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hal2000

R.I.P. 18L

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Not sounding good at all. 

I hope you bought it at you local dealer.

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Yes. It’s been picked up by the dealer already. Awaiting post-mortem.

Edited by hal2000

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Yip, There is/was a severe Firmware problem, sounded  exactly like ..solved now with FW 1.07, this afternoon released.

Guess to late for you...Feeling bad for you! Fortunately you seam to have a very serious dealer!

 

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In the pc gaming field, constant updates to a game is often signs of bad first release. easier to push out half complete products when you can just fix them later. I rather have something correct right away.

Not saying anything about the wheels here. just what it can mean in general. i dont want that. :)

1 hour ago, hal2000 said:

It just froze while In trolley mode. The wheel locked so I couldn’t even push/pull it. LEDs remained on. Power button unresponsive. Carried it back home. Damn it’s heavy. Unable to connect to KS app. Same with DB app. Got really hot (top cover, engine and rim) to the point I couldn’t touch it. Then it died.

hope you get it fixed soon!

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Doesn't is suck that both King Song and Inmotion can't get their firmware updates correct?  Regardless of their failures, I'll take the ability to update my firmware over the inability to update my firmware any day.  Bad King Song, Bad inmotion.  King Song though just release new firmware to fix the issue, unfortunately too late for this poor fellow.  Inmotion have yet to release their firmware.  I'm supposed to be testing it, haven't seen anything yet form Bob.  He mention 2-3 weeks, been only a week.

In the case of Gotway, you have to send your wheel to a dealer to fix if they mess up their firmware release, Msuper V3s+ oscillation. (hint hint).  Also no such thing as the wheel getting any better or worse than when you bought it.  

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Sooo....

right now we have:

- Gotway: we all know they have reliability issues

- Kingsong: new wheel with reliability issues

- Inmotion: new wheel with reliability issues

Let's hope the Z10 will be ok :lol:

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Sorry to hear about your wheel @hal2000. I hope you will have it up and running soon. 

When I finally get my KS18L, I will stay away from the native ios KS app despite this so called recent firmware  “fix”. For now, I will just use  DarknessBot to break free from the default beginner max speed. In fact, I will even delete the KS app from my phone before the wheel arrives. 

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1 minute ago, Marty Backe said:

I'm not defending Gotway. But if you or other people are going to crap on Gotway because of firmware problems, then be an equal opportunist and crap on KingSong and Inmotion :P

I will defend Gotway somewhat by saying that I'm only aware of one instance where bad Gotway firmware had to be replaced because of a defect. Can't say the same thing about the other wheel manufacturers.

Yes, I agree it is bad and frankly very surprised with how badly Inmotion handled it.  Still no fix yet. 

So far as firmware issues go, one strike for each of the three, GW, KS, IM.  LOL  If there were more than one, I'm not aware of it.  

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5 minutes ago, eddiemoy said:

Yes, I agree it is bad and frankly very surprised with how badly Inmotion handled it.  Still no fix yet. 

So far as firmware issues go, one strike for each of the three, GW, KS, IM.  LOL  If there were more than one, I'm not aware of it.  

My KS14S had crippled firmware that needed fixing. Can't remember about any problems with the KS16S or 18S.

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20 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

I'm not defending Gotway. But if you or other people are going to crap on Gotway because of firmware problems, then be an equal opportunist and crap on KingSong and Inmotion :P

I will defend Gotway somewhat by saying that I'm only aware of one instance where bad Gotway firmware had to be replaced because of a defect. Can't say the same thing about the other wheel manufacturers.

Jaja...Sure, there was only one instance where they HAD to change it...

While this here is certainly not the best example, the ability to upgrade firmware from KS is mostly not used because of such bad firmware behaviour....it is used to make the wheel better!

My 18S got about 8 Firmware iterations, where 2 have been major motor driver updates, which made the wheel more torque and more powerfull. The rest have been for slight bettering of coomunication with the app...adding LED music response etc etc...

i guess its no question that this a great advantage.

