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Matthieu Pretre

Bug of lift sensor KS-18L KS-18XL

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Hello everybody

I just recieved my new KS18XL and I have a problem with the lift sensor. Indeed sometimes it works well but often it’s doesn’t work at all.
I precise that I trie to fix it with turn the two screw of the two sensor but the problem is always present.

After a lot of investigations, I identified how to make it work properly but it does not tell me anything about the origin of the problem and exceeds my skills. Moreover it is not normal that it behaves well. Let me explain:

I turn on my wheel normally (straight) = it does not work

I turn on my wheel lying on the side (right or left) -> the balance is off -> I put it right -> the balance connects = it works perfectly 

I turn on my wheel normally = it does not work -> I lean it hard left or right -> the balance is disconnected -> I put it right -> the balance connects = it works perfectly

I have tried various caliber wheel recumbent etc without success. So I have the impression that as soon as the balance is disconnected when the wheel is in use it activates it, if not. The problem does not come from the chain of the lift sensor system but from the interpretation by the "brain" of the wheel Do you think that the Mother Board has a gyroscopic problem? This problem scares me, I do not want to fall if the motherboard is faulty

If Anybody have or had the same problem please tell me if a solution exist.

Sorry for my English, I'm not fluent again :)

Thanks.

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For the KS-18L/KS-18XL, I will tighten the bottomed trolley screws where the metal sensor pieces are affixed just a notch before fully tight, then re-calibrate the lift sensor sensitivity in the KS App, keeping the wheel fully upright while calibrating. I've found the lift sensor works the best after doing, as best as it can.

It sounds like you might also want to recalibrate the pedal level as well, again, while the wheel is fully upright.

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No you don’t understand. The calibration of the sensor is good. 

The problem is that the lift sensor is not opperationnal if I just turn on my wheel upright. I must lean it on the side or turn on it horizontaly if I want that it works well. 

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In fact if your wheel is moving even a little bit it will disable the sensor... it must be perfectly stable, with no movement at all for it to works...

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5 hours ago, Matthieu Pretre said:

No you don’t understand. The calibration of the sensor is good. 

The problem is that the lift sensor is not opperationnal if I just turn on my wheel upright. I must lean it on the side or turn on it horizontaly if I want that it works well. 

Without a video to demonstrate, it's not very easy to know what you are describing then.

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21 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

Without a video to demonstrate, it's not very easy to know what you are describing then.

Yeah...i also unfortunately did not understand the problem at all.

As Tom said..the lift sensor ONLY works if the wheel is not rolling even a little bit...and also a proper calibration is key to have it working. Normally no need to work at all on the screws. On my 18L - i have to say i have no problems at all. 98% of all time the sensor works fine.

The most “problems” i had when it was under 0 degree celsius...then sometimes i have to lift the wheel up “very hefty” to get the sensor to work....and that also only on 2-3 first trys....

 

So a video would help...

Edited by US69
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I understand what he's describing.  He's saying the lift sensor(effect) only works, after the gyro has been disabaled by a 45+ degree lean left or right, which also includes powering up the wheel when it's lying on its side.

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13 hours ago, houseofjob said:

For the KS-18L/KS-18XL, I will tighten the bottomed trolley screws where the metal sensor pieces are affixed just a notch before fully tight, then re-calibrate the lift sensor sensitivity in the KS App, keeping the wheel fully upright while calibrating. I've found the lift sensor works the best after doing, as best as it can.

It sounds like you might also want to recalibrate the pedal level as well, again, while the wheel is fully upright.

Do you have a video detailing this for those of us that have never pulled the skirt up on our wheels?

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On 2/6/2019 at 12:27 AM, Smoother said:

I understand what he's describing.  He's saying the lift sensor(effect) only works, after the gyro has been disabaled by a 45+ degree lean left or right, which also includes powering up the wheel when it's lying on its side.

Exactly

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Excellent video; it demonstrated clearly what you described.  I don't have an 18xx so I can't help you, but I do have a suggestion.

Because your fault and the work-around is so consistent, until a proper solution is found, why don't you get in the habit of either starting your wheel on its side, or leaning it over past 45 degrees before you ride off.

ps you don't have to pick the tyre off the floor (as in the video) to activate the tilt feature, just lean it to one side until it goes limp, then bring it back up again.  It's not a fix but it's an easy to complete habit to get into, in the mean time.

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On 2/5/2019 at 11:28 PM, Matthieu Pretre said:

I’ll make a video tomorrow

You also have a faulty left rear LED strip. So it's a good idea to contact your seller for warranty repair and he will be able to manage boths problems.

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Yes, I see your issue now, good demo vid.

This just seems like bad firmware. Contact your distributor for a possible fix. I imagine they might try to re-flash the board with the KS developer app.

