KingSong 16X 1554Wh 2200W 16*3in (Released July 2019)

[houseofjob]

2 hours ago, US69 said:

Without joke:

The more feedback i have...the better the chances are to get what we want....

Well, I'm not partaking in this 16X due to my dislike of the shell aesthetics, but for this model & future models (KS-24 pleeeeeaaase *fingers crossed*)......

1. Please tell KS to at least make an attempt to design into the shell a way for the wheel to stand upright. Every other manufacturer has this on at least one of their models, some more effective than others: Ninebot > Z10, all InMotion, Gotways with egg-shapes all rest upright.
2. Please have them copy the Gotway idea to build a bright, over-sized volt-meter that is visible when looking down on the wheel top shell while riding.
3. It would be super if you could tilt the headlight to your taste. I've always wished for this with all EUCs.
4. Since this is in fact the KS16X design, which looks almost identical to the Rockwheel GT18 mockups to me, please copy the GT18 prototype built-in front handles, so you don't have to always rely only on and stress the locked trolley. Not sure if it's too late for that / if they've already pressed up the mold.

 

Edited March 13, 2019 by houseofjob

[meepmeepmayer]

3 hours ago, US69 said:

As Jason said...its only a prototype and the shell under the pedals will be cut/changed.

Was one of the first things that got back to the drawing board :-)

 

And for all other „small“ details...this goes the same, remember, its the first protoype, and actually lately KS has been very, very good in listening to some advice...

So if this is only a prototype, I guess the release will be towards the end of the year? Going by the 18(X)L schedule?

Will GW will have their next 16 incher after the Nikola out when the Rockwheel KS16X releases?

But it certainly looks nice. I wonder for how long the design existed and how much influence the ninebot Z was.

I'm surprised KS did a 3 inch wide tire. Expected 2.5 like the V10, and maybe just a modest 16S update. Nobody would have said "Kingsong!" when shown this design.

Finally, might it get a smaller 14 inch brother?

Edited March 13, 2019 by meepmeepmayer

[meepmeepmayer]

1 hour ago, houseofjob said:

It would be super if you could tilt the headlight to your taste. I've always wished for this with all EUCs.

That is a fantastic idea!!!

No complicated or electrical mechanism, just manually adjust the angle how you see fit.

[Smoother]

Since we're talking lighting; how about a light that actually throws some sort of focused beam like on road legal vehicles, rather than the generic flashlight "all blinded" circle. Something that throws some of the light at the ground immediately in front of the wheel would also be nice for obstruction identification.

 

[US69]

1 hour ago, meepmeepmayer said:

this is only a prototype, I guess the release will be towards the end of the year? Going by the 18(X)L schedule?

Jaja...good joke.. :-)

In Contrary to the 18L release, which was reported after first scetches, here i for the first time functioned that the specs/pics and all was kept confidential until the first prototype. So as said in the video...production run to be set for June.

Perhaps you finally try a KS then...when you have one in hand ...you will know why it takes them a bit longer as some of the competition to plan and release a new wheel ;-)

And, seeing that 9b needed 3 years for a new wheel, i am quite happy with one new KS a year :-)

@houseofjob @Unventor Ideas noted....

Edited March 13, 2019 by US69

[US69]

@houseofjob

Just some feedback to your ideas:

while i understand the craving for a 24 or 22 KS...its unfortunatly nearly sure this will not happen.

The EUC market is still muhc to small .....and such wheels like a 24inch EUC are just a super niche. Even GW...selling more wheels than KS considers the Monster a niche wheel....in relation to popular sellers like the MSX the Monster beiing much more expensive.

What i want to say is: No market which will give KS the chance to make this even a bit profitable!

Sorry, just beeing honest....

 

The grips, we see on the RW 18inch...not only that there is no real place for doing something like this...as Ks prefers lights, charge ports and USB there.

But main point ..i have the 18L now for 900kmh...commuting daily to work and carrying it about 4-6 of 10-12meter stairs every day. I admit that the first trolley version of 18L/Xl might be to weak for such a daily job....but now with the latest stronger locks and improvements on trolley, as it is now, i really dont see any need for this extra carrying grip anymore.

Edited March 14, 2019 by US69

[Dzlchef]

1 hour ago, Smoother said:

Since we're talking lighting; how about a light that actually throws some sort of focused beam like on road legal vehicles, rather than the generic flashlight "all blinded" circle. Something that throws some of the light at the ground immediately in front of the wheel would also be nice for obstruction identification.

