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stephen

Msx 82v is some battery faulty

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So I've always wondered why i get 30-35 miles from my msx and battery goes down to 80% in the first 5-10 miles , so i bought a charge doctor to check my battery voltage and it says 82v, battery is on charge atm but where it says 82v should that be 84v? Any info welcome thx @Marty BackeckeBkeBaeBBakeBkeBBBacke

 

Edited by stephen

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17 minutes ago, stephen said:

So I've always wondered why i get 30-35 miles from my msx and battery goes down to 80% in the first 5-10 miles , so i bought a charge doctor to check my battery voltage and it says 82v, battery is on charge atm but where it says 82v should that be 84v? Any info welcome thx @Marty BackeckeBkeBaeBBakeBkeB

 

It says 82-volt when it's fully charged? Or ... ?

Most definitely, when the wheel is fully charged it should be at or very near 84-volts.

I don't have a Charge Doctor, but I have a fast charger that shows the voltage. A discharged wheel will show a voltage in the 70's at the beginning of the charge cycle and it'll slowly ramp up to 84-volts. If yours never gets over 82-volts than you have a problem in your wheel. That's a warranty item with Speedyfeet for sure.

Your app (WheelLog?) will accurately show the voltage too.

Edited by Marty Backe

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1 minute ago, Marty Backe said:

It says 82-volt when it's fully charged? Or ... ?

Most definitely, when the wheel is fully charged it should be at or very near 84-volts.

I don't have a Charge Doctor, but I have a fast charger that shows the voltage. A discharged wheel will show a voltage in the 70's at the beginning of the charge cycle and it'll slowly ramp up to 84-volts. If yours never gets over 82-volts than you have a problem in your wheel. That's a warranty item with Speedyfeet for sure.

Thanks Marty for answering , I've just got the charge doctor today and need to fully charge the battery but like I've said before it never reaches 100% on wheellog only 95% but thought that was wheellog . On the video i did it says 73v but when i press the button the red voltage says 82v i thought that was the reading of the packs to what it charges to , I'll fully charge it tonight and see what it says , I'll put it on my fast charger so will know later on 

Thanks

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7 minutes ago, stephen said:

Thanks Marty for answering , I've just got the charge doctor today and need to fully charge the battery but like I've said before it never reaches 100% on wheellog only 95% but thought that was wheellog . On the video i did it says 73v but when i press the button the red voltage says 82v i thought that was the reading of the packs to what it charges to , I'll fully charge it tonight and see what it says , I'll put it on my fast charger so will know later on 

Thanks

Doesn't the Charge Doctor allow you to set what level you want to charge to (100, 90, 80, etc). So maybe yours is set to 82-volts? But again, I don't have a Charge Doctor so I have no idea how to configure its settings.

If you have multiple chargers and none of them get you above 95-percent, then you know it's an issue with the battery pack. My MSX never charges above ~97% because of the EWheels instigated diode protection circuit that was added. I thought that was a EWheels only defect (yeah, I really wish EWheels had not reduced my MSX range).

Edited by Marty Backe
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8 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

Doesn't the Charge Doctor allow you to set what level you want to charge to (100, 90, 80, etc). So maybe yours is set to 82-volts? But again, I don't have a Charge Doctor so I have no idea how to configure its settings.

If you have multiple chargers and none of them get you above 95-percent, then you know it's an issue with the battery pack. My MSX never charges above ~97% because of the EWheels instigated diode protection circuit that was added. I thought that was a EWheels only defect (yeah, I really wish EWheels had not reduced my MSX range).

I thought it did to lol but there's only 1 little button to press and this usb thing I'll have to look it up what it is

IMG_20190112_174424.jpg

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Just now, stephen said:

I thought it did to lol but there's only 1 little button to press and this usb thing I'll have to look it up what it is

IMG_20190112_174424.jpg

@US69 is a savvy Charge Doctor user. Maybe he can provide some enlightenment? 

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25 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

@US69 is a savvy Charge Doctor user. Maybe he can provide some enlightenment? 

Thanks hope @US69 can throw some light on things , it bother me when someone posted before and said i could be losing 10-15 miles due to loss of 2-3v . Here my screenshots of what my full charge is ..usually 81.6v 94%  if lucky i get 95%😊

Screenshot_20190112_184217_com.android.gallery3d.jpg

Screenshot_20190112_184157_com.android.gallery3d.jpg

Edited by stephen
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3 minutes ago, stephen said:

Thanks hope @US69 can throw some light on things , it bother me when someone posted before and said i could be losing 10-15 miles due to loss of 2-3v . Here my screenshots of what my full charge is ..usually 81.6v 94%  if lucky i get 95%😊

Screenshot_20190112_184217_com.android.gallery3d.jpg

 

Yeah, that really is not right. I'm concerned that at ~1000-miles Ian may be cautious at treating this as a warranty problem. Have you ever contacted him? He is always pushing his 2-year warranty. I would test him.

