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[EcoDrift.ru] Ninebot Z10: A Diagnosis of Common Issues


houseofjob

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All this talk about self draining battery packs got me thinking.  My KS14C Battery has been in a box for over a year connected to nothing.  It didn't have a full charge when I removed it, so I started to worry that it may have discharged to an injurious level.  So I took a drive to go visit it (it over 60 miles away across London) and do some other things.  I put a volt meter on it and guess what! 58.3V  Now I didn't measure the voltage when I took it off but, as I said, it was no where near full. As I recall I had it somewhere between 40% and 50% as I had read this is a good storage voltage.

So if this "reference" voltage retention example, helps anybody understand the problem, you're welcome.

To reiterate this pack (cells and BMS) were not connected to the control board, so the only things that could have drained them were their own chemistry, and the BMS.  I was very happy with 58.3V, but I gave the pack a quick charge up to 60 something to "stir up the chemicals a bit" before tucking it away again.

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3 hours ago, Smoother said:

I gave the pack a quick charge up to 60 something to "stir up the chemicals a bit" before tucking it away again.

Can you just imagine the disappointment of the wheel. Locked up all that time. Sitting waiting for someone to dig it out and take a ride. The joy of being discovered and charged up only to be placed back in the dark. :angry: 

“Baby we were born to ride” 

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That wheel's  in no state to think.  It's a bit like Star Wars C3PO in pieces in a garbage dump.  Battery, control board shells, over there, motor and rim in the trunk of my car (but separate also)

But it will have some stories to tell when it's powered up again.  beep, beep, beeeep, beepety beep beep etc.

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Hi !

As I’ve had problems with steep decline in the first week , I‘m a little afraid that I also may have a defective unit.

N3OTC1828....so is this the second and maybe defective batch? I‘ve had no problems since I avoided riding down steep sections with more than 15degrees.

I got my Z10 at  30/9/2019.

Shall I contact my dealer, what would you recommend? So far I‘m quite happy with the Z10, it’s great for traveling 20-50km with >35kph and I don’t see a nicer competitor , I would trust more...(exc.the KS18XL)

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9 minutes ago, Jekyll_500 said:

Hi !

As I’ve had problems with steep decline in the first week , I‘m a little afraid that I also may have a defective unit.

N3OTC1828....so is this the second and maybe defective batch? I‘ve had no problems since I avoided riding down steep sections with more than 15degrees.

I got my Z10 at  30/9/2019.

Shall I contact my dealer, what would you recommend? So far I‘m quite happy with the Z10, it’s great for traveling 20-50km with >35kph and I don’t see a nicer competitor , I would trust more...(exc.the KS18XL)

Can you tell us exactly what "I've had problems" means?

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18 minutes ago, Jekyll_500 said:

Hi !

As I’ve had problems with steep decline in the first week , I‘m a little afraid that I also may have a defective unit.

N3OTC1828....so is this the second and maybe defective batch? I‘ve had no problems since I avoided riding down steep sections with more than 15degrees.

I got my Z10 at  30/9/2019.

Shall I contact my dealer, what would you recommend? So far I‘m quite happy with the Z10, it’s great for traveling 20-50km with >35kph and I don’t see a nicer competitor , I would trust more...(exc.the KS18XL)

Have you tried brake assist and  the firmness level settings it makes a difference to braking .i have everything on soft level 0 for riding when i don't think I'm going to brake hard, if riding around town i change the firmness, seems better for braking cause not leaning right back 

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15 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

Can you tell us exactly what "I've had problems" means?

I think he believed that the ability of the Z10 to go up or down steep hills isn't very good.

Not at all at 30 degrees like it is described. 

I've the same problem. My One S2 goes up or down a hill better then the Z10. First I tried to go down a underpass with my Z10 it didn't  decelerate enough and I had to sit down! Same place no problem with the S2.

I'm the opinion the Z10 has much to little torque especially at low speed. 

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I've been thinking about these braking issues you Z10 riders report.  It doesn't make any sense; these motors have no back or front so energy reserves in both directions should be equal.

  But I have also been thinking about Marty's descent from The Wilson Observatory where his Z10 didn't regen nearly as much as the other wheels in the group.

AND the statement made later that the Z10 charges one battery pack and then the other.

So I put this all together in my head and wondered if regen also, only goes to one battery pack first, and if so, could a current limiter be preventing full regen braking? I can easily produce 5 Amps of regen without trying, maybe the Z10 battery management doesn't like these kinds of Amps dumped into one battery.

