meepmeepmayer Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 Somehow I can see you (or people in general) more with the 18XL, not sure why. It is a strong contender now with battery parity, and in the end, overall nicer. If the price isn't crazy... all those 2000€ wheels are too expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockyTop Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 IMO, The KS is more refined. Better quality. More options. Better in most ways. The GW is more of an after market product. Stronger boards, fewer options. Poor fit and finish. The performance wheel to beat. IMO the KS wins in the driveway and country club and the GW wins on the race track and mountain bike trails. ( although the KS shell is much stronger.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockyTop Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 4 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: Somehow I can see you (or people in general) more with the 18XL, not sure why. I second that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 14 minutes ago, RockyTop said: IMO, The KS is more refined. Better quality. More options. Better in most ways. The GW is more of an after market product. Stronger boards, fewer options. Poor fit and finish. The performance wheel to beat. IMO the KS wins in the driveway and country club and the GW wins on the race track and mountain bike trails. ( although the KS shell is much stronger.) That's a really good way to put it Reasonable people who want to use their wheel as an allrounder (handle! lift sensor!) get the 18XL, cool people get the MSX and save a bit of money and do crazy stuff like @EUC GUY If the prices were the same, I'd have a longing, melancholic look at the manly MSX and its power and other advantages, and then never look back and get an 18XL. Probably. Unless "the Gotway" put a spell on me. -- One thing that can't be discussed here is just how the wheels feel to ride. Imho (and I never tried a KS other than a 14C) it appears GW just has really really good feeling firmware for riding. Some people like just the way GWs ride. Pure power. I love how my ACM stays rock-solid whatever I throw at it. But maybe some other people will prefer how other wheels feel. If you can, try both long enough so that the MSX's likely ergonomic disadvantage goes away a bit and you can maybe feel some differences in how it feels to ride both wheels. In the end, always trust your gut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seba Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 18 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: If you can, try both long enough so that the MSX's likely ergonomic disadvantage goes away a bit and you can maybe feel some differences in how it feels to ride both wheels. In the end, always trust your gut. And this is the best advice I don't have enough experiences with MSX, but can say that KS-18L is a wonderful wheel. It's worth to note that @Tishawn Fahie was impressed with this wheel also: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travsformation Posted November 29, 2018 Author Share Posted November 29, 2018 32 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: I think all the worrying about the battery is pointless. By the time you notice even a slight change, your wheel is ooooooooooold. Don't do the bad stuff (don't charge to 100% and keep it there for a long time, especially at high temperatures; don't keep it at empty for a long time; don't use/charge if the battery is below 5°C) and don't baby it otherwise. Enjoy the wheel and use it. But opinions differ. Yeah, good point. You'll soon find a direct correlation between the weather (being able to ride) and my presence on the forum + overthinking... 34 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: I assume you will want the wheel soon and find some peace, but since the new Gotway 17 incher was shown... I guess in 2 or 3 months it will be available. Do you consider it? Soon as in...as soon as possible....but not as soon as I'd like to. BTW, any mafia contacts interested in buying a kidney? In-line reply to your details: MSX is dead quiet, 18XL has a whine. > Don't really mind that Lights are both shitty for serious usage (in traffic, at night, rain, etc) so you might want an extra one anyways. Figured that would be the case. A tie in shittiness, then! MSX is more manly (agreed; like the box/suitcase look, but do think the rainbow LEDs take away from the manliness ) and has a little speed edge (not an important factor for me) , 18XL the overall nicer package with build quality and features. (very important factor: I don't plan on having a 14" for city riding, 16" for commuting, 18" for offroading, etc. The plan is a good, sturdy reliable wheel I can use for everything and that meets all my requirements and won't make me wanna