If I have any problems with my wheels (I've had a couple) I immediately contact EWheels and have gotten assistance.

Are you reluctant to contact Ian to resolve this? Or have you already tried and he has been uncooperative?

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24 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

Yeah, that really is not right. I'm concerned that at ~1000-miles Ian may be cautious at treating this as a warranty problem. Have you ever contacted him? He is always pushing his 2-year warranty. I would test him.

If I have any problems with my wheels (I've had a couple) I immediately contact EWheels and have gotten assistance.

Are you reluctant to contact Ian to resolve this? Or have you already tried and he has been uncooperative?

I've always held back because i thought it was wheel log ,gotway app only ever goes up in 10s so it says 100% even if it's 91 etc .. I've managed to put charge doctor to 83v so I'll see later if it ever gets there my battery has never been there lol,, I'll contact ian in the morning if it's not right ,, i don't like coming home after 30 miles then it beeps at me i could easy do more 😐😞😊

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1 hour ago, Marty Backe said:

Doesn't the Charge Doctor allow you to set what level you want to charge to (100, 90, 80, etc). So maybe yours is set to 82-volts? But again, I don't have a Charge Doctor so I have no idea how to configure its settings.

Hold the button on the side of the Charge Doctor while plugging your charger into its input. After it starts up (displays "Auto" on top line) make sure the voltage (lower line) is set to 84.2 if you want to charge your battery to 100%. If it isn't 84.2, you can tap or hold the button to cycle through different voltages to set its charging limit. 

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2 minutes ago, who_the said:

Hold the button on the side of the Charge Doctor while plugging your charger into its input. After it starts up (displays "Auto" on top line) make sure the voltage (lower line) is set to 84.2 if you want to charge your battery to 100%. If it isn't 84.2, you can tap or hold the button to cycle through different voltages to set its charging limit. 

Yeah I've done that now I've reset it to 84.2 see what results i get I'm sure it's going to stop at near 82v but we will see i hope I'm wrong though  , thanks 

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I'm using this wheelog version if it makes a difference 🤔

Screenshot_20190112_194643_com.android.settings.jpg

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8 minutes ago, stephen said:

I'm using this wheelog version if it makes a difference 🤔

Screenshot_20190112_194643_com.android.settings.jpg

That's the version I use. Seems accurate for all my Gotway wheels.

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Calm down:)

From the video, your charge doctor is configured to stop at 82V. So that's what it does. And therefore shows on the display.

See the cd user manual website. You get into the configuration menu by holding down the button while you plug it in. Be careful, this way you can also fuck up its calibration by holding too long, so read before you try.

Even if something is wrong, it is most likely the charger stopping too early, not a problem with the wheel. I wouldn't know what would cause your symptoms in the wheel. Even if a single cell was bad and limiting your voltage, you'd be at 79.8V max and you're already above that.

Edited by meepmeepmayer

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4 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

Calm down:)

From the video, your charge doctor is configured to stop at 82V. So that's what it does. And therefore shows on the display.

See the cd user manual website. You get into the configuration menu by holding down the button while you plug it in. Be careful, this way you can also fuck up its calibration by holding too long, so read before you try.

Even if something is wrong, it is most likely the charger stopping too early, not a problem with the wheel. I wouldn't know what would cause your symptoms in the wheel. Even if a single cell was bad and limiting your voltage, you'd be at 79.8V max and you're already above that.

Yet he has multiple chargers and just recently got the Charge Doctor. He has about a 1000-miles on this wheel and has been talking about the low range since he got it.

So I don't think you can blame it on the charger. But I'm not there so I can't really say.

Like you though, I don't know how a faulty battery pack(s) can cause this symptom.

If it was my wheel and I had these symptoms and have tried my 10 different chargers, I would open the wheel and investigate the wiring path from the charge port to the batteries. There's not much in these wheels. Charge port goes to the battery connector. That's it. The control board is not in the loop.

Unplug the batteries. Plug in the charger. Measure the voltage at the connector that plugs into the battery. If that's at 84-volts than the problem is in the battery subsystem.

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9 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

10 different chargers

Are the chargers the same model type? I have never viewed the one that comes with the wheel as being quality.

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10 minutes ago, RockyTop said:

Are the chargers the same model type? I have never viewed the one that comes with the wheel as being quality.

He has the stock charger from Gotway and a fast charger from ???  Maybe he has other chargers too?

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7 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

He has the stock charger from Gotway and a fast charger from ???  Maybe he has other chargers too?

I got stock charger and 5amp charger from speedyfeet ,,, so the state of play so far is the charge doctor  is reading 83.2v and still charging at 1.5amp so i unplugged it and connect to wheellog which shows 81.6v 95% battery so hopefully it's just the app BUT it's still charging so I'll wait till the end of charge now and see what's the outcome😊 thanks guys i appreciate everyone's input so far 

Screenshot_20190112_204407_com.android.gallery3d.png

Screenshot_20190112_203117_com.cooper.wheellog.jpg

Edited by stephen
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35 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

He has about a 1000-miles on this wheel and has been talking about the low range since he got it.