 

Truly it needs a multi-light approach to illuminate the closer field in front of the wheel and a speed variable long-throw headlight that can be adjusted in the app.

[houseofjob]

22 minutes ago, US69 said:

while i understand the craving for a 24 or 22 KS...its unfortunatly nearly sure this will not happen.

Never say never. 

We said the same thing about Ninebot years back, they would never release a bigger battery, faster wheel.

And look now, .... Z, voila!

 

22 minutes ago, US69 said:

The EUC market is still muhc to small .....and such wheels like a 24inch EUC are just a super niche. Even GW...selling more wheels than KS considers the Monster a niche wheel....in relation to popular sellers like the MSX the Monster beiing much more expensive.

What i want to say is: No market which will give KS the chance to make this even a bit profitable!

Sorry, just beeing honest....

Niche, yes, but what no one ever mentions in this debate is that the Monster is based on borrowed parts from their higher-selling models, same board, up-size the same motor, etc. The only real infrastructural cost introduced is investing in a new shell moulding.

Profits can be had, albeit not as big a profit margin as the cheaper, smaller wheels, if they streamline production intelligently.

 

22 minutes ago, US69 said:

The grips, we see on the RW 18inch...not only that there is no real place for doing something like this...as Ks prefers lights, charge ports and USB there.

But main point i have to say...i have the 18L now for 900kmh...commuting daily to work and carrying it about 4-6 of 10-12meter stairs every day. I admit that the first trolley version of 18L/Xl might be to weak for such a daily job....but now with the latest stronger locks and improvements on trolley, as it is now, i really dont see any need for this extra carrying grip anymore.

They don't have to be there FWIW, just anywhere.

This is sad that KS can't just add something so simple as this, considering EVERY other manufacturer does this, reducing potential point of failure. 

And FWIW, you haven't owned your 18L with new trolley design a year yet, the real test of time IMHO. Typically, all EUC issues will reveal themselves on a wheel around the 1 year usage mark in my experience, having owned 16 different wheels so far.

Edited March 13, 2019 by houseofjob

[eddiemoy]

3 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

Which is about $500 more than they were 1-1/2 years ago. Just a bit more than inflation 

Trump tax.

[Mono]

6 hours ago, Smoother said:

No I haven't but the Z10 is as wide as a bus.  Is it even possible to make contact with the ankles once the shin bone has made its way past the top of the shell?  This is a real question, I actually don't know.

With bent knees you can for sure.

[US69]

17 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

And FWIW, you haven't owned your 18L with new trolley design a year yet, the real test of time IMHO. Typically, all EUC issues will reveal themselves on a wheel around the 1 year usage mark in my experience, having owned 16 different wheels so far.

Hmmh, so a year usage is the quality messurement point for a wearing down part? Then i put it in the cellar now....and pull it out failure free next year...

FWIW At least i own one for over 900km....5—6 months....use it each! day for commuting to work, carry it over the the subway stairs and my appartment stairs each day, produce stress on the Grip/trolley like what not...instead of just having an opinion about long time usage of the wheel and actual trolley.

But yeah.....me having only owning 11 wheels instead of 16 makes my experience probably much worse....but wait, isnt having less wheels over time meaning the average longer usage time per wheel? :-)

 

32 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

This is sad that KS can't just add something so simple as this, considering EVERY other manufacturer does this, reducing potential point of failure. 

It‘s not that they cant add it..its just not needed. See above......

I even would point that out as a unique selling argument, having a middle retractable trolley, that also serves for carrying the wheel! 

Yeah, as said before: The trolley locks werent perfect in the beginning...but now the are working flawless :-)

 

FWIW and Just  to make it clear...thats a „personal“ answer from my very own, quasi my very own IMHO :-) 

Perhaps as „KS rep“ ..i shouldnt give such personal answers...so thats probably one of the reasons, why, as @Unventor stated...i was „out of buisiness“ and partly stayed out of discussions....

So, help needed? Contact me by PM!!!

 

[Heyzeus]

1 hour ago, houseofjob said:

This is sad that KS can't just add something so simple as this, considering EVERY other manufacturer does this, reducing potential point of failure. 

