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Marty Backe

My Z10 Triumphs, Tribulations, and Failures

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5 hours ago, Steef Klonoa said:

Got an update from Jason this morning, the second batch of Z10's will be shipping out in the next week or so. Wooooo :w00t2:

Wondering if it's better now to wait until next Spring?  On this one it seems better to get it while you can and store it.  Really sad they missed so many delivery dates on these.  Basically they lost an entire year in North America, which seems to like the wheel a lot more than China (but maybe i'm wrong on that). 

Edited by FreeRide

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31 minutes ago, FreeRide said:

Wondering if it's better now to wait until next Spring?  On this one it seems better to get it while you can and store it.  Really sad they missed so many delivery dates on these.  Basically they lost an entire year in North America, which seems to like the wheel a lot more than China (but maybe i'm wrong on that). 

Hold your horses. There are large swaths of the country where wheels can be easily and comfortable ridden year-round B)

Unfortunately for you, I suspect Boston does not fall under the year-round category :(

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I won't be out there on it every day, but I will be using it year round. I'm in the suburbs outside Boston. Will be spending some quality time in a nearby state forest with the Z10

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2 hours ago, FreeRide said:

Wondering if it's better now to wait until next Spring?

Wheel is generally usable until big snowfall if you keep it warm before the ride.  But there are guys form Finland and Norway... who ride all around the year  -so - also on the ice/snow. Wide tire shall probably help here, with some experimental ideas about studs/spikes use...  

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1 hour ago, Lukasz said:

Wheel is generally usable until big snowfall if you keep it warm before the ride.  But there are guys form Finland and Norway... who ride all around the year  -so - also on the ice/snow. Wide tire shall probably help here, with some experimental ideas about studs/spikes use...  

I think riding in sub zero (32F) temperatures should be ok; snow and ice will have a lot of friction then. Zero or slightly higher, I would probably not try it if there is snow on the ground. Although, I am not sure what kind of rubber the wheel has and how hard it gets in cold weather. For example, the central European car winter tyres are not really usable here in very cold weather because the rubber hardens too much making it lose its road grip.

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How well does the Z10 handle wet surface, like right after light rain? Can it still handle the fast turn as good as on dry surface or I need to slow down before making the turns?

 

I have no experience riding on wet surface with any EUC, so just curious what to watch out for.

Edited by cloudy_jai

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1 hour ago, cloudy_jai said:

How well does the Z10 handle wet surface, like right after light rain? Can it still handle the fast turn as good as on dry surface or I need to slow down before making the turns?

 

I have no experience riding on wet surface with any EUC, so just curious what to watch out for.

I have not encountered any issues on wet asphalt or sand, but then I don't ride that fast either.

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Quick question, I'm new to the euc and am looking at and want the z10 (for a number of reasons). A lot of my commute though is along angled footpath, ie riding along a slope horizontally. The path itself is not the best condition (tree roots pushing up pavement into nice little speed bumps) and sometimes I get stuck behind walkers so have to crawl along (currently on a mini pro). 

 

With the fatter tyre I've heard it likes to stay upright more - I'm figuring this is relative to the road (am I wrong?). Would this then make those sections of my route more of a challenge than a skinnier tyre? How much so? What's the z10 riding along a slope like? 

 

Cheers everyone, 

Alex

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20 minutes ago, Alex_from_NZ said:

Quick question, I'm new to the euc and am looking at and want the z10 (for a number of reasons). A lot of my commute though is along angled footpath, ie riding along a slope horizontally. The path itself is not the best condition (tree roots pushing up pavement into nice little speed bumps) and sometimes I get stuck behind walkers so have to crawl along (currently on a mini pro). 

 

With the fatter tyre I've heard it likes to stay upright more - I'm figuring this is relative to the road (am I wrong?). Would this then make those sections of my route more of a challenge than a skinnier tyre? How much so? What's the z10 riding along a slope like? 

 

Cheers everyone, 

Alex

I have found this kind of horizontally sloped roads difficult to ride on my Z10. The wheel sort of presses on your calf to the downward direction of the slope. But that maybe just because I don't have the right technique yet. Although @mrelwood made the same observation when testing the wheel.

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43 minutes ago, Alex_from_NZ said:

Quick question, I'm new to the euc and am looking at and want the z10 (for a number of reasons). A lot of my commute though is along angled footpath, ie riding along a slope horizontally. The path itself is not the best condition (tree roots pushing up pavement into nice little speed bumps) and sometimes I get stuck behind walkers so have to crawl along (currently on a mini pro). 