change 'til it dies on me) People say the 18XL is more ergonomic than the MSX. (V-angle pedals? BTW, the padding isn't great on ether of them is it?) People say the MSX keeps itself more upright, and is more stable and comfy (tire) in comparison (to the 18L at that time). Just saw a review by Speedyfeet who mentioned the top-heaviness an V-angled pedals actually provide, as you said, more stability, especially offroad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travsformation Posted November 29, 2018 Author Share Posted November 29, 2018 1 hour ago, meepmeepmayer said: Somehow I can see you (or people in general) more with the 18XL, not sure why. It is a strong contender now with battery parity, and in the end, overall nicer. If the price isn't crazy... I kind of can too... 57 minutes ago, RockyTop said: IMO, The KS is more refined. Better quality. More options. Better in most ways. The GW is more of an after market product. Stronger boards, fewer options. Poor fit and finish. The performance wheel to beat. IMO the KS wins in the driveway and country club and the GW wins on the race track and mountain bike trails. ( although the KS shell is much stronger.) Very good point. Quality, fit, finish and strong shell are important requirement for me. The KS18 definitely has a considerable edge over the MSX there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travsformation Posted November 29, 2018 Author Share Posted November 29, 2018 8 minutes ago, Seba said: It's worth to note that @Tishawn Fahie was impressed with this wheel also That says a lot! He pretty much says its the perfect all-rounder, and mentions nothing of being disappointed with speed or the wheel not being up to his usual (crazy) riding style and kamikaze NYC traffic runs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 29 minutes ago, travsformation said: You'll soon find a direct correlation between the weather (being able to ride) and my presence on the forum + overthinking... 29 minutes ago, travsformation said: BTW, any mafia contacts interested in buying a kidney? 29 minutes ago, travsformation said: People say the 18XL is more ergonomic than the MSX. (V-angle pedals? BTW, the padding isn't great on ether of them is it?) People say the MSX keeps itself more upright, and is more stable and comfy (tire) in comparison (to the 18L at that time). Just saw a review by Speedyfeet who mentioned the top-heaviness an V-angled pedals actually provide, as you said, more stability, especially offroad It's not just the pedals, it seems the 18(X)L is more cuddly and the MSX more boxy on your legs. You don't need padding anyways as you barely touch the wheel sides - unless you grip them for jumping or for serious offroad (here the V-pedals might help). MSX has better, new side pads now, I think. Both are good enough and you can easily glue on something better if you really want to. Yep, MSX is more stable. Potholes, offroad, a bit more cushioning tire - more forgiving to errors or a tired early morning commute. But it's not like the 18XL is bad in that regard. (I want to stress I have ridden neither wheel and I'm only repeating what people write here and what I think the gist is.) -- Looks like the 18XL is the better choice for you (unless crazy price) - get it and forget it, no repairs or fixes (I think the MSX electronics are the best, but things like the exposed rainbow lights and general construction... eh... KS will hold up notably better). Hoping you can try them both soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travsformation Posted November 29, 2018 Author Share Posted November 29, 2018 @meepmeepmayer Thanks for all the info! And yeah...CAN'T WAIT TO TRY THEM !!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockyTop Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 3 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: It's not just the pedals, it seems the 18(X)L is more cuddly and the MSX more boxy. Boxy!!??? I think you meant compact or space saving or maybe area efficient. I like it. One of the things I don’t like about other wheels after having the MSupers is the unnecessary large size of what adds up to a small wheel. The MS3 and KS16 would almost fit in the same small box. ( The MS3 is 3/4” wider) The KS16 shell sticks out past the tire making it the same size as the MS3. I do like the KS pedals better. They are mechanically superior. ( stronger) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted November 29, 2018 Share Posted November 29, 2018 I meant in terms of how it feels on the legs (edges vs smooth curve) and whether it pushes your legs apart more than natural (thicker vs thinner). I agree that most wheels are way too big, bigger than they need to be. I also prefer compact wheels. Look how big the ACM is with 1600Wh, too, or the Z10 - wide tire 18 incher as big as the ACM! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockyTop Posted November 30, 2018 Share Posted November 30, 2018 2 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said: I meant in terms of how it feels on the legs (edges vs smooth curve) and whether it pushes your legs apart more than natural (thicker vs thinner). Ahh! Very true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travsformation Posted December 1, 2018 Author Share Posted December 1, 2018 Looks like houseofjob, Tishawn Fahie and a lot of others coincide about the KS18XL being the perfect all-rounder Now that I've pretty much settled on the idea of the 18XL (and am pushing it on everyone else), who fancies talking me into a 14D? BTW, @meepmeepmayer, the Nikola...not really up my alley. It's HUGE for a 17", and I don't much like the look; I'm now much more attracted to the matte black of the KS18 or the boxy ruggedness of the MSM; the Nikola has too much of that glossy IM finish, and the KS-style leds look a bit...forced? I dunno, just doesn't tickle my fancy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 Yea, it makes more sense for the kind of allround riding you want to do and if you don't want your wheel to look run down after a year. And the big pedals seem to be a revelation (check if your seller includes them). Now all you need to do is prepare you wallet (and maybe gf) https://www.speedyfeet.co.uk/collections/electric-unicycle/products/ks18xl 2195GBP = 2475€😣I hope that price will be a little lower from your dealer. 2200 maybe? 2300? There might be some hope for that, Ian used to have the best prices but now you can find better € prices for some wheels. MSX for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rama Douglas Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 After months of planning my next wheel, and really salivating over the Z10, I finally decided (last night) and pulled the trigger on the 18L. I loved the feel of this wheel when I got to try it on a group ride. I also that day fell in love with the Z10. Mostly because it felt like a challenge to tame and felt like the most unique ride available. @Marty Backe's range test video ended my desire to own a Z10 (at least for now). I wanted that all around does everything wheel. I wasn't concerned with the 10 miles more range of the XL, plus I can order the larger pedals later if I want ... I've had the cash for a few months, and finally ordered. As soon as I stepped outside of work yesterday, just after paying ewheels, a beautiful firework (from nearby Universal Studios) went off right above me as if a congratulatory bang gesture from the Universe was telling me, good choice. 😁 So I'm beyond stoked and relieved that I finally decided. Now, for your choices, have you considered the MCM5? Dig up Marty's clibing video on the Griffith Park trail. The MCM5 seems to be the best climber so far and a 14" that goes 25mph! Sounds like a good option for what you are after. Btw, I'm upgrading from V5F, which has served me well. My first wheel now almost completely bald tire, 1700 miles on it since April. 😎 Great wheel! V8 is awesome too. Any how, I would just like to show gratitude, love and respect to our entire EUC family, for your passion, reviews, videos, forum posts, addictive behaviors 😜, and humor. We are a strange breed indeed and the community commeradery is awesome. Y'all rock! Be safe out there everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travsformation Posted December 1, 2018 Author Share Posted December 1, 2018 1 hour ago, Rama Douglas said: After months of planning my next wheel, and really salivating over the Z10, I finally decided (last night) and pulled the trigger on the 18L. I loved the feel of this wheel when I got to try it on a group ride. I also that day fell in love with the Z10. Mostly because it felt like a challenge to tame and felt like the most unique ride available. @Marty Backe's range test video ended my desire to own a Z10 (at least for now). I wanted that all around does everything wheel. I wasn't concerned with the 10 miles more range of the XL, plus I can order the larger pedals later if I want ... I've had the cash for a few months, and finally ordered. As soon as I stepped outside of work yesterday, just after paying ewheels, a beautiful firework (from nearby Universal Studios) went off right above me as if a congratulatory bang gesture from the Universe was telling me, good choice. 😁 So I'm beyond stoked and relieved that I finally decided. Now, for your choices, have you considered the MCM5? Dig up Marty's clibing video on the Griffith Park trail. The MCM5 seems to be the best climber so far and a 14" that goes 25mph! Sounds like a good option for what you are after. Btw, I'm upgrading from V5F, which has served me well. My first wheel now almost completely bald tire, 1700 miles on it since April. 