And FWIW, you haven't owned your 18L with new trolley design a year yet, the real test of time IMHO. Typically, all EUC issues will reveal themselves on a wheel around the 1 year usage mark in my experience, having owned 16 different wheels so far.

They could feasibly keep the same handle/trolley design and have a shell handle so no weight is put on the trolley handle when lifting while maintaining the same look of the current design..

Mold the shell so that the plastic shell handle part that is weight bearing is wider than the trolley handle and thick to be strong yet has a recess in it that the trolley handle slightly sits in.

when trolley handle is down, it sits part ways in the recess of the plastic handle part, when you lift the unicycle all weight is on the plastic part and not the telescoping trollery parts.  To use the trolley handle, simply depress the button on the trolley handle and lift it up.

[houseofjob]

2 minutes ago, US69 said:

But yeah.....me having only owning 11 wheels instead of 16 makes my experience probably much worse....but wait, isnt having less wheels over time meaning the average longer usage time per wheel? :-)

[houseofjob]

2 minutes ago, Heyzeus said:

They could feasibly keep the same handle/trolley design and have a shell handle so no weight is put on the trolley handle when lifting while maintaining the same look of the current design..

Mold the shell so that the plastic shell handle part that is weight bearing is wider than the trolley handle and thick to be strong yet has a recess in it that the trolley handle slightly sits in.

when trolley handle is down, it sits part ways in the recess of the plastic handle part, when you lift the unicycle all weight is on the plastic part and not the telescoping trollery parts.  To use the trolley handle, simply depress the button on the trolley handle and lift it up.

[houseofjob]

Man, I dream of the day when EUC manufacturers will over-engineer, not under-engineer. *sigh*

[US69]

27 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

I totally understand any concerns about the actual handle designs and the doubts about it being able to carry the wheel over long time.

I also admit that Ks16 wheels and trolleys have been very far from perfect and also even  the very first 18L versions are not beeing strong enough.

BUT: it would be nice if you could at least try it in the latest version.

While i would say that the handle sensor for shutting off the wheel spinning  „only“ has worked 99,5% of the time... in my 900km daily commuting usage of the wheel, with daily carrying it multiple times, i did NOT have even ONE Failure of the locks of the trolley not closing perfect on each side and there was not even a bit of feeling at all of the wheel not beeing able to carry or feeling unsecure to do so.

14 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

Man, I dream of the day when EUC manufacturers will over-engineer, not under-engineer. *sigh*

Yeah...and i will dream of the day when on social media experience and facts gets over pure opinion and imagination *sigh*

 

 

Edited March 14, 2019 by US69

[houseofjob]

13 minutes ago, US69 said:

I totally understand any concerns about the actual handle designs and the doubts about it being able to carry the wheel over long time.

I also admit that Ks16 wheels and trolleys have been very far from perfect and also even  the very first 18L versions are not beeing strong enough.

BUT: it would be nice if you could at least try it in the latest version.

I did, before I sold my L, was sent the replacement, etc.

Sorry, the poor history of this design across all KS models in general, and just pure eyeballing how it's put together, doesn't inspire much confidence for the longer haul.

But that's just me, most guys don't seem to care until their handles actually break.

 

13 minutes ago, US69 said:

While i would say that the handle sensor for shutting off the wheel spinning  „only“ has worked 99,5% of the time... in my 900km daily commuting usage of the wheel, with daily carrying it multiple times, i did NOT have even ONE Failure of the locks of the trolley not closing perfect on each side and there was not even a bit of feeling at all of the wheel not beeing able to carry or feeling unsecure to do so.

Er, I said nothing about the sensor / sensor implementation. I actually like it, got it tuned to work really well before I sold my L 

 

13 minutes ago, US69 said:

Yeah...and i will dream of the day when on social media experience and facts gets over pure opinion and imagination *sigh*

I like that you're KS's stubborn, grumpy social media rep.... totally unorthodox haha!

Any typical company social media rep would respond with generic, politically correct, banal retorts, nodding in agreement that they'll take comments to heart, no matter how hard they disagree with them. @US69 please don't change 

Edited March 14, 2019 by houseofjob

[Marty Backe]

10 minutes ago, US69 said:

I totally understand any concerns about the actual handle designs and the doubts about it being able to carry the wheel over long time.

I also admit that Ks16 wheels and trolleys have been very far from perfect and also even  the very first 18L versions are not beeing strong enough.

