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Hsiang

Ancient EUC history of ninebot and KingSong

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I am working on a video for a KingSong wheel and am a bit curious about the history of both Kingsong and ninebot. I tried digging around their website and didn't find very much information other than that they started in 2014. I also did a search on this forum and most of the threads were about the wheels and not so much the company. Not sure if I missed anything obvious but would love some pointer from someone better informed.

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38 minutes ago, Hsiang said:

I am working on a video for a KingSong wheel and am a bit curious about the history of both Kingsong and ninebot. I tried digging around their website and didn't find very much information other than that they started in 2014. I also did a search on this forum and most of the threads were about the wheels and not so much the company. Not sure if I missed anything obvious but would love some pointer from someone better informed.

you should maybe interview their staff?  like tina... i'm sure they know the history of their own company.   don't know much about ninebot except that they made knock off of segway, when sued, they bought segway out.  LOL  Then xiao mi bought them ninebot out.  definitely a interesting history.

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I love how you make more investigative videos recently!

All I have heard is that one guy from Gotway left and started Kingsong. I imagine some epic story of disagreement, betrayal, and intense competition between former allies who are now bitter rivals. Maybe I'm dramatizing it in my head:D

So both big EUC manufacturers have a common origin.

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I guess I should be more specific; I am more looking for general timeline of when they first introduced their early models? I assume Gotway predate both ninebot and Kingsong; and I think on the ninebot website they release the One C (is that the first one?) in 2014. When did KingSong release their model and did they start with a 14” and move up or did they introduce all 3 wheel sizes at the same time?

and ooh I heard about the starting story of Kingsong also, and have no doubt that it’d be a really good story to tell, but since none of the party involved would likely ever be willing to talk about it. There aren’t a lot of concrete information I can go on. =(

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50 minutes ago, Hsiang said:

I guess I should be more specific; I am more looking for general timeline of when they first introduced their early models? I assume Gotway predate both ninebot and Kingsong; and I think on the ninebot website they release the One C (is that the first one?) in 2014. When did KingSong release their model and did they start with a 14” and move up or did they introduce all 3 wheel sizes at the same time?

and ooh I heard about the starting story of Kingsong also, and have no doubt that it’d be a really good story to tell, but since none of the party involved would likely ever be willing to talk about it. There aren’t a lot of concrete information I can go on. =(

Ninebot was before Gotway and KS.....Ninebot One c, one c+, one e, one e+ as their 16 Inch, their 1 14 S1/2 or however the same Thing is namend and now their  One Z6 and 10

KS: this rumour of the "Guy which left Gotway and build KS".... i dont know if there is anything true on it.

You would mean than a copy and paste of the recent Wheel was Happening, but from the getgo the KS wheels where totally different from the start! Other boards, other technique, other Philosophy.

KS started with KS14c and KS14B, then 18A (that shell has run About 5 iterations from 500W, 800W, 1200W to 1500W motors with the FIRST Company offering 1500wh battery packs), then the 16b come up, then the brandnew 14d and 14s, then the 16s iteration, then the 18L and XL and now the 16X got a brandnew overhaul.

 

When you have some more Questions...i have no clue what you want to know???

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Hsiang said:

I guess I should be more specific; I am more looking for general timeline of when they first introduced their early models? I assume Gotway predate both ninebot and Kingsong; and I think on the ninebot website they release the One C (is that the first one?) in 2014. When did KingSong release their model and did they start with a 14” and move up or did they introduce all 3 wheel sizes at the same time?

and ooh I heard about the starting story of Kingsong also, and have no doubt that it’d be a really good story to tell, but since none of the party involved would likely ever be willing to talk about it. There aren’t a lot of concrete information I can go on. =(

From what I've snooped around, KS has been around since 2012, but they didn't make their first EUC until 2015 (the 14") and soon the first 18".  The first 16" model came in early 2016 I think. Before EUCs, I think they made at least hoverboards (as an OEM?) and some "general electronics" (BMSs?). Of course take this all with a pinch of salt, it's coming from memory and isn't fact-checked in any way ;) 

Also heard the story of a Gotway employee leaving and joining KS, maybe that's when they started making EUCs.

EDIT: Directly from their own About -page ( https://www.kingsong.com/list-13.html ) :

 

Quote

 

Kingsong Intell Tech Co., LTD is a hi-tech manufacturer specializing in King Song brand one wheel/ two wheel scooters. King Song started researching self balancing scooters business since 2012, through continual studying from domestic and oversea professions combining absorbing professional designers ,finally, King Song formed complete production line: electric unicycle/ E-scooter/ two wheel balance scooters, and keep track of market tredency to keep refresh for our customers.

 

In comparison to our competitors, King Song focus on researching self balancing scooters with our own uniqueness. From the beginning, King Song aims at leading the brand vendors and manufacturers by versus of quality, building King Song an A class brand, forming sales channels domestic and aboard, meanwhile, takes “ product quality, diversity, superior after-sales” as philosophy to promote its long-term development and booming.

 

Prior to self balancing scooters business, King song has been engaged in developing and producing power bank protection board, all of the control boards of king song scooters are made by our own SMT factory, which is one of our advantage compared to our competitors, we can be more flexible and gurrantee quality of core components.

 

Through our effort, we have gained a good fame in electric unicycle industry,welcome to Join us to make win-win business.

 

King Song’s Senior engineers team(consisting of electronic, structure, software engineers) can assure you powerful OEM service.

