mph, so you can surely see why I assumed you meant a straight line race. Now you’re talking about track racing with twists and turns. 

This perspective of racing like “EUC NASCAR” is very different. In that scenario it would certainly be feasible and fun to “race” EUC’s and skill would be a large factor. 

 

Oh, ok, seems like we had a simple misunderstanding. Thanks for clarifying! 

I agree with you that straight line drag racing is probably pointless. In any case, I have no interest in it.

Yes, I can surely see why you would have assumed that I meant a straight line race. It was my mistake for not specifically mentioning that I had a road racing type of track in mind.

NASCAR is an oval track, so that's not really what I have in mind, either. The type of racing I'm most in favor of for EUC's would take place on smaller versions of the kind of road racing tracks where Formula One and MototGP races are held. Fortunately, these types of smaller road racing tracks are all over the USA, Europe, Australia, and elsewhere because they're outdoor kart racing tracks. If an EUC racing league were formed, I think outdoor kart racing tracks would be the ideal venue. 

 

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You know in 0-10mph highest acceleration may be in mten3 ;)

Which has advantage in torque due to wheel diameter as well low weight and is very easy to lean forward 

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19 hours ago, andrew900nyc said:

I think the unique qualities of EUC's could make EUC racing one of the most unique, interesting, and exciting forms of motorsport.

I think it's coming. In the past year we've seen a growing trend of EUC competition events, several of which included timed laps around courses. So the riders were "racing" each other, just not simultaneously. This will lead inevitably to a field of racers on the track together.

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I feel like it’d be entertaining to watch and would generate good viewership if given tv coverage. Moto GP but with unicycles. 

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11 minutes ago, Darrell Wesh said:

I feel like it’d be entertaining to watch and would generate good viewership if given tv coverage. Moto GP but with unicycles. 

Very entertaining indeed! Exactly what I've been thinking! Front and back rider cameras, vehicle/gimbal mounted stabilized cameras, and drone cameras could provide outstanding angles and perspectives of the racing action! And guess what, the Formula E courses are the perfect length (they're shorter than Formula One) for EUC racing! Can you picture the top EUC racers in the world competing against each other at an opening race on the Formula E circuit? I can... and I think it would be incredible! My torque question transformed into a thread about EUC racing. Perhaps we should create a separate thread about this with an appropriate title so that more people will see it and we can obtain more thoughts on this idea.  

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6 hours ago, LucasD said:

You know in 0-10mph highest acceleration may be in mten3 ;)

Which has advantage in torque due to wheel diameter as well low weight and is very easy to lean forward 

Since the topic is = Which BIG wheel has the MOST TORQUE?

mten3 is way off lol :P

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2 hours ago, andrew900nyc said:

Front and back rider cameras, vehicle/gimbal mounted stabilized cameras, and drone cameras could provide outstanding angles and perspectives of the racing action! And guess what, the Formula E courses are the perfect length (they're shorter than Formula One) for EUC racing! Can you picture the top EUC racers in the world competing against each other at an opening race on the Formula E circuit?

I'd love to race against Chooch, Freeman, and any other top riders! The track in Colorado looks awesome, was sorry to have missed. Hopefully everyone can make it out to the LA EUC Games in October. It was a blast finishing second at the EUC Grand Prix in April, and a longer, wider track would only make things more fun and interesting.

But to bring things back on topic, the 84V Nikola has the most usable torque I have felt from a larger wheel. 

 

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I guess at the moment it would be MSX 100v. The "Plus" mod by EUCService (Poland) has even more cells, so I guess that increases torque? 

Other than that, I'm looking forward to see what the specs for the Aikesu A9 will be next month. That motor looks huge, I think it is 5000w.

mmexport1561031370092.jpg

If it is 5000w, 245.9 torque (can't find which torque the MSX has):

Screenshot-20190620-134038-com-brave-bro

Screenshot-20190620-134024-com-brave-bro

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On 6/21/2019 at 10:38 AM, Jean Dublin said:

I guess at the moment it would be MSX 100v. The "Plus" mod by EUCService (Poland) has even more cells, so I guess that increases torque? 

Other than that, I'm looking forward to see what the specs for the Aikesu A9 will be next month. That motor looks huge, I think it is 5000w.

Earlier respondents to this post thought other big wheels had more torque than the MSX. I just rode my new 100v MSX for the first time today, but I don't have any other big wheels to compare it to, so I have no basis for an opinion on this topic. The only other wheel I've ridden is my MTen3 and now I know why that wheel is considered to be so zippy and highly maneuverable! 

That A9 looks interesting. Hopefully it will have better performance and will be more successful than RYNO motors' one-wheeled vehicle.

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It would be cool if anyone would actually test their wheel torque.  How? 

1. Get a hanging scale, eg: https://www.ebay.com/itm/500kg-1100-LBS-Digital-Hanging-Scale-Heavy-Industrial-Crane-Scale-W-LCD-SCREEN/201359235679?hash=item2ee1f21a5f:g:cE4AAOSwdzxdl-eu

2. tie it to both foot plates and a parked vehicle. 

3. use a pair of crow-bars to pry down on the front of the foot plates

4. Observe max static force on the scale.

5. Convert the force from lbs to motor torque in ft-lbs by proportioning it to the wheel radius.  For example, if its a 19" wheel, the radius is 9.5".  So multiply the force by (12/9.5) to get ft-lbs.

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2 hours ago, Elliott Reitz said:

It would be cool if anyone would actually test their wheel torque.  [...]

But that completely misses measuring torque at anything above 0 kph.

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Posted (edited)
On 6/20/2019 at 5:49 PM, LucasD said:

You know in 0-10mph highest acceleration may be in mten3 ;)

Which has advantage in torque due to wheel diameter as well low weight and is very easy to lean forward 

The mten3 from a standing 0-10mph is one of the slower wheels. I will show you why in my upcoming video. Make sure you get a rolling start before you race anyone on that wheel 

Edited by Darrell Wesh

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