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My Z10 Triumphs, Tribulations, and Failures


Marty Backe

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The Z10 is in the house :dribble:

Today I received the Z10 from Chooch. I am going to give him a hard time, but only because he's causing me some unneeded work and stress. It's all in fun though, but he deserves it :lol:

As you know by now, the tire valve access is via a port on the side of the wheel, and requires a long (~4-inch) valve extender to access for filling. As shown in his video, he didn't care too much for the one that ships with the wheel. So he opted to use an existing one that he had from an earlier Ninebot wheel of his.

I guess he decided to throw away the one that comes with the Z10, because it wasn't in the box. And I don't have an old Ninebot wheel kicking around the house. And the tire was essentially flat because that's how he liked riding it. With my additional 55-pounds the wheel was unrideable in the flat condition that it was in.

Imagine your feelings, having just received one of the coolest wheels being made, and only being able to look at it. :furious:

After calling various stores I realized that I'm not going to be able to buy an extension tube locally and it could be a day before I could possibly bum one off a local rider (nobody lives nears me). :furious: But then I decided to try something ghetto. I drove to a local PepBoys and bought a pack of four 1-inch valve extenders. I got home, ripped the package open, and screwed them together end-to-end. It worked! I as able to fill the tire :clap3:

The air in the tire did not register on my gauge, so Chooch really likes it low. I pumped it up to 20-psi for now.

Next, he didn't send it to me charged or clean. Looks like it came right from the trails. And you know those pads he taped to the shell? Well, he used Duct Tape. You now what that means right? Lots of sticky residue on the shell. So I'll be spending a fair amount of time cleaning it so it looks purty in the videos.

There, I feel better now. Chooch, you owe me one :D

Very First Impressions

This is one very nice looking wheel in person, and damn heavy. When I showed my wife, her unprompted reaction was, "That's cool looking". I don't think she's said that about any of my other wheels. This wheel is going to turn heads for sure ?

Last night I had downloaded the Ninebot Android app; apparently only one is used for all of their devices. Wow is all I have to say. I immediately connected to the wheel and I didn't have to create an account or give my social security number. It knew everything about the Z10 and was super easy to configure.

Why can't us KingSong and Gotway owners experience the joys of an app like this? No Chinese. Just my native language. Kudos to Ninebot.

Any way, the wheel is charging. After the charge and cleaning, my first ride will be a night ride. I'll try and capture all of the light affects on video.

More to come of course. Tomorrow is a Demo day for anyone in Southern California who wants to see and ride it.

 

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Wow, so he comments how it was nice to receive the wheel charged and it looked cleaned, yet don’t care about anyone else ?, how selfish can one be, hmmm. Feel bad for you cleaning all that tape.....

really looking forward to your review.

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3 minutes ago, yourtoys7 said:

Wow, so he comments how it was nice to receive the wheel charged and it looked cleaned, yet don’t care about anyone else ?, how selfish can one be, hmmm. Feel bad for you cleaning all that tape.....

really looking forward to your review.

It's not too bad, but I felt he needed a little payback for what he put me through :D   I don't think he reads this Forum though - too many old guys ;)

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I've said it once, but I'll say it again.  Chooch is a choch.  Plain and simple.  How did he even get on the test drive list?  I know, I know, it's all about the clicks and views, but I'll never watch another Chooch video so help me God.  Ever since his little incident with Ian Sampson over at Speedyfeet plus the stabbing thing I've lost all respect for the kid.  :rolleyes:  He could be the master EUC rider super skill dude of the century, but he's dead to me.  :eff05cf9bc:

Funny thing is that before all that I loved his riding through the snow with the Ninebot video and some of this other riding ones.  The kid can ride an EUC, I'll give him that.  Oh well, some people have a lot of growing up to do.  What goes around comes around I always say.  It might be a generational difference thing, but yeah no I think not.

