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So I decide to repeat the run that caused my faceplant 2 weeks ago..


Hsiang

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It's not the girth, length or firmness that really matters, but what you do with the wheel that really counts.  :whistling:  From our tiny friend, the Mten3, to the Magnum sized Z10 and Big Monster wheels, they all provide loads of fun regardless of how deeply they have penetrated the EUC marketplace.  :innocent1:  Whether they be engaged in threesomes, foursomes or mass group rides :w00t2:, they all are fun in their own unique ways and even quite enjoyable in solitary fashion by oneself.  :yawn:  Uh, what were we talking about again?  Ah, it doesn't matter.  Less talk, more riding!  :clap3:

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11 minutes ago, Alex_from_NZ said:

I am very curious how wide we are talking here.. my feet hang off all ends of the pedals and im trying all different positions at the moment.  

If I’m perfectly balanced on the wheel, I’m typically standing in such a way that the inside of my calfs are barely touching the sides.  Basically, there’s enough gap on both sides to tilt the wheel quite a bit one way or the other.

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2 hours ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said:

It's not the girth, length or firmness that really matters, but what you do with the wheel that really counts.  :whistling:  From our tiny friend, the Mten3, to the Magnum sized Z10 and Big Monster wheels, they all provide loads of fun regardless of how deeply they have penetrated the EUC marketplace.  :innocent1:  Whether they be engaged in threesomes, foursomes or mass group rides :w00t2:, they all are fun in their own unique ways and even quite enjoyable in solitary fashion by oneself.  :yawn:  Uh, what were we talking about again?  Ah, it doesn't matter.  Less talk, more riding!  :clap3:

Genius.:lol:

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1 hour ago, Alex_from_NZ said:

I am very curious how wide we are talking here.. my feet hang off all ends of the pedals and im trying all different positions at the moment.  

Well, your body physics might be different from mine, as I am 5'8" and a bit of a small-footer at a US M 8.5.

Basically, the outer edges of my shoes, and more so my heels, are hanging off the side edge of the pedals enough so that I can supinate both my feet outwards and away from the Z10 body to the degree that my feet are tilted and fully off the flats of the pedals, only on the edges.

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58 minutes ago, JBoo said:

If I’m perfectly balanced on the wheel, I’m typically standing in such a way that the inside of my calfs are barely touching the sides.  Basically, there’s enough gap on both sides to tilt the wheel quite a bit one way or the other

So when turning your leg is not pushing the side of the wheel over?  Rather you are using the pressure applied to each leg/foot to tilt the unit?

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6 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

supinate

I learned a new word today!

OK, i am 6ft 1 and about 70kgs (155lbs) and have a US size 10 hiking boot.  It hangs off every edge but ive been favouring having my heels in and toes out, with the heels lightly touching the side of the unit, so quite close in and my toes hanging off the pedals, so quite wide..  I have tried to move my heels further out, but it doesn't feel as stable yet and ive now tried the pidgeon foot thing but i have no idea how you do that, my legs dont bend that way :D even bringing them straight on feels weird..

Im running around 30psi i think, the bike gauge isnt the best and the valveless extender it comes with is ratshit.

I will persist.

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11 minutes ago, Alex_from_NZ said:

I learned a new word today!

:clap3::clap3: (had to re-lookup that one myself, I'll admit :D)

 

11 minutes ago, Alex_from_NZ said:

OK, i am 6ft 1 and about 70kgs (155lbs) and have a US size 10 hiking boot.  It hangs off every edge but ive been favouring having my heels in and toes out, with the heels lightly touching the side of the unit, so quite close in and my toes hanging off the pedals..  I have tried to move my heels further out, but it doesn't feel as stable yet. 

Im running around 30psi i think, the bike gauge isnt the best and the valveless extender it comes with is ratshit.

I will persist.

Yes, heels in is a common tendency for riders I see often, but doesn't really promote the best range of motion and maneuverability, especially on the weird physics Z, which in turn can possibly cause you to brace and tense up for stability, leading to the dreaded foot pain.

Start to move your heels out slowly, gradually I'd say.

Having heels out even felt weird for me at first as a small-footer, but this positioning gives you the widest base upon which you can hinge left-right unimpeded.

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8 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

:clap3::clap3: (had to re-lookup that one myself, I'll admit :D)

 

Yes, heels in is a common tendency for riders I see often, but doesn't really promote the best range of motion and maneuverability, especially on the weird physics Z, which in turn can possibly cause you to brace and tense up for stability, leading to the dreaded foot pain.

Start to move your heels out slowly, gradually I'd say.

