My KS18XL Trials, Tribulations, and Failures

[Marty Backe]

 

[Afeez Kay]

Good first impression video 18XL.. and Merry Christmas Marty 

[Lutalo]

9 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

 

Very nice. Great video. Love the armor. I love the way the XL feels as well. I haven't yet done a range test. Most of my tests have thus far been direct comparisons with the 18L; jumping off of one and on to the other to detect dynamic differences. Happy holidays 👍

Edited December 25, 2018 by Lutalo

[radial]

Great to see the XL in action and to hear your commentary!  I'm feeling optimistic about my decision to order one.  Just out of curiosity, did you buy the wheel, or do you have it from Jason for T&E?  

[Lutalo]

2 minutes ago, radial said:

Great to see the XL in action and to hear your commentary!  I'm feeling optimistic about my decision to order one.  Just out of curiosity, did you buy the wheel, or do you have it from Jason for T&E?  

@radial when is yours gonna be delivered. I am linking up with @Neil (yanex) this weekend for a ride. Will you have your wheel by then?

[radial]

2 minutes ago, Lutalo said:

@radial when is yours gonna be delivered. I am linking up with @Neil (yanex) this weekend for a ride. Will you have your wheel by then?

Probably not.  Last email from ewheels.com said the shipment from China was expected to make landfall in the U.S. today and that they would be shipping wheels next week.  I'll catch up with you guys soon, I hope.  

[ED209]

7 hours ago, Lutalo said:

Most of my tests have thus far been direct comparisons with the 18L; jumping off of one and on to the other to detect dynamic differences

@Marty Backe & @Lutalo, How does the new extension handle feel compared to original? Does it feel like it can support the extra weight of The XL when lifting the wheel?

Also do the extra large pedals really improve performance, allowing you to really exploit the wheel? 

Edited December 25, 2018 by ED209

[Lutalo]

1 hour ago, radial said:

Probably not.  Last email from ewheels.com said the shipment from China was expected to make landfall in the U.S. today and that they would be shipping wheels next week.  I'll catch up with you guys soon, I hope.  

OK, cool. When it arrives We'll do one just for you sir. 

[Lutalo]

14 hours ago, ED209 said:

@Marty Backe & @Lutalo, How does the new extension handle feel compared to original? Does it feel like it can support the extra weight of The XL when lifting the wheel?

Also do the extra large pedals really improve performance, allowing you to really exploit the wheel? 

There have been 3 iterations of the handle stem mechanism. I have had them all on my 18L. Luckily, The 18XL is fitted with the best iteration from the factory. Thanks to the premature failure of the two previous trolley versions, my 18L has the black handle as well. 

The new trolley mechanism is the best version by far. It's much thicker, stronger, better, and has longer lasting reinforcement pins along the stem. The stem alloy seems to be more substantial as well with a smoother operating telescoping function. 

Bear in mind that the handle when elevated is not a load bearing structure. The wheel is not designed to be lifted with the handle in the raised position. If the wheel is raised from the ground with the stems raised,  the mechanism will fail and you will need to buy a new handle very quickly.

The handle should always be retracted and locked before lifting the wheel from the ground. If the wheel is lifted properly it should easily last several years without a problem. 

Edited December 26, 2018 by Lutalo

[Unventor]

14 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

 

You are turning a few heads on that video 😎 it must be that sexy wheel. Since people can't see you face inside the helmet 😉.

Like you said you can go faster, but to me 30-35kmh is fine for me. I have my KS18L set to 40kmh warning and 42kmh for forced tiltback. And now with LP(large pedals) mod. My 19.7 km ride today took 45min in outskirts of the city, and not being in race mode. Like you ride today. 

Note: As I were typing this, your review stopped on my Tv, and it went on to this....ok it is not an EUC...But I can't help thinking of you recent crash...Then look the risk they are taking...I know pro mtb have shock absorbers but still. 

 

Edited December 25, 2018 by Unventor

[Unventor]

8 hours ago, Lutalo said:

Very nice. Great video. Love the armor. I love the way the XL feels as well. I haven't yet done a range test. Most of my tests have thus far been direct comparisons with the 18L; jumping off of one and on to the other to detect dynamic differences. Happy holidays 👍

So do they feel different KS18L vs KS18XL? As I understand KS have changed  algorithms but using same motor. And of course the added weight due to bigger battery pack.

[Lutalo]

1 hour ago, Unventor said:

So do they feel different KS18L vs KS18XL? As I understand KS have changed  algorithms but using same motor. And of course the added weight due to bigger battery pack.

Yes. They do feel different. Especially when you jump off one and immediately perform the same maneuver on the other. I talked about my impressions at some length in the "Guess What Came in the Mail Early" thread. 

In a nutshell; the differences are mostly the result of weight differences. The 18L handles better - relative to quick direction changes and overall maneuverability. The XL feels more stable in and out of turns,  and in a straight line.

The last difference I am not yet sure how to explain. The XL feels like it accelerates more strongly, and steadily, and maybe more quickly. 