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14 minutes ago, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said:

I've said it once, but I'll say it again.  Chooch is a choch.  Plain and simple.  How did he even get on the test drive list?  I know, I know, it's all about the clicks and views, but I'll never watch another Chooch video so help me God.  Ever since his little incident with Ian Sampson over at Speedyfeet plus the stabbing thing I've lost all respect for the kid.  :rolleyes:  He could be the master EUC rider super skill dude of the century, but he's dead to me.  :eff05cf9bc:

Funny thing is that before all that I loved his riding through the snow with the Ninebot video and some of this other riding ones.  The kid can ride an EUC, I'll give him that.  Oh well, some people have a lot of growing up to do.  What goes around comes around I always say.  It might be a generational difference thing, but yeah no I think not.

Dang! Stabbing thing!??

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2 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

Why can't us KingSong and Gotway owners experience the joys of an app like this? No Chinese. Just my native language. Kudos to Ninebot

see why i was pulling my hair out with me getting all these wheels at once and  all these 9bots working flawlessly with their app, and holding my breath and hoping with the kingsongs app.

i was so frustrated i just wanted an on/off switch with battery meter.

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Enjoy! Try to be gentle with the screws, easily stripped. Those nuts embedded in plastic base are also very easily damaged, especially those 4 on the mud guard.

And charging, well, if it’s drained, overnight may not be enough time... 

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1 minute ago, Turbocharged said:

Enjoy! Try to be gentle with the screws, easily stripped. Those nuts embedded in plastic base are also very easily damaged, especially those 4 on the mud guard.

:o Thanks for the heads-up. I'll put my torque wrench away ;)

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Initial Handling Impressions

This is going to be a fun wheel. I've been testing the handling in the street in front of my house, and my driveway. It does not handle like any other 18-inch wheel. Oddly, at low speeds (circles in the driveway, etc.) this wheel feels closer to a 14-inch wheel than my MSuper. Must be the super wide tire. I can stop, do reversals, do 180 reversals, super tight forward 360's, etc. and it's very smooth and tight. Feels very controlled. Hard to explain.

I'll find better words over time, but I'm thoroughly enjoying the slow speed handling. This actually feels closer to my Mten3 when doing tight maneuvers in constrained spaces. Very relaxing. Again, it must be the fat tire that is offering the better stability. I'm doing all this at 20-psi.

In contrast, my MSuper feels much more unwieldy than this Z10, when operating in tight spaces. Other than my Mten3, out of all my other wheels, I'd rather be idling on this Z10. Very relaxing. When I keep saying relaxing, I'm comparing the experience to my other wheels where controlling them at slow speeds can feel very hectic.

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9 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

Initial Handling Impressions

This is going to be a fun wheel. I've been testing the handling in the street in front of my house, and my driveway. It does not handle like any other 18-inch wheel. Oddly, at low speeds (circles in the driveway, etc.) this wheel feels closer to a 14-inch wheel than my MSuper. Must be the super wide tire. I can stop, do reversals, do 180 reversals, super tight forward 360's, etc. and it's very smooth and tight. Feels very controlled. Hard to explain.

 I'll find better words over time, but I'm thoroughly enjoying the slow speed handling. This actually feels closer to my Mten3 when doing tight maneuvers in constrained spaces. Very relaxing. Again, it must be the fat tire that is offering the better stability. I'm doing all this at 20-psi.

 In contrast, my MSuper feels much more unwieldy than this Z10, when operating in tight spaces. Other than my Mten3, out of all my other wheels, I'd rather be idling on this Z10. Very relaxing. When I keep saying relaxing, I'm comparing the experience to my other wheels where controlling them at slow speeds can feel very hectic.

Yes, at low speed there is almost no learning curve if not even easier. Go up to 15-20 mph, it's a different wheel, you have to really throw yourself left and right, in a fun way! I really hope more EUC fans can have the chance and give enough patience to learn the Z riding style, it is FUN!