 

With the fatter tyre I've heard it likes to stay upright more - I'm figuring this is relative to the road (am I wrong?). Would this then make those sections of my route more of a challenge than a skinnier tyre? How much so? What's the z10 riding along a slope like? 

 

Cheers everyone, 

Alex

Yes, the unit tilt relative to the road, I have gotten used to it after more 1000km, but on these surfaces I ride with very loose stance, and 'gribs' the unit when there are bumbs etc. It feels comfortable in that respect now, but I haven't tried any other performance wheels, so I cannot compare

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1 hour ago, Alex_from_NZ said:

Quick question, I'm new to the euc and am looking at and want the z10 (for a number of reasons). A lot of my commute though is along angled footpath, ie riding along a slope horizontally. The path itself is not the best condition (tree roots pushing up pavement into nice little speed bumps) and sometimes I get stuck behind walkers so have to crawl along (currently on a mini pro). 

 

With the fatter tyre I've heard it likes to stay upright more - I'm figuring this is relative to the road (am I wrong?). Would this then make those sections of my route more of a challenge than a skinnier tyre? How much so? What's the z10 riding along a slope like? 

 

Cheers everyone, 

Alex

I haven't ridden extensive distances in those conditions, but every wheel I own fights you a bit when riding along a sloped trail. I don't think the Z10 is particularly worse than any other wheel.

When you're commuting, taking the same route again and again, you learn the trail and it gets pretty easy to ride difficult sections because you get to know the route so well.

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2 hours ago, cloudy_jai said:

How well does the Z10 handle wet surface, like right after light rain?

Chooch was able to skid and fall with the demo version while accelerating from a corner on asphalt. I’m not at all sure about this but I think the ground was wet. The rubber on the Z10 tire is hard, so I would be (even) more careful than with other wheels.

1 hour ago, Alex_from_NZ said:

Would this then make those sections of my route more of a challenge than a skinnier tyre? How much so?

I think this is one of the major things that other wheel riders will notice on the Z10, so yes, the effect of turning with the surface is quite strong.

What should make it easier is to keep your legs away from the wheel body and let the wheel tilt when it wants to. Just keep your upper torso straight, and compensate if needed.

Regardless how fluent you become with a new technique, it is still something you have to do more than with other wheels. I know my feet would get tired if I was to ride a long road like that daily.

Of course that’s not to say other wheels don’t have their fatique points as well. 16S makes a bruise on my starting leg since the contact point is too low, KS pedals are so narrow that my feet start to hurt after 10 minutes, V10F pedal angle is so low that I have to squeeze my legs not to slide to the side, MSX riding modes are too stiff so I have to lean quite far forwards/backwards, and of course the original sideways angle on the MSX pedals makes it near unridable to me. And IPS Lhotz... Almost all of the above!

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Thanks everyone for your replies.  As this is my first wheel i will be learning with it so to speak, so i suppose the question of comparable difficulty to other wheels in my given situation would really be, is the z10 harder to the point I should buy a different wheel over it?  From what im hearing the answer is no.. which is the answer i was looking for.

Excellent.... :D 

My Mini Pro point down the slope too... bit hard not to i suppose... :D I got used to it, as long as its not un-ride-able im willing to put the practice in to get it smooth.

Edited by Alex_from_NZ
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4 minutes ago, Alex_from_NZ said:

Thanks everyone for your replies.  As this is my first wheel i will be learning with it so to speak, so i suppose the question of comparable difficulty to other wheels in my given situation would really be about, is the z10 harder to the point of i should buy a different wheel over it.  From what im hearing, no.. which is the answer i was looking for.

 

Excellent.... :D 

It is good that this will be your first wheel as you have nothing to compare to... I will tell you that the Z is a bit harsh going over bumps as compared to my MSX... when I ride the Z on a banked surface, the wheel will be up against and put pressure on your outside leg... this is not a problem, just something I notice because I have others to compare to which you will not... only other thing to look at is range... recently there have been reported range tests that have come in lower than most reported, for me this wheel is a solid 30 miler, you can push more if you take it easy, or may be less if conditions dictate so or you weight is above average... Good luck :cheers:

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21 minutes ago, Alex_from_NZ said:

Thanks everyone for your replies.  As this is my first wheel i will be learning with it so to speak, so i suppose the question of comparable difficulty to other wheels in my given situation would really be, is the z10 harder to the point I should buy a different wheel over it?  From what im hearing the answer is no.. which is the answer i was looking for.

