Have you personally ever had a cutoff caused by the wheel?

[novazeus]

not hitting a hole or overleaning. just perfectly flat cruising with ample battery power and not riding the upper limits of the wheel.

just a mechanical failure. 

bonus points for video.

when? what wheel? and how bad were you hurt?

[cg]

yes, on my generic 14" somewhere in 2015... Not going fast, but the battery packed failed.

After that time the wheel never really came to itself again, it was shaking as soon as i tried to use it. (its actually the wheel on my profile picture... quite early after getting it, the battery pack feel out... therefore the gaffa tape to keep it in place

[novazeus]

10 minutes ago, cg said:

yes, on my generic 14" somewhere in 2015... Not going fast, but the battery packed failed.

After that time the wheel never really came to itself again, it was shaking as soon as i tried to use it. (its actually the wheel on my profile picture... quite early after getting it, the battery pack feel out... therefore the gaffa tape to keep it in place

thanks for sharing. i hope you weren’t hurt.

[cg]

6 minutes ago, novazeus said:

thanks for sharing. i hope you weren’t hurt.

not hurt but im glad from the experience, knows how a failure feels, and still remembers it when riding my Z10! So I know there is always the risk of hardware/software failure

[novazeus]

yes, but right or wrong i bet you feel safer on your z10. it’s a beautiful wheel.

i wish this could be a sticky topic so at least among forum members we could get an actual feel of how susceptible to purely mechanical cutoffs our wheels are and are they getting better?

[cg]

1 minute ago, novazeus said:

yes, but right or wrong i bet you feel safer on your z10. it’s a beautiful wheel.

it has taken me time to rebuild my confidence, but it feels much saver today -- going to work 35km from home, average speed 30km/h.

I also think it would be good that people have tried it. I get a bit nervous about people getting a performance wheel today as their first wheel. If I hadn't tried 'over leaning' on a crap wheel, I would probably do it on my Z10...

[novazeus]

2 minutes ago, cg said:

it has taken me time to rebuild my confidence, but it feels much saver today -- going to work 35km from home, average speed 30km/h.

I also think it would be good that people have tried it. I get a bit nervous about people getting a performance wheel today as their first wheel. If I hadn't tried 'over leaning' on a crap wheel, I would probably do it on my Z10...

yes, i agree. it’s hard to relate to a complete mechanical failure with no warning. 

and i agree to about people new to this getting performance wheels but their accidents will probably be rider error. 

i prefer to go slow but Bob, my dog, wants to go fast.

[Jerome]

No, and if it happens and I survive, it will be ebikes or three wheel scooters for the duration. All during my extreme LD Motorcycle riding period I knew that I could have a blow-out/breakdown at 85 mph in no man's land Wyoming, yet I continued to ride. An EUC unexpected cutoff is the worse dread I have had about riding/driving any vehicle. it's going to happen to some, you hope that it doesn't happen to you.   if I thought I was going to be the one I wouldn't ride, regardless of gear.

[LanghamP]

I was showing off in front of people by doing pendulums when a bratty toddler darted forward and hit the power button.  How could she have even known that was a power button? And with such unerring accuracy? I challenge anyone here to hit the power button on a rider doing pendulums.

Kids are pure evil, we just hope to have them civilized before they reach the age of majority.

Basically a cutout is already being out of balance when, suddenly, your wheel is replaced by a block of wet ice on a skating rink.

[novazeus]

8 minutes ago, LanghamP said:

when a bratty toddler darted forward and hit the power button.  

not a mechanical failure but a wheel should have some override while the wheel is moving. 

the z10 power button is extremely sensitive and easily accidentally actuated. i swear a drop of sweat could activate it. glad you mentioned the power button because i am gonna see if it works while the z10 is moving. i need a test dummy.

so far we have one mechanical cutoff on a cheap wheel when the battery disconnected.

