Nic Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 Hi Amber, That was a clever bit of thinking by your dad that saved his EUC from being destroyed. Where is your dad located (is he in York?). Seems like the police were trying to be reasonable as they needed to be seen to be doing something rather than simply ignoring someone breaking the law. Your dad was really unlucky with the police officer who charged him and has effectively got away with a £77 fine, but cannot ride his EUC again. He should cancel the insurance as it isn't much use because he still can't ride his EUC unless the local police decide to be more accommodating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
U-Stride Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 I'm really sorry to hear this. Here in Boston I have no issues with riding where ever. Here is a recent video and you will see COPS EVERYWHERE, even coming up to me and asking questions about it. This is unfortunate: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lutalo Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 On 2/5/2019 at 6:06 AM, Amber said: I am happy to let you all know that my dad has his gotway back from the police station today. He provided them with liability insurance last week and has finally got it home. 😁 Glad to hear it. As @Planemo has said; stick to the parks and trails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lutalo Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 On 2/5/2019 at 4:10 PM, Nic said: He should cancel the insurance as it isn't much use because he still can't ride his EUC unless the local police decide to be more accommodating. Property riders on insurance may not impact the legality of riding, but, if I am not misunderstanding @Amber's Dad presenting personal property insurance (PPI) coverage seems to have helped him to have his wheel returned to him. I don't pretend to understand Euro-statutes. I live in the USA. If I am not mistaken once the police confiscated the wheel, they confiscated personal property; not an MV. If the law stipulates that insurance must be presented to have confiscated property returned it would follow that @Amber's dad did not need to present MVI; only PPI would be required to recover his wheel from the police. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planemo Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 Whilst the wheel was indeed personal property, for the purposes of the law used it was assumed to be a motor vehicle. The fact that the vehicle also happened to be personal property bears no relevance. It would still have been seized under Sec165 if it belonged to someone else. For the police to (under policy) return the wheel from a 165, it would require MVI which the father wouldn't have had (or been able to get). I can only assume that what was presented to the police was some sort of personal liability insurance for a mobility vehicle. This is not MVI, and the police were under no obligation to return the wheel unless proof of it being a mobility vehicle (and your fathers disability) were confirmed. For a mobility carriage to comply with road regulations (therefore Class 3), it needs indicators, horn etc. And it has to be registered with the DVLA. Ironically, a Class 3 mobility vehicle doesn't need insurance. I suspect that once the mention of 'disability' and 'mobility' was brought up, the police simply decided that it wasn't worth progressing the matter. Who knows, maybe the counter clerk actually thought (mistakenly) that what they were presented with was indeed MVI and that's why the wheel was released.... Notwithstanding all the above, I still don't understand why the clerk stated 'it's still illegal' and then proceeded to give it back. It all smacks of them not being bothered to see it through to the end tbh. A total win for your father I have to say. Edit: and before any of my UK friends start thinking about registering their EUC's as Class 3 mobility vehicles, a Class 3 must weigh between 113.5kg and 150.00kg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoother Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 @Planemo I think you covered ever angle on that one. Well done. BTW, is your wheel here yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planemo Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 Nope! Another agonizing 6 weeks to go yet. I have already decided that what I really want is a Z10... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoother Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 36 minutes ago, Planemo said: Nope! Another agonizing 6 weeks to go yet. I have already decided that what I really want is a Z10... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lutalo Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 21 hours ago, Smoother said: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lutalo Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 22 hours ago, Planemo said: Whilst the wheel was indeed personal property, for the purposes of the law used it was assumed to be a motor vehicle. The fact that the vehicle also happened to be personal property bears no relevance. It would still have been seized under Sec165 if it belonged to someone else. For the police to (under policy) return the wheel from a 165, it would require MVI which the father wouldn't have had (or been able to get). I can only assume that what was presented to the police was some sort of personal liability insurance for a mobility vehicle. This is not MVI, and the police were under no obligation to return the wheel unless proof of it being a mobility vehicle (and your fathers disability) were confirmed. For a mobility carriage to comply with road regulations (therefore Class 3), it needs indicators, horn etc. And it has to be registered with the DVLA. Ironically, a Class 3 mobility vehicle doesn't need insurance. I suspect that once the mention of 'disability' and 'mobility' was brought up, the police simply decided that it wasn't worth progressing the matter. Who knows, maybe the counter clerk actually thought (mistakenly) that what they were presented with was indeed MVI and that's why the wheel was released.... Notwithstanding all the above, I still don't understand why the clerk stated 'it's still illegal' and then proceeded to give it back. It all smacks of them not being bothered to see it through to the end tbh. A total win for your father I have to say. Edit: and before any of my UK friends start thinking about registering their EUC's as Class 3 mobility vehicles, a Class 3 must weigh between 113.5kg and 150.00kg. New technology can create gray areas in the interpretation of the law's applicability, and in people's understanding of how to enforce. Sucks all around. 