😎 Great wheel! V8 is awesome too. Any how, I would just like to show gratitude, love and respect to our entire EUC family, for your passion, reviews, videos, forum posts, addictive behaviors 😜, and humor. We are a strange breed indeed and the community commeradery is awesome. Y'all rock! Be safe out there everyone! Firstly...I just finished reading your post, and as I clicked on "Quote", a bunch of fireworks starting going off somewhere in the distance. Guess the congratulatory bang from the universe for your choice has reached Spain! Thanks for the tips, the MCM5 is a good option, but not quite what I'm looking for. I'd rather go for a larger wheel, and it doesn't really meet my needs in terms of range & battery size. I think I've made up my mind on the KS18XL, but the price tag is pretty hefty: my distributor is selling the 18L for 1,999€, and I'm still waiting for a reply on the exact price of the XL. The 18L might be cheaper, but it's the same dilemma as with the 1300 or 1600Wh battery on the MSX....it'll probably be a good 300-400€ extra, but if it's to serve as my only wheel, I think it's worth the investment, as others have pointed pointed out, not just because of range, but also battery longevity, and in the case of KS's, battery-level dependant speed throttling. I guess it's a matter of waiting for a final price, assessing my financial options, and assessing my patience if I'm not in time for the first batch of 18XLs (I've been told there were 100 units for all of France and Spain). BTW, totally agree about the community's vibe/humor, camaraderie and EUC-obsessive behaviour. We are an odd bunch indeed Safe riding! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rama Douglas Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 1 minute ago, travsformation said: Firstly...I just finished reading your post, and as I clicked on "Quote", a bunch of fireworks starting going off somewhere in the distance. Guess the congratulatory bang from the universe for your choice has reached Spain! 💜 That's awesome! 😁 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 1 hour ago, Rama Douglas said: After months of planning my next wheel, and really salivating over the Z10, I finally decided (last night) and pulled the trigger on the 18L. I loved the feel of this wheel when I got to try it on a group ride. I also that day fell in love with the Z10. Mostly because it felt like a challenge to tame and felt like the most unique ride available. @Marty Backe's range test video ended my desire to own a Z10 (at least for now). I wanted that all around does everything wheel. I wasn't concerned with the 10 miles more range of the XL, plus I can order the larger pedals later if I want ... I've had the cash for a few months, and finally ordered. As soon as I stepped outside of work yesterday, just after paying ewheels, a beautiful firework (from nearby Universal Studios) went off right above me as if a congratulatory bang gesture from the Universe was telling me, good choice. 😁 So I'm beyond stoked and relieved that I finally decided. Now, for your choices, have you considered the MCM5? Dig up Marty's clibing video on the Griffith Park trail. The MCM5 seems to be the best climber so far and a 14" that goes 25mph! Sounds like a good option for what you are after. Btw, I'm upgrading from V5F, which has served me well. My first wheel now almost completely bald tire, 1700 miles on it since April. 😎 Great wheel! V8 is awesome too. Any how, I would just like to show gratitude, love and respect to our entire EUC family, for your passion, reviews, videos, forum posts, addictive behaviors 😜, and humor. We are a strange breed indeed and the community commeradery is awesome. Y'all rock! Be safe out there everyone! Congrat's on getting the 18L BTW, the XL will get a lot more than 10 additional miles. I know everyone is different, but having a ~1600wh wheel sure opens up the possibility of some grand rides (I'm always thinking of group rides where we go places that require that extra juice). 1000wh seems so limiting. But of course we are all different. Hey, I'm curious, what about that Z10 range test convinced you not to go with the Z10? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rama Douglas Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 52 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: Hey, I'm curious, what about that Z10 range test convinced you not to go with the Z10? Hey Marty. Thanks and maybe I'm remembering the XL stats wrong. I had 70miles on my brain, but now seem to remember it going up to 90!? Crazy range! The 18L certainly won't be my last wheel, as I'm addicted like the rest of us, but I really wanted this next wheel to be a great all around wheel. Z10 seems more a niche wheel and I still want it, but in comparing to the L, for now with my budget, the 18L was the decision. As far as that range test video, I was unimpressed with it only going 36 miles, and all that sluggishness as the battery drains to me really turned me off to it. I know most wheels limit speed more as battery drains, but I was honestly pretty shocked to see how slow the lower percentage made it go...nitpicky, I know, but you gotta nitpick spending this much dinero. Maybe I'm wrong, but I anticipate 10-15 more miles of range on the 18L...I almost just settled for a V8, honestly, because it's great to dance on, and it works well for my daily requirements ie: commuting to downtown and Beverly Hills, where I work most often. Speaking of which, I'll be working in Manhattan Beach all this week, if you want to meet up for an evening ride, Marty... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travsformation Posted December 1, 2018 Author Share Posted December 1, 2018 1 hour ago, Marty Backe said: know everyone is different, but having a ~1600wh wheel sure opens up the possibility of some grand rides (I'm always thinking of group rides where we go places that require that extra juice). 1000wh seems so limiting. But of course we are all different. Yeah, that's what I have in mind. Might be moving to the coast in the next year, and there are beachfront promenades connecting town to town...a quick Google Maps search showed an uninterrupted 25 km/h stretch. Am already salivating at the possibilities of 100 km+ rides... Doesn't look like I'll be getting a chance to try out the 18XL before buying, but the L should be an option. I'm guessing in terms of ride feel, there's no difference whatsoever, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 38 minutes ago, Rama Douglas said: Hey Marty. Thanks and maybe I'm remembering the XL stats wrong. I had 70miles on my brain, but now seem to remember it going up to 90!? Crazy range! The 18L certainly won't be my last wheel, as I'm addicted like the rest of us, but I really wanted this next wheel to be a great all around wheel. Z10 seems more a niche wheel and I still want it, but in comparing to the L, for now with my budget, the 18L was the decision. As far as that range test video, I was unimpressed with it only going 36 miles, and all that sluggishness as the battery drains to me really turned me off to it. I know most wheels limit speed more as battery drains, but I was honestly pretty shocked to see how slow the lower percentage made it go...nitpicky, I know, but you gotta nitpick spending this much dinero. Maybe I'm wrong, but I anticipate 10-15 more miles of range on the 18L...I almost just settled for a V8, honestly, because it's great to dance on, and it works well for my daily requirements ie: commuting to downtown and Beverly Hills, where I work most often. Speaking of which, I'll be working in Manhattan Beach all this week, if you want to meet up for an evening ride, Marty... Small correction. On my range test I achieved a bit over 42-miles on the Z10. But yeah, the last few miles were pretty slow. I'll be doing a couple long range tests on the XL when I get it, but I'm anticipating a 50 to 60 mile wheel. The L must be a 35+ mile wheel. These ranges are for ~175-pound rider. Thanks for the riding invite but I generally don't do much evening riding in the winter because of the cold temperatures - mid-60's is my limit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 @Rama Douglas Did you get an 18L or 18XL? You wrote 18L. 18L and Z10 have nearly the same battery size (995Wh vs 1036Wh). I don't think you'll find a range difference there. 35 minutes ago, travsformation said: Am already salivating at the possibilities of 100 km+ rides... You have your heart in the right place You'll want 2500Wh soon... I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travsformation Posted December 2, 2018 Author Share Posted December 2, 2018 2 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said: You have your heart in the right place You'll want 2500Wh soon... I do. Haha yeah, I can see that coming . The time it takes my legs to adjust to 100km rides and start yearning for more might work in my favor and 2500Wh wheels will be on the market by then Just got confirmation from my distributor: KS18L = 1999€ KS18XL = 2449€ MSX 100v = 2119€ (although he didn't specify which battery it is) Hmmm..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamn. I was hoping for 2300 max for you (and everyone else expecting reasonable wheel prices) MSX 100V only comes with 1240Wh, but usually the 100V price is the same as the 84V 1600Wh. So expect 2119€ for the MSX 1600Wh. Around 300-350€ is the usual extra price going from 1300Wh to 1600Wh, so this matches with the 1800€ price of the MSX 1300Wh. 2450€ oh dear... you may need a few days to get used to the thought That's what you get for getting into EUCs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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