What happend here is that a a fault in the LED lightring behaviour, that in seldom circumstances lead to a never ending loop in the firmware...which at the end fried 4-5 boards...very bad indead and should never had happen!!!

What would have been if this had happend on the Tesla? Instead of offering a FW upgrade over the air (in 3 days after reported to KS) the GW resellers  would have to recall all wheels by post, visit to their shop, open them, and use their “secret” bluetooth upgrading tool...or Ok...all would have to wait for the next batch of wheels...

@Marty Backe You really want to tell me thats better?

Edited by US69
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20 minutes ago, Ethereal said:

Sorry to hear about your wheel @hal2000. I hope you will have it up and running soon. 

When I finally get my KS18L, I will stay away from the native ios KS app despite this so called recent firmware  “fix”. For now, I will just use  DarknessBot to break free from the default beginner max speed. In fact, I will even delete the KS app from my phone before the wheel arrives. 

I will not shock you....but this frying board behaviour is not only IOS related...its a fault in the FIrmware of the LED lightring behaviour, which even on android can lead to a board “loop” ...and in seldom instances to a board fry.....

So i would update the Firmware to 1.07  ?

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17 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

My KS14S had crippled firmware that needed fixing. Can't remember about any problems with the KS16S or 18S.

that was a throttling issue, too conservative?  wheel was ridable, just annoying right?  same with inmotion's new fw update, it is annoying the speed limit and the tiltback is bad, but if i don't go crazy, wheel is ridable. 

Edited by eddiemoy
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34 minutes ago, ir_fuel said:

Sooo....

right now we have:

- Gotway: we all know they have reliability issues

- Kingsong: new wheel with reliability issues

- Inmotion: new wheel with reliability issues

Let's hope the Z10 will be ok :lol:

Well I might be alone with view, but here goes...

As a consumer I do not this this is good enough of any brand. So are the producers the only to blame for this?

I think not. Again the classic 80-20 apply to this too. As long consumers are fine being put on risk using a product, someone will make it.

Some look to get an Rusk from risk taking other want effort freedom...me well learned a lot (I hope) from read forum about behaviour and dynamics of euc. As example, I didn't realise riding downhill at 100% is a high risk taker.

Looking at the mirror..am I happy with my choice of wheels. So far yes. See signature for what I got. So far I chosen not to buy Gotway, my choose because I felt I could chose a safer wheel. Key point here, I do not know that for a fact, but as a consumer I did make a choice. 

Now I am playing the waiting game for my KS18L to be delivered.

Edited by Unventor

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18 minutes ago, US69 said:

I will not shock you....but this frying board behaviour is not only IOS related...its a fault in the FIrmware of the LED lightring behaviour, which even on android can lead to a board “loop” ...and in seldom instances to a board fry.....

So i would update the Firmware to 1.07  ?

Would turning off the leds prevent the problem if the latest firmware upgrade does not?

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12 minutes ago, US69 said:

I will not shock you....but this frying board behaviour is not only IOS related...its a fault in the FIrmware of the LED lightring behaviour, which even on android can lead to a board “loop” ...and in seldom instances to a board fry.....

So i would update the Firmware to 1.07  ?

Well, my KS18L should arrive in about 3 weeks since I chose the snail mail route anyway. Only time will tell whether  this most recent firmware update is the real fix...For now, I will avoid the KS app like the plague. 

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And just some infos about the “beginner max speed regulation”:

On older wheels KS applied a 20kmh speed limit that was automatically free after 50 or 100km...or you could  use the KS unlock code...if you dont want to wait.

The new wheels nowadays have this 20kmh speed regulation, too....it goes away after just 5! km.

Then the wheel...here in this example the 18L is set to a max of 40kmh. After 200kmh you can run 50kmh....

Having some years experience now on some wheels you might find this ridiculous....i personally find it at least understandable that KS wants the user to get some use on his new wheel before you can go faster than the -already crazy fast - 40kmh....That are just about 3-4 charges until you can use the full potential of the wheel. 

