Asphalt Posted February 27, 2019 Share Posted February 27, 2019 https://www.theverge.com/2019/2/27/18243310/battery-lithium-ion-cargo-ban-faa-department-of-transportation Also, companies cannot ship batteries with more than 30% charge aboard cargo-only aircrafts. So this probably means: No flying with your EUC Prepare for very long shipping times if you buy overseas Prepare to receive your new EUC with near-dead batteries Hopefully this opens up a market for home-grown battery companies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MetricUSA Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 This is not going to be any good whatsoever!!!! Houston we got a problem! We will need to build more train tracks to every city, now...BIG PUSH FOR HIGHSPEED TRAINS... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scatcat Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 Why 30%? As long as the battery voltage are within the approximate span 3.4-4.0 V there shouldn't be any real charge level dangers involved. Or am I missing something? Actually if the batteries are not disconnected, I personally would recommend the slightly higher end of the range, at least above 3.6V When you buy well kept, long terms storage batteries, they're usually at 3.6-3.7V Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heyzeus Posted March 1, 2019 Share Posted March 1, 2019 12 hours ago, Scatcat said: Why 30%? As long as the battery voltage are within the approximate span 3.4-4.0 V there shouldn't be any real charge level dangers involved. Or am I missing something? Actually if the batteries are not disconnected, I personally would recommend the slightly higher end of the range, at least above 3.6V When you buy well kept, long terms storage batteries, they're usually at 3.6-3.7V Not knowing the specifics of lithium ion battery chemistry and how it works when "exploding" or in a thermal runaway battery fire situation.... my guess is that, the lower charge limits how bad the battery fire is. If the size of the battery fire is related to how much energy is currently stored in it when it fails then I imagine keeping it at a lower charge state would limit how bad things could get. like a full propane tank I expect would have a much bigger explosion than a nearly empty one I could be wrong though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scatcat Posted March 1, 2019 Share Posted March 1, 2019 9 hours ago, Heyzeus said: Not knowing the specifics of lithium ion battery chemistry and how it works when "exploding" or in a thermal runaway battery fire situation.... my guess is that, the lower charge limits how bad the battery fire is. If the size of the battery fire is related to how much energy is currently stored in it when it fails then I imagine keeping it at a lower charge state would limit how bad things could get. like a full propane tank I expect would have a much bigger explosion than a nearly empty one I could be wrong though When a lithium battery fails, the killer is the electrolyte. The base of the electrolyte is hydrocarbons, and it also contains free lithium which is pyrophoric. With a "safe chemistry", the likelihood of actual fire is low, but the highest energy density is also the unsafest. So charge levels AFAIK, only affects the first stage in a battery failure, the part where the battery heats up. As soon as it reaches a critical temperature, electrolyte starts to eject and it goes into thermal runaway. That means a serious risk of reaching the flashpoint for the electrolyte and metals. When you reach the stage where the electrodes catch fire all is lost. Most extinguishers won't do much for a combination of hydrocarbon and metal fire, and the heat can easily reach welding temperatures where surrounding cells go into sympathetic meltdown. But 30% should be plenty to start a thermal runaway, so a battery with low charge that gets shorted may well cause a fire. The best ways to avoid a battery fire are good battery health, good circuits that won't cause shorts, and even pulling the plug while transporting the battery pack. Under-voltage is a sure downer for battery health, just like overcharging. I doubt this rule will prevent even one battery fire from happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz Bon Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 I work with Samsung batteries on MegaWatt systems and other manufacturers as being LG and Kokam Samsung Ship all batteries at 20% SOC And recommend that spare batteries be stored at 20% SOC and checked every 6 months Recommended storage temps 23deg +/- 5deg I see nothing wrong with 30% so long as they are checked before shipping and disconnected or have a function to isolate for travel and are not held in storage for a considerable amount of time. Complete battery removal and separate packaging being impact and vibration tolerant maybe what the future holds for PEVs, With obvious freight cost increases but being more readily accepted by freight companies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esper Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 Now all the battery companies will be trying to get batteries that won't explode. Ionic Materials to the rescue. I hope their battery goes mainstream. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 What about temperatures? How cold does it get in passenger plane cargo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esper Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 5 hours ago, ir_fuel said: What about temperatures? How cold does it get in passenger plane cargo? Can you clarify whom you're directing your questions to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 Just now, Esper said: Can you clarify whom you're directing your questions to? It's a forum. To everyone that knows the answer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esper Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 1 hour ago, ir_fuel said: It's a forum. To everyone that knows the answer A quick google search revealed that the average cargo temp for a passenger plane is between 7°C - 18°C (depending on location and if there are animals) I would imagine that these temperatures are not vastly different across many airlines/planes and may fluctuate based on altitude and global position in relation to the sun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 That's not bad. So no problem with freezing batteries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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