[LanghamP]

1 hour ago, novazeus said:

not a mechanical failure but a wheel should have some override while the wheel is moving. 

the z10 power button is extremely sensitive and easily accidentally actuated. i swear a drop of sweat could activate it. glad you mentioned the power button because i am gonna see if it works while the z10 is moving. i need a test dummy.

so far we have one mechanical cutoff on a cheap wheel when the battery disconnected.

You can just lean down and hit that power button; in all wheels I've tested (all of mine) the button is disabled at even slight speeds, but all do work while doing pendulums.

Amusingly, only after I played this way with all my wheels did it occur to me, some days later, to hit the power button while doing a lift test.

[novazeus]

1 hour ago, LanghamP said:

You can just lean down and hit that power button; in all wheels I've tested (all of mine) the button is disabled at even slight speeds, but all do work while doing pendulums.

Amusingly, only after I played this way with all my wheels did it occur to me, some days later, to hit the power button while doing a lift test.

yeah i checked my z10 and it doesn’t cut off going forward but it did going back and forth.

[mkygod]

Are most cut outs due to overloading/overheating of the motor? If so, wouldn't wheels with tiltback features be near impervious to this issue, short of letting the batteries run out?

[LanghamP]

12 minutes ago, mkygod said:

Are most cut outs due to overloading/overheating of the motor? If so, wouldn't wheels with tiltback features be near impervious to this issue, short of letting the batteries run out?

No, because tilt back is speed dependent.

WheelLog can buzz you when you exceed a certain amount of current, and this is what I suggest the prudent rider use because it's the high currency that smokes your wheel.

All wheels have a tendency to shield the rider from extreme actions until, suddenly and disastrously, they don't. In constrast, most other vehicles and motors I can think of give you some sort of feedback, perhaps some wobbling, shaking, noise, or even instrument panel beeping.

Wheels can't be raced because they fail suddenly, and tiltback kinda sucks.

[CptSalami]

September 2017, flat ground KS-18A with about 70% battery. Going 30km/h flat ground, no acceleration and BAM! 

Thumb broken, knees and elbows + left side severe road rash. 

 

Still don't know the cause of it as my reseller won't even have a look at it and claims it can't have been anything but an overlean. 

He claims "cut outs like that can't happen". 

 

I haven't opened it myself, the wheel still works but the pedals are really "mushy" and not hard at all like the 18a or 18S should be.

So I simply got an 18S intead and that has not let me down yet.

[novazeus]

35 minutes ago, CptSalami said:

September 2017, flat ground KS-18A with about 70% battery. Going 30km/h flat ground, no acceleration and BAM! 

that sure sounds like a mechanical cutoff.

if that happened to me and i survived, i’d never ride again.

just not worth it.

glad u got well quick.

pls be sure to lmk if ur 18s ever acts up, i have one as well and really like it. fits me nice.

[BassdudeBTB]

Exact same think happened to me like you said crushing on level ground at top speed and it just dropped me in to the pavement. The Bluetooth music stayed on. 

But it apparently burned out a part of a coil in the motor. 
Supposedly it has 3 phases and a section in one of them died and if I tried rolling the wheel along it would vibrate and buzz the motor trying to compensate and offer no resistance at that section. I got the wheel replaced but the Bluetooth music never worked on the new one 😕 and I was ghosted by the distributor after that...

[MetricUSA]

Nope on a real wheel because I don't ride to the edge like other idiots who don't understand there is no more power to give... I did have a cut out on a q3 airwheel... A baby wheel...

[Cerbera]

Yes. My old Gotway MS3 cut out on me with no notice or provocation when a motor wire chose that moment to pop out of its (apparently not very well) soldered connector ! This was very much a surprise to me given the 5 years of near-perfect riding it had done previously.

Edited May 7 by Cerbera

[Scubadragonsan]

Bad experiences are good lessons! I was riding on a problematic KS16 which kept making a clunking noise for every wheel rotation. I kept riding it which I shouldn't. Finally, it cutout and a faceplant. Lessons learned: 1) Don't keep riding if you find anything suspicious/abnormal with your wheel. 2) Faceplants reinforce the need of donning on proper protective gear. 3) Faceplants happen in a split of second. Before you know it, you are kissing the cement/concrete/asphalt/grass/dog shit or a stranger girl in front of you...just so happen!

[alcatraz]

Yes I did on my msx84 and on my v8. The v8 might have been an overlean but it didn't feel like it to me. It felt like a total power off. I was near max speed on a flat road. 

The msx was wayyy wayyy wayy below max speed (maybe 20km/h) and on flat ground. It blew a mosfet. I blame the cooling. The mosfet screws weren't all tight so maybe one of them had poor cooling. I got the board repaired and then torqued all the mosfets down properly with loctite. Did 1000km on the repaired board so far. 

My most reliable wheel I've ridden is the Tesla v1. 13000km without a hickup. Just one time I recalibrated in cold weather and had to take the bus home because apparently you're not supposed to do that on older Gotway wheels. The gyro is temperature sensitive. It's fine to ride it in the cold but not calibrate.

Edited May 8 by alcatraz

[mrelwood]

11 hours ago, Scubadragonsan said:

1) Don't keep riding if you find anything suspicious/abnormal with your wheel.

Yes! Extremely important! It’s sad to see how many ignore clear warning signs from their wheels.

17 hours ago, MetricUSA said:

Nope on a real wheel because I don't ride to the edge like other idiots

This topic is about sudden cutouts without user provocation. Riding on the edge (steep inclines aside) can cause an overlean, but rarely a hardware failure.

[RagingGrandpa]

On 9/10/2018 at 1:43 PM, novazeus said:

Have you personally ever had a cutoff caused by the wheel?

(Old topic, but why not...)

Yeah, they turn off sometimes.

1. Crashed from broken MTen3 axle. Related to cumulative fatigue after many months of riding; final failure happened on a sidewalk crack/gap during calm riding at 10mph. 
2. Multiple crashes from trigging the roll-angle shutoff while riding MSX on banked turns & skate bowls. 
3. Crashed from broken MSP axle. Related to cumulative fatigue after many months of riding; final failure happened landing a jump at 25mph. Ouch. 
4. Crashed from Sherman motor sensor failure. Failure related to age after 3 years of operation; final occurrence happened at about 7mph while accelerating normally from a stop.  

On 9/10/2018 at 1:43 PM, novazeus said:

just perfectly flat cruising with ample battery power and not riding the upper limits of the wheel

I think #1 and #4 qualify.

#ATGATT

[techyiam]

16 minutes ago, RagingGrandpa said:

Crashed from Sherman motor sensor failure. Failure related to age after 3 years of operation; final occurrence happened at about 7mph while accelerating normally from a stop. 

With top speeds climbing above 55 mph, this sounds scary, especially if you happened to be in traffic. 

Are you talking about the hall effect sensors? 

Edited May 10 by techyiam

[RagingGrandpa]

7 minutes ago, techyiam said:

Are you talking about the hall effect sensors? 

Yes.

18 minutes ago, techyiam said:

this sounds scary, especially if you happened to be in traffic

This slowly-worsening fault revealed and confirmed the Sherman firmware's dependence on the motor sensors: only below 8mph. 
I felt some sensor glitches while riding 20mph+, and did not crash. At those higher speeds, errors created occasional, instantaneous gaps in the torque output, with a similar feeling as riding over a small gap in pavement. Self-balancing control continued and there was no pedal dip. A friendly warning of trouble brewing. 

Below 8mph, if the sensor fails, "E HALL" is shown on the display, and the motor becomes disabled and spins freely, the same as if the EUC was turned off. 

Replaced the sensor now; kept everything else original. No glitches in >100mi of riding since. 
 

I remember this "sensorless operation at higher speeds" behavior was also mentioned by Leaperkim during responses to the Abrams motor problems... seems like it applies to Sherman as well.