Of course that still doesn't account for the wheel simply  using battery power instead of regen, to brake.  I mean applying power in the opposite direction to achieve braking, but it's something to consider.

Edited by Smoother
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  • 1 month later...

With the Z10 it's easy to go for 1000w regen braking and more and this with a weight of around 70kg... Tested it for several days... I think its more a problem of feeling. In my first trys I also thought "OMFG I'm going faster and faster I'm not able to brake, I will crash" BUT if you allow the wheel to go at least 10km/h you could brake nearly everything... The problem is around walking speed every wheel suffers in braking... Smaller wheels could handle this better because torque is smaller and rotation speed higher, both helps the electric motor. 

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This week I was turning in tight circles at a sloping parking lot and my Z6 lost it's gyro- calibration 3 out of about 10 times. I only own this one wheel, so I can't confirm by myself whether this is a particular or general issue to Zs or all EUCs.

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1 hour ago, TheseusMinor said:

This week I was turning in tight circles at a sloping parking lot and my Z6 lost it's gyro- calibration 3 out of about 10 times. I only own this one wheel, so I can't confirm by myself whether this is a particular or general issue to Zs or all EUCs.

When you say "tight", do you mean that the wheel has leaning heavily to one side? Because all wheels will stop balancing when the wheel leans hard to one side.

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1 hour ago, TheseusMinor said:

This week I was turning in tight circles at a sloping parking lot and my Z6 lost it's gyro- calibration 3 out of about 10 times. I only own this one wheel, so I can't confirm by myself whether this is a particular or general issue to Zs or all EUCs.

And do you mean it just dipped heavily or completely lost it's gyro and seemed like it turned off?

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1 hour ago, Marty Backe said:

When you say "tight", do you mean that the wheel has leaning heavily to one side? Because all wheels will stop balancing when the wheel leans hard to one side.

By "tight" I mean that I was going round-and-round at walking speeds in a 9 inch radius circle. 

1 hour ago, stephen said:

And do you mean it just dipped heavily or completely lost it's gyro and seemed like it turned off?

The pedals were suddenly no longer horizontal but rather slanted higher at the front, when the EUC was upright and stationary. Turning it off and on fixed it though.
I've decided to just stay away from doing tricks on wholly steep floors.. 

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6 hours ago, TheseusMinor said:

By "tight" I mean that I was going round-and-round at walking speeds in a 9 inch radius circle. 

The pedals were suddenly no longer horizontal but rather slanted higher at the front, when the EUC was upright and stationary. Turning it off and on fixed it though.
I've decided to just stay away from doing tricks on wholly steep floors.. 

Oh, now I understand. I totally missed your comment about doing this on  steeply sloped floor. I think this makes sense. At least you don't have to worry that something is wrong with your wheel - it would probably happen on any wheel in the same conditions.

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18 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

Oh, now I understand. I totally missed your comment about doing this on  steeply sloped floor. I think this makes sense. At least you don't have to worry that something is wrong with your wheel - it would probably happen on any wheel in the same conditions.

I kinda suspected so. Thank goodness! Praise be to Shenzhen! 🚀🇨🇳

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  • 2 weeks later...

Well. the caps bursted and the fluid damaged the board itself. I noticed some weird behaviour (battery drop from 55km to 23km after 3km of wheeling). Also when the last one died you heard the wheel suffer (speaker wise)

WhatsApp Image 2019-05-19 at 19.21.00.jpeg

Edited by ruohki
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4 minutes ago, ruohki said:

Well. the caps bursted and the fluid damaged the board itself.

Beside direct board damaging they loose their capacity and increase their resistance already before bursting. And since they would be needed could lead to any weird behaviour/faults....

4 minutes ago, ruohki said:

I noticed some weird behaviour (battery drop from 55km to 23km after 3km of wheeling). Also when the last one died you heard the wheel suffer (speaker wise)

 

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Thanks. Bad to hear that. I know that the electrolytic capacitors lifespan is not very big. But 500km is very small. Obviously I have to open my  wheel and check the condition and probably change the capacitors with better quality. 

Edited by Ch.Eng.62
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Thanks. Bad to hear that. I know that the electrolytic capacitors lifespan is not very big. But 500km is very small. Obviously I have to open my  wheel and check the condition. 

Is your mainboard totally damaged? Probably it is still possible to repair it by washing the remaining of the electrolyte and replacing the capacitors. 

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