It's a great wheel. @Marty Backe just got 45 miles out of his with about 20% battery remaining. So, range is another not so surprising difference between them. I haven't personally done a range test, but Marty's is encouraging and basically took away my need to rush to do one. I found his test satisfactory and within the realm of what I expected; cool. Thanks to Marty I feel confident that my wheel could take me from DC to Baltimore. Recharge, and ride back to DC; nice (that actually sounds like a ride I should organize). I have had mine for about a week. I have ridden almost daily including today and have only charged it once.

I am loving this wheel. Best wheel I have ever had the privilege to mount and go.

The 18XL is probably the last dedicated wheel I will buy for a while until there is some new compellingly irresistible upgrade to wheels like a real 100 miles of range on a much lighter and more efficient device. 👍

Edited December 26, 2018 by Lutalo

[Marty Backe]

7 hours ago, Unventor said:

You are turning a few heads on that video 😎 it must be that sexy wheel. Since people can't see you face inside the helmet 😉.

Like you said you can go faster, but to me 30-35kmh is fine for me. I have my KS18L set to 40kmh warning and 42kmh for forced tiltback. And now with LP(large pedals) mod. My 19.7 km ride today took 45min in outskirts of the city, and not being in race mode. Like you ride today. 

Note: As I were typing this, your review stopped on my Tv, and it went on to this....ok it is not an EUC...But I can't help thinking of you recent crash...Then look the risk they are taking...I know pro mtb have shock absorbers but still. 

 

I watched the entire video. Incredible. I can't believe it was a continuous 40-minute downhill ride of insane proportions. How do those bikes withstand the torture, yet alone the body?

They make it look easy but I bet injuries are common.

[Marty Backe]

9 hours ago, ED209 said:

@Marty Backe & @Lutalo, How does the new extension handle feel compared to original? Does it feel like it can support the extra weight of The XL when lifting the wheel?

Also do the extra large pedals really improve performance, allowing you to really exploit the wheel? 

I never really rode the L so I can't address the comparison. But the handle feels very robust when closed. When fully extended it feels less robust than say, my KS14S. The cutoff sensor seems consistently good.

I can't say the big pedals improve performance, but they sure feel nice. I think my feet felt better after this 45-mile ride compared to any other wheel I've ridden. Seems like a no-brainer to upgrade. Oh, and I didn't notice them getting in the way of tight turns in any way. I haven't scraped the pedals yet.

10 hours ago, radial said:

Great to see the XL in action and to hear your commentary!  I'm feeling optimistic about my decision to order one.  Just out of curiosity, did you buy the wheel, or do you have it from Jason for T&E?  

Thanks. No, this is the loaner wheel from EWheels.

[The Fat Unicyclist]

2 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

I never really rode the L so I can't address the comparison. But the handle feels very robust when closed. When fully extended it feels less robust than say, my KS14S. The cutoff sensor seems consistently good.

I can't say the big pedals improve performance, but they sure feel nice. I think my feet felt better after this 45-mile ride compared to any other wheel I've ridden. Seems like a no-brainer to upgrade. Oh, and I didn't notice them getting in the way of tight turns in any way. I haven't scraped the pedals yet.

I happen to have an 18L and an 18XL kicking around... This is my take on the differences;

The trolley handle does appear to be a little stiffer when extended (though it may be that the handle on my 18L has loosened up over time) - the 18L/XL handle is a LOT taller than the 14S, so challenging to keep tight.

The real difference between the 18L and 18XL trolleys isn't visible though... The pins that hold the extenders in position (and take the weight of the wheel when lifted) are much stronger, so a definite plus. 

The lift cut-off sensor is the same on both wheels - provided it is calibrated it works well. 

 

Outside of the USA, the larger pedals are not standard, but are available as a "spare part" (and I happen to have some of those too). 

I have tried them on a couple of wheels so far... They fit beautifully on the 18L/XL. The higher pedal position and rounded corners mean that they don't cause any issues (even with sharp cornering). And for me I did find them to be beneficial going uphill (with a Fat Unicyclist onboard even). Being able to shift in my weight an extra inch forward allows me to push the wheel a bit harder and with less effort. 

Oh and they are SO SO SO comfortable! Going from pedals that fitted from the middle of my heel to the middle of the ball of my foot to these ones that run from almost the back of my heel to just under my toes is fantastic! It almost feels like I could curl my toes around the pedals to hold on better - and other than it is almost like you are standing on the ground - those annoying pressure points have simply gone. 

Note: I wear a size 10 shoe. 

Having said all that, I also put the large pedals onto a KS-16S... They completely change the ride experience! I have let a few riders try them and they were all converts after only about 10 feet of riding. However, with the lower pedal height of the 16S, they are quite easy to scrape. And unfortunately the black paint is very quick to flake off - which is also a lot more noticeable than on the grey pedals!

I would also suggest that from a show size of about 8 downward, there would be no real benefit to the larger pedal size. 

