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Marty Backe

My 84-volt Nikola Triumphs, Tribulations, and Failures

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Posted (edited)

Well this is very disturbing. 2000 dollars and i cant trust the thing. Looks like this might be my first and last Gotway

Edited by Han Vo

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10 minutes ago, Han Vo said:

Well this is very disturbing. 2000 dollars and i cant trust the thing. Looks like this might be my first and last Nikola.

were you planning on having a fleet of them? xD

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27 minutes ago, Rywokast said:

were you planning on having a fleet of them? xD

Good catch;)

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1 minute ago, Marty Backe said:

Try something like this yourself. Stuff like this easily shifts around. Just the act of laying the circuit board on top of a strip of rubber type material would cause the strip to shift and move around. This happens all the time in woodworking or other assembly projects I've been involved it.

I can easily imagine the assembly line folks doing this if someone without engineering knowledge about MOSFETs and heat-sinks weren't around to say, "STOP - don't do that"

Point taken :cheers:

Thanks again on behalf of us all for looking so deeply into this, Marty. It's certainly eye-opening...

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This is just incredible. It appears they still don’t have an electronics engineer (or even a hobbyist) watching over the assembly at GW.

And we were pondering wether a thin plastic film could disturb the cooling enough for the Mosfets to fail. Turns out it was a layer of hot glue. For those that don’t know, hot glue doesn’t squeeze away very well when squeezed between items that are in room temperature. Especially if there is a flexible silicone sheet to share the pressure.

If the company assembling the boards would make a horribly stupid mistake like that, they would’ve been out of business after their first client. That’s why I’m sure this issue is all GW. Somehow, in a pessimistic way it even has GW written all over.

I guess I will be taking a closer peek in my MSX.

Un-freaking-believeable.

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9 minutes ago, mrelwood said:

I guess I will be taking a closer peek in my MSX

Ooh yes please do I'm sure there's many of us wanting to know 👍 , my msx is on charge before i go on my euc ride today 😬

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8 minutes ago, mrelwood said:

This is just incredible. It appears they still don’t have an electronics engineer (or even a hobbyist) watching over the assembly at GW.

And we were pondering wether a thin plastic film could disturb the cooling enough for the Mosfets to fail. Turns out it was a layer of hot glue. For those that don’t know, hot glue doesn’t squeeze away very well when squeezed between items that are in room temperature. Especially if there is a flexible silicone sheet to share the pressure.

If the company assembling the boards would make a horribly stupid mistake like that, they would’ve been out of business after their first client. That’s why I’m sure this issue is all GW. Somehow, in a pessimistic way it even has GW written all over.

I guess I will be taking a closer peek in my MSX.

Un-freaking-believeable.

It's my theory, but everything seems to add up. Hopefully somebody at Gotway knows about this and we'll know the bottom line eventually.

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1 minute ago, stephen said:

Ooh yes please do I'm sure there's many of us wanting to know 👍 , my msx is on charge before i go on my euc ride today 😬

Our MSX's have the huge MOSFETs and there has been zero reported failures. Somehow I don't think we have to worry about that wheel :)

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Yikes

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5 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

Our MSX's have the huge MOSFETs and there has been zero reported failures. Somehow I don't think we have to worry about that wheel :)

It is indeed very unlikely that I would find anything. But still, I might have a hard time enjoying a ride until I take a look.

During my first inspection of the MSX, I soldered and glued the capacitors down properly. I’d have thought reading about a few cases of snapped capacitor legs at this point. Happy I was wrong!

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I’m cheating death, 8 days and 201 miles!  I’m going to continue to ride my Nikola and enjoy a brilliant wheel. If there is a larger Gotway issue with their boards then I’d expect a replacement but I can’t stop riding until it does. 

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5 minutes ago, Dzlchef said:

I’m cheating death, 8 days and 201 miles!  I’m going to continue to ride my Nikola and enjoy a brilliant wheel. If there is a larger Gotway issue with their boards then I’d expect a replacement but I can’t stop riding until it does. 

It's no fair that your odometer is spinning and mine is stuck at 100-miles :furious:

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1 hour ago, Dzlchef said:

I’m cheating death, 8 days and 201 miles!  I’m going to continue to ride my Nikola and enjoy a brilliant wheel. If there is a larger Gotway issue with their boards then I’d expect a replacement but I can’t stop riding until it does. 

Lol. Right..  I’m not gonna stop riding my nikola. It feels too damn good.   Hope you get yours fixed soon @Marty Backe

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6 minutes ago, stephen said:

I don't have Facebook so i can't see what he has done apart from leave it in the rain but i don't know for how long , it's here if anyone want to look 👍

https://www.facebook.com/groups/GotWay/permalink/2391946640863644?sfns=mo

 

I think I saw him here on forum too....I recall his picture.

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6 minutes ago, stephen said:

I don't have Facebook so i can't see what he has done apart from leave it in the rain but i don't know for how long , it's here if anyone want to look 👍

https://www.facebook.com/groups/GotWay/permalink/2391946640863644?sfns=mo

Screenshot-20190621-101918-com-android-c

he said for an hour on its side lol.. but later he said its back working now.. obviously a bunch of water seeped onto some components and has now dried.. no apparent permanent damage.. i dont suspect there are many wheels that would do good on their side sitting in the rain lol

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Posted (edited)
39 minutes ago, stephen said:

i can't see me ever forgetting and leaving my wheel outside nevermind in the rain lol

I totally agree with that sentiment.  My Z10 Always sits on it's stand in the lounge anytime that I'm not out riding it! 

Edited by fbhb

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11 hours ago, Lukas83 said:

question for the electronic gurus here

in theory: if you can get the to247 mosfets and get rid of all that hot glue residue, do you guys think it's possible to change the mosfets myself to the 247 ones?? I know a guy who is an expert in soldering, would not be a problem for him to change the mosfets... but I'm not sure if everything will work if you only change them? of course I will go for a lot better heatsink as well... 

what do you guys think about? 

 

Could work out - you have to look carefully for the electric specifications in the datasheet!

Beside the max ratings (voltage, current), the R DS on the gate charge and capacitance are very important. Also the gate threshold voltage and the curves for max DS current over gate voltage.

Your friend should not only be good in soldering but also in choosing a good enough matching mosfet - the bigger casing won't help if the new mosfets not switch "perfectly" anymore or overburden the gate driver.

8 hours ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said:

Way back, I remember someone who desoldered his MOSFETs to move them to a daughter board.  I think he basically used a wire cable to connect it to the mainboard.  I wonder whether moving to an easily replaceable MOSFET board might be a consideration for the future.  ...  There didn't seem to be any timing issues, but I think that was one concern that was raised.  It sure would be easier and cheaper to replace just the MOSFETs on a mini-board if those are the only things blowing.

By the wirings the timings of steep high current slopes _can_ be dramaticly changed. 

So this can work out, but no one should expect it to work....

5 hours ago, mrelwood said:

This is Turns out it was a layer of hot glue. For those that don’t know, hot glue doesn’t squeeze away very well when squeezed between items that are in room temperature. Especially if there is a flexible silicone sheet to share the pressure.

Seems one needs a run in phase with this wheels now - to get the mosfets hot enough to melt the hot glue so it can distribute evenly... :ph34r:

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