 

On 2/6/2019 at 12:11 AM, Major Bathos said:

Do you have a video detailing this for those of us that have never pulled the skirt up on our wheels?

Sorry, I no longer have a KS-18L or XL in my possession, but the below video does a good teardown of the 18XL, and cued up to 2:24, you can see where the ends of the black trolley sticks meet the base of the metal plate where the screw I speak of is on the underside of.

 

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He's already adjusted the lift sensors, although I don't know what the proper procedure is.  He said this in the 2nd line of his first post.  Not the best English, but it's not his first language:

"I precise that I trie to fix it with turn the two screw of the two sensor but the problem is always present."

The fact is, his sensors are working consistently , otherwise how else could he do what he does in the video.  The question is why do they require him to mess about with angles of lean before they cooperate.

Edited by Smoother
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1 hour ago, Smoother said:

He's already adjusted the lift sensors, although I don't know what the proper procedure is.  He said this in the 2nd line of his first post.  Not the best English, but it's not his first language:

"I precise that I trie to fix it with turn the two screw of the two sensor but the problem is always present."

The fact is, his sensors are working consistently , otherwise how else could he do what he does in the video.  The question is why do they require him to mess about with angles of lean before they cooperate.

If you're addressing this to me, I wasn't posting the video for @Matthieu Pretre, I was responding to @Major Bathos's question/comment.

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20 hours ago, Smoother said:

Excellent video; it demonstrated clearly what you described.  I don't have an 18xx so I can't help you, but I do have a suggestion.

Because your fault and the work-around is so consistent, until a proper solution is found, why don't you get in the habit of either starting your wheel on its side, or leaning it over past 45 degrees before you ride off.

ps you don't have to pick the tyre off the floor (as in the video) to activate the tilt feature, just lean it to one side until it goes limp, then bring it back up again.  It's not a fix but it's an easy to complete habit to get into, in the mean time.

yes I'm doing it for now

Edited by Matthieu Pretre

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11 hours ago, Seba said:

You also have a faulty left rear LED strip. So it's a good idea to contact your seller for warranty repair and he will be able to manage boths problems.

He is in Hollidays I'm waiting is answer, thanks for the LED strip but I'm not blinded ^^

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8 hours ago, houseofjob said:

Yes, I see your issue now, good demo vid.

This just seems like bad firmware. Contact your distributor for a possible fix. I imagine they might try to re-flash the board with the KS developer app.

 

Sorry, I no longer have a KS-18L or XL in my possession, but the below video does a good teardown of the 18XL, and cued up to 2:24, you can see where the ends of the black trolley sticks meet the base of the metal plate where the screw I speak of is on the underside of.

 

I had make a re flash yesterday with the developer app, same problem. It's a hardware problem, maybe the gyroscope for the lift sensor.

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Thank you @Matthieu Pretre !! I had given up on the lift switch feature of my 18XL as simply broken/unreliable. My wheel reproduces the behavior in your video exactly. I will now start my wheel on it's side until this issue is hopefully fixed in firmware. :clap3:

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34 minutes ago, Uno Solo said:

Thank you @Matthieu Pretre !! I had given up on the lift switch feature of my 18XL as simply broken/unreliable. My wheel reproduces the behavior in your video exactly. I will now start my wheel on it's side until this issue is hopefully fixed in firmware. :clap3:

Well it looks like we have a repeatable process across two or more wheels.  That should help narrow down the search for the problem. If anyone is searching, that is.

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11 hours ago, Uno Solo said:

Thank you @Matthieu Pretre !! I had given up on the lift switch feature of my 18XL as simply broken/unreliable. My wheel reproduces the behavior in your video exactly. I will now start my wheel on it's side until this issue is hopefully fixed in firmware. :clap3:

You're welcome :) You can contact your dealer and Kingsong china via facebook to report the problem. The more we will report to them, the more they will work on it. Then if I will have an issue before you, I will tell it here.

However, be careful, my lift sensor often bug when I'm stopped and disconnect stealthily the balance. For now I let mine disconnected 

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Mine seems to work without having to tilt it before I try it.  

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It's really a bummer as this is one very expensive wheel. One would expect everything to work flawlessly for that kind of money. However, I gave up on the lift sensor and the trolley issue was disheartening as well. Also, the app sucks ass too. All huge disappointments. So, I disabled lift sensor, trolley it and lift it with wheel turned off, and I set the lights how I like, and never touch the app anymore. No more issues. So now, I feel much better about the wheel, and am no longer stressing about it. Loving it in fact! I suggest doing all these things and not worrying about it anymore. Let Kingsong worry about it and hopefully a new firmware will fix these issues in the near future...

Edited by Rama Douglas
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WHY??? the don't install just normal switch in the bottom of the handle. IM has this concept and it is reliable and convenient.

Otherwise it is never-ending disaster.

Edited by jitesar

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