I lately heard @Marty Backe in the video podcast with Duf...where he said something like:

“as longer i ride...the more conservative i get...my main speed is about 20-23mph...everytime i am on that-allready fast speed- i ask myself what happens now....if the wheel might fail?“

(forgive me if i dont say it exactly like it was ? )

Thats very wise and exactly my standpoint to....Everything over 25mph....i find this totally questionable for an EUC....that are speeds that just make no fun anymore! More reserves? Yes, i take them  ..but that wont fasten my ride.....

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3 minutes ago, Jerome said:

Would turning off the leds prevent the problem if the latest firmware upgrade does not?

I cant say that....as i dont know when exactly that happens...i wouldnt touch the LED settings at all!

BUT: KS has reproduced the fault and FIXED it with the 1.07 Firmware...

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3 minutes ago, Ethereal said:

Well, my KS18L should arrive in about 3 weeks since I chose the snail mail route anyway. Only time will tell whether  this most recent firmware update is the real fix...For now, I will avoid the KS app like the plague. 

Just to say it again....the fault is NOT the KS app...the fault sits in the firmware of the wheel....

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9 minutes ago, US69 said:

I cant say that....as i dont know when exactly that happens...i wouldnt touch the LED settings at all!

BUT: KS has reproduced the fault and FIXED it with the 1.07 Firmware...

 

8 minutes ago, US69 said:

Just to say it again....the fault is NOT the KS app...the fault sits in the firmware of the wheel....

I got your message the first time regarding the firmware of the wheel regarding the LED lights causing a board loop resulting in board frying. Your other added info of KS reproducing the fault and then FIXING it is reassuring to hear. Before that added news, no one could pinpoint what exactly was causing all these 18L frozen states. Glad to hear KS has isolated the cause at least. Hopefully no more surprises. 

Edited by Ethereal
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8 minutes ago, Ethereal said:

 

I got your message the first time regarding the firmware of the wheel regarding the LED lights causing a board loop resulting in board frying. Your other added info of KS reproducing the fault and then FIXING it is reassuring to hear. Before that added news, no one could pinpoint what exactly was causing all these 18L frozen states. Glad to hear KS has isolated the cause at least. Hopefully no more surprises. 

Plus one on that ?

I have seen and driven the wheel in its white and glossy black manifestation....

This wheel is...without beeing biased...Kingsongs most impressive masterpiece!

Really, i have seen and ridden a lot of EUC....but this one really left me impressed! For sure not the best performance/most powerfull wheel in the market...but qualitywise and its appearance....worth the wait!

My 2cents....

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2 hours ago, US69 said:

Jaja...Sure, there was only one instance where they HAD to change it...

While this here is certainly not the best example, the ability to upgrade firmware from KS is mostly not used because of such bad firmware behaviour....it is used to make the wheel better!

My 18S got about 8 Firmware iterations, where 2 have been major motor driver updates, which made the wheel more torque and more powerfull. The rest have been for slight bettering of coomunication with the app...adding LED music response etc etc...

i guess its no question that this a great advantage.

What happend here is that a a fault in the LED lightring behaviour, that in seldom circumstances lead to a never ending loop in the firmware...which at the end fried 4-5 boards...very bad indead and should never had happen!!!

What would have been if this had happend on the Tesla? Instead of offering a FW upgrade over the air (in 3 days after reported to KS) the GW resellers  would have to recall all wheels by post, visit to their shop, open them, and use their “secret” bluetooth upgrading tool...or Ok...all would have to wait for the next batch of wheels...

@Marty Backe You really want to tell me thats better?

No, I don't.

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1 hour ago, eddiemoy said:

that was a throttling issue, too conservative?  wheel was ridable, just annoying right?  same with inmotion's new fw update, it is annoying the speed limit and the tiltback is bad, but if i don't go crazy, wheel is ridable. 

Well, for me the firmware that came with the wheel, if not upgradable, would have made me sell the 14S because it was not a fun wheel. And if I had the V10F right now, it would be sitting in my closet because it's essentially unusable for the kind of riding that I enjoy.

I hope someday Gotway releases a wheel that can be upgraded. There's hope yet. They seem to be listening to the market considering the changes made in the MSX. Still might be a few years :facepalm:

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