Also marty I've have alot more miles on the wheel if it falls over or i stumble😀 or set the wheel setting to soft or hard my milage gets reset lol, msx bug , fingers crossed I've stopped falling 😣y did i say that😣 , if my battery is ok y would my wheellog show 81.6v 🤔 i have tried a few versions and still the same... Not long to go before it's fully charged fingers crossed 😊

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31 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

Wheellog should always be accurate, it just displays what the wheel firmware tells it, so gets the info straight from the source. And it is in 1% increments. Your Wheellog is the latest/current version.

100% battery is not 84V. A Gotway considers the battery at 100% at 4.1125V per cell (x20 cells = 82.25V) so 82.25V is where the charger will stop (green light instead of red light). You have to keep the green light charger in to get to 84V, it will keep charging.

By the way, the max voltage is 84V, not 84.2V. The BMS would stop you from overcharging anyways, but still. 67.2V for "67V" wheels is where there is a 0.2 decimal. Set your CD to stop at 84V or disable the auto stop (or just plug in the charger directly) and let the BMS/charger do the stopping and allow for the maximum charge.

-

But the 82V vs 84V does not explain your range loss, that would be about 10%, not 30-35 miles instead of 50 (you have the 1600Wh, right?) which is equivalent to about 1000Wh usable. Either you're very heavy/have low tire pressure/have the mysterious Ian's-low-range-phenomenon-in-the-UK (what did he get in his MSX range test?), or there might be something wrong indeed.

Again, I'm not sure what could even be wrong to cause these symptoms. Maybe some disconnected battery blocks so your wheel is only 4p instead of 6p? But if there definitely is something wrong, the 2 year warranty is a legal requirement, not just an offer. So no problem there. But Ian's service is really his strength, so don't worry about that.

How exactly did you measure the distance ridden? What the wheel says?

Yeah, I think maybe the gravitational constant is different in England or something similar :lol: All you guys get weirdly lower range values than I do.

Great explanation about the voltages. My wheels are typically charging for many many hours past the green light stage. So they always show at 100-percent. Based on what @stephen just wrote about it being at >83-volts and was still charging, I don't think he has an issue with the voltage. Range might me another problem.

However, I don't think @stephen is a light weight :whistling: and he is known for liking to ride with low tire pressure (in the mid-30's I believe). As we know, that can kill the range. I ride mine at the max pressure listed on the tire.

Lastly regarding the range, I know multiple people over 200-pounds that easily get 45+ miles during our group rides. We're riding mostly below 20-mph during those rides. Mixed-speed rides, but little 22+ mph riding.

Edited by Marty Backe
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1 minute ago, Marty Backe said:

Based on what @stephen just wrote about it being at >83-volts and was still charging, I don't think he has an issue with the voltage. Range might me another problem.

I believe that too. The charger stopping at around 82V and the rest of the voltage story seems mostly plausible.

But the range, the range... that's just strange. (It rhymes;))

--

@stephen It's not a 100V MSX with 1240Wh, is it? At least then the range would be closer to normal and could maybe be explained by not-full-charging, cold weather, low tire pressure, whatnot. Have you ever opened the Wheel and looked inside? Is the battery the full size?

Grasping at straws here;)

--

By the way, do you know if the latest Wheellog uses the original Gotway formula (where 15% is where the beeps start etc) or maybe a different one? @palachzzz What is it?

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19 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

I believe that too. The charger stopping at around 82V and the rest of the voltage story seems mostly plausible.

But the range, the range... that's just strange. (It rhymes;))

--

@stephen It's not a 100V MSX with 1240Wh, is it? At least then the range would be closer to normal and could maybe be explained by not-full-charging, cold weather, low tire pressure, whatnot. Have you ever opened the Wheel and looked inside? Is the battery the full size?

Grasping at straws here;)

--

By the way, do you know if the latest Wheellog uses the original Gotway formula (where 15% is where the beeps start etc) or maybe a different one? @palachzzz What is it?

After a bit of complaining by me, the 19 version of WheelLog now matches the Gotway hardware. There were a few versions where a different lookup table was being used.

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Thanks guys , yes i have the 1600 msx so I've let it charge for ages now the charge doctor was showing 83.2v so now I've looked again and it's actually gone down now ..pic attached,,,, i unplugged it and wheellog shows 82v which is the issue i have ,yes im 200lbs ,yes i ride soft tire 30 psi , yes i live in UK and it's very hilly and i ride 20+ mph in Bursts but what i dont get  its always 82v it doesn't matter how long i have it on charge I've never got it over 82.1v which is my problem .i can live with the range if its my conditions but why 82v🤔

IMG_20190112_220604.jpg

IMG_20190112_220600.jpg

Screenshot_20190112_214025_com.cooper.wheellog.jpg

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