BUT: it would be nice if you could at least try it in the latest version.

While i would say that the handle sensor for shutting off the wheel spinning  „only“ has worked 99,5% of the time... in my 900km daily commuting usage of the wheel, with daily carrying it multiple times, i did NOT have even ONE Failure of the locks of the trolley not closing perfect on each side and there was not even a bit of feeling at all of the wheel not beeing able to carry or feeling unsecure to do so.

Yeah...and i will dream of the day when on social media experience and facts gets over pure opinion and imagination *sigh*

I don't have near the mileage on my KS18XL as you do, but the lift sensor has been working 100-percent for me. One thing I do is not immediately lift the wheel. I apply a little bit of upward force and wait for the wheel to disengage. Then I fully lift the wheel.

I'm just now reassembling mine. I had to remove the tire to patch two holes in the inner tube. I also have to fabricate new mounting supports for one of the shell covers since only one brass insert is remaining on that side of the shell 

[US69]

Time to go to bed..

...perhaps i should shoot a video about the actual trolley and what it can take...

5 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

I don't have near the mileage on my KS18XL as you do, but the lift sensor has been working 100-percent for me. One thing I do is not immediately lift the wheel. I apply a little bit of upward force and wait for the wheel to disengage. Then I fully lift the wheel.

I'm just now reassembling mine. I had to remove the tire to patch two holes in the inner tube. I also have to fabricate new mounting supports for one of the shell covers since only one brass insert is remaining on that side of the shell 

Yeah..we are not talking/argumenting about the handle sensor..which is actually nearly flawless...at least after calibrating it.

Chris has no trust that the trolley and the handle is not strong enough, so that you are  not able to carry the 18l/xl with it. 

So he wants extra grips/carry handles on the side or elsewhere. which i said will not happen, cause not needed.

 

But as said..enough of this fake news. Good Night to all ;-)

Edited March 14, 2019 by US69

[seage]

36 minutes ago, US69 said:

I also admit that Ks16 wheels and trolleys have been very far from perfect

Yeah, no one told me about the weak handle until the 2nd one broke on my 2nd time picking it up, dropping my 16s directly on the top of my foot - fracturing it a few weeks ago XD. I love everything else about that wheel, but that handle was just terrible terrrrrrrriible engineering. Im happy its fixed, i just wished it was before it broke me, loll. 

Still waiting on my replacement tho, lol. 

[houseofjob]

41 minutes ago, US69 said:

Chris has no trust that the trolley and the handle is not strong enough, so that you are  not able to carry the 18l/xl with it. 

So he wants extra grips/carry handles on the side or elsewhere. which i said will not happen, cause not needed.

But as said..enough of this fake news. Good Night to all ;-)

I love to disagree, and so do you!

We were meant for each other Ulf!

Edited March 14, 2019 by houseofjob

[houseofjob]

3 minutes ago, seage said:

Yeah, no one told me about the weak handle until the 2nd one broke on my 2nd time picking it up, dropping my 16s directly on the top of my foot - fracturing it a few weeks ago XD. I love everything else about that wheel, but that handle was just terrible terrrrrrrriible engineering. Im happy its fixed, i just wished it was before it broke me, loll. 

Still waiting on my replacement tho, lol. 

Oh damn, hope that foot is ok-ish now.

Edited March 14, 2019 by houseofjob

[seage]

Just now, houseofjob said:

Oh damn, hope that foot is ok-ish now.

Slow healing spot, but its getting better everyday! No longer hurts unless i poke it. You can imagine my disappointment having it break off on the day it arrived, and mashing my foot up on the process LOL. 

[houseofjob]

Just now, seage said:

Slow healing spot, but its getting better everyday! No longer hurts unless i poke it. You can imagine my disappointment having it break off on the day it arrived, and mashing my foot up on the process LOL. 

Damn dude, sorry. Not a lot of luck in your EUC hobbyist infancy, but glad to see you persevere~

[seage]

1 minute ago, houseofjob said:

Damn dude, sorry. Not a lot of luck in your EUC hobbyist infancy, but glad to see you persevere~

Haha, honestly. But on the upside, passed 200km on the wheel today! Learning to ride a bit faster now. But i wont hijack this thread with that stuff.

After seeing the specs and riding my own 16, i think id still go for that 18xl...unless i win that contest LOL. But man, how can folks go 40km+ on a 16 inch wheel?