Edited December 26, 2018 by The Fat Unicyclist

[ED209]

@Lutalo, so how do you find the new Pedals over the old? do they allow you to shift more of your body weight on? Giving you more leverage? @The Fat Unicyclist says it only takes 10 metres to realise that the new foot plates are much better than the old, is this really true? 

[ED209]

@The Fat Unicyclist thankyou for your take on extension handle and new footplates, just read your last post, Very helpful, mouth watering information. 

I am ordering these bad boys right away!!! 

Edited December 26, 2018 by ED209

[The Fat Unicyclist]

1 hour ago, ED209 said:

@The Fat Unicyclist says it only takes 10 metres to realise that the new foot plates are much better than the old, is this really true? 

I actually said it only takes about 10 feet...

@Mishkin convinced me to relinquish a pair to him, installed onto his 16S for him even (and with my secret pedal lube procedure included too). He has had them for 5-6 days now, so might be able to add his own comment here.

[ED209]

21 minutes ago, The Fat Unicyclist said:

actually said it only takes about 10 feet...

Even better! 

[Unventor]

3 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

I watched the entire video. Incredible. I can't believe it was a continuous 40-minute downhill ride of insane proportions. How do those bikes withstand the torture, yet alone the body?

They make it look easy but I bet injuries are common.

I am pretty sure they too are armoured up underneath the shirt.

Now I don't know what speed they are running, but to me it just looks insane. From their perspective I get they ask for more speed....But then again they are on a race track conditions not in traffic as such with cars comming out in blind spots.

So as you said in your review, 22mph or 35-40kmh is enough for me. 

@Lutalo thanks for your reply, I have to browse back a bit to find you review, I must have missed it somehow. But from what you wrote in your reply I get the added weight makes it more stable but that you need more force to turn it. As for breaking or more like emergency breaking is a key performance I am looking at. Since I ride in traffic either roads or crowded bike lanes. And cars constant are unpredictable due they are jaw dropping look at th EUC or simply misjudge it capabilities in terms on ridestyle, speed and road conditions needs. They simply do not look out for road conditions as I do since I dislike to test potholes 😀 especially water filled or muddy potholes.

[Unventor]

@The Fat Unicyclist thanks for your comparison. I only test more or less straight riding, but I totally get your point of uphill and downhill riding, that you can shift forward or backwards you stance to get a more effort less ride. I have not taken this into account yet. In my size 40-41 EU size or 8 US size shoes.

[Lutalo]

3 hours ago, ED209 said:

@Lutalo, so how do you find the new Pedals over the old? do they allow you to shift more of your body weight on? Giving you more leverage? @The Fat Unicyclist says it only takes 10 metres to realise that the new foot plates are much better than the old, is this really true? 

I believe this foot plat upgrade may be the single most important upgrade KS has made to their wheels since they started making them. That is perhaps arguable, but I doubt anyone who has tried them would deny their importance to the KS ride experience.

My opinion on using them is pretty much an echo of @The Fat Unicyclist. I had been using them for a bit when my XL arrived,  because I installed them on the 18L when they became available. The improvement to foot comfort and stability was a marked upgrade over the original equipment. The combination of size and surface coverage of the grip tape made Everything feel easier to do, and I was comfortable doing it for a longer period. 

I would not go back to old plats, and if I bought a wheel with them I would immediately swap them out for the new plats. 

Edited December 26, 2018 by Lutalo

[Lutalo]

8 hours ago, Unventor said:

As for breaking or more like emergency breaking is a key performance I am looking at. Since I ride in traffic either roads or crowded bike lanes. And cars constant are unpredictable due they are jaw dropping look at th EUC or simply misjudge it capabilities in terms on ridestyle, speed and road conditions needs. They simply do not look out for road conditions as I do since I dislike to test potholes 😀 especially water filled or muddy potholes

I tested braking also. Sorry that I forgot to mention that. The 18L to me felt superior in this regard as well. I imagine that is also a product of the weight difference. The lighter weight of the 18L appears also to lend itself well to slowing forward momentum a very slight bit better than the 18XL

The XL brakes perform very well however, and I could only detect the marginal difference in feel when I immediately alternated wheels during hard braking. While there is certainly a difference in feel, I didn't do any quantitative measurements of braking distance so I don't know if there is an actual difference in performance.  

 

Edited December 26, 2018 by Lutalo

[RockyTop]

  I just ordered my 18XL.  Jason said they would likely ship around the end of next week. I also got a set of pedals for my KS16s. I can’t wait. 

  Get them while you can! eWheels.com  $25 off, free shipping and free wrist guards for the next 4 days!  ( promo code 25OFF)

I am not a paid sponsor just a happy customer. 

[ED209]

@RockyTop, Nice! do you know if that 25% offer is open to those of us in Europe? 

Also which Colour did you go for?

@Lutalo,  Which colour do you favour the most? The White or Matt Black?

Edited December 26, 2018 by ED209