Having heels out even felt weird for me at first as a small-footer, but this positioning gives you the widest base upon which you can hinge left-right unimpeded.

Thank you for the help, i will be giving it some work this evening and the next few days.

I think part of my problem is i cant straighten one leg out fully, so im trying to find my medium at the moment..

will persist. :D 

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24 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

So you're riding again?;)

I do believe I stumbled on photos of @Hunka Hunka Burning Love  un-EUCedduck-tales-gizmoduck-kids-costume.jpg

And now back in buisness.....

latest?cb=20130826071114

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27 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

So you're riding again?;)

:cry2:  Not yet, but I did visit a physiotherapist who helped determine that I squished my supraspinatus muscle and gave me some exercises to try to get it back to normal.  I’m tempted to ride again one day, but I need to rethink and update my elbow/arm/shoulder protective gear.  I still think maybe a larger cushioned forearm / elbow protector might help slow the forces down more for EUC riders.  

Think of it this way - if we all had cushy mattrress pads floating just ahead of us, faceplanting probably wouldn’t be that bad.  Shrink that mattress down in size and place them over the first impact places on the body, and a similar effect should result.  Or at least in theory!  :smartass:  Maybe.

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9 minutes ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said:

I still think maybe a larger cushioned forearm / elbow protector might help slow the forces down more for EUC riders.

It's not cushioned, but I wear the knee guards from my Rollerblade guard set as my elbow guards, because I prefer the over-sized, extra coverage :ph34r: (had to tape & sew on more velcro to accommodate for the really long straps)

I'm trying to either buy or make extra long forearm guards so I can wear them over my nice-ish-I-don't-want-to-tear-them-again-but-I-refuse-to-look-like-a-moto-warrior jackets. Combined with having active arms while I ride, I think hope this will be sufficient to brace against falls.

 

Either way, I wish your hondasupra muscles a speedy recovery :ph34r:

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Thanks!  :cheers:   I noticed Duf has some heavy duty elbow pads, but they still look pretty thinly padded.  I wonder if hockey goalie pads would be suited to falls like we are prone to.  Goalies are always diving onto their arms to cover up loose pucks.  They don't fall at over 20 kph though... :whistling:  That extra kinetic energy really makes a difference!

https://www.prohockeylife.com//products/ccm-referee-elbow-pads?variant=39877478660

Hopefully someone will develop and put out an EUC specific arm/elbow skid cushion in the future.  Something like that could possibly reduce serious injuries.  I know you NYC riders are all about style and appearances, but being prepared for that unexpected fall can be a real game changer!  Good to hear you are taking some proactive steps for protection!

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15 minutes ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said:

Thanks!  :cheers:   I noticed Duf has some heavy duty elbow pads, but they still look pretty thinly padded.  I wonder if hockey goalie pads would be suited to falls like we are prone to.  Goalies are always diving onto their arms to cover up loose pucks.  They don't fall at over 20 kph though... :whistling:  That extra kinetic energy really makes a difference!

https://www.prohockeylife.com//products/ccm-referee-elbow-pads?variant=39877478660

Hopefully someone will develop and put out an EUC specific arm/elbow skid cushion in the future.  Something like that could possibly reduce serious injuries.  I know you NYC riders are all about style and appearances, but being prepared for that unexpected fall can be a real game changer!  Good to hear you are taking some proactive steps for protection!

Have you seen @Rehab1 in his current gear? He looks really protected now, and not bulky at all. With his recent injury he has a lot more to worry about, yet he's out and about riding up a storm :-)

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1 hour ago, Marty Backe said:

Have you seen @Rehab1 in his current gear? He looks really protected now, and not bulky at all. With his recent injury he has a lot more to worry about, yet he's out and about riding up a storm :-)

To be fair to @Hunka Hunka Burning LoveI have $70K worth of protective hardware and someone's fibula wedged inside my humerus.  Good as new.  :)

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Oh yeah he’s geared up good! :thumbup:   I still don’t think I’ve seen any arm/shoulder gear that’s suited to a fall at 20 kph and over.   I don’t think we’ll ever see components that guarantee a rider complete protection, but I can maybe see room for improvement with some EUC specific requirements in mind.

When you factor in that velocity component it really ramps up the kinetic energy produced the faster you go.  KE=1/2 m v^2

We really need a protective gear company to produce some arm skid pads with maybe thicker padding to help cushion riders in the diving faceplant type of accident to help protect the arms and shoulders more.