 

Welcome to join us! 

 

There's also this video of their manufacturing:

 

 

Edited by esaj

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4 hours ago, esaj said:

Also heard the story of a Gotway employee leaving and joining KS, maybe that's when they started making EUCs.

I know a very intelligent guy from Finland with a long track record in electronics and PCB design that would be a perfect fit working at Kingsong. :)

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23 hours ago, US69 said:

Ninebot was before Gotway and KS.....Ninebot One c, one c+, one e, one e+ as their 16 Inch, their 1 14 S1/2 or however the same Thing is namend and now their  One Z6 and 10

KS: this rumour of the "Guy which left Gotway and build KS".... i dont know if there is anything true on it.

You would mean than a copy and paste of the recent Wheel was Happening, but from the getgo the KS wheels where totally different from the start! Other boards, other technique, other Philosophy.

KS started with KS14c and KS14B, then 18A (that shell has run About 5 iterations from 500W, 800W, 1200W to 1500W motors with the FIRST Company offering 1500wh battery packs), then the 16b come up, then the brandnew 14d and 14s, then the 16s iteration, then the 18L and XL and now the 16X got a brandnew overhaul.

 

When you have some more Questions...i have no clue what you want to know???

Just curious, when you say the KS wheel was totally different, how do you mean since at least in appearances they look very much like the Ninebot One.

Also, has the shell design of the KS wheel stayed mostly the same from the beginning? I did a quick search and it looks like the 18A was the outlier from the round design. was there ever a round 18" shell before the 18L?

Oh and when was the KS14c released? and what was the first Gotway wheel and when was it released?

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49 minutes ago, Hsiang said:

Oh and when was the KS14c released? and what was the first Gotway wheel and when was it released?

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1T9GZJGJf9V24WRLqzVIyXuIeax2mu3fG5fXzHchPMwk/edit#gid=0

Here is a table that has most of the wheels listed. Looks like the KS 14-C was released in 2014 and the first Gotway was the MCM2 (pre 2015?)

 

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On 6/14/2019 at 9:43 AM, Flyboy10 said:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1T9GZJGJf9V24WRLqzVIyXuIeax2mu3fG5fXzHchPMwk/edit#gid=0

Here is a table that has most of the wheels listed. Looks like the KS 14-C was released in 2014 and the first Gotway was the MCM2 (pre 2015?)

 

Awesome; that chart is super helpful thank you!!

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On 6/14/2019 at 2:50 PM, Hsiang said:

Just curious, when you say the KS wheel was totally different, how do you mean since at least in appearances they look very much like the Ninebot One.

Also, has the shell design of the KS wheel stayed mostly the same from the beginning? I did a quick search and it looks like the 18A was the outlier from the round design. was there ever a round 18" shell before the 18L?

Oh and when was the KS14c released? and what was the first Gotway wheel and when was it released?

The VERY first KS wheels have been 14c (340wh, 680wh, 840wh) and 14b(ejectable 174wh battery)...and then 18A(at the first iteration only 500Watt motor).......so NO, they never looked like ninebot and never tried that.....

The next wheel......the KS16b...comes up in middle 2016 ....about a year after the Ninebot “One P” debacle.....and yeah ..the roundness was the only “One” similarity....other than that ....it started what now has become what KingSongs are best known for: Trolley and handle grip in ONE piece, which just started the “included trolley” thing for the hole EUC industrie.

What you call the “round design” started only with the 16b...it was very succesful and so AFTER that the 14d/s where developed with round design, too!

The first wheels, 14b and 14c and also 18A never had a round design!

After the “roound design” of 16b...and then also 14d and 14s where so succesfull....KS was under pressure to made an 18 inch in the same design. That was the birth of 18L/Xl with 50kmh and 84volt. 

btw: Allready the latest iteration of 18A, called 18S, was able of 50kmh(1680wh!) seated riding, and so on....but customer wanted the “KS brand round design” here, too!

And so now...after all wheels have the round design....the 16b (800Watt, 30kmh) iterated to 16S(1200Watt, 35kmh)....it was time to start a new 16inch line....whihc you see now in the 16X....going away from “round”...but staying on what people love and know from KS:

Integrated Trolley in the MIDDLE of the wheel.

 

KS14c -afaik- was released 2014.....i dont know exactly about GW....but at this Time Gotway was around with i guess the MCM2....nothing more.....

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1 hour ago, US69 said:

KS14c -afaik- was released 2014.....i dont know exactly about GW....but at this Time Gotway was around with i guess the MCM2....nothing more.....

Could have been out earlier, but as I recall, Kingsong wasn't a very well known manufacturer when I joined in April 2015. John Eucist has posted a video visiting the KS-factory in April 2015, the earliest first impressions I could find on a quick glance were from July-August 2015. Not that it really matters. :P

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I know this has nothing to do with Ninebot or Kingsong, but I thought it would be interstin gto share.

I just stumbled upon this article. Could this have been the first EUC? It was functional in 2012. It is interesting that he had to hold the "kill switch" engaged while riding. https://www.stephanboyer.com/post/17/my-electric-unicycle 

Edited by Flyboy10

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Good find! Very interesting, thanks. Great to see a young guy done this, clearly had a good grasp to be able to complete a working prototype. Gutted for him that it got pinched though!

He does state he wasn't the first though - naming Trevor Blackwell as being before him.

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