I for one hated the early version, at all speed ranges, and it got better and better through both software and hardware updates, I just love the Z now. I thought I would only use Z when I needed the range or speed, or to participate Ninebot club event, and keep using smaller wheels for other purposes, but I find myself almost never touch other wheels now. I take Z for supermarket run... It's just so much fun to ride.

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37 minutes ago, Turbocharged said:

Yes, at low speed there is almost no learning curve if not even easier. Go up to 15-20 mph, it's a different wheel, you have to really throw yourself left and right, in a fun way! I really hope more EUC fans can have the chance and give enough patience to learn the Z riding style, it is FUN!

I for one hated the early version, at all speed ranges, and it got better and better through both software and hardware updates, I just love the Z now. I thought I would only use Z when I needed the range or speed, or to participate Ninebot club event, and keep using smaller wheels for other purposes, but I find myself almost never touch other wheels now. I take Z for supermarket run... It's just so much fun to ride.

The trolley handle truly sucks. In principle the design would work great but for some reason Ninebot decided to go with the flimsiest material possible. I know it's metal but it feels like cheap rubbery plastic. Considering the quality of the rest of the wheel I struggle to understand how they allowed this handle to be shipped with the wheel.

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2 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

The trolley handle truly sucks. In principle the design would work great but for some reason Ninebot decided to go with the flimsiest material possible. I know it's metal but it feels like cheap rubbery plastic. Considering the quality of the rest of the wheel I struggle to understand how they allowed this handle to be shipped with the wheel.

Ninebot staff admits that they may have rushed the trolley handle, they cannot afford to miss too much of the summer, that would hurt sales even more than a bad trolley handle.

We had a group ride last Saturday, it was in constant light rain, and quite a few of the Zs got rust locked handle, couldn't pull out anymore.

After all the fixes tweaks and updates, two major complaints remains, the trolley handle and the headlight which doesn't illuminate the ground but blinding whoever is in front of you.

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2 hours ago, Turbocharged said:

Ninebot staff admits that they may have rushed the trolley handle, they cannot afford to miss too much of the summer, that would hurt sales even more than a bad trolley handle.

We had a group ride last Saturday, it was in constant light rain, and quite a few of the Zs got rust locked handle, couldn't pull out anymore.

After all the fixes tweaks and updates, two major complaints remains, the trolley handle and the headlight which doesn't illuminate the ground but blinding whoever is in front of you.

Good. We are in agreement. I just finished a ride around town in some very dark conditions. The headlamp is like the old Gotway/KingSong lights - worthless for safe riding but probably pretty good for maintaining visibility by others. I think Inmotion's V10F has the best headlamp in the current crop of wheels.

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50 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

Good. We are in agreement. I just finished a ride around town in some very dark conditions. The headlamp is like the old Gotway/KingSong lights - worthless for safe riding but probably pretty good for maintaining visibility by others. I think Inmotion's V10F has the best headlamp in the current crop of wheels.

Marty please find out what's the lowest tire pressure that you can ride without damaging the tire if that is even possible? Thanks so much ??

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3 minutes ago, Vikas said:

Marty please find out what's the lowest tire pressure that you can ride without damaging the tire if that is even possible? Thanks so much ??

15-psi for my weight (175-pounds).

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10 hours ago, Turbocharged said:

And charging, well, if it’s drained, overnight may not be enough time... 

@Turbocharged Do You  know the name/type of the charging connector used in Z10? (afaik it is the same type as used on some type of NB mini model) Or maybe You know the source where to get the connector (full set of male-female) from? While still waiting for my Z10 to arrive - I would like to get ready with possibility to use Charge Doctor (to monitor and limit charge to 90% for everyday use)   also - to consider use of two standard Z10 chargers to shorten charge time when needed (I use charge doctor with my Kingsong KS16S with very good results - after 5200 km done in one year I do not see any significant decrease in battery capacity) to see what charge doctor is and the basic use - please see  

 

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26 minutes ago, Lukasz said:

@Turbocharged Do You  know the name/type of the charging connector used in Z10? (afaik it is the same type as used on some type of NB mini model) Or maybe You know the source where to get the connector (full set of male-female) from? While still waiting for my Z10 to arrive - I would like to get ready with possibility to use Charge Doctor (to monitor and limit charge to 90% for everyday use)   also - to consider use of two standard Z10 chargers to shorten charge time when needed (I use charge doctor with my Kingsong KS16S with very good results - after 5200 km done in one year I do not see any significant decrease in battery capacity) to see what charge doctor is and the basic use - please see  

 

It’s a proprietary connector type, the same as the ones used for the mini plus model (the “fat mini”) .

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15 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

Imagine your feelings, having just received one of the coolest wheels being made, and only being able to look at it. 

☹️

9 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

This actually feels closer to my Mten3 when doing tight maneuvers in constrained spaces. Very relaxing. Again, it must be the fat tire that is offering the better stability. I'm doing all this at 20-psi.

Now I’m fired up! There has been so much talk about the lack of the Z10’s agility. Exciting when you compare the handling in confined spaces approaching that of the Mten3!

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Lukasz said:

@Turbocharged Do You  know the name/type of the charging connector used in Z10? (afaik it is the same type as used on some type of NB mini model) Or maybe You know the source where to get the connector (full set of male-female) from? While still waiting for my Z10 to arrive - I would like to get ready with possibility to use Charge Doctor (to monitor and limit charge to 90% for everyday use)   also - to consider use of two standard Z10 chargers to shorten charge time when needed (I use charge doctor with my Kingsong KS16S with very good results - after 5200 km done in one year I do not see any significant decrease in battery capacity) to see what charge doctor is and the basic use - please see  

 

It is a 3-pin plug. What's interesting about the Z10 is that there are two apparently independent battery packs. As you use the wheel, the battery voltages diverge. Even the primary battery status on the main screen shows two separate battery percentages (e.g. 99% / 97%). So you can say that the 2-amp charger is a dual charger because I suspect each battery is being charged independently.

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1 hour ago, Rehab1 said:

 

☹️

Now I’m fired up! There has been so much talk about the lack of the Z10’s agility. Exciting when you compare the handling in confined spaces approaching that of the Mten3!

 

I rode it about 12-miles last night. It's a very agile wheel. However, unlike the Mten3, at slow speeds I would use the adverb 'lumbering' to describe it's responsiveness. Not in a bad way, but very deliberative. Back to that 'relaxing' word.

I'm definitely glad that I put my deposit down on this wheel.

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25 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

I'm definitely glad that I put my deposit down on this wheel.

me too. haters will just have to hate.

the “u have too many wheels haters”.

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50 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

It is a 3-pin plug. What's interesting about the Z10 is that there are two apparently independent battery packs. As you use the wheel, the battery voltages diverge. Even the primary battery status on the main screen shows two separate battery percentages (e.g. 99% / 97%). So you can say that the 2-amp charger is a dual charger because I suspect each battery is being charged independently.

Yes, I have noticed before the divided display in the application, with slightly different battery percentages - it would be interesting to find out how far those separate channels reach - two batteries, two separate sets of MOSFETS, and what about hall sensors? From the Ninebot One Z Teardown by Houseofjob we know that there are only 3 wires to the  motor - so we do not have  "two motors" (separate coils) .  In scope of the Charge Doctor - not good, as new "dual" version of Charge Doctor will be needed in such case...  but for safety - it should be very interesting.  Also - it would be interesting to know more technical details of such setup - in which battery "unbalance" state we will get some error message / wheel disabled status?  what happens if one "power set" fails? does it mean switch off / fall or some emergency slowdown / safe speed decrease? @Turbocharged  Can You maybe give us some clue if You are in contact with engineering team in NB?  Also - would it be possible to charge the Z10 from 2 chargers, or if there is the plan to release some kind of "fast" charger?   (if You mention that charging "overnight" may not be enough with standard charger... )

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