👎 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planemo Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 21 hours ago, Smoother said: Don't know why you are face palming pal, it's your fault that I am getting a V5F! I hope you realise that I am holding you personally responsible for not only making me buy a wheel, but also creating enough interest in EUC's that I want my second one before I have even got the first! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoother Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 3 hours ago, Planemo said: Don't know why you are face palming pal, it's your fault that I am getting a V5F! I hope you realise that I am holding you personally responsible for not only making me buy a wheel, but also creating enough interest in EUC's that I want my second one before I have even got the first! Me? What did I do? Did I recommend a V5f? I can't remember, maybe I did. Remind me again, who makes them? Wait. Didn't you say something about a small budget. Yeah, it's all coming back to me now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayBanMonster Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 On 2/15/2019 at 8:46 PM, Planemo said: Who knows, maybe the counter clerk actually thought (mistakenly) that what they were presented with was indeed MVI and that's why the wheel was released.... Notwithstanding all the above, I still don't understand why the clerk stated 'it's still illegal' and then proceeded to give it back. Nice analysis, thank you. My own belief is that the insurance wasn't even a factor in the reason they gave it back, they were always going to because the CPS hasn't any will or mandate or proper statute to prosecute such a case considering no major crime was involved. My thinking is that the insurance simply appeased the officers already giving it back, not the CPS who ultimately decide to prosecute these cases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planemo Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 The CPS wouldn't have been involved, or even consulted in a minor traffic offence. It would have been a simple traffic file by the OIC then summons to magistrates. CPS are primarily involved with deciding on whether or not to progress with criminal offences (and mostly serious ones at that, given that staff are snowed under with cases). I do agree though that I think the police just couldnt be bothered to progress this one. They also are inundated with more pressing matters. @Smoother : Assuming you are male, you will be fully coversant with the male meaning of the word 'budget'. To remind you, there are in fact 2 meanings: 1. Things I want and can just about afford. Just. 2. Things I really really want, cant afford, but will sell body organs to obtain. The Z10 comes under the second catagory for me. Unfortunately I reached this conclusion shortly after ordering the V5F. So clearly it is all your fault and I hope you can find it within you to hang your head in shame. Do you have any requirement for a kidney? A lung? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoother Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Kidney, definitely, kidney. I can go as high as £11.99 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planemo Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Not £1500 then? Doh. Ok I will take your £11.99 and raise you £1488.01 for a pancreas. Seriously, this Gotway case is somewhat of a landmark achievement. I would guess that the police are unlikely to tug an EUC'er in the first place, and I suspect the officer did so only becuse they were being observed and felt they had to do something, but the end result is good news for sure. Long may it continue (until someone gets hurt, at which point we are knackered). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerome Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 On 2/6/2019 at 12:04 AM, Jediah Matthew said: I'm really sorry to hear this. Here in Boston I have no issues with riding where ever. Here is a recent video and you will see COPS EVERYWHERE, even coming up to me and asking questions about it. This is unfortunate: For now it is okay. I wouldn't be telling people it goes 30+ mph! If that sinks in they will be banned or restricted to 12.5 mph. Your full size scooter is probably not faster than the Tesla, yet you can't ride that anywhere you want. We have no special rights as EUC rider's just because we loved them. Whenever I talk about my EUC with curious bystanders I always call it a one wheel Segway. As to top speed, I say it is around Segway speed, about equal to a casual bicycle rider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unventor Posted February 18, 2019 Share Posted February 18, 2019 Well I got overtaken by police in Sweden today. But I had spotted themtso I didn't ride fast. Here EUC can go on cycle lanes upto 20kmh. So when ever I spot police, I have 120% "ride.by traffic" rule hat on as I don't want to get their evil eye on me. So far so good. However on my way home, I were riding near 40kmh as the darkness sneaked up on me. Then again I were in MC helmet and geared up with light on my reflective backpack. This here is like 5min before I got overtaken. In the recording there is no car lanes, but it came later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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