Excellent.... :D 

My Mini Pro point down the slope too... bit hard not to i suppose... :D I got used to it, as long as its not un-ride-able im willing to put the practice in to get it smooth.

i’m selling all my other wheels and i’ll only be riding z10’s from now on. 

i think if u do the mast thing we talked about, the z10 will be easier than the other wheels. the slow speed handling is like no other wheel i own. today while just trying to see how slow i could go, i almost found myself still balance at a standstill, like u can on a motorcycle momentarily.

i gotta think that tire on the z10 out in the wild wotld of lousy roads, broken glass, sidewalk transitions etc has got to be better and more durable than the rest.

i probably only have twelve miles on mine but i know it’s rideable and with time it will be an extension of me.

looks more ada like to me too. Bob could use the exercise romping thru costco but my old bones are gonna need my portable ada ped assist device.

i gotta detune the looks a bit though. the carbon fiber is a bit racy for an electric walker.

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47 minutes ago, Alex_from_NZ said:

My Mini Pro point down the slope too... bit hard not to i suppose... :D I got used to it, as long as its not un-ride-able im willing to put the practice in to get it smooth.

Moving from a Mini Pro to a single wheel will definitely make life easier... You will need to learn the best way to ride it for this scenario, but the single wheel provides for a lot more flexibility!

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7 hours ago, Marcglider said:

It is good that this will be your first wheel as you have nothing to compare to... I will tell you that the Z is a bit harsh going over bumps as compared to my MSX... when I ride the Z on a banked surface, the wheel will be up against and put pressure on your outside leg... this is not a problem, just something I notice because I have others to compare to which you will not...

Cool, I figured the profile of the tyre would mean it was a bit easier to roll through cracks and crap, and stands up right a bit more, but depending on situation (and rider) that is always a bit of a tradeoff. Curiously, how much pressure would you estimate if you were riding along say a 20deg slope at under 10mph? I'm guessing it would change linearly depending on your speed.. 

7 hours ago, Marcglider said:

 

only other thing to look at is range... recently there have been reported range tests that have come in lower than most reported, for me this wheel is a solid 30 miler, you can push more if you take it easy, or may be less if conditions dictate so or you weight is above average... Good luck :cheers:

I'm 188cm and 75kg (shit, what's that in American.. 6,1 and 165 ish).  I usually get around 18km from the mini before it is to slow to be much use but also don't ride conservatively (I tend to like to ride/drive everything quick).

I don't usually go for more than 10-12km rides at a time as have a bit of a bung foot that cramps up over time.  I look forward to the extended range the euc will give me (also because I can go faster, therefore further) but think the z10 will be such a huge step up it will satisfy that for me anyway. Any extended riding will be purely for pleasure as my commute is only about 8km a day, so I'm good there I think. :cheers:

8 hours ago, novazeus said:

i’m selling all my other wheels and i’ll only be riding z10’s from now on. 

i think if u do the mast thing we talked about, the z10 will be easier than the other wheels. the slow speed handling is like no other wheel i own. today while just trying to see how slow i could go, i almost found myself still balance at a standstill, like u can on a motorcycle momentarily.

That sounds awesome ??

8 hours ago, novazeus said:

i gotta think that tire on the z10 out in the wild wotld of lousy roads, broken glass, sidewalk transitions etc has got to be better and more durable than the rest.

I'm curious what grade rubber they went with, if the torque really is enough to throw a lighter rider off from spinning (like apparently happened to Gooch) , and considering the lighter overall weight of the unit vs other motored transportation, you would think there would of been a design meeting on using the softest rubber possible vs durability vs cut resistance etc etc. And performance would have to be up there in the wants lists.. Wonder if we will see more options opening up.. 

8 hours ago, novazeus said:

i probably only have twelve miles on mine but i know it’s rideable and with time it will be an extension of me.

I actually just hit 1000 miles on my mini pro today, in the pouring rain no less. Had to make some temporary mud flaps to stop getting water flicking up from the new chunky tyres, metal ducting tape works bloody well for future reference. 

8 hours ago, novazeus said:

looks more ada like to me too. Bob could use the exercise romping thru costco but my old bones are gonna need my portable ada ped assist device.

Bob I know.., ada? 