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4 hours ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said:

Oh yeah he’s geared up good! :thumbup:   I still don’t think I’ve seen any arm/shoulder gear that’s suited to a fall at 20 kph and over.   I don’t think we’ll ever see components that guarantee a rider complete protection, but I can maybe see room for improvement with some EUC specific requirements in mind.

The jacket I wear does have built in protective panels in the shoulder and elbow regions but your correct if the ‘exact’ same conditions reared their ugly head again during a fall ( deep pothole, spikes, speed , dusk...etc) the current protective panels would not shield my shoulder.

I tried donning my customized elbow pads over the bulky jacket and that doesn’t work. . I may attempt to add shock absorbing pads onto the injection molded shells inside the jacket. 

I have already fallen since my accident and luckily just rolled. Being able to quickly release my feet from the pedals makes a huge difference. No More Spikes! :cry2:

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On 12/6/2018 at 11:58 PM, eddiemoy said:

The MSX is not ergonomic.  Means you will need to be “conditioned”.  I feel that is just a fancy word for “it wasn’t designed right so here are some aches you need to get used to”.

I now know that if a wheel is properly designed and it fits you, not too small, there is no “conditioning”.    

Why is your MSX stuck for another 6 months?

Actually it's not, it just feels like it. I ordered it from @Yi Chen, that I have a good relation with, but it is in the queue for shipment to Europe. China could probably say "ho ho ho" given how many Europeans and Americans that buy their XMas gifts there. So I preliminary got a date in early Dec for delivery, now the tracking says I should report the issue if I don't get it by the 26th...

But what is ergonomic or not, depends quite a lot on who you are. Your length, leg-shape, feet, weight and so on affects what you think is comfortable a lot. I will have the opportunity to compare the 18L with the MSX directly, I'll leave my personal judgement of the matter until then ;) 

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5 hours ago, Rehab1 said:

The jacket I wear does have built in protective panels in the shoulder and elbow regions but your correct if the ‘exact’ same conditions reared their ugly head again during a fall ( deep pothole, spikes, speed , dusk...etc) the current protective panels would not shield my shoulder.

I tried donning my customized elbow pads over the bulky jacket and that doesn’t work. . I may attempt to add shock absorbing pads onto the injection molded shells inside the jacket. 

I have already fallen since my accident and luckily just rolled. Being able to quickly release my feet from the pedals makes a huge difference. No More Spikes! :cry2:

I really do think that those spikes were your downfall. And I try and maintain an asymmetrical body pose when riding. I think that helps to initiate a body roll when/if you fall.

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3 hours ago, Scatcat said:

Actually it's not, it just feels like it. I ordered it from @Yi Chen, that I have a good relation with, but it is in the queue for shipment to Europe. China could probably say "ho ho ho" given how many Europeans and Americans that buy their XMas gifts there. So I preliminary got a date in early Dec for delivery, now the tracking says I should report the issue if I don't get it by the 26th...

But what is ergonomic or not, depends quite a lot on who you are. Your length, leg-shape, feet, weight and so on affects what you think is comfortable a lot. I will have the opportunity to compare the 18L with the MSX directly, I'll leave my personal judgement of the matter until then ;) 

The MSX feels very different than my MSuper V3s+, yet the adjustment period was very short for my MSX. IMO Eddie is a bit of an outlier when it comes to Gotway. I suspect that you'll love the MSX.

And correct me if I'm wrong, but you're tall guy too, right? I suspect shorter guys (like Eddie) have a harder time with the shell ergonomics of the wider Gotway wheels.

Look forward to your views.

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11 hours ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said:

<snip>

We really need a protective gear company to produce some arm skid pads with maybe thicker padding to help cushion riders in the diving faceplant type of accident to help protect the arms and shoulders more.

In my downhill longboarding days I swore by my G-form Elbow pads. Now I can only find one of them :( 

Also...in my lifelong quest of spending every dollar I make, I bought an MSX. Whoops :whistling:

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1 hour ago, Marty Backe said:

I really do think that those spikes were your downfall. And I try and maintain an asymmetrical body pose when riding. I think that helps to initiate a body roll when/if you fall.

I agree. You had stated that riding with the the Insta360 and extended stick helps create that asymmetrical posture as well. Subliminally ‘protect the camera at all costs’ probably enters your mind as well.;)

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2 hours ago, csmyers said:

In my downhill longboarding days I swore by my G-form Elbow pads. Now I can only find one of them :( 

Also...in my lifelong quest of spending every dollar I make, I bought an MSX. Whoops :whistling:

Wow. You're becoming a wheel collector :D ACM2, Mten3, and now the MSX. Did I miss one :confused1:

:cheers:

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