8 hours ago, novazeus said:

i gotta detune the looks a bit though. the carbon fiber is a bit racy for an electric walker.

I actually agree, I like minimalist/purpose built design. Thinking of matt black plasti dip, or bedliner paint.. Few things I've used on my off road trucks I thought about testing out..

 

8 hours ago, The Fat Unicyclist said:

Moving from a Mini Pro to a single wheel will definitely make life easier... You will need to learn the best way to ride it for this scenario, but the single wheel provides for a lot more flexibility!

Interesting, like I don't doubt the euc is better in many ways but I thought the mini pretty flexible in its use and where I could go etc, especially since putting the AT tyres on, but I'm very happy to hear you think it will be a step up in this department too! 

 

Cheers again team. 

Alex. 

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I think the Z is a good choice, any nuances those with multiple wheels feel will go unnoticed by you... the only other thing that needs to be said is this wheel is freakin heavy... it is not relevant to me as I am not carrying it and is not noticeable when riding, so if you do not need to carry it around go for it...

if the pressure on your leg bothers you, they come with pads that look like they will work well, I just Love the look without them:D

Edited by Marcglider
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4 minutes ago, Marcglider said:

I think the Z is a good choice, any nuances those with multiple wheels feel will go unnoticed by you... the only other thing that needs to be said is this wheel is freakin heavy... it is not relevant to me as I am not carrying it and is not noticeable when riding, so if you do not need to carry it around go for it...

if the pressure on your leg biothers you, they come with pads that look like they will work well, I just Love the look without them:D

I will have to carry in and out of the car, and on and off the ferry if I can't trolley it. No stairs I need to deal with and fuck it, I'll just get stronger haha. 

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1 minute ago, Alex_from_NZ said:

I will have to carry in and out of the car, and on and off the ferry if I can't trolley it. No stairs I need to deal with and fuck it, I'll just get stronger haha. 

can't think of a better reason to go work out except for "SHEILA"... lol  oh yeah I forgot, at least it is with my hang gliding buddy from NSW, and I never understood it but what is the reason Ausies don't like Kiwi's??? :confused1:

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9 minutes ago, Marcglider said:

can't think of a better reason to go work out except for "SHEILA"... lol  oh yeah I forgot, at least it is with my hang gliding buddy from NSW, and I never understood it but what is the reason Ausies don't like Kiwi's??? :confused1:

https://www.quora.com/Do-Australians-and-New-Zealanders-hate-each-other-If-so-why

In, short, its a myth...Aussies and Kiwi's get along just fine.

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52 minutes ago, Alex_from_NZ said:

I will have to carry in and out of the car, and on and off the ferry if I can't trolley it. No stairs I need to deal with and fuck it, I'll just get stronger haha. 

Be sure to switch arms when you carry so you don’t end up with a Hulk bicep on one side.  :o

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15 minutes ago, JBoo said:

Firstly, the Z10 is a great commuter wheel (so far).  Winter is soon approaching here in Seattle and that will be the real test of the wheel, where I'll be riding usually 1 or more days a week in the rain.  As others have mentioned, the wheel is 50lbs, and is more cumbersome to lift than a 50lbs dumbbell.  While I don't have issues totting the wheel up and down a few flights of stairs, I'm pretty fit and wouldn't call it a trivial task by any means.

But because this is going to be your first euc, I'm going to be a wet blanket and recommend that you NOT get a Z10 as your first wheel.  When learning to ride for the first time, you are really going to bang-up the wheel you're training on.  Even if you manage to make it through the training phase with few issues and start street riding, the latter presents a whole slew of new issues that you never have to deal with when practicing in a nice, safe place, and only logging many, many miles on streets and sidewalks can train you for that.  For these reasons, I'd recommend getting a cheap wheel as you first wheel, something that you won't really care about banging up, or, if you discover you just don't enjoy it, you don't find yourself out a whole lot of money.  However, if money is no object, then, sure, knock yourself out and get a Z10 ;)

Or he could pad up @novazeus style with a yoga mat and then take them out once learnt to ride. The wheel also comes with upper and lower pads and my lower pads are already destroyed due to fallouts when learning. My upper pads are fine, although the tape attaching them does not work 100%.

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my doggy scales are very accurate.

as shiiped with box

2018-08-25_12-26-52

hard to read but naked wheel 54 pounds 10 ounces. no trolley, pads, or rear fender.